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The new class sets need a lot of work (many need a complete redesign from scratch).
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StShoot✭✭✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »The DK set is beyond broken and needs to be seriously nerfed before it goes live.
Otherwise all of PvP is going to be just DKs running that set.
Major and Minor Heroism permanently on a class that relies heavily on ultimate and has the by far strongest ult in the game is such a horrible idea for anyone who knows anything about balance in this game.
PS: ZOS please remove ult regen while in corrosive.
Even without corrosive; DKs get massive sustain and a burst heal from just using ultimate. Not like we need a buffed shield on dragon leap being practically a spammable, rcovering resources and healing all at once. Would be entertaining to play, jumping all over; but it would be ridiculous
It will be hard to get the larger shield on the jump tho, because you have to use it on the backbar i mean you could probably switch bars but than you miss out the healing.
Otherwhise yeah that set is completly broken. Moreover unlike the templar set (which you have to use on 2 bars) you can probably just use it on one bar, since it proccs a buff.1 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »The DK set is beyond broken and needs to be seriously nerfed before it goes live.
Otherwise all of PvP is going to be just DKs running that set.
Major and Minor Heroism permanently on a class that relies heavily on ultimate and has the by far strongest ult in the game is such a horrible idea for anyone who knows anything about balance in this game.
PS: ZOS please remove ult regen while in corrosive.
Even without corrosive; DKs get massive sustain and a burst heal from just using ultimate. Not like we need a buffed shield on dragon leap being practically a spammable, rcovering resources and healing all at once. Would be entertaining to play, jumping all over; but it would be ridiculous
It will be hard to get the larger shield on the jump tho, because you have to use it on the backbar i mean you could probably switch bars but than you miss out the healing.
Otherwhise yeah that set is completly broken. Moreover unlike the templar set (which you have to use on 2 bars) you can probably just use it on one bar, since it proccs a buff.
So here's a question. How does the game determine what the back bar is? That really is a term players use for their buff/heal bar. I from habit, actually have my offensive "front bar" stuff on bar 2. They going to count just buffs? If so; you could just run a 2her on that bar and tge ultimate still would hit hardEdited by TechMaybeHic on September 15, 2023 11:19AM2 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Turtle_Bot wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Correct me if I'm wrong, but we don't actually know if the Necro set turns you into a mobile corpse, and won't know until PTS. It might just drop a corpse down when you consume it.
And even still, I'm not convinced sacrificing an entire 5 piece (with defensive lines on a class that lacks offense) for the ability to make 1 (not both) of your tethers mobile is worth it at all.
Not to mention that other (better) abilities like Deaden Pain will just be consuming your self-corpse anyways.The set states that when casting a bone tyrant ability it applies the buff called "beautiful corpse" to you.
It also states that when casting an ability that consumes a corpse, it consumes the beautiful corpse buff, treating you as a corpse.
Unless I am mistaken, this set is basically saying cast a bone tyrant ability then cast an ability that consumes a corpse to treat the caster as a corpse for the purpose of applying the secondary effects of that ability that consumes a corpse.
The only thing that needs to be tested is if it works with the tethers (since they technically don't consume the corpse, but they do target a corpse to create their beam). If it does work with the tethers (restoring tether + shocking siphon) it will be a really cool way to incorperate those abilities into the necro kit since they would essentially become and AoE HoT/DoT around the cro allowing them to remain active in mobile fights or around LoS.
But again, IF the tethers end up working that way, you'll still only be able to use one of them, and any other consumption ability will place the self corpse on cooldown anyways. Deaden Pain is way too good now to not use, so that ability would likely be taking the majority of cooldowns for your self corpse.
Additionally, necro needs offensive power. Running a set that has a less than 100% uptime on Minor Resolve and Protection (two things you can get VERY easily at 100% uptime), plus defensive 2-4 pieces? Just to MAYBE have a mobile tether every few casts? Not worth at all.3 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The DK set is beyond broken and needs to be seriously nerfed before it goes live.
Otherwise all of PvP is going to be just DKs running that set.
Major and Minor Heroism permanently on a class that relies heavily on ultimate and has the by far strongest ult in the game is such a horrible idea for anyone who knows anything about balance in this game.
PS: ZOS please remove ult regen while in corrosive.
Not saying they will or won't, but we don't have the patch notes yet.
