Zenimax; you need to communicate better and more with your customers

Losian · April 2014

Jarnhand wrote: »

Love the game! Yes some horrible horrible bugs and exploits are there, but I have a hope you will take care of your baby, it just goes a bit slow, at least what it seems for us customers.

You need to let your customers know what you are working on when it comes to fixes, bot bans/gold farmers, exploits, know bugs (without broadcasting how to exploit), coming plans etc. Yes I know you have given information about upcoming plans about new content, but to paying customers that are angry at exploits, stuck in bugs etc, that just makes them more frustrated.

When there are bad exploits, game-breaking flaws or bugs in the game; drop everything else and focus on fixing them! Everyone that are in customer relations knows that once you make a customer angry, they are hard to win back, and they also spread their anger...

So please; communicate more, show us you take the flaws/bugs/bot problem/exploits serious! Would hate for this game to go down in flames!

Do you read patch notes? Every single patch note has fixed bugs, mentioned spammers/botters, etc. The dev trackers constantly talks almost exclusively about fixing bugs and battling spammers/bots. Your wording seems to imply that all they are doing is selling new content; I've seen woefully little about new stuff besides Craglorn briefly. They've been very communicative so far.

jschweitz · April 2014

I would love to be able to remove all of the non-english posts as an option in the dev tracker forum, it's odd to hunt down the english-only stuff as it's randomly mixed among the columns.

SaibotLiu · April 2014

birdeye wrote: »

SaibotLiu wrote: »

What exactly would you want them to say that they havent already said? There was already a state of the game release, and CS posted a timeline for upcoming fixes.

People are so pampered these days. They now expect all their specific and special needs to be accommodated to, rather than just being happy when they get something. When they do get what they want, you'll no doubt move on to crying about something else that isnt going your exact specific way this moment.

Get over yourselves, in a hurry.

By the way, when you get the answer "there is no date" or "we dont have an estimate on the time frame for that." That's your freakin answer. Just because you want answers right bloody now this moment, its not going magically conjure a different answer for you.

So then if you cable, telephone, or electrical company said we have no date for the promised service you would be ok with that? Admittedly a game service is a luxury not an essential service it is the same idea. All I'm saying is that we should hold them to a higher standard. Game Developers are able to get away with releasing a buggy games because we accept it as the norm as opposed to the exception. Being pampered is asking for stuff for free that's not what has been stated or asked here.

You already answered your own question. Comparing essential services to entertainment software is really dumb, they're in no way comparable. And regardless, in the event of catastrophes and natural disasters those services may not be restored for untold weeks. Comparing the launch of an MMO to a hurricane makes more sense than what you've done there anyways.

As for holding developers to higher standard, yeah sure. Would you know the first thing about programming code? Im guessing not, so you wouldnt have the first idea about what kind of standard we should be holding them to in the first place. So at the end of the day, its just whiney entitlement from an uneducated customer. That's not the best of looks.

birdeye · April 2014

SaibotLiu wrote: »

birdeye wrote: »

SaibotLiu wrote: »

What exactly would you want them to say that they havent already said? There was already a state of the game release, and CS posted a timeline for upcoming fixes.

People are so pampered these days. They now expect all their specific and special needs to be accommodated to, rather than just being happy when they get something. When they do get what they want, you'll no doubt move on to crying about something else that isnt going your exact specific way this moment.

Get over yourselves, in a hurry.

By the way, when you get the answer "there is no date" or "we dont have an estimate on the time frame for that." That's your freakin answer. Just because you want answers right bloody now this moment, its not going magically conjure a different answer for you.

So then if you cable, telephone, or electrical company said we have no date for the promised service you would be ok with that? Admittedly a game service is a luxury not an essential service it is the same idea. All I'm saying is that we should hold them to a higher standard. Game Developers are able to get away with releasing a buggy games because we accept it as the norm as opposed to the exception. Being pampered is asking for stuff for free that's not what has been stated or asked here.

