Anyone else seeing groups disband all over the place?

Cigy · July 2022

two out of three of my current prog groups are going to disband if this goes live (Assuming the third will too, just haven't talked to them about it yet).
A handful of prominent influencers on Youtube/ESOU/Twitch/ETC have either stated they may quit, or already have..OMC is cut, I'm seeing multiple guilds disband their progs and training runs etc.

This seems like absolute chaos. This patch really can't go live like this without killing so much of the game for so many people.

FantasticFreddie · July 2022

Yep. The vAS prog I just barely started is DOA. My vDSR team, that was looking forward to starting hardmode within the next few weeks, has at least 3 people poised to quit, and if these changes go live? We won't have the damage to do it, period.

jecks33 · July 2022

I didn't logged in since monday, I have lost my enthusiasm in this game

mikemacon · July 2022

Nope.

colossalvoids · July 2022

Witnessed couple in discord and have a gut feeling my group won't be up next patch if nothing major changes. As far as people's feedback I've talked with goes. Some gave it a chance already but I guess they'll need to find replacements going forward if that's going live as is.

Riptide · July 2022

Every discord I am on, from raiding to trading guilds there are chunks of folks talking about putting activities on hold.

Disgust with the “just trust us” tweet followed by this soup sandwich really is ubiquitous.

And frankly I think anything short of a full throated apology and scrapping the update wholesale will have pretty significant lasting damage.

As in right about half of everyone seems to be looking at their options for where to land next.

If it goes live in this state it isn’t theoretical or opinion anymore, there will be an exodus.

If they only adjust it in an anemic and cursory way, same result I think. It takes time to read the forums to see whats what, read these long patch notes, roll to PTS, discuss results, watch videos on others results, on and on.

And at a certain point of absolutely wasted recreation time the contempt will be baked into the cake, sadly.

JustAGoodPlayer · July 2022

Cigy wrote: »

two out of three of my current prog groups are going to disband if this goes live (Assuming the third will too, just haven't talked to them about it yet).
A handful of prominent influencers on Youtube/ESOU/Twitch/ETC have either stated they may quit, or already have..OMC is cut, I'm seeing multiple guilds disband their progs and training runs etc.

This seems like absolute chaos. This patch really can't go live like this without killing so much of the game for so many people.

Do not worry i hope all will change. And this patch will not be a hit to players.

But after some changes yes - a lot of depression.

But it was even some funny thingth )))

As exampke mistakes where skill becomes weeker in healing power with leveling ))) (yellow morph of vigor)

Some new concept of mmorpg ))) lol

But i hope ZOS already see that we all are angry and second PTS will not be such big dissapoitment.

Or than we better become angry again

Vaoh · July 2022

Yes. I’m talking high level groups as well, players who’d push Swashbuckler Supreme. However I’m sure nearly all progs will be ended as well since the DPS setback will completely ruin their chances.

I’d say Week 1 PTS for Update 35, is genuinely worse than Morrowind’s balance when it came out.

GreatGildersleeve · July 2022

The Great Exodus version 2.0

peacenote · July 2022

Riptide wrote: »

Every discord I am on, from raiding to trading guilds there are chunks of folks talking about putting activities on hold.

Disgust with the “just trust us” tweet followed by this soup sandwich really is ubiquitous.

Yea, this is what I'm seeing as well.

And I would like to add that after AwA dropped, my groups are already having a much tougher time getting fills. We just went through and weathered an exodus by a bunch of people who left or started playing significantly less after the loss of alt tracking.

The bottom line is that a lot of people prefer to play with something to work towards. Part of the AwA discussions were filled with disdain for those people and I don't know why. I'm definitely one of them. I always log in with a goal in mind... do my writs, make progress on the main story, whatever.

People first lost a reason to re-do content on other characters (the to-do list/acknowledgement) and now another chunk of players feels like they are facing loss of access to group content they have been working towards... in some cases for YEARS.

If or when ZOS finally reaches their goal of making the content more accessible, there may not be enough people left to experience it. Especially for trials. It's HARD to find 12 people available at the same time who want to tackle the same goal. ZOS really needs to stop with the sledgehammer approach if they want people to stick with them.

Note I'm not saying the game will immediately die or I'm quitting. But I am seeing a slow erosion of the community due to so many frequent, massive disruptions. It's sad.