For all we know, they could disable ult gen while in Corrosive on Monday. That would make the DK class set still great but much less oppressive than it looks on paper.Edited by CameraBeardThePirate on September 15, 2023 11:26AM0 -
the1andonlyskwex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Some of these sets are a lot more obviously useful than others, and I'm super disappointed that there aren't sets for every role-class combination.Edited by the1andonlyskwex on September 15, 2023 11:32AM1 -
emilyhyoyeon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »TechMaybeHic wrote: »The DK set is beyond broken and needs to be seriously nerfed before it goes live.
Otherwise all of PvP is going to be just DKs running that set.
Major and Minor Heroism permanently on a class that relies heavily on ultimate and has the by far strongest ult in the game is such a horrible idea for anyone who knows anything about balance in this game.
PS: ZOS please remove ult regen while in corrosive.
Even without corrosive; DKs get massive sustain and a burst heal from just using ultimate. Not like we need a buffed shield on dragon leap being practically a spammable, rcovering resources and healing all at once. Would be entertaining to play, jumping all over; but it would be ridiculous
It will be hard to get the larger shield on the jump tho, because you have to use it on the backbar i mean you could probably switch bars but than you miss out the healing.
Otherwhise yeah that set is completly broken. Moreover unlike the templar set (which you have to use on 2 bars) you can probably just use it on one bar, since it proccs a buff.
So here's a question. How does the game determine what the back bar is? That really is a term players use for their buff/heal bar. I from habit, actually have my offensive "front bar" stuff on bar 2. They going to count just buffs? If so; you could just run a 2her on that bar and tge ultimate still would hit hard
Yeah I set up my bars based on which weapon I want to be showing in character select screen lol.
My two guesses are either 1-the game treats the bar labeled as 1 as the front and the bar labeled as 2 the back so people will have to re-do all their bars if they have always set them up ''backwards'' or 2-it'll treat whichever bar has the full 5p bonus as the front and if you're double-barring it, you only get the front bar bonus.
On another note I like the NB set at first thought because my main character is a siphon-themed nightblade in PVP. I don't see why the Siphoning line set has to address their PVE issues. I would guess the future Assassination line set would address the PVE NB issues considering PVE NB DD is way more focused on the skills in that line (their ''damage'' skill line) than the Siphoning line (their ''healing'' skill line). I play my NB in all roles in PVE so I care about their PVE state as well for the record.
I can't speak for how balanced the set is. If it's too strong then it should be adjusted. I only disagree that the set necessarily has to address the PVE issues/should be reworked rather than adjusted.
I can't even tell how the set will actually manifest in PVP other than stealth bombing. If Siphoning abilites spend ult, then you have to be very particular about how you cast your skills if you actually want to use the set for Tether. Especially considering that the more ult you build, the more ult you lose when casting another Siphoning ability like Offering or Siphoning Strikes or Extract. Maybe bump the ult cost when using a Siphoning ability from 1% to 2% or even higher.IGN @ emilypumpkin, imperial pumpkin seller
Tullanisse Starborne, altmer battlemage & scholar of the ayleids
High Priest Eraamine as a houseguest please C:0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Turtle_Bot wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Correct me if I'm wrong, but we don't actually know if the Necro set turns you into a mobile corpse, and won't know until PTS. It might just drop a corpse down when you consume it.
And even still, I'm not convinced sacrificing an entire 5 piece (with defensive lines on a class that lacks offense) for the ability to make 1 (not both) of your tethers mobile is worth it at all.
Not to mention that other (better) abilities like Deaden Pain will just be consuming your self-corpse anyways.The set states that when casting a bone tyrant ability it applies the buff called "beautiful corpse" to you.
It also states that when casting an ability that consumes a corpse, it consumes the beautiful corpse buff, treating you as a corpse.
Unless I am mistaken, this set is basically saying cast a bone tyrant ability then cast an ability that consumes a corpse to treat the caster as a corpse for the purpose of applying the secondary effects of that ability that consumes a corpse.
The only thing that needs to be tested is if it works with the tethers (since they technically don't consume the corpse, but they do target a corpse to create their beam). If it does work with the tethers (restoring tether + shocking siphon) it will be a really cool way to incorperate those abilities into the necro kit since they would essentially become and AoE HoT/DoT around the cro allowing them to remain active in mobile fights or around LoS.