You already answered your own question. Comparing essential services to entertainment software is really dumb, they're in no way comparable. And regardless, in the event of catastrophes and natural disasters those services may not be restored for untold weeks. Comparing the launch of an MMO to a hurricane makes more sense than what you've done there anyways.

As for holding developers to higher standard, yeah sure. Would you know the first thing about programming code? Im guessing not, so you wouldnt have the first idea about what kind of standard we should be holding them to in the first place. So at the end of the day, its just whiney entitlement from an uneducated customer. That's not the best of looks.

Actually I would, If you must know I an a college educated individual who works in IT so I know what it takes to write code and know what it takes to debug code. Do I do it on the same scale as ZOS no I don't. You however missed the entire point of my post and started making unfounded assumptions. Should I be assuming the same thing about you? Considering your unable to grasp the similarities of essential and luxury services. The whole point of my post was to point out that as a service oriented company you have certain obligations to your customers you can't make promises or change things mid stream without giving an update. In the business world doing so would cause lost of revenue, loss of customers, and potentially lawsuits. As customers we should hold game developers to the same standard that of any other program developer. Yes its a game but your still paying for a service. If this was a accounting program or a Enterprise system they would be trying to find a way just to survive. Point is we let game developers get away providing us with a faulty service. Is any program perfect no, there will always be bugs in a new release however there is level that is acceptable there is a point that exceeds that. As I said we should hold Zenimax and every game developers to a higher standard or we will continue to get unfinished games.

Hexanon · April 2014

SaibotLiu wrote: »

birdeye wrote: »

As for holding developers to higher standard, yeah sure. Would you know the first thing about programming code? Im guessing not, so you wouldnt have the first idea about what kind of standard we should be holding them to in the first place. So at the end of the day, its just whiney entitlement from an uneducated customer. That's not the best of looks.

Some of us do, and I can assure you that the concept of knowingly releasing buggy code is a gaming concept only. I am and have worked with many development organisations and if we had the same poor customer service we would have lost all our customers faster than you could say 'Troll'. It's called customer service for a reason and something that MMOs need to get right. If someone is unhappy they are not a troll, they are an unhappy customer. If you are happy great but you do not have the right to determine what makes a customer happy or not. Even if the opinions are unfounded, they are still unhappy and should be treated accordingly.

Lack of communication, information and a callous lack-lustre attitude is not customer service. I for one would actually like customer service.

Kenny_McCormick · April 2014

i tbh am glad that the GMs are finally putting an end to bots...........on another note i dont want a justice system....this isnt skyrim. yes it is Elder Scrolls. HOWEVER an MMO shouldnt be so stressful on what decisions you make lol...have a justice system (law system) will make people want to quit the game cause it will make it HARDER to get provision materials. also only way they would make a law system is if EVERY SINGLE NPC was attackable....including Quest NPCs. as that wont happen i see no Law system in the future..again this isnt skyrim...its an MMO......if u want a law system go play one of the single player Elder Scrolls games!

Jarnhand · April 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Jarnhand wrote: »

You need to let your customers know what you are working on when it comes to fixes, bot bans/gold farmers, exploits, know bugs (without broadcasting how to exploit), coming plans etc.

We can assure you we're hard at work fixing bugs - and these forums have been quite helpful in identifying and detailing these problems. Communication is also key, and we've been regularly updating the In-Progress Known Issues thread, and posting about ongoing problems in Developer Discussions. You can also view general staff posts with the Dev Tracker.

We're working on revamping the forum layout to make our posts more visible, and accessible. The staff post signifier and ability to jump between staff posts was added recently, and we're working on several other improvements we hope to roll out soon.

1- Thanks for a reply!
2- Thanks for the tracker link, didnt have that
3- Well what you REALLY need to revamp is the Vamp, no pun intended. I have been playing MMOs since I started playing daoc in 2001. And this situation right now is seriously bad, and not a word from Zenimax on if they even consider it broken or a problem. And no, the AoE cap will NOT fix the problem, a vamp can still heal for up to about 1800 a sec:
http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/249ojv/there_is_no_counterplay_to_the_vr10_vampire/

I HOPE there is no word yet because you are not sure how to fix it, but even so you need to speak up to your customers.