ESO_Nightingale · July 2022

Unironically going to jump to WoW full-time if this goes live. zos never learns or listens and i'm honestly sick of stressing over it. As many issues as WoW has, it's at least got class identity and fun combat, can't say that'll be the case with this crap launching. Zos hates dots being as powerful as they are in pve and i seriously have no idea why. It's fun combat to cast a ton of dots and maintain them. Keeps it on your toes and interesting. Spamming a spammable for over 10 seconds isn't my idea of fun combat. these changes only hurt everyone involved. they help literally no-one from several different directions.

Svenja · July 2022

I won't quit the game, but I am pretty sure my current godslayer-progression-group will have to disband as there is simply no way we will be able to accomplish that trifecta if those changes go live. No way. I mean, we are having problems right now on the live server, I really don't want to see our performance after the changes.
Let's hope we get our [snip] together and get GS before the patch hits.

[Edited for Censor Bypass]

Pevey · July 2022

JustAGoodPlayer wrote: »

As exampke mistakes where skill becomes weeker in healing power with leveling ))) (yellow morph of vigor)

I know it’s hard to believe, but it’s a feature, not a bug. At least, that’s how it is supposed to work on live. As you level it, the time is supposed to increase, and the hps goes down. If they changed it to a fixed length, they probably forgot to remove this other part, which always was a silly feature to me anyway.

As to the point of the post, I have friends who have been trying to get me into destiny 2 forever, and I never had time. Now, I do.

Dalsinthus · July 2022

My raid group has the attitude of “there is nothing we can do about this; we’ll deal with it when the update launches.” That said I’m personally reconsidering whether to continue raiding (or just play casually going forward). I’m also hearing second hand of many groups disbanding.

Elsonso · July 2022

The combat team has four more weeks of PTS testing to tune what they are rolling out.

I am sure they are full turtle right now and won't talk to us anymore, but they hinted during ESO Live that PTS Weeks 3 and 4 would have some combat team updates based on player response during Week 1.

JustAGoodPlayer · July 2022

peacenote wrote: »

Riptide wrote: »

Every discord I am on, from raiding to trading guilds there are chunks of folks talking about putting activities on hold.

Disgust with the “just trust us” tweet followed by this soup sandwich really is ubiquitous.

Yea, this is what I'm seeing as well.

And I would like to add that after AwA dropped, my groups are already having a much tougher time getting fills. We just went through and weathered an exodus by a bunch of people who left or started playing significantly less after the loss of alt tracking.

The bottom line is that a lot of people prefer to play with something to work towards. Part of the AwA discussions were filled with disdain for those people and I don't know why. I'm definitely one of them. I always log in with a goal in mind... do my writs, make progress on the main story, whatever.

People first lost a reason to re-do content on other characters (the to-do list/acknowledgement) and now another chunk of players feels like they are facing loss of access to group content they have been working towards... in some cases for YEARS.

If or when ZOS finally reaches their goal of making the content more accessible, there may not be enough people left to experience it. Especially for trials. It's HARD to find 12 people available at the same time who want to tackle the same goal. ZOS really needs to stop with the sledgehammer approach if they want people to stick with them.

Note I'm not saying the game will immediately die or I'm quitting. But I am seeing a slow erosion of the community due to so many frequent, massive disruptions. It's sad.

We try do god slayer on only HA builds by the way.

I can not say that all goes perfect but - we kill red boss on 2 atros it fly. But we have a META tank who say so much about buff sets and how he likes it, that after third try we desband our party )))

We just tired from him ))) And it was hard to find another tank ))) Or HA player to exchange one of us to tank role )))

So yes people are always a problem )))

starkerealm · July 2022

One of the primary members of my group has disappeared. Like, I still see him posting in discord, but he hasn't been on comms since Monday. Normally four or five of us are in Discord nightly, and last time I checked, he hadn't logged in a couple days.

It could be a coincidence, could be something else, but this is unusual.

So, yeah, my team may already be suffering losses. I don't yet know.

dhoward5b14_ESO · July 2022

None of my groups already disbanded, and there may be changes on the PTS so I think it is premature to do so. If the DPS drop is the 20-30% it appears to be then my groups are in trouble...

Group 1 - 75% chance to disband. Group has cleared all vet trials but sometimes struggles.
Group 2 - Almost certain to disband. Group just started a vCR+3 prog. DPS is not high but they are good at mechs. I fear the portals will become impossible to consistently finish.
Group 3 - HM group may be OK. Just started vDSR and not doing HM yet. vDSR HM may be out of reach but we can do something else.

If 2 of my groups disband I will leave.

Pevey · July 2022

Some holding out hope for major changes in the remaining 4 weeks of pts. Past history shows not how zos works. There will be some adjustments, but the majority and the spirit of these changes are going live. The chances are 99.9%. In fact, the more we explain to them why it is a terrible idea, the more likely they will do it anyway.