But again, IF the tethers end up working that way, you'll still only be able to use one of them, and any other consumption ability will place the self corpse on cooldown anyways. Deaden Pain is way too good now to not use, so that ability would likely be taking the majority of cooldowns for your self corpse.
Additionally, necro needs offensive power. Running a set that has a less than 100% uptime on Minor Resolve and Protection (two things you can get VERY easily at 100% uptime), plus defensive 2-4 pieces? Just to MAYBE have a mobile tether every few casts? Not worth at all.
Overall I would agree. This set is for PvE Tanking and that's fine, that is I garner the most popular use of the class anyhow.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭TechMaybeHic wrote: »The DK set is beyond broken and needs to be seriously nerfed before it goes live.
Otherwise all of PvP is going to be just DKs running that set.
Major and Minor Heroism permanently on a class that relies heavily on ultimate and has the by far strongest ult in the game is such a horrible idea for anyone who knows anything about balance in this game.
PS: ZOS please remove ult regen while in corrosive.
Even without corrosive; DKs get massive sustain and a burst heal from just using ultimate. Not like we need a buffed shield on dragon leap being practically a spammable, rcovering resources and healing all at once. Would be entertaining to play, jumping all over; but it would be ridiculous
Yeah DK should absolutely never be able to reliably access Major Heroism, because it makes the class way too strong.
I mean Daedric Trickery is a random chance to get Major Heroism and you will very rarely have more than like 30-40% uptime on it in longer fights and its still used by tons of DKs because the buff is so strong.
[snip]
[edited for bashing]
Well there's been a way to reliably get it for most of this game's history: Last Stand passive - but at far less than 100% uptime.
You could make an argument it's fine to have 100% Uptime on it from a 5 piece but not with Seething Fury at its current strength - not unless Seething Fury is just converted to Courage or something. (It's gotta keep the eyes tho)
It's true that the first iterations of Seething Fury were too difficult to use, but right now it more or less gives you a Weapon Damage total most other classes need a 5 piece to obtain.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Turtle_Bot wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Correct me if I'm wrong, but we don't actually know if the Necro set turns you into a mobile corpse, and won't know until PTS. It might just drop a corpse down when you consume it.
And even still, I'm not convinced sacrificing an entire 5 piece (with defensive lines on a class that lacks offense) for the ability to make 1 (not both) of your tethers mobile is worth it at all.
Not to mention that other (better) abilities like Deaden Pain will just be consuming your self-corpse anyways.The set states that when casting a bone tyrant ability it applies the buff called "beautiful corpse" to you.
It also states that when casting an ability that consumes a corpse, it consumes the beautiful corpse buff, treating you as a corpse.
Unless I am mistaken, this set is basically saying cast a bone tyrant ability then cast an ability that consumes a corpse to treat the caster as a corpse for the purpose of applying the secondary effects of that ability that consumes a corpse.
The only thing that needs to be tested is if it works with the tethers (since they technically don't consume the corpse, but they do target a corpse to create their beam). If it does work with the tethers (restoring tether + shocking siphon) it will be a really cool way to incorperate those abilities into the necro kit since they would essentially become and AoE HoT/DoT around the cro allowing them to remain active in mobile fights or around LoS.
But again, IF the tethers end up working that way, you'll still only be able to use one of them, and any other consumption ability will place the self corpse on cooldown anyways. Deaden Pain is way too good now to not use, so that ability would likely be taking the majority of cooldowns for your self corpse.
Additionally, necro needs offensive power. Running a set that has a less than 100% uptime on Minor Resolve and Protection (two things you can get VERY easily at 100% uptime), plus defensive 2-4 pieces? Just to MAYBE have a mobile tether every few casts? Not worth at all.
Overall I would agree. This set is for PvE Tanking and that's fine, that is I garner the most popular use of the class anyhow.
Even in that context it's not really giving you anything tho - the tethers aren't really an issue in static PvE fights, and you already get Minor Resolve from your healer. So what, you get iffy uptime on Minor Protection? You can get decent uptime just from slotting Temporal Guard in your unused ultimate slot. There are far better tank sets that will help your group or yourself way more.Edited by CameraBeardThePirate on September 15, 2023 12:11PM2 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I keep going back to "why would I use this over another 5 piece?" And there's little reason for most. How much am I losing from not having another offensive set to buff not only siphoning abilities, but NBs entire tool kit and not have it spending my ultimate as an example.4 -
Lalothen✭✭✭✭✭The disparity in potential usefulness between the sets is enormous, but on the whole I just don't see most of them being used - particularly the Necro one... wtf even is that going to be used for?