Love the game, but Zenimax you need to speak up on the matter, or your loyal/hardcore/possible long time customers leaves, and you are left with the casuals and fotm kids. And the later group will also leave, just a few more months down the road. Casuals leave because they get bored/done playing/get facesmashed in PvP. The fotm crowd leaves when their fotm builds get nerfed, and while getting there, ruin the game for many. Its the hardcore players that you need to focus on, they are the ones that turn into loyal customers for year after year. Look at daoc! DAoC is still alive today, so many years later due to the hardcore PvP fan base.

People that are serious about a MMO can not stand for broken/OPen/gamebreaking exploits/bugs like this for long, and at same time total silence from Zenimax. As far as I know there are no word at all if you even this is bug/exploit/need adjustment/working as intended.

Bad reviews are starting to show up on the net. And do you think it will attract more players if it gets common knowledge on the internet how broken the game is right now due to how laughable broken vampires are?! It will not, anyone seriously looking for a new MMO to invest time in, will turn before opening the door. They see all these posts, read the facts, see the youtube vids, and look for another game!

Zenimax; you need to speak up on matters this grave, you need to communicate and do damage control! My impression is that now this is close to a breaking point. No fix/info on the matter in 1-2 weeks, and the serious crowd do not resub, or just plain cancels. And then its downhill from there. Then you will have a F2P dying game in less then 1 year, dead content, hoards of bots (if you think bots are bad now, imagine how unplayable it will be with F2P) and full of 'trash' players (people playing DOTA2 knows what I mean).

Harakh · April 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Jarnhand wrote: »

You need to let your customers know what you are working on when it comes to fixes, bot bans/gold farmers, exploits, know bugs (without broadcasting how to exploit), coming plans etc.

We can assure you we're hard at work fixing bugs - and these forums have been quite helpful in identifying and detailing these problems. Communication is also key, and we've been regularly updating the In-Progress Known Issues thread, and posting about ongoing problems in Developer Discussions. You can also view general staff posts with the Dev Tracker.

We're working on revamping the forum layout to make our posts more visible, and accessible. The staff post signifier and ability to jump between staff posts was added recently, and we're working on several other improvements we hope to roll out soon.

What about EU Server in EU

?

Razzak · April 2014

Altheina wrote: »

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Jarnhand wrote: »

You need to let your customers know what you are working on when it comes to fixes, bot bans/gold farmers, exploits, know bugs (without broadcasting how to exploit), coming plans etc.

We can assure you we're hard at work fixing bugs - and these forums have been quite helpful in identifying and detailing these problems. Communication is also key, and we've been regularly updating the In-Progress Known Issues thread, and posting about ongoing problems in Developer Discussions. You can also view general staff posts with the Dev Tracker.

We're working on revamping the forum layout to make our posts more visible, and accessible. The staff post signifier and ability to jump between staff posts was added recently, and we're working on several other improvements we hope to roll out soon.

Yes this is definitely step to the right direction

Can't wait to see the new forum layout

If that's the same kind of promise as EU server being actually in EU, you might wait longer than you think.

Bromburak · April 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Jarnhand wrote: »

You need to let your customers know what you are working on when it comes to fixes, bot bans/gold farmers, exploits, know bugs (without broadcasting how to exploit), coming plans etc.

We can assure you we're hard at work fixing bugs - and these forums have been quite helpful in identifying and detailing these problems. Communication is also key, and we've been regularly updating the In-Progress Known Issues thread, and posting about ongoing problems in Developer Discussions. You can also view general staff posts with the Dev Tracker.

We're working on revamping the forum layout to make our posts more visible, and accessible. The staff post signifier and ability to jump between staff posts was added recently, and we're working on several other improvements we hope to roll out soon.

