The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Magblade in U32 (PvP)
VarisVaris
✭✭✭✭✭
For a very long time Magnb has suffered from its effectiveness in PvE.
Back when Raid groups consisted of only Magnb DDs due to their good damage paired with exceptional survivability, the devs designed to change this by doing many things that directly hurt magnb and pushed it off a cliff when it comes to PvP viability.
Those nerfs were complemented by universal changes that have made magnb's life a lot harder to the point where magnb was considered to be the worst class or to be heavily lacking.
This patch once again hasn't given magnb any buff while at the same time has managed to worsen its survivability by removing the critical healing amplifiers on focus.
The list of issues magnb has is long, starting with rather a unreliable offensive toolkit as Strife still has a 450ms minimum traveltime which causes it to be heavily punished in PvP, the cast time on soul harvest and soul tether as well has the comically loud audio warning on assassin's will (while assasin's scourge has no loud audio cue at all)
When it comes to the defensive side of things magnb makes a turn for the worst, its once great healing is now just a shadow of itself and formerly available tools have also took a hit over time.
To complete this list of magnb player mass hysteria causing changes some of the skills magnb has used in the past have been painfully weak or are outclassed by so many of their competitors.
A few examples are:
Consuming Darkness and it's morphs being the worst Ground Aoe ult available in the game
Mass Hysteria just being a waste of a CC as it has no redeeming qualities outside of being a CC.
Healing path being only a heal rather than the great hybrid ability it once was.
Malovent offering being only useable as a heal for other people.
Mark Target having a rather mild effect compared to some other available skills on top of being only useable on one single target.
Dragonknights have received love this patch, don't let Magicka nightblades stand outside in the rain any longer, give it the changes the spec has deserved for a very long time now.
Back when Raid groups consisted of only Magnb DDs due to their good damage paired with exceptional survivability, the devs designed to change this by doing many things that directly hurt magnb and pushed it off a cliff when it comes to PvP viability.
Those nerfs were complemented by universal changes that have made magnb's life a lot harder to the point where magnb was considered to be the worst class or to be heavily lacking.
This patch once again hasn't given magnb any buff while at the same time has managed to worsen its survivability by removing the critical healing amplifiers on focus.
The list of issues magnb has is long, starting with rather a unreliable offensive toolkit as Strife still has a 450ms minimum traveltime which causes it to be heavily punished in PvP, the cast time on soul harvest and soul tether as well has the comically loud audio warning on assassin's will (while assasin's scourge has no loud audio cue at all)
When it comes to the defensive side of things magnb makes a turn for the worst, its once great healing is now just a shadow of itself and formerly available tools have also took a hit over time.
To complete this list of magnb player mass hysteria causing changes some of the skills magnb has used in the past have been painfully weak or are outclassed by so many of their competitors.
A few examples are:
Consuming Darkness and it's morphs being the worst Ground Aoe ult available in the game
Mass Hysteria just being a waste of a CC as it has no redeeming qualities outside of being a CC.
Healing path being only a heal rather than the great hybrid ability it once was.
Malovent offering being only useable as a heal for other people.
Mark Target having a rather mild effect compared to some other available skills on top of being only useable on one single target.
Dragonknights have received love this patch, don't let Magicka nightblades stand outside in the rain any longer, give it the changes the spec has deserved for a very long time now.
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Myux✭✭✭fear i never felt needed anything additional, its a cc thats aoe and it ignores iframes and block. that alone is pretty good. but magblade does deserve better as its currently unuseable in high effort pvp. its always been pretty underpowered during the large majority of patches in the game, but its exceptionally bad now.
zos employee potentially reading this, please consider how to buff and fix magblade for pvp but not pve. theres a lot of ways you can do this! such as: making our 3 damage skills (swallow soul, incap, merciless resolve) be more reliable to land, buffing swallow soul in general as its damage is nothing compared to concealed and its healing is horrible compared to when it actually was worth something and its not used in pve currently outside of solo, and give us our class heals back! path and swallow soul arent enough to survive. i dont even have enough slots to use refreshing path because i need to slot so many other heals in order to survive. and even then i still cant survive nearly as much as every other class in the game.
i know you always ignore us, but magblade players who dont bomb or gank exist! just make us worth something!
also remove ult cast times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Edited by Myux on September 20, 2021 7:50PM10 -
ANewHand✭✭✭I made a PvP Magblade (bomber build) alt earlier this year to try and honestly I'm finding it very easy and fun to play. Cloak makes it really easy to surprise gank/stun with Concealed Weapon and then disengage if needed. I do suck at bombing however as it requires good timing (and luck), which I don't seem to have. But then even if I can't go in and backstab/bomb I can still support the fight with Regeneration and Refreshing Path.