Also why did they create sets that suit different roles? If the intent is to eventually have several class sets to cover all roles, then they should've picked one role and then created a set for each class based on that selection - not this mess which makes it impossible to do comparitive testing across classes for balance purposes.
It would be so much simpler if, for example, at the design stage they had said: "Ok most players are DPS so we'll create DPS sets first, that way during testing we can then make sure they're all offering comparable output at all levels of gameplay".5 -
loveeso✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Turtle_Bot wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Correct me if I'm wrong, but we don't actually know if the Necro set turns you into a mobile corpse, and won't know until PTS. It might just drop a corpse down when you consume it.
And even still, I'm not convinced sacrificing an entire 5 piece (with defensive lines on a class that lacks offense) for the ability to make 1 (not both) of your tethers mobile is worth it at all.
Not to mention that other (better) abilities like Deaden Pain will just be consuming your self-corpse anyways.The set states that when casting a bone tyrant ability it applies the buff called "beautiful corpse" to you.
It also states that when casting an ability that consumes a corpse, it consumes the beautiful corpse buff, treating you as a corpse.
Unless I am mistaken, this set is basically saying cast a bone tyrant ability then cast an ability that consumes a corpse to treat the caster as a corpse for the purpose of applying the secondary effects of that ability that consumes a corpse.
The only thing that needs to be tested is if it works with the tethers (since they technically don't consume the corpse, but they do target a corpse to create their beam). If it does work with the tethers (restoring tether + shocking siphon) it will be a really cool way to incorperate those abilities into the necro kit since they would essentially become and AoE HoT/DoT around the cro allowing them to remain active in mobile fights or around LoS.
But again, IF the tethers end up working that way, you'll still only be able to use one of them, and any other consumption ability will place the self corpse on cooldown anyways. Deaden Pain is way too good now to not use, so that ability would likely be taking the majority of cooldowns for your self corpse.
Additionally, necro needs offensive power. Running a set that has a less than 100% uptime on Minor Resolve and Protection (two things you can get VERY easily at 100% uptime), plus defensive 2-4 pieces? Just to MAYBE have a mobile tether every few casts? Not worth at all.
Overall I would agree. This set is for PvE Tanking and that's fine, that is I garner the most popular use of the class anyhow.
It would be a selfish tanking set though so most people wouldn’t’ t want to run it in group PvE content. I know I wouldn’t.
MMOs: ESO (PS & PC), GW2 (😍) & Souls/Elden (😍)0 -
ESO_Nightingale✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭frankly from what i can see, this is an experiment, you can tell which classes had more effort put into their class set design. some classes got genuinely interesting ideas or near revolutionary gameplay changing designs and other classes got minor buffs already accessable from other better sources for casting a class skill.
this type of design as a 5pc genuinely worries me regarding the winter's embrace line as i know without a doubt it'll have some sort of tanking related bonus when the line serves 2 roles as both a tanking line and a major thematic dps line.
we already have enough 5 piece item sets. I would have thought it'd be more interesting and fun to create them as 3 piece item sets to potentially match them with other bonuses.Edited by ESO_Nightingale on September 15, 2023 12:52PMPvE Frost Warden Main and teacher. Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/5PT3rQX8 -
loveeso✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »frankly from what i can see, this is an experiment, you can tell which classes had more effort put into their class set design. some classes got genuinely interesting ideas or near revolutionary gameplay changing designs and other classes got minor buffs already accessable from other better sources for casting a class skill.
this type of design as a 5pc genuinely worries me regarding the winter's embrace line as i know without a doubt it'll have some sort of tanking related bonus when the line serves 2 roles as both a tanking line and a major thematic dps line.
we already have enough 5 piece item sets. I would have thought it'd be more interesting and fun to create them as 3 piece item sets to potentially match them with other bonuses.
This. Three-piece sets are a much better idea, they could revive theory crafting. Don’t get me wrong, I love the idea of having class sets, but… As a DD, would you run most of those instead of Rele, Pillar, Depths, Deadly, Coral, and so on? Which one of the meta sets would you give up and with which class? All trial sets give you minor slayer. Pillar? Deadly on a Templar? Would it be worth getting a new set and upgrading it? Why?