No doubt that you guys working hard but you cannot speak for your management at the moment. They are responsible for any kind of problems and finding a proper way to advice staff and how to deal with public.

Many of us follow Matt Firor and Zenimax visions over years and his fan base is huge since DAOC. We actually appreciate your hard work and every single step of TESO development in the last years and most of us were thankful for every single dev blog you have shared with us.

But I think Matt Firor or at least any leader should be more present these days because a lot of things are not running well right now and a big part of the community is disappointed, not because of bugs its more like very bad communication.

One reason why many players trust in Matts team is because he was never acting like classic Managers in this industry forgetting their roots for money.
He always had a gamer for gamer attitude and was "close" to the community without excuses or useless marketing talk.

Matt will not read this anyway but i am sure that he does care about the community. At the moment it feels like reading news or maintenance templates all day or reading marketing when anyone from Zenimax is posting any infos.

Sorry, but thats the current situation.

Bromburak · May 2014

Bromburak wrote:

No doubt that you guys working hard but you cannot speak for your management at the moment. They are responsible for any kind of problems and finding a proper way to advice staff and how to deal with public.

Many of us follow Matt Firor and Zenimax visions over years and his fan base is huge since DAOC. We actually appreciate your hard work and every single step of TESO development in the last years and most of us were thankful for every single dev blog you have shared with us.

But I think Matt Firor or at least any leader should be more present these days because a lot of things are not running well right now and a big part of the community is disappointed, not because of bugs its more like very bad communication.

One reason why many players trust in Matts team is because he was never acting like classic Managers in this industry forgetting their roots for money.
He always had a gamer for gamer attitude and was "close" to the community without excuses or useless marketing talk.

Matt will not read this anyway but i am sure that he does care about the community. At the moment it feels like reading news or maintenance templates all day or reading marketing when anyone from Zenimax is posting any infos.

Sorry, but thats the current situation.

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

ZOS_AlanG · May 2014

Bromburak wrote: »

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

Several members of the development team, including Matt Firor, will also be participating in a Reddit AMA later today: http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/24bd5b/zenimax_craglornpostlaunchgeneral_ama_this/

GossiTheDog · May 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

Several members of the development team, including Matt Firor, will also be participating in a Reddit AMA later today: http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/24bd5b/zenimax_craglornpostlaunchgeneral_ama_this/

"Craglorn post-launch AMA" later today... when Craglorn didn't launch :P

AngryNord · May 2014

Bromburak wrote: »

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

Looks like this Update 1 will pretty much make ESO into what it should've been like at pre-release...

Windshadow_ESO · May 2014

It is almost intern season where companies can "hire" high tech trained students for next to nothing for the summer months.
Perhaps a few with extensive exp with the both beta and launch would be a good addition to the support system?

TheRealSkippy · May 2014

If you have the money left, you should hire 2 more people for customer service, who only have the job to transport information between zenimax and the customers.

Not like writing to any problem "they are working on it" every 3 hours, but really talking with different programers in their office, with administrators, with everybody who is involved in doing anything that the customers want to know.
I call them "Zenimax-Customer Interfacer" ^^

Image the following.
- ZCI surfing the forums after new patch, seeing what happens
- sees that people start spamming about a "forever loading screen" problem
- ZCI makes a new Thread just about that and pins it somehow, that the affected people can see it
- ZCI writes the link to the created post into the other posts
- ZCI writes in the new main Thread, that he just saw all the problems, and he goes talking with the devs
- ZCI 10 minutes later: "I just told em, they have to finish something and check it in about 20 min"
- ZCI after that "ok they take a look now"
- ZCI some mins after that "They said something about the memory"
- ZCI after that "So they are working on it right now, needs a little time to test around how to get the error"
etc.