Considering the really high number of NBs in PvP (and how absolutely annoying they are) I do fail to see how they're so bad.
Honestly if there wasn't any cast time on the ults there'd be no counterplay at all to bombers.also remove ult cast times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Edited by ANewHand on September 20, 2021 8:49PM1 -
VarisVaris✭✭✭✭✭I made a PvP Magblade (bomber) build earlier this year to try and honestly I'm finding it very easy and fun to play. Cloak makes it really easy to surprise gank/stun with Concealed Weapon and then disengage if needed. I do suck at bombing however as it requires good timing (and luck), which I don't seem to have. But then even if I can't go in and backstab/bomb I can still support the fight with Regeneration and Refreshing Path.
Considering the really high number of NBs in PvP (and how absolutely annoying they are) I do fail to see how they're so bad.
Honestly if there wasn't any cast time on the ults there'd be no counterplay at all to bombers.also remove ult cast times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bombing has little to do with what made magnb once fun and engaging to play and I think that having a class being pigeonholed into a single role that's reliant on many people stacking up and being more or less afk (taking a flag, reparing a keep etc) isn't something to aim for.
I don't want bombing removed or anything but I'd like for Magnb to be more than just bombers and be what it once was, one of the best balanced classes in the game with great gameplay and a high skill ceiling6 -
Kaysha✭✭✭✭I made a PvP Magblade (bomber build) alt earlier this year to try and honestly I'm finding it very easy and fun to play. Cloak makes it really easy to surprise gank/stun with Concealed Weapon and then disengage if needed. I do suck at bombing however as it requires good timing (and luck), which I don't seem to have. But then even if I can't go in and backstab/bomb I can still support the fight with Regeneration and Refreshing Path.
Considering the really high number of NBs in PvP (and how absolutely annoying they are) I do fail to see how they're so bad.
Honestly if there wasn't any cast time on the ults there'd be no counterplay at all to bombers.also remove ult cast times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
how does a cast time help you counter the bomber?4 -
Jodynn✭✭✭✭✭
✭Cast time on an assassin class is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of; they are by lore made to be deadly, agile, stealthy and final. A cast time does NOT fit this class at all.Jodynn PC NA
PvE and PvP MagDK
The lack of communication from ZOS to player speaks volumes.12 -
ANewHand✭✭✭
Idk if you've read what I wrote but I literally said I have an easy and fun time on my bomber build doing anything and everything except bombing (which I suck at). I'm still keeping the build in case I manage a glorious bomb, one of these days. 🙏VarisVaris wrote: »Bombing has little to do with what made magnb once fun and engaging to play and I think that having a class being pigeonholed into a single role [...] isn't something to aim for.
I don't want bombing removed or anything but I'd like for Magnb to be more than just bombers.
You can see them and roll-dodge before the stun from Soul Tether hits. I usually manage to get out of bombs unscathed like maybe 50% of the time? My main is a light armored Breton (warden) though so I have high magic resist. It usually depends on whether I'm paying attention or I'm looking at the map/rummaging through my bag.how does a cast time help you counter the bomber?0 -
AhSeLYaG✭✭✭İts total disappointment!
Magblade pvp has been begging for a proper improvement for ages and again nothing on the table. Besides we re getting huge nerfs by intruduction of crit cap for damage and healing . We had to rely on item sets and non class skills to play. But they nerfed proxi deronation and mech aquity too. What is left? For a warden or a necro a magblade who try to engage in battle is free ap.
(Oh sorry only caluurion left. Pls nerf that too)3 -
Chubarov_S✭✭✭I got desperate and just play my way, but the magic blade is really dead now.