But three-piece class sets - brilliant idea, would love to see that.Edited by loveeso on September 15, 2023 1:22PMMMOs: ESO (PS & PC), GW2 (😍) & Souls/Elden (😍)4 -
Lalothen✭✭✭✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »we already have enough 5 piece item sets. I would have thought it'd be more interesting and fun to create them as 3 piece item sets to potentially match them with other bonuses.
Completely agree with this.
There are so many 5-piece sets out there that see virtually no use already and so few 3-piece ones that can fit adaptively into a build, that designing class sets to fill that niche in build design could be fantastic.7 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The sorc set could definitely use a bit of work.
But I think it will be a bit easier to proc than mentioned. Start a fight with Liquid Lightning, Hurricane, and Fury, and you immediately get your max 3 procs of the set.
I do think the static and tether sounding nature of it is a bit off. Maybe it should give you stacks directly, up to 3, that deal damage in an area around you, increasing with each stack. Kind of like a more powerful boundless storm.0 -
RaidingTraiding✭✭✭On live certain group comps in pvp make it so you can leap with corrosive ult up. This should be interesting. As far as the other bar, stronger coags is exactly what dk needed lol. One of these class sets is way stronger than the others. 3 guesses which.1 -
Jierdanit✭✭✭✭✭
✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »we already have enough 5 piece item sets. I would have thought it'd be more interesting and fun to create them as 3 piece item sets to potentially match them with other bonuses.
Completely agree with this.
There are so many 5-piece sets out there that see virtually no use already and so few 3-piece ones that can fit adaptively into a build, that designing class sets to fill that niche in build design could be fantastic.
Instead of creating new Item sets that no one is going to use with every patch they should use that time to actually make the existing sets useful.
Currently when im making a build i am looking at maybe 15 to 20 different Sets that could be useful for that particular build.
That is for everything, including Monster Sets, Mythics, Arena Weapons and regular Sets.
It is ridiculous that there is hundreds of sets in the game and probably 75% of them are completely useless for anything outside of roleplaying.PC/EU, StamSorc Main3 -
TechMaybeHic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ESO_Nightingale wrote: »frankly from what i can see, this is an experiment, you can tell which classes had more effort put into their class set design. some classes got genuinely interesting ideas or near revolutionary gameplay changing designs and other classes got minor buffs already accessable from other better sources for casting a class skill.
this type of design as a 5pc genuinely worries me regarding the winter's embrace line as i know without a doubt it'll have some sort of tanking related bonus when the line serves 2 roles as both a tanking line and a major thematic dps line.
we already have enough 5 piece item sets. I would have thought it'd be more interesting and fun to create them as 3 piece item sets to potentially match them with other bonuses.
I don't know. I feel like maybe the sets they got really creative with, they just missed on considering the power level usefulness.
The best one is a simple "use an ability, get a couple buffs for 20 seconds depending on your bar." Pretty simple. But then the others are creating multiple effects that didn't already exist; and mostly worthless. The sorc one sounds cool as far as I'd like to see what it looks likeEdited by TechMaybeHic on September 15, 2023 3:02PM1 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Turtle_Bot wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Correct me if I'm wrong, but we don't actually know if the Necro set turns you into a mobile corpse, and won't know until PTS. It might just drop a corpse down when you consume it.
And even still, I'm not convinced sacrificing an entire 5 piece (with defensive lines on a class that lacks offense) for the ability to make 1 (not both) of your tethers mobile is worth it at all.
Not to mention that other (better) abilities like Deaden Pain will just be consuming your self-corpse anyways.The set states that when casting a bone tyrant ability it applies the buff called "beautiful corpse" to you.
It also states that when casting an ability that consumes a corpse, it consumes the beautiful corpse buff, treating you as a corpse.
Unless I am mistaken, this set is basically saying cast a bone tyrant ability then cast an ability that consumes a corpse to treat the caster as a corpse for the purpose of applying the secondary effects of that ability that consumes a corpse.
The only thing that needs to be tested is if it works with the tethers (since they technically don't consume the corpse, but they do target a corpse to create their beam). If it does work with the tethers (restoring tether + shocking siphon) it will be a really cool way to incorperate those abilities into the necro kit since they would essentially become and AoE HoT/DoT around the cro allowing them to remain active in mobile fights or around LoS.