Imagine the satisfaction of the customers who have such problems, when they actually see how and what is done about their problems.

continous information about a problem, brought directly to the customer is the key of fighting the anger you produce.

still a great game ^^

AlexDougherty · May 2014

TheRealSkippy wrote: »

- ZCI writes in the new main Thread, that he just saw all the problems, and he goes talking with the devs
- ZCI 10 minutes later: "I just told em, they have to finish something and check it in about 20 min"

Nice scenario, would be great, but two problems, sadly;
First I doubt the Forum Mods have direct access to the devs, they probably just have an email address to apprise them of bugs/glitches
Second, I really doubt any Dev would define any kind of timeline, they would probably say "got to fix this first, then about ten other things, then I'll try to look at it", and wouldn't give a deadline once they have looked at it.

But nice scenario. (*)

LonePirate · May 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

Several members of the development team, including Matt Firor, will also be participating in a Reddit AMA later today: http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/24bd5b/zenimax_craglornpostlaunchgeneral_ama_this/

@ZOS_AlanG‌
Why is there an AMA on Reddit when that precious time of ZOS VIPs would be better spent hosting an AMA on the official forums so that they can address actual player questions and problems? At least one or two people from ZOS should host a daily AMA right here so that paying customers like myself can actually receive help and answers instead of being ignored as we wander aimlessly without assistance due to the overloaded and ineffectual customer support system.

Jadakin · May 2014

GossiTheDog wrote: »

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

Several members of the development team, including Matt Firor, will also be participating in a Reddit AMA later today: http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/24bd5b/zenimax_craglornpostlaunchgeneral_ama_this/

"Craglorn post-launch AMA" later today... when Craglorn didn't launch :P

It says postlaunchgeneral. My guess it will discuss Craglorn and Post Launch General questions.

GreySix · May 2014

Eris wrote: »

Now the question is, how can they give you more. They cannot tell you what they are doing to fix the problem as then the gold spammers, the botters, etc., would have programmed their software to get around it by the time it was deployed. So the only thing they can say is we know, we're working on it.

Will provide a simple example: In SWTOR, when I entered a bug report or fix recommendation, I got a reply stating something was (or was not) being worked.

Have entered at least a dozen bug reports in-game for ESO, and have received ... nothing in reply.

Jarnhand · May 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

Several members of the development team, including Matt Firor, will also be participating in a Reddit AMA later today: http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/24bd5b/zenimax_craglornpostlaunchgeneral_ama_this/

Thanks for the info!
Thanks to Zenimax for at least sharing some info on a few vital matters, just wish it was more and less vague

Also, agree with some other people here, do this on the official forums, we like it all in one place, and they should be easily noticed and read

Keep up the good work!

Edit:
AAaarrrgggghhhhh please stop using the reddit, cannot even find the ama wrapup there... needed to get it from another thread, here is the wrapup:
http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/24hrc8/may_1_reddit_ama_qa_transcriptsummary/

So yes please oh please host these things yourselves, or at least post the wrapups easily accessable here on the official forums.

Delith · May 2014

LonePirate wrote: »

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Bromburak wrote: »

Nice timing Mr. President.

http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en/news/post/2014/05/01/the-road-ahead---may-1st

Several members of the development team, including Matt Firor, will also be participating in a Reddit AMA later today: http://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/24bd5b/zenimax_craglornpostlaunchgeneral_ama_this/

@ZOS_AlanG‌
Why is there an AMA on Reddit when that precious time of ZOS VIPs would be better spent hosting an AMA on the official forums so that they can address actual player questions and problems? At least one or two people from ZOS should host a daily AMA right here so that paying customers like myself can actually receive help and answers instead of being ignored as we wander aimlessly without assistance due to the overloaded and ineffectual customer support system.

Hi! I'm a paying customer who made a reddit account just for the AMA. You could have too, but chose not to, and opted instead to write a forum post complaining about the situation.

I feel like my time was better spent.

GreySix · May 2014

Delith wrote: »

Hi! I'm a paying customer who made a reddit account just for the AMA. You could have too, but chose not to, and opted instead to write a forum post complaining about the situation.

