Hot Take: AWA is good

Tenthirty2 · May 2023

Before I was indifferent, just didn't see much benefit to it for me.
Further I feel ZoS devalued some repeatable content, like the "Witch" title. I earned it on my Main and only use it on one Alt, who never had to do the mini-quests to get it.

But what created a minor headache was when I created my main on the EU server, same name as my NA main...
Yeah, trying to track achievements so I know what collectables and unlocks I want for my EU main is a cumbersome mess.
I see BOTH my NA main's and EU main's favourites, etc.

Really wish they would have either introduced a way to filter which characters got what achievements, per server too.
Or just give us the ability to toggle AWA on or off.
I know, the claimed "benefits" of less server\database load, etc. Yet after the optimizations more often than not my in-game experience is still a laggy mess, on BOTH servers.

Browiseth · May 2023

i can't believe we live in a world where this is a hot take

zos removing one of the most pointless and arbitrary grinds (doing achievements all over again) is one of the best changes they ever made

SaffronCitrusflower · May 2023

Elsonso wrote: »

There is hardly a day that goes by where I don't curse AWA. It's nice that people don't have to repeat Achievements on every character, and for some of those Achievements, I agree... but now no one can. There are unmarked quests and events that are fun to do, even without the Achievement reward, that they decided to implement as achievements, and of course, these are all one and done. Sort of like a book or movie that is always around, but can only be experienced once in a lifetime

Same here. Account wide titles makes sense, but AWA just screws up individual toon tracking. AWA eliminates the desire to create more than about 5 toons because there is no reason to get an achievement more than once on alt toons now. This is one of the major instances where ZOS completely ignored the feedback of 80% of their customer base prior to making the change.

Daggerfell0929 · May 2023

Every other MMO has account wide achives, it is the industry standard. WoW, New World, FF14

SerafinaWaterstar · May 2023

Daggerfell0929 wrote: »

Every other MMO has account wide achives, it is the industry standard. WoW, New World, FF14

Care not a jot what other MMOs do.

I used achievements to track character progress across all my 18 chars. Now its a hot mess. And seriously decreased my playing time as it just gets annoying when you can’t do a zone properly without half of it being marked as complete after you put on foot in it.

Achievements should never have been a way to monitor progress, but it was all there was. Zone guide is ok but generally not that helpful. And has been pointed out, new zones have skyshards all marked off once done on one char.

And no, can’t use add on as on console. Thank the gods for the ESO app otherwise I’d be weeping over pen & paper.

SoraJP · May 2023

Completionist here, I had never even considered making alts until AWA. I had spent thousands of hours completing things on my main, and wouldn't want to make a healer/tank, or even meta dps just to have a blank slate with none of the achievements that i had sunk soooo much time into. With AWA I can actually strive to get trial trifectas and get every single achievement!

To me, AWA was a godsend and made me even more addicted to the game, spending more money than I had ever done before.

Elsonso · May 2023

Daggerfell0929 wrote: »

Every other MMO has account wide achives, it is the industry standard. WoW, New World, FF14

This is what catches a lot of people, I think. It is easy to say that until you realize that ZOS was inconsistent in what an "Achievement" is. They were never intended to be "account-wide", at least not in the "MMO sense" of the term. There are "achievements" that should not be Achievements, and things that should be Achievements, that are not. It's a mess, actually.

peacenote · May 2023

Browiseth wrote: »

i can't believe we live in a world where this is a hot take

zos removing one of the most pointless and arbitrary grinds (doing achievements all over again) is one of the best changes they ever made

We don't. It isn't really a "hot take." Lots of people wanted AwA and were happy with its release. And actually, very very few detractors failed to acknowledge this, myself included.

The issue was the implementation was flawed. It excluded play styles unnecessarily, and even within the confines of the implementation, the choices for what made sense to be individual vs account were less than ideal. For example, why ZOS chose to delete the "I got to level 50!" achievement per character is beyond me. But some GIGANTIC grinds still remain, like the motif achievements. (And yes, we also all know why...$$$$...)

Also the change took away the ability to start the game over from scratch without having to have a second account, which was something that some conpletionists enjoyed. Starting over on a new account is a much bigger grind. So it isn't true that it reduced grind for everyone and is oversinplifying (and thus misrepresenting) the whole situation.

But anyway. We are all aware that AwA was a welcome change for many. That's not news. What would be nice is if ZOS could address some of the things that were collateral damage with the change, as there are many improvements that could be made without taking away the benefits of AwA for those who are happy about it.

Vulkunne · May 2023

I don't dislike AWA, its not terrible but at same time it feels like something is missing when I look thru my characters. Its like all of them are employees at the same company or something, instead of being steadfast individuals out... "doing things". I dunno. Could be worse I guess.