But again, IF the tethers end up working that way, you'll still only be able to use one of them, and any other consumption ability will place the self corpse on cooldown anyways. Deaden Pain is way too good now to not use, so that ability would likely be taking the majority of cooldowns for your self corpse.
Additionally, necro needs offensive power. Running a set that has a less than 100% uptime on Minor Resolve and Protection (two things you can get VERY easily at 100% uptime), plus defensive 2-4 pieces? Just to MAYBE have a mobile tether every few casts? Not worth at all.
Overall I would agree. This set is for PvE Tanking and that's fine, that is I garner the most popular use of the class anyhow.
Even in that context it's not really giving you anything tho - the tethers aren't really an issue in static PvE fights, and you already get Minor Resolve from your healer. So what, you get iffy uptime on Minor Protection? You can get decent uptime just from slotting Temporal Guard in your unused ultimate slot. There are far better tank sets that will help your group or yourself way more.
Right it could at least be a strong selfish set! This one is likely outperformed by cheap BoE sets like Livewire. Unless I'm missing something and/or there's something in the patch notes.
A mobile tether which gives Minor Resolve is nice because it's free and Vigor isn't - but that cost isn't even close to being worth a 5 piece. Again a mobile Detonating is fun - but I'm not even sure it's better than a few similar proc sets, Red Mountain etc.
Ravenous might be the best defensive Ult in the game but Necro's pretty reliant on burst Ults to secure a kill right now - so I'm sure I'm not the only one happily running Temp Guard without a reasonable replacement - and it's also one of the best defensive Ults and to me the most fun.
My initial read then says buff it for selfish PvE Tanking for pug tanking Vet DLC - because really defense isn't something Necro's lacking in PvP, still maybe the tankiest class, so no matter what this one does we're probably all waiting for the Gravelord set.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
CameraBeardThePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Turtle_Bot wrote: »CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »Correct me if I'm wrong, but we don't actually know if the Necro set turns you into a mobile corpse, and won't know until PTS. It might just drop a corpse down when you consume it.
And even still, I'm not convinced sacrificing an entire 5 piece (with defensive lines on a class that lacks offense) for the ability to make 1 (not both) of your tethers mobile is worth it at all.
Not to mention that other (better) abilities like Deaden Pain will just be consuming your self-corpse anyways.The set states that when casting a bone tyrant ability it applies the buff called "beautiful corpse" to you.
It also states that when casting an ability that consumes a corpse, it consumes the beautiful corpse buff, treating you as a corpse.
Unless I am mistaken, this set is basically saying cast a bone tyrant ability then cast an ability that consumes a corpse to treat the caster as a corpse for the purpose of applying the secondary effects of that ability that consumes a corpse.
The only thing that needs to be tested is if it works with the tethers (since they technically don't consume the corpse, but they do target a corpse to create their beam). If it does work with the tethers (restoring tether + shocking siphon) it will be a really cool way to incorperate those abilities into the necro kit since they would essentially become and AoE HoT/DoT around the cro allowing them to remain active in mobile fights or around LoS.
But again, IF the tethers end up working that way, you'll still only be able to use one of them, and any other consumption ability will place the self corpse on cooldown anyways. Deaden Pain is way too good now to not use, so that ability would likely be taking the majority of cooldowns for your self corpse.
Additionally, necro needs offensive power. Running a set that has a less than 100% uptime on Minor Resolve and Protection (two things you can get VERY easily at 100% uptime), plus defensive 2-4 pieces? Just to MAYBE have a mobile tether every few casts? Not worth at all.
Overall I would agree. This set is for PvE Tanking and that's fine, that is I garner the most popular use of the class anyhow.
Even in that context it's not really giving you anything tho - the tethers aren't really an issue in static PvE fights, and you already get Minor Resolve from your healer. So what, you get iffy uptime on Minor Protection? You can get decent uptime just from slotting Temporal Guard in your unused ultimate slot. There are far better tank sets that will help your group or yourself way more.
Right it could at least be a strong selfish set! This one is likely outperformed by cheap BoE sets like Livewire. Unless I'm missing something and/or there's something in the patch notes.
A mobile tether which gives Minor Resolve is nice because it's free and Vigor isn't - but that cost isn't even close to being worth a 5 piece. Again a mobile Detonating is fun - but I'm not even sure it's better than a few similar proc sets, Red Mountain etc.