So his problems:
1. Unreliable burst - while you shoot from a bow, the enemy will have time to go to brew tea, return and dodge
2. All range abilities are projectiles - and, accordingly, it is unrealistic to kill the dodge spammer, just as it is almost impossible to kill Varden under the class shield
3. Lack of range ult - you need to approach the enemy, while in a battle with the sorcerer he will hide in an atronach, or in mines, or will run away from you, while spamming you with Overload
4. Lack of mitigation - before the magic blade had 20% more mitigation, now i see unrealistic numbers in death statistics
5. Lack of sources of damage - you only have a bow and swallow souls for damage, everything else is buffs and debuffs
6. Lack of quick damage - the bow takes a very long time to charge, and the enemy will not stand and wait while you charge the next shot
This specialty is so dead that in a high MMR there are only 2 people left to play on the entire server (I and Heresya), the rest of the players all play now for the sorcerersEdited by Chubarov_S on September 21, 2021 11:24AMTheorycrafter manaNB5 -
ANewHand✭✭✭Chubarov_S wrote: »I got desperate and just play my way, but the magic blade is really dead now.
So his problems:
1. Unreliable burst - while you shoot from a bow, the enemy will have time to go to brew tea, return and dodge
2. All range abilities are projectiles - and, accordingly, it is unrealistic to kill the dodge spammer, just as it is almost impossible to kill Varden under the class shield
3. Lack of range ult - you need to approach the enemy, while in a battle with the sorcerer he will hide in an atronach, or in mines, or will run away from you, while spamming you with Overload
4. Lack of mitigation - before the magic blade had 20% more mitigation, now i see unrealistic numbers in death statistics
5. Lack of sources of damage - you only have a bow and swallow souls for damage, everything else is buffs and debuffs
6. Lack of quick damage - the bow takes a very long time to charge, and the enemy will not stand and wait while you charge the next shot
I'm not sure what kind of perspective you have on PvP (have you played any other class?) but it seems pretty obvious to me that:
1. That's everybody's problem, not just NBs.
2. The only beam (non-projectile) ranged attacks are Templar's Radiant Destruction (Jesus Beam, an execute channel), Resto & Lightning staff heavy attacks, and Force Shock. NBs have access to 3 out of 4.
3. Arguably the best PvP ranged ult in the game is the Mages Guild Meteor, which you are free to try out.
4. Nightblades have an almost exclusive access to Major Evasion + Minor Resolve in one long duration ability (Mirage), and already get Major Resolve by using any shadow ability.
5. I use Cripple for the crowd control & DoT, Sap Essence for bombing, Concealed Weapon for ganking, and Impale for executes.
6. Grim Focus is the ability that deals the highest burst damage in the whole game, tied with Meteor and Dragon's Leap (Dragonknight), both of which are ultimates. Grim Focus's burst has to be gated by some mechanic to be anywhere near balanced.
It seems like most of your complaints focus on playing MagNB from range only. NBs have the unique ability to get very close and disengage safely with Shadow Cloak, without the need to invest in defense. Only sorcerers have a similar tool (Bolt Escape). If you use Shadow Cloak, it's much easier to make use of NB melee range abilities in PvP, which -don't forget- have higher damage coefficient than ranged abilities.3 -
VarisVaris✭✭✭✭✭Chubarov_S wrote: »I got desperate and just play my way, but the magic blade is really dead now.
So his problems:
1. Unreliable burst - while you shoot from a bow, the enemy will have time to go to brew tea, return and dodge
2. All range abilities are projectiles - and, accordingly, it is unrealistic to kill the dodge spammer, just as it is almost impossible to kill Varden under the class shield
3. Lack of range ult - you need to approach the enemy, while in a battle with the sorcerer he will hide in an atronach, or in mines, or will run away from you, while spamming you with Overload
4. Lack of mitigation - before the magic blade had 20% more mitigation, now i see unrealistic numbers in death statistics
5. Lack of sources of damage - you only have a bow and swallow souls for damage, everything else is buffs and debuffs
6. Lack of quick damage - the bow takes a very long time to charge, and the enemy will not stand and wait while you charge the next shot
I'm not sure what kind of perspective you have on PvP (have you played any other class?) but it seems pretty obvious to me that:
1. That's everybody's problem, not just NBs.
2. The only beam (non-projectile) ranged attacks are Templar's Radiant Destruction (Jesus Beam, an execute channel), Resto & Lightning staff heavy attacks, and Force Shock. NBs have access to 3 out of 4.
3. Arguably the best PvP ranged ult in the game is the Mages Guild Meteor, which you are free to try out.
4. Nightblades have an almost exclusive access to Major Evasion + Minor Resolve in one long duration ability (Mirage), and already get Major Resolve by using any shadow ability.