El_Borracho · May 2023

My main gripe with AWA is trying to find what group dungeons a character has not done, or what group event in a public dungeon a character has not done. Usually an issue when trying to amass skill points on a new build or expanding a PVP build. Should have kept those separate

Dojohoda · May 2023

AWA benefits end game PVE since it allows players to continue achievement goals with any alt. The game also seems to be routinely balanced around those goals to make those achievements pointlessly arduous, which is (imo) akin to trolling the player base. The rest of us, who like to just wander about, are left with completed maps on our new alts which is boring. The makers talk about "fantasy" aspects of the game, so, what about that adventurer/explorer/loner/wanderer fantasy? That, like lowbie pvp *cough cough*, was brushed off, forgotten, ignored.

In my opinion, AWA could have been done better.

Coppes · May 2023

I'd be fine with account-wide achievements only if they didnt cause missed dialogue across my older characters.

The 'Crime Pays' achievement NPCs all act like my fresh out of Balfiera characters already met and extorted them.

All the Undaunted dialogues for new dungeons are gone and inaccessible. As well as the 'This One's On Me' dialogue when you travel the world paying the bar tabs of the various members.

It's small stuff to some people, but as a person who does everything with my alts, its really irritating. One thing I definitely miss is the achievement sound and pop ups; it gave me a nostalgic feeling each time it happened.

If these things were fixed I appreciate AwA much more.

SoraJP · May 2023

El_Borracho wrote: »

My main gripe with AWA is trying to find what group dungeons a character has not done, or what group event in a public dungeon a character has not done. Usually an issue when trying to amass skill points on a new build or expanding a PVP build. Should have kept those separate

You can see which group dungeons your character has done on the world map. If the character got that skill point, it will be white. For the ones with a second visit you have to hover over it to see if you have 1 of them, if you have both then the whole thing turns white.

Public dungeons turn white when you have completed the group event (this is a character-specific achievement) and have done the quest(s) associated with it.

FantasticFreddie · May 2023

Dojohoda wrote: »

AWA benefits end game PVE since it allows players to continue achievement goals with any alt. The game also seems to be routinely balanced around those goals to make those achievements pointlessly arduous, which is (imo) akin to trolling the player base. The rest of us, who like to just wander about, are left with completed maps on our new alts which is boring. The makers talk about "fantasy" aspects of the game, so, what about that adventurer/explorer/loner/wanderer fantasy? That, like lowbie pvp *cough cough*, was brushed off, forgotten, ignored.

In my opinion, AWA could have been done better.

As an end game PVE player I 10000000% disagree.

Used to be a great deal of fun getting achievements on alts, and in fact some absolutely bonkers group compositions showed up out of a desire for people to get titles and trifectas on their alts.

Now every single group is exactly the same composition, and once you get the achievement you are after, there's no incentive to go again unless you are planning to score push.

The PVE scene got wrecked by AWA. Almost all my friends stopped playing, my teams were decimated, cores got canceled left and right.

Dova_13 · May 2023

Daggerfell0929 wrote: »

For a completionist that is. I dont want to have to farm out 60,000 achievement points on 6 different characters.

Also I dont understand the "roleplay" perspective of MMOs. Like there are so many game systems that are lore unfriendly such as respawning, or being able to teleport everywhere, or stabbing a boss a thousand times before it dies. When it comes to MMOs sometimes you have to sacrifice roleplay for practical progression systems.

Keep in mind ESO is a MMO first and a Elder Scrolls game second

That is your vision of the game. I don't play eso because it's an mmo, but because it's part of the Tes saga. Players who aren't interested in achievements or roleplaying with each character always had a choice, even without AWA. But those of us who like to play and live the game in a different way have left us no other option.

Since AWA, I only play one character. There is nothing to explore, to rediscover. And I don't need more content. Caves already completed, world bosses finished, dungeons, fishing, everything. All that made sense to play again. Tes is exploration, replayability, going back to a cave you've done a long time ago, and feeling it like it was the first time. I'm not interested in leveling up quickly to get to the end game content. It is a game of progression, of enjoying the missions, the stories and that each character has an identity, a role.

All of that is gone. 2 characters and nothing else. The incentive and motivation to play again have died.

Eso is an mmo, but everyone should be able to play it how they want. Believe me, there are many of us who play because it is an The elder scrolls and not an mmo.