I’m sorry to be a downer, but the people at zos who came up with these ideas in the first place are not suddenly rethinking everything. They are wondering why we don’t “get it” and thinking maybe we will eventually, after it’s released.

Elsonso · July 2022

Pevey wrote: »

Some holding out hope for major changes in the remaining 4 weeks of pts. Past history shows not how zos works. There will be some adjustments, but the majority and the spirit of these changes are going live. The chances are 99.9%. In fact, the more we explain to them why it is a terrible idea, the more likely they will do it anyway.

I’m sorry to be a downer, but the people at zos who came up with these ideas in the first place are not suddenly rethinking everything. They are wondering why we don’t “get it” and thinking maybe we will eventually, after it’s released.

No, they are not going to walk back the big ticket items. They are not going to walk back 20 second DoTs. They are not going to walk back flat LA and HA damage. They are not going to walk back the change to Oakensoul.

These things are changes that players can adapt to. Players are already demonstrating that it is possible to adapt.

What I expect them to do is tweak numbers, not to restore them to values that are on Live, but to make it easier to get to the level where adaptation is successful for more players.

We will know the full extent of this when PTS Week 4 drops.

Until then, my belief is that it is too soon for people to throw in the towel. Besides, no towel throwing needs to be done until this update is put on Live. The game is unchanged until then. If anything, the time between now and then can be used to tie up loose ends, finish off that bucket list, etc.

divnyi · July 2022

Elsonso wrote: »

These things are changes that players can adapt to. Players are already demonstrating that it is possible to adapt.

It's possible to adapt to everything, but the question everybody will ask themselves is "do I want to adapt to unfun gameplay?"
I know the answer for myself.

pklemming · July 2022

Guild numbers and prog groups/trials? Things are not looking good, 1 down and 1 shaky right now. Will lose 1 person from out 4 man prog and maybe 2. People are not even waiting for the patch to hit. Craglorn pugs are non-existent a lot of the time,

If this is not reverted, there is no doubt they will change numbers.

This is a regular thing, though. Give us a bad patch, then give us a more acceptable version to soften the blow... because... y'know, we are all 5 years olds....

Week 1 of proposed changes should be at least close to the final release, with players just needing to find bugs and problems with the patch. It is never that way here.

My hope is that they go back to the drawing board and reconsider their approach, and stop the cycle of extreme patch for a less extreme patch, whilst expecting us to be happy about it.

There are far too many things wrong with the patch.

With the amount of outrage over this, I expect it to hit game news soon as well, which will not be great for them enticing their new players.

Mr_Stach · July 2022

The entire Frost Warden Discord is in Shambles, like last PTS cycle we had a ton of engagement a lot of testing. But they just Massacred Warden this Patch and it's not just the AoE stuff.

The Advanced Species Rework is such a huge nerf to Warden, since at any given time it adds between 6-12% Damage to Wardens Damage, all the rest of these nerfs hit 6-12% harder.

We had a 20k Drop in DPS which means probably a 30k Drop to live since the changes to the Target Dummy.

It's just wild.

Pevey · July 2022

Elsonso wrote: »

No, they are not going to walk back the big ticket items. They are not going to walk back 20 second DoTs. They are not going to walk back flat LA and HA damage. They are not going to walk back the change to Oakensoul.

These things are changes that players can adapt to. Players are already demonstrating that it is possible to adapt.

What I expect them to do is tweak numbers, not to restore them to values that are on Live, but to make it easier to get to the level where adaptation is successful for more players.

Like I said, the majority of the changes and the spirit of the changes will go through. If they do exactly as you say, the majority and the spirit go through. And many people will not be happy.

Fans of this game are unhappy and untrusting because the changes show that the combat team of this game DOES NOT LIKE THE COMBAT in this game. Huh? Really? They want to delete it and replace it with something else. Um, okay. Sure. But if you are a big fan of the combat in this game, of course you are going to be upset. These are not minor changes. They are completely, intentionally changing the way combat feels and functions in the game. If you are a fan, and the developer makes clear that they are not a fan, there needs to be a complete 180 and public apology to have any shot at regaining trust after something like that.

But that will never happen. They think they are right. Maybe their new combat that they are creating will be more popular than the old combat. Remains to be seen. I think it is a doomed effort to try to design a combat system for an audience who dislikes combat and would prefer housing/trading/etc, which are all perfectly valid in-game activities with their own rewards. But that is just me.