5. I use Cripple for the crowd control & DoT, Sap Essence for bombing, Concealed Weapon for ganking, and Impale for executes.
6. Grim Focus is the ability that deals the highest burst damage in the whole game, tied with Meteor and Dragon's Leap (Dragonknight), both of which are ultimates. Grim Focus's burst has to be gated by some mechanic to be anywhere near balanced.
It seems like most of your complaints focus on playing MagNB from range only. NBs have the unique ability to get very close and disengage safely with Shadow Cloak, without the need to invest in defense. Only sorcerers have a similar tool (Bolt Escape). If you use Shadow Cloak, it's much easier to make use of NB melee range abilities in PvP, which -don't forget- have higher damage coefficient than ranged abilities.
None of the things you have proposed to use make magnb any more viable.
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ThePedge✭✭✭✭✭Chubarov_S wrote: »I got desperate and just play my way, but the magic blade is really dead now.
So his problems:
1. Unreliable burst - while you shoot from a bow, the enemy will have time to go to brew tea, return and dodge
2. All range abilities are projectiles - and, accordingly, it is unrealistic to kill the dodge spammer, just as it is almost impossible to kill Varden under the class shield
3. Lack of range ult - you need to approach the enemy, while in a battle with the sorcerer he will hide in an atronach, or in mines, or will run away from you, while spamming you with Overload
4. Lack of mitigation - before the magic blade had 20% more mitigation, now i see unrealistic numbers in death statistics
5. Lack of sources of damage - you only have a bow and swallow souls for damage, everything else is buffs and debuffs
6. Lack of quick damage - the bow takes a very long time to charge, and the enemy will not stand and wait while you charge the next shot
I'm not sure what kind of perspective you have on PvP (have you played any other class?) but it seems pretty obvious to me that:
1. That's everybody's problem, not just NBs.
2. The only beam (non-projectile) ranged attacks are Templar's Radiant Destruction (Jesus Beam, an execute channel), Resto & Lightning staff heavy attacks, and Force Shock. NBs have access to 3 out of 4.
3. Arguably the best PvP ranged ult in the game is the Mages Guild Meteor, which you are free to try out.
4. Nightblades have an almost exclusive access to Major Evasion + Minor Resolve in one long duration ability (Mirage), and already get Major Resolve by using any shadow ability.
5. I use Cripple for the crowd control & DoT, Sap Essence for bombing, Concealed Weapon for ganking, and Impale for executes.
6. Grim Focus is the ability that deals the highest burst damage in the whole game, tied with Meteor and Dragon's Leap (Dragonknight), both of which are ultimates. Grim Focus's burst has to be gated by some mechanic to be anywhere near balanced.
It seems like most of your complaints focus on playing MagNB from range only. NBs have the unique ability to get very close and disengage safely with Shadow Cloak, without the need to invest in defense. Only sorcerers have a similar tool (Bolt Escape). If you use Shadow Cloak, it's much easier to make use of NB melee range abilities in PvP, which -don't forget- have higher damage coefficient than ranged abilities.
On point 1 alone, every other class except DK (which has more DoTs and designed that way) have one or more delayed burst abilities that they can time to stack damage all at once. NB does not and requires proc sets (getting nerfed) and/or two skills with a GCD in the middle. Most likely to be Ult (cast time) and bow proc (travel time) which makes not only the slowest burst, but the easiest to mitigate by block/roll dodge.
Please do not accuse others of not playing enough if you cannot understand this is a problem.4 -
Arkew✭✭✭mag NB is in very good place for me
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/1630856397661069976/2B921591111D458EF9C7F55A01F3241D2F2FC842/?imw=5000&imh=5000&ima=fit&impolicy=Letterbox&imcolor=#000000&letterbox=false
beaten my record today1 -
sweatapodimas✭✭✭Cast time on an assassin class is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of; they are by lore made to be deadly, agile, stealthy and final. A cast time does NOT fit this class at all.
Yes! We've been saying this for over a year. Please remove this absurd, awkward mechanic. Maybe leave it on dawnbreaker and soul tether since they are AOE's and that the animation is so quick and abrupt.