Dojohoda · May 2023

FantasticFreddie wrote: »

Dojohoda wrote: »

AWA benefits end game PVE since it allows players to continue achievement goals with any alt. The game also seems to be routinely balanced around those goals to make those achievements pointlessly arduous, which is (imo) akin to trolling the player base. The rest of us, who like to just wander about, are left with completed maps on our new alts which is boring. The makers talk about "fantasy" aspects of the game, so, what about that adventurer/explorer/loner/wanderer fantasy? That, like lowbie pvp *cough cough*, was brushed off, forgotten, ignored.

In my opinion, AWA could have been done better.

As an end game PVE player I 10000000% disagree.

Used to be a great deal of fun getting achievements on alts, and in fact some absolutely bonkers group compositions showed up out of a desire for people to get titles and trifectas on their alts.

Now every single group is exactly the same composition, and once you get the achievement you are after, there's no incentive to go again unless you are planning to score push.

The PVE scene got wrecked by AWA. Almost all my friends stopped playing, my teams were decimated, cores got canceled left and right.

Fair enough, not all endgamer's wanted it or benefitted from it. I am sad to hear that you lost many friends and teams because of it. I can relate to losing friends and guilds from a PVP perspective and the lack of attention in that area of the game. Personally, I hate AWA and have found no benefit from it, which makes sense because AWA was not implemented for the good of the player.

Amottica · May 2023

kargen27 wrote: »

Account wide achievement was the absolute worst thing for a completionist. With account wide achievements no character unless you have only one can complete an achievement let alone all of them. Okay maybe one character can complete some of the more simple achievements but overall achievements have been cheapened and watered down. There isn't the same sense of accomplishment.

While the design that was implemented has some flaws, AWA is great for completionists as they are not stuck on one character. It was absurd being forced to do everything on multiple characters.

Idk, maybe some like having to do Godslayer on 18 characters.

kargen27 · May 2023

Daggerfell0929 wrote: »

Every other MMO has account wide achives, it is the industry standard. WoW, New World, FF14

Might be why many of us don't play those other MMOs. This one didn't have account wide achievements and when they were introduced it changed the game in a negative way for a lot of players. When I realized account wide achievements was inevitable I hope it would be optional. Unfortunately it was forced on all players.

kargen27 · May 2023

Amottica wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Account wide achievement was the absolute worst thing for a completionist. With account wide achievements no character unless you have only one can complete an achievement let alone all of them. Okay maybe one character can complete some of the more simple achievements but overall achievements have been cheapened and watered down. There isn't the same sense of accomplishment.

While the design that was implemented has some flaws, AWA is great for completionists as they are not stuck on one character. It was absurd being forced to do everything on multiple characters.

Idk, maybe some like having to do Godslayer on 18 characters.

Doing everything on multiple characters was for many of us a major part of why we enjoyed the game. I had multiple master fishermen and was planning on getting others. Can't do that now. I would occasionally spend time trying for the trophies achievement on my main. I was down to needing one item each to finish two achievements and one other needed two or three items. When account wide achievements came to be all of a sudden all my characters had the achievements despite none of them actually earning the achievement. There is no way of knowing what each character contributed so I can't even get the achievements tracking progress on a sticky note just for my own satisfaction of finishing all on one character. This wasn't great for completionists. This made it so unless you play only one character you have no chance of knowing if a character completed most achievements or not.
It is being rewarded for playing the game less.

El_Borracho · May 2023

SoraJP wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

My main gripe with AWA is trying to find what group dungeons a character has not done, or what group event in a public dungeon a character has not done. Usually an issue when trying to amass skill points on a new build or expanding a PVP build. Should have kept those separate

You can see which group dungeons your character has done on the world map. If the character got that skill point, it will be white. For the ones with a second visit you have to hover over it to see if you have 1 of them, if you have both then the whole thing turns white.

Public dungeons turn white when you have completed the group event (this is a character-specific achievement) and have done the quest(s) associated with it.

Oh, I know, but AWA removed the far more convenient way of looking in your achievements for dungeons.

As for the group event in the public dungeons, no, they do not turn white when completed. I thought they did, too, but recently did the one in Eastmarch. It wasn't white but after completing the group, it was clear I already did it.

kringled_1 · May 2023

Public dungeons are more likely to mark as complete on the map when you finish the quest. I don't have any characters that have done the quest and skipped the group event though.
Group event achievements are character specific, because it's the marker for the skill point.

shadyjane62 · May 2023

I disagree. I hate the AWA. I deleted every alt I had (17) the day it was implemented.

I have two now but I am not emotionally invested in them.

I make and delete alts often.