ESO is dead. Long live the new ESO. Maybe. I have my doubts.

.

Elsonso · July 2022

divnyi wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

These things are changes that players can adapt to. Players are already demonstrating that it is possible to adapt.

It's possible to adapt to everything, but the question everybody will ask themselves is "do I want to adapt to unfun gameplay?"
I know the answer for myself.

I don't want to get into place where I am defending ZOS. I will repeat what ZOS says to provide perspective and information, but ZOS needs to say it. They need to ditch the standard response of turtling up rather than talking to the players.

I am guessing what your answer is... but my recommendation above stands. The writing may be on the wall, and an initial answer to not bother adapting may win the day. On the other hand, by waiting until the end, you may decide they changed enough that you can adapt, or you may find that adapting isn't as bothersome as the first look indicated. The answer from today might change. If that happens, hopefully you have not burned any bridges that are not easily rebuilt.

For me, ESO is considerably "unfun" post-AwA. My initial answer to AwA was to put ESO in my rear view. I watched through PTS and waited until the end to finalize decisions. In the end, I realized that this game is less of a character-oriented "MMO Role Playing Game" and more of a player-oriented "MMO Action Adventure Game". As a result, I crafted and implemented an adaptation, but there is a lot less to do here, so I was able to step back considerably from the game. I still play, but at a fraction of the time and effort that I used to, and none of the expense. Thanks to ZOS Turtle Mode, maintaining this decision has been easy.

AzuraFan · July 2022

divnyi wrote: »

It's possible to adapt to everything, but the question everybody will ask themselves is "do I want to adapt to unfun gameplay?"
I know the answer for myself.

And will I want to adapt in 3 months? And again in 3 months? And again in 3 months? Rinse and repeat ad nauseum.

Mr_Stach · July 2022

Zos needs to change their Approach to Balance. They keep trying to reinvent the wheel. We already have a good wheel, it works fine, you just need to smooth out the edges, fill in some gaps.

Pevey · July 2022

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Zos needs to change their Approach to Balance. They keep trying to reinvent the wheel. We already have a good wheel, it works fine, you just need to smooth out the edges, fill in some gaps.

That is the thing, they don't like their wheel. We like it. They don't. They show contempt for their own game.

Mr_Stach · July 2022

But people like ESO Wheel because it's ESO Wheel. If you change the Wheel, people who like the Wheel leave.... Right?

Thecompton73 · July 2022

jecks33 wrote: »

I didn't logged in since monday, I have lost my enthusiasm in this game

Same, I'll get the itch to play but then I'll think about the patch notes and I lose the desire to even log in for research/mount training. Just seems like a waste of time when I know the combat in the game will be absolutely gutted in a month.

Necrotech_Master · July 2022

Elsonso wrote: »

divnyi wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

These things are changes that players can adapt to. Players are already demonstrating that it is possible to adapt.

It's possible to adapt to everything, but the question everybody will ask themselves is "do I want to adapt to unfun gameplay?"
I know the answer for myself.

I don't want to get into place where I am defending ZOS. I will repeat what ZOS says to provide perspective and information, but ZOS needs to say it. They need to ditch the standard response of turtling up rather than talking to the players.

I am guessing what your answer is... but my recommendation above stands. The writing may be on the wall, and an initial answer to not bother adapting may win the day. On the other hand, by waiting until the end, you may decide they changed enough that you can adapt, or you may find that adapting isn't as bothersome as the first look indicated. The answer from today might change. If that happens, hopefully you have not burned any bridges that are not easily rebuilt.

For me, ESO is considerably "unfun" post-AwA. My initial answer to AwA was to put ESO in my rear view. I watched through PTS and waited until the end to finalize decisions. In the end, I realized that this game is less of a character-oriented "MMO Role Playing Game" and more of a player-oriented "MMO Action Adventure Game". As a result, I crafted and implemented an adaptation, but there is a lot less to do here, so I was able to step back considerably from the game. I still play, but at a fraction of the time and effort that I used to, and none of the expense. Thanks to ZOS Turtle Mode, maintaining this decision has been easy.

for me personally, im really indifferent about the light attack changes

but im not particularly happy about the dot changes, unless your getting all of your dots from procs that are not being changed (there are very very few existing dot sets that were actually noted in the patch notes unless all of these were stealth changed like caluurion)

i could see a reduction in dmg, but a reduction of dmg AND making them tick even slower is just going to make them too slow to do anything useful

if we just saw our dots duration extended to help maintain uptime easier but without the garbage like slower ticks or dmg nerfs then that would be something that actually helped people