Mainly on B Strike (fighter's guild) and deathstroke."Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa3 -
ANewHand✭✭✭On point 1 alone, every other class except DK (which has more DoTs and designed that way) have one or more delayed burst abilities that they can time to stack damage all at once. NB does not and requires proc sets (getting nerfed) and/or two skills with a GCD in the middle. Most likely to be Ult (cast time) and bow proc (travel time) which makes not only the slowest burst, but the easiest to mitigate by block/roll dodge.
Please do not accuse others of not playing enough if you cannot understand this is a problem.
You can go look up skill coefficients at https://esoitem.uesp.net/viewSkills.php
Merciless Resolve has a burst similar to Warden's Shalks + Force Shock combined. If you use Death Stroke before using the bow proc, you get the same damage as Blastbone + Flame Skull, or Deadric Prey + Fragments (base, not augmented proc). It uses a GCD but also it doesn't require any channel, timing, or aiming, it's cheap, and it comes with a crit chance bonus (5% damage bonus on PTS).
You're all discounting that NBs have the unique ability to wait out and surprise people with Shadow Cloak, so getting all the burst in one GCD is not as critical. You can wait for allied players to burst so you can pile it on top, or if you surprise someone you're likely to get more than one GCD to act before they react, especially if you stun with Veiled Strike.
I've played every class in PvP and so far NBs are the cheesiest and the easiest to get kills with, IMO. If it was so bad I don't think every 1 in 3 player in Cyro would be a nightblade lol. It's literally impossible to play without Magelight or Expert Hunter.
Also proc sets getting "nerfed" by having their damage coefficients reduced by 5% but being allowed to crit is really not going to hurt any Nightblade.0 -
Irisa37✭Chubarov_S wrote: »This specialty is so dead that in a high MMR there are only 2 people left to play on the entire server (I and Heresya), the rest of the players all play now for the sorcerers
I still play magicka Nightblade in PvP as well. It's very hard though, especially compared to stamina Nightblade. I agree with all the issues that you have raised. Trying to kill anything at range is so very difficult. Even if I manage to get off a burst combination with Merciless Resolve it often does not kill the target, unless someone else has already significantly softened it up first and landing a hit in the first place is very tough for the reasons that you have mentioned.You're all discounting that NBs have the unique ability to wait out and surprise people with Shadow Cloak, so getting all the burst in one GCD is not as critical. You can wait for allied players to burst so you can pile it on top, or if you surprise someone you're likely to get more than one GCD to act before they react, especially if you stun with Veiled Strike.
I've played every class in PvP and so far NBs are the cheesiest and the easiest to get kills with, IMO. If it was so bad I don't think every 1 in 3 player in Cyro would be a nightblade lol. It's literally impossible to play without Magelight or Expert Hunter.
You are discounting the fact that for this to work, you are forced to play melée magicka Nightblade
. This idea that ranged magicka Nightblade can sit around waiting for a perfect time to strike does not work because ultimately either you run out of magicka because you've had to use cloak so much or your strike does not work because the opponent usually manages to dodge your burst combination (assuming Merciless Resolve is even ready to fire).
Most Nightblades that I see in Gray Host are stamina Nightblades and the few magicka Nightblades that I do see are either bombers or duel wielding gankers. Ranged magicka Nightblades are incredibly rare and while I enjoy using a build that is not commonly used by others, it's very tough to actually do any significant in fights, even in a group, unless the odds are overwhelmingly stacked in your favour. Even then, it feels as though the group is carrying the ranged magicka Nightblade.0 -
Langeston✭✭✭✭✭
✭Idk if you've read what I wrote but I literally said I have an easy and fun time on my bomber build doing anything and everything except bombing (which I suck at). I'm still keeping the build in case I manage a glorious bomb, one of these days. 🙏
If you're able to "have an easy and fun time on [your] bomber build doing anything and everything except bombing," then it likely isn't a particularly good build — any bomber build I've used is pretty terrible at anything outside of bombing (mostly due to sustain). So it wouldn't surprise me that your bombs are unsuccessful.
As far as magblade being bad in PVP, this isn't a particularly controversial subject — pretty much everyone agrees that it's at the bottom of the barrel right now, and has been for quite a while.
Just out of curiosity, what class/spec do you think it's stronger than? Also, have you tried playing mid to high MMR BGs on it?3 -
ANewHand✭✭✭Just out of curiosity, what class/spec do you think it's stronger than? Also, have you tried playing mid to high MMR BGs on it?