SoraJP · May 2023

El_Borracho wrote: »

SoraJP wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

My main gripe with AWA is trying to find what group dungeons a character has not done, or what group event in a public dungeon a character has not done. Usually an issue when trying to amass skill points on a new build or expanding a PVP build. Should have kept those separate

You can see which group dungeons your character has done on the world map. If the character got that skill point, it will be white. For the ones with a second visit you have to hover over it to see if you have 1 of them, if you have both then the whole thing turns white.

Public dungeons turn white when you have completed the group event (this is a character-specific achievement) and have done the quest(s) associated with it.

Oh, I know, but AWA removed the far more convenient way of looking in your achievements for dungeons.

As for the group event in the public dungeons, no, they do not turn white when completed. I thought they did, too, but recently did the one in Eastmarch. It wasn't white but after completing the group, it was clear I already did it.

For the public dungeons, you have to have completed the quest(s) in that dungeon for it to turn white for that character. You also need to have the achievement (not character-specific) for killing each boss in the dungeon.

Ragnarok0130 · May 2023

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Daggerfell0929 wrote: »

Every other MMO has account wide achives, it is the industry standard. WoW, New World, FF14

Care not a jot what other MMOs do.

I used achievements to track character progress across all my 18 chars. Now its a hot mess. And seriously decreased my playing time as it just gets annoying when you can’t do a zone properly without half of it being marked as complete after you put on foot in it.

Achievements should never have been a way to monitor progress, but it was all there was. Zone guide is ok but generally not that helpful. And has been pointed out, new zones have skyshards all marked off once done on one char.

And no, can’t use add on as on console. Thank the gods for the ESO app otherwise I’d be weeping over pen & paper.

I'm curious what progress tracking did you use achievements for before AWA? The game tells you which quests to do so beyond that what, roleplaying? Personally I love AWA now I can take the proper toon for the trial or dungeon instead of worrying about ensuring the achievement or title is on my main toon.

Ragnarok0130 · May 2023

Kendaric wrote: »

I hate AwA with a passion.

As someone who often plays non-standard characters like Ashlanders and Reachmen, I can no longer prevent certain achievements from showing up on those characters. And then there's the problem of delve boss spawn timers being tied to the achievement, which basically makes doing delves on alts annoying as hell.

How is this even a consideration since YOU earned the achievement and not the character? Your goody two shoes paladin still have never entered a dark brotherhood sanctuary even if he has the silencer title for optional use. I'm sure someone invested enough in the RP aspect to create a Reachman or an Ashlander knows exactly what the toon has done and has not done in its story.

Lumsdenml · May 2023

SoraJP wrote: »

Completionist here, I had never even considered making alts until AWA. I had spent thousands of hours completing things on my main, and wouldn't want to make a healer/tank, or even meta dps just to have a blank slate with none of the achievements that i had sunk soooo much time into. With AWA I can actually strive to get trial trifectas and get every single achievement!

To me, AWA was a godsend and made me even more addicted to the game, spending more money than I had ever done before.

Yeah, same here. It's given me the freedom to play as I want, choose a character I'd like to play for the day and not feel like I'm not making any progress. Love it!

spartaxoxo · May 2023

El_Borracho wrote: »

My main gripe with AWA is trying to find what group dungeons a character has not done, or what group event in a public dungeon a character has not done. Usually an issue when trying to amass skill points on a new build or expanding a PVP build. Should have kept those separate

I believe the public dungeon group events are separate. You can find it in the achievement journal if it's not showing up on your map.

Mik195 · May 2023

El_Borracho wrote: »

SoraJP wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

My main gripe with AWA is trying to find what group dungeons a character has not done, or what group event in a public dungeon a character has not done. Usually an issue when trying to amass skill points on a new build or expanding a PVP build. Should have kept those separate

You can see which group dungeons your character has done on the world map. If the character got that skill point, it will be white. For the ones with a second visit you have to hover over it to see if you have 1 of them, if you have both then the whole thing turns white.

Public dungeons turn white when you have completed the group event (this is a character-specific achievement) and have done the quest(s) associated with it.

Oh, I know, but AWA removed the far more convenient way of looking in your achievements for dungeons.

As for the group event in the public dungeons, no, they do not turn white when completed. I thought they did, too, but recently did the one in Eastmarch. It wasn't white but after completing the group, it was clear I already did it.

I'm on console so the fact that delves turn white when I walk by them is a problem. I'd rather they wait until I pick up the skyshard.

jad11mumbler · May 2023

Oh wow what a hot take.

It's not like the majority of the playerbase like AWA and want more to be account wide, while those who dislike AWA are a tiny, now vocal minority.

Credible_Joe · May 2023

Sometimes I have trouble distinguishing which character has unlocked which memento. I wish AWA had come with filters that show what skins and collectibles each character had earned, especially since that point is already tracked by the achievement itself.