Ravenous might be the best defensive Ult in the game but Necro's pretty reliant on burst Ults to secure a kill right now - so I'm sure I'm not the only one happily running Temp Guard without a reasonable replacement - and it's also one of the best defensive Ults and to me the most fun.
My initial read then says buff it for selfish PvE Tanking for pug tanking Vet DLC - because really defense isn't something Necro's lacking in PvP, still maybe the tankiest class, so no matter what this one does we're probably all waiting for the Gravelord set.
To me it kinda shows a disconnect with how the devs view Necro and what the current state of Necro is.
Like you said, it's already absurdly tanky - even moreso after the Deaden Pain buff. I get that Bone Tyrant is a "tank" line, but that doesn't mean the set needs to be a (mediocre) tank set.
Either use it to supplement the weaknesses of the class (lack of buffs and need for damage), or have the set play into the strengths of class (ulti gen, debuffs, etc).
Instead, we get a set that gives two buffs that nearly every Necromancer will already have, and a change to Corpse gameplay that, while cool in theory, feels a little undercooked.Edited by CameraBeardThePirate on September 15, 2023 3:16PM0 -
propertyOfUndefined✭✭✭✭✭The optimist in me is hoping there are actually changes to the class skills in the patch notes that when combined with the new set will make us go "Ooooh! I get it now!"
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Lozeenge✭✭✭it's kinda awesome how some of these sets have apparent downsides (like templar or nightblade), meanwhile dragonknight is "get both heroism buffs by pressing one key."
just absolutely phenomenalPC-NA / 1600+ CP / PVE sometimes / "Mama didn't raise no tank."10 -
Necrotech_Master✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭i think the sorc set looks cool, it says the monoliths can proc on "initial hits" from those abilities and at a rate of 1 per second, so each time you cast mages fury you get a monolith for example
my problem is my sorc is a healer, not dps lol
a lot of the other sets look really niche, could be fun to play around with but not sure how easy it would be to use, as they have very specific proc conditionsplays PC/NA
handle @Necrotech_Master
active player since april 2014
i have my main house (grand topal hideaway) listed in the housing tours, it has multiple target dummies, scribing altar, and grandmaster stations (in progress being filled out), as well as almost every antiquity furnishing on display to preview them
feel free to stop by and use the facilities0 -
Lalothen✭✭✭✭✭Instead of creating new Item sets that no one is going to use with every patch they should use that time to actually make the existing sets useful.
Currently when im making a build i am looking at maybe 15 to 20 different Sets that could be useful for that particular build.
That is for everything, including Monster Sets, Mythics, Arena Weapons and regular Sets.
It is ridiculous that there is hundreds of sets in the game and probably 75% of them are completely useless for anything outside of roleplaying.
I agree; I've been wanting and requesting a set revamp for a while now. There are even sets out there where if they simply rolled them back to a previous iteration, they would once again be viable - an example that I've mentioned before being Queen's Elegance. Hopefully some sort of balance pass is done on sets at some point in the not too distant future.0 -
FangOfTheTwoMoons✭✭✭✭✭it's kinda awesome how some of these sets have apparent downsides (like templar or nightblade), meanwhile dragonknight is "get both heroism buffs by pressing one key."
just absolutely phenomenal
Exactly. I seriously do not know what's going on with the combat team that they could even look at DK and Templar in their current states, then go ahead and come up with these two sets.
All the other sets have "depth" but DK literally only has to press 1 button and it's hands down the strongest of them all.
DKs have been eating swell for a very long time and it looks like it will just continue.
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BetweenMidgets✭✭✭✭✭The DK set is absolutely bonkers... surely it has to be a joke.
In other games, there are people working at the company that champion a class, which helps make sure that someone is advocating for every class and no one gets left behind.
Apparently everyone at ZoS plays a DK.PC-NA9 -
Finedaible✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭RaptorRodeoGod wrote: »Alphawolf01A wrote: »Turtle_Bot wrote: »
I didn't see anything about an "animal compainions" set. I'm not able to spend the data to watch the entire stream....
I thought I heard 1 of them say that there are 21 sets. 7 classes with a set for each of the 3 skill trees.
There will eventually be one for each class tree. They're starting with one per class for now
I wonder how long we will have to wait for new sets though. From the initial offerings during the reveal, I don't really feel like the Endless Dungeon is worth grinding, especially as a NB main.1