I rarely play BGs because I hate it. I'm most likely low MMR since I don't play much (can you even estimate your MMR? google isn't showing anything), but I'm also usually in the top scoring so I must be doing something right amongst the noobs. I'm aware I'm a BG noob and honestly don't really care about them. Also I recently learned there was a separate queue for solo so I've only played in the default queue.
I'm usually doing PvP in Blackreach (or IC during PvP events). My main is a MagWarden, which kinda sucks in PvP since you have no crowd control and your only burst is shalks, which I personally find clunky and loathe using. I usually support with heals and Siege Shield, and kill with Ice Comet when it's up. I very much enjoy my MagNB, which isn't pure bomber (like 2 skills different from the Alcast build, and using War Maiden instead of New Moon Acolyte) because I want some flexibility. The other two characters I play often in PvP are a s&b/bow StamDK and a dw/bow StamSorc (some juicy focused aim+crystal weapon snipes).
Out of all my toons, MagNB is the easiest to stay alive with since you can almost always gtfo with Cloak, and the surprise backstab is very satisfying and easy to kill with.
As far as controversy goes, a few months ago Templars and DKs were at the bottom of the PvP tiers and they still are (!!) so I don't know why me saying MagNBs are decent and fun is so controversial for this thread.0 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Just out of curiosity, what class/spec do you think it's stronger than? Also, have you tried playing mid to high MMR BGs on it?
I rarely play BGs because I hate it. I'm most likely low MMR since I don't play much (can you even estimate your MMR? google isn't showing anything), but I'm also usually in the top scoring so I must be doing something right amongst the noobs. I'm aware I'm a BG noob and honestly don't really care about them. Also I recently learned there was a separate queue for solo so I've only played in the default queue.
I'm usually doing PvP in Blackreach (or IC during PvP events). My main is a MagWarden, which kinda sucks in PvP since you have no crowd control and your only burst is shalks, which I personally find clunky and loathe using. I usually support with heals and Siege Shield, and kill with Ice Comet when it's up. I very much enjoy my MagNB, which isn't pure bomber (like 2 skills different from the Alcast build, and using War Maiden instead of New Moon Acolyte) because I want some flexibility. The other two characters I play often in PvP are a s&b/bow StamDK and a dw/bow StamSorc (some juicy focused aim+crystal weapon snipes).
Out of all my toons, MagNB is the easiest to stay alive with since you can almost always gtfo with Cloak, and the surprise backstab is very satisfying and easy to kill with.
As far as controversy goes, a few months ago Templars and DKs were at the bottom of the PvP tiers and they still are (!!) so I don't know why me saying MagNBs are decent and fun is so controversial for this thread.
[snip] if you claim that templar was at the bottom of the PvP food chain.
When I see you post about cloak like it's a miracle cure for magblade survivability all I can do is facepalm. Cloak has so many counters that when you hit a good player it is almost useless. Magblade has a much better survivability skill and cloak is not it.
The problem with magblade is its lack of any kind of build freedom - magblade? Only ranged projectile or bombing. Bombing is a niche, and limiting class only to ranged projectile gives so many disadvantages that it's hard to even describe. DK has a skill that reduces our damage by 50% with most of what we can throw at him, stam and mag warden have a shield that they can sustain indefinitely that absorbs all our burst, until recently sorc had a skill that absorbed practically everything we could throw at them now it absorbs just 50% of it.
On top of that there is cast time for our ultimates (NB is the only class that has 2/3 ultimate with cast time). Our nuke skill has such a loud sound cue, that even during the biggest turmoil in Cyrodiil you know someone is shooting at you.
Travel time of all our skills is just ridiculous.
The lack of delayed burst combined with the above leads to magblade being the only class that can't guarantee a kill even with a perfect combo executed.
On top of that everything we have can be countered with a single roll dodge.
Magblade has average damage, easy to dodge combo, cast times on ults, no delayed burst skills, travel time on everything.
Not to mention that this class lost its identity by giving away all the more interesting skils to everyone (fear, merciless even cloak).
You want to prove your point? My magplar against your magblade, PC EU. Will you take up the gauntlet?
[edited to remove rude comments]Edited by ZOS_Ragnar on September 30, 2021 2:24PMSay no to Toxic Casuals!
I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.
"Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver&Gold as a "you think you do but you don't"-tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game." - @AlexanderDeLarge5 -
Andre_Noir✭✭✭✭
With exception that shalks apply damage twice it's an AoE, cost less and should be casted once, doesn't require weaving and can so can be casted at any moment.Merciless Resolve has a burst similar to Warden's Shalks + Force Shock combined..
And for every class else: bones, curse (btw frags on proc deals ~4200 alone), breath etc are all unavoidable options and even most ults just better3 -
azjuwelz✭✭✭✭I main a stamblade, and I've played every class in pvp except Templar. I love my magblade for vet trials, but she's completely useless in pvp. I think the biggest difference between her and my stamblade is the lack of any kind of burst heal. Sure you can cloak and hope nobody's using detect pots or you can spam the Harness Magicka but that only lasts a few seconds, and Swallow Soul is just a HOT and worthless if you can't target anything.
A delayed damage ability would be nice as well. Oh, and Mark Target is the most useless skill--not needed in pve and just a huge red flag to the enemy in pvp. This does not satisfy the need for a burst heal.Xbox-NA
Guildmaster of Nightmothers Deadly Deals
PVE/PVP Stamblade: Ylandra Silverthorn
PVE Magwarden healer: Raw'zl Dah Zel
PVE DK Tank: Greta Feuerwerk
PVP StamDK: Helga Feuerwerk
PVP Necro Healer: Dratha Helbain
PVE Magcro: Dorian Fey
PVE Magblade: Arivssa Thaoral
PVE Magsorc: Eldara Birchwood4 -
What if grim focus made it that once it procs, for a window it allows 100% hit rate of ranged skills with a damage reduction on the bow proc. Burst is not as crazy then & then you wouldnt need to rely on timing through lag, gcd & range to melee conversion for a combo.
Would actually feel like the skill should be aswell. Charge up to have an assasians focus.
Major brut/sorc in leech/siphoning would be nice too.0 -
seitekisaki✭✭✭You know what, I know a cool fix that could work. Grim Focus unlike Armanents for stam sorc has to be fully charged with light or heavy attacks. What if it could be used, much like armaments, not fully proc'd. Then we would have a burst heal and some damage at any stage of Merciless Resolve.
Maybe that isn't as good as I think though.Edited by seitekisaki on October 3, 2021 5:24PM1 -
VarisVaris✭✭✭✭✭So magnb has now potentially received a much needed defensive change that will have to prove itself once we can test it on PTS.
However magnb still suffers a lot from not being able to force any damage onto targets and thus often seeing a lot of its offence being evaded resulting in it not being able to secure any kills.
In order to combat that magnb needs a big traveltime reduction on strife, overall something to deal with enemies spamming dodge back to back or holding block, neither of those can be pressured by magnb currently.
There is a line between allowing a magnb to land its burst all the time with no counterplay (which no one wants because that's not healthy at all) and all damage being so easy to avoid that you have to rely on mediocre opponents to get a kill (this is where magnb currently is)6 -
Selot✭✭✭My main pvp character is magblade and I've been playing it for a year. I can confirm that everything you say is true. Magblade is the worst magicka pvp class now. Its combo can be easily avoided and its healing is trash now. Once magblade used to have decent HoTs, but now it's a joke. Magplar has stronger HoTs than magblade, not to mention 'honor the dead' skill which can restore the half of your max hp. But you keep buffing templars for some reason. Now it's magblade's turn to get some love.4
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Deathlord92✭✭✭✭✭
✭I’d really like to see concealed weapon get a buff I like playing a melee magblade maybe give it a hot kinda like swallow soul has. This is from a pvp perspective most magblade will be using rat so the movement speed in stealth from concealed weapon isn’t that important.0 -
Chelo✭✭✭✭✭Hopefully New World make an impact on ESO PvP community and when Devs see the numbers are going down, they will finally do something about this game.
New World prove that people were desperately looking for a PvP MMORPG...5 -
exeeter702✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Hopefully New World make an impact on ESO PvP community and when Devs see the numbers are going down, they will finally do something about this game.
New World prove that people were desperately looking for a PvP MMORPG...
Yeah I dont think eso has anything to worry about in terms of pvp lol. Let the honey moon phase end.
Eso is long since fallen into its niche, anyone jumping ship is mainly doing it for a variety of reasons bot least of all generally boredom of ESOs formula.
There is nothing about new world that indicates superior design choice that directly correlates to eso player leaves->plays new world. That migration was going to happen no matter what.
Maybe if new world held on to it's original vision of a sandbox survival pvp based online game with an emphasis on a weighted deliberate combat system , we would have had a wonderful highly skilled based playground to enjoy. Instead of the nonsense joke of an "mmorpg" that it ended up becoming. The shallow neutered combat system that removed nearly all deliberation and weight does not hold up whatsoever in a game shifted into some type of pve focus. A complete lack of depth to skill options and skill lines works perfectly fine in a game with a hard emphasis on the aforementioned combat system of its orignal pitch, but take that away and do nothing with the skill system? Yeah good luck.
As it stands now, it's a weird hodgepodge of a game that tries to be many things and fails miserably at all of them purely becasue of its last minute 180 in core design.
Crafting and survival? Lol.. nope.
Pve emphasis for end game? Yeah good luck crafting an interesting group dynamic with the available actual build variety and skill options available.
Pvp emphasis for end game? There is something to be said about being out amd about and getting into little skirmishes for sure. The only reason it works as decent as it does in this environment is due in large part to the dna of its orginal combat design. Large scale battles? Dont make me laugh. What an absolute joke. Spammy, disjointed, linear and stiff.1 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Is there any chance MagNB is too effective at large scale potato mashing to get the buffs it needs to be competitive in 1v1 / smallscale between experienced players?
On our server it's quite conspicuous: MagNBs have been a rare sight in the popular dueling spots for years, and are much, much less popular in high MMRs BGs then they were years ago.
On the other hand, year after year, this class earns the most AP in Cyrodiil. So perhaps some look at that and say, why would this class need buffs? It's almost like the inverse of MagDK over the last few years: premier duelist, decent in BGs, but a fairly uncommon class in Cyrodiil.
In other words, is MagNB a victim of the outrageously overpowered state Vicious Death has been in for years, because this set has been necessary to limit the power of zerging?
(PS: these thoughts are all pre-Dark Convergence)
Edited by Urzigurumash on October 5, 2021 11:06PMXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
xDeusEJRx✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Don't think so, I just believe people don't know proper nightblade counterplay.Urzigurumash wrote: »Is there any chance MagNB is too effective at large scale potato mashing to get the buffs it needs to be competitive in 1v1 / smallscale between experienced players?
On our server it's quite conspicuous: MagNBs have been a rare sight in the popular dueling spots for years, and are much, much less popular in high MMRs BGs then they were years ago.
On the other hand, year after year, this class earns the most AP in Cyrodiil. So perhaps some look at that and say, why would this class need buffs? It's almost like the inverse of MagDK over the last few years: premier duelist, decent in BGs, but a fairly uncommon class in Cyrodiil.
In other words, is MagNB a victim of the outrageously overpowered state Vicious Death has been in for years, because this set has been necessary to limit the power of zerging?
(PS: these thoughts are all pre-Dark Convergence)
If you watch ganking videos a lot of times people die because they turn their backs on nightblades as soon as they start ganking because they panic, but turning your back to a NB only makes it easier for them.
On top of that, lots of people don't adequately block on flags, they just sit their completely exposed nor do they run reveals, detects, Zoals monster helm, etc. They just don't know proper counterplay to NBS. Lots of magblades don't even run crippling grasp, which IMO a magblade running crippling grasp and following with concealed weapon stun is worse than getting with fossilize from a DK. Because that combo has high damage, immobilize, stun and snare capabilities. Hell most magblades bombers don't even need to run Mark Target
Magblade bombers mostly succeed because the players leave themselve vulnerable half of the time, I rarely personally get successfully bombed unless there's multiple magblades that hit me at once.
I don't think it's that Magblade is too effective, I think it's just people aren't accustomed to fighting magblade style and therefore don't know proper counterplay. Like I'm sure most players have never been hit with crippling grasp into concealed weapon stun combo or the fear trap, etc.Solo PvP'er PS5 NA player
90% of my body is made of Magblade0 -
Thecompton73✭✭✭✭✭Back when the servers still worked well enough to actually be able to weave in PvP I could keep myself alive and win many 1v1 fights on my magblade bomber by deftly weaving Swallow Soul with LA's to soften them up before hitting them with a Soul Tether/Merciless resolve combo to finish. Sadly performance has degraded to the point where weaving smoothly is almost impossible and so that strategy no longer works.Edited by Thecompton73 on October 7, 2021 9:52PM1