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How can i hide my stuff for the Group-Loot Add-On
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remosito✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »ZOS is. and they are telling us.
most of you are constantly saying "we spy, snoop, illegallily look into your bag, we have no right,...."
these are all targetting us statements like we are doing something bad.
we aint doing any of that ***.
ZoS has a right to snoop into anything we do. You don't.
they sure have a right to snoop. but do they have right to share everything they learn with every other player?
I do not even snoop. zos tells me officially and publicly.
A 3rd party addon is not an official part of the game.
nope. but it is using an official part of the game that is put there for the express purpose of being used for addons.
It is not put there for the express purpose of being used for addons unless zos specifically states that. They have had to remove stuff from being used before because it was not what they wanted.
You keep acting as though the having the ability to do something is the same thing as being officially sponsored and that is NOT the case.
This addon is NOT an official part of the game and is instead a third party app. ZoS has never commented on it's legitimacy either way. That is the reason it's unable to be used by console and why you cannot claim official endorsement.
It is the same thing as being officially permitted.
The game could and would function perfectly fine and the same. Even if that api were made unaccessible to everybody but zos code.
The fact the api exists as it is. Is implicit permission to use it and write addons. and use those.
Something being permitted is not and will never be the same exact thing as being official. That's really just not how it works. ZOS can and HAS removed information from there because people were using it in ways they found abusive.
The ability to do something is not the same thing as endorsement. It's just not.
People have permission to use any information to make addons, but the functionality of any particular Add-ons is not endorsed or approved by zos unless explicitly stated otherwise.
what's with you and endorsed?
they allow addons. they enable addons. they put the function to get group loot in there.
wether that qualifies as endorsed or not in my book. your book. or anybody elses book.
does nit matter one yota.
it. is. allowed. period.
that is all that is relevant.Edited by remosito on March 19, 2021 8:21PMShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)1 -
remosito✭✭✭✭✭colossalvoids wrote: »
Pretty pointless to explain at this point, people ignoring the fact that it's made for add-on creators use specifically and proceeding like it's just some unpatched yet messaging that is here because some zos reasons.
Yeah. I think they just really don't understand how it actually works.ShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭it. is. allowed. period.
that is all that is relevant.
No. It is not. You keep making the FALSE claim that is OFFICIAL part of the game to discredit complaints. That is NOT true. It's not up for debate. You are wrong.
It. is. not. official. period.
In no way can you make the claim that any individual Add-on is allowed, endorsed, or sponsored by ZOS. Only ZOS can make that claim.
And actually specifically because you stated this I actually found that this Add-on may even violate the add-on policy. As it can be argued it unfairly interferes with other players, which is against the rules and an nonpermissable addon. And the EULA about not sharing information about someone else's avatar.Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 8:30PM5 -
Sanguinor2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »
Something being permitted is not and will never be the same exact thing as being official. That's really just not how it works. ZOS can and HAS removed information from there because people were using it in ways they found abusive.
The ability to do something is not the same thing as endorsement. It's just not.
People have permission to use any information to make addons, but the functionality of any particular Add-ons is not endorsed or approved by zos unless explicitly stated otherwise.
While its functionality is not endorsed by Zos unless they say otherwise it is approved until Zos says otherwise. If the functionality was not approved the API wouldnt exist or would be disabled/removed. We know that Zos can and will do this if they deem it necessary.
From my understanding an addon can only have functions that are approved by the very API that Zos creates and by Zos choosing to create said API they approve the functions it enables actually being used. Otherwise they would remove it as soon as they notice something they dont approve of is being done with it or not even create it in the first place. So to say that the function an addon has is only being approved when explicitly stated is very far fetched imo.
I agree that it is not endorsed by simply being possible but imo it is 100% approved by being possible until Zos decides otherwise.
Again if I got something about how API works or is created wrong anyone feel free to tell me.Politeness is respecting others.
Courage is doing what is fair.
Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
Honor is keeping ones word.1 -
remosito✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.ShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)5 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sanguinor2 wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Something being permitted is not and will never be the same exact thing as being official. That's really just not how it works. ZOS can and HAS removed information from there because people were using it in ways they found abusive.
The ability to do something is not the same thing as endorsement. It's just not.
People have permission to use any information to make addons, but the functionality of any particular Add-ons is not endorsed or approved by zos unless explicitly stated otherwise.
While its functionality is not endorsed by Zos unless they say otherwise it is approved until Zos says otherwise. If the functionality was not approved the API wouldnt exist or would be disabled/removed. We know that Zos can and will do this if they deem it necessary.
From my understanding an addon can only have functions that are approved by the very API that Zos creates and by Zos choosing to create said API they approve the functions it enables actually being used. Otherwise they would remove it as soon as they notice something they dont approve of is being done with it or not even create it in the first place. So to say that the function an addon has is only being approved when explicitly stated is very far fetched imo.
I agree that it is not endorsed by simply being possible but imo it is 100% approved by being possible until Zos decides otherwise.
Again if I got something about how API works or is created wrong anyone feel free to tell me.