I feel like my time was better spent.

I disagree, because Reddit sucks, and this forum was established for those who purchased the game. Otherwise, why have this forum at all?

Cherryblossom · May 2014

GreySix wrote: »

Delith wrote: »

Hi! I'm a paying customer who made a reddit account just for the AMA. You could have too, but chose not to, and opted instead to write a forum post complaining about the situation.

I feel like my time was better spent.

I disagree, because Reddit sucks, and this forum was established for those who purchased the game. Otherwise, why have this forum at all?

This is the ESO official Forum, I am right am I. Has anyone told Zenimax?
We ask for more communication, and some of the questions we have been asking, you answer on a completely different forum, it's then up to the community to search for Zenimax's answers in everywhere but their OWN forum.

Is this really what you call communicating with your customers???

Just an idea, you can see the threads that relate to the answers you have given else where, why not update those threads with the official answers.

Is it that the Developers believe Reddit have a much better Forum than you @ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ or is there another reason that they don't engage the community on your Forum?

Procela · May 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

Communication is also key, and we've been regularly updating the In-Progress Known Issues thread, and posting about ongoing problems in Developer Discussions.

I'm sorry but if you think crossing out the one-two quests you manage to "fix" with each small patch counts as "regularly updating" then this might be why people are upset with the poor communication. There are dozens of issues players have brought up in that "known issues" thread that have never made it to that list, nor even been confirmed as being looked in to at all.

Still have yet to see any confirmation in there about broken Mundus stones, passive skills / gear bonuses not applying to your character correctly and forcing a relog to get them back. Still no update for those of us constantly being unknown error spammed out of the game.

AryaWythers · May 2014

Cherryblossom wrote: »

GreySix wrote: »

Delith wrote: »

Hi! I'm a paying customer who made a reddit account just for the AMA. You could have too, but chose not to, and opted instead to write a forum post complaining about the situation.

I feel like my time was better spent.

I disagree, because Reddit sucks, and this forum was established for those who purchased the game. Otherwise, why have this forum at all?

This is the ESO official Forum, I am right am I. Has anyone told Zenimax?
We ask for more communication, and some of the questions we have been asking, you answer on a completely different forum, it's then up to the community to search for Zenimax's answers in everywhere but their OWN forum.

Is this really what you call communicating with your customers???

Just an idea, you can see the threads that relate to the answers you have given else where, why not update those threads with the official answers.

Is it that the Developers believe Reddit have a much better Forum than you @ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌ or is there another reason that they don't engage the community on your Forum?

I'm sure it was more entertaining for them to sit there and watch us fight for five hours than to give us information they posted on Reddit. Who knows maybe it shows how poor communication is at their own company.

I love sending tons of information to some low level support agent who couldn't even help with anything if he did have the power only to have it escalated and the higher tier support agent has no clue as to what your issue is! Rinse and Repeat...of course after hours of waiting.

Dita · May 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

...You can also view general staff posts with the Dev Tracker.

We're working on revamping the forum layout to make our posts more visible, and accessible...

I almost broke my eyes looking at the Developer Tracker

but, I glad to hear you are working on the new forum layout !

Blackwidow · May 2014

Jarnhand wrote: »

ZENIMAX; YOU NEED TO COMMUNICATE BETTER AND MORE WITH YOUR CUSTOMERS

What I find hilarious is, this is a no brainer. Of course customers would like better support.

However, even on this simple topic, you have players coming here to fight against this idea.

Grithok · May 2014

I love that they use reddit, the only site I know with a worse layout than this one, and also a site when the founder defended the pedo areas of the site.

Brunlea · May 2014

ZOS_AlanG wrote: »

We're working on revamping the forum layout to make our posts more visible, and accessible. The staff post signifier and ability to jump between staff posts was added recently, and we're working on several other improvements we hope to roll out soon.

Good, try XenForo or Invision. This software is bloomin' awful with the way you have it set out.