They actually implicitly admit in their Add-on policy that it's possible to create add-ons that violate their policies. By stating that you must not do so as it violates their policy. Presumably this means we can also report add-ons that violate the EULA.Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 8:36PM3 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 8:35PM3 -
LashanW✭✭✭✭✭
✭
@spartaxoxospartaxoxo wrote: »perfiction wrote: »Actually no, you are wrong. Read the above and stop putting the blame on players/addons - they are not spying on anyone, they are reading public data.
It's not public data if you have to use specialized tools to read it.
You are intercepting information that is NOT made easily publicly available by zos but instead requires 3rd party software and making it public.
Functionality of the Addons API is public. You do not need specialized tools or 3rd party software to access it or use it. You can just use your chat window in-game (but I think only for PC version). All you need is a bit of knowledge about LUA scripting language (honestly being familiar with programming is enough) and access to Addons API documentation (so you'd know the names of the functions). Documentation is available to the public here. In game chat window has the ability to execute LUA code via the "/script" command.
Let me give you an example. Unfortunately if you are on console you cannot test this I think, only works for PC. No need of addons tho.
Say there is someone in your server (PC-EU or PC-NA) who has a primary residence with permissions set so that any player can visit this house. You know his account name, but he's not in your friend list. He's not in any of your guilds. He's currently offline so you can't whisper him or group with him. You've never interacted with him before, you've never gone to his house, you don't even know where his house is. All you know is his account name.
So how do you visit his house? afaik base/vanilla PC game has no user interface feature anywhere to let you do this. But pls correct me if I'm wrong.
It can be easily done by calling a function in ESO API from your in-game chat window. No addons involved, no specialized tools, no 3rd party software involved. Just your trusty keyboard and chat window in the PC version of the game
---No longer active in ESO---
Platform: PC-EU
CP: 2500+Trial Achievements
Godslayer, Gryphon Heart, Tick-Tock Tormentor, Immortal Redeemer, Dro-m'Athra Destroyer, vMoL no death
Arena Achievements
vMA Flawless, vVH Spirit Slayer
DLC Dungeon Trifectas
Scalecaller Peak, Fang Lair, Depths of Malatar, Icereach3 -
remosito✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.Edited by remosito on March 19, 2021 8:42PMShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)2 -
ghost_bg_ESO✭✭✭✭It starts to sound like crusade against all add-on "because PC users have advantage over console users" (not that they play together to affects them in any way).
People just can seek response from ZOS (like with mudballs) if someone whispers you non-stop to give them something is it count as abusive behavior.
And as much as i find some of add-ons incredibly useful (mini-map at first place) I won't be surprised if its support gets discontinued over MS management.0 -
remosito✭✭✭✭✭
@spartaxoxospartaxoxo wrote: »perfiction wrote: »Actually no, you are wrong. Read the above and stop putting the blame on players/addons - they are not spying on anyone, they are reading public data.
It's not public data if you have to use specialized tools to read it.
You are intercepting information that is NOT made easily publicly available by zos but instead requires 3rd party software and making it public.
Functionality of the Addons API is public. You do not need specialized tools or 3rd party software to access it or use it. You can just use your chat window in-game (but I think only for PC version). All you need is a bit of knowledge about LUA scripting language (honestly being familiar with programming is enough) and access to Addons API documentation (so you'd know the names of the functions). Documentation is available to the public here. In game chat window has the ability to execute LUA code via the "/script" command.
Let me give you an example. Unfortunately if you are on console you cannot test this I think, only works for PC. No need of addons tho.
Say there is someone in your server (PC-EU or PC-NA) who has a primary residence with permissions set so that any player can visit this house. You know his account name, but he's not in your friend list. He's not in any of your guilds. He's currently offline so you can't whisper him or group with him. You've never interacted with him before, you've never gone to his house, you don't even know where his house is. All you know is his account name.
So how do you visit his house? afaik base/vanilla PC game has no user interface feature anywhere to let you do this. But pls correct me if I'm wrong.
It can be easily done by calling a function in ESO API from your in-game chat window. No addons involved, no specialized tools, no 3rd party software involved. Just your trusty keyboard and chat window in the PC version of the game
indeed.
/script valid lua code accessing api
right in the chat input works. have used it quite a bit.ShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)0 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
You have consistently conflated "ZOS has an offical api and we are expressly permitted to create add-ons" with "any app that uses it's information is officially part of the game according to zos" and argued with me when I stated that any individual app is not part of the official game nor necessarily approved by ZOS.
This app is not offical. It's a third-party software
Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 8:58PM0 -
Goregrinder✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
Agreed. People want to hide their loot so they can say "Sorry...didn't loot anything bud...see ya!.." But ZOS says you can't hide your loot from me, and that's all that matters in the end. People can feel however they want about it, but I'm going to see everything you loot so you can't lie haha.
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remosito✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
my full quote:
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
as you see. I only stated officially allowed. not official part of the game or any such thing.
btw.. pretty low to leave relevant parts of my statement out. And trying to camouflage it by using a carefully cropped screenshot.Edited by remosito on March 19, 2021 8:59PMShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)1 -
Sanguinor2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »
They actually implicitly admit in their Add-on policy that it's possible to create add-ons that violate their policies. By stating that you must not do so as it violates their policy. Presumably this means we can also report add-ons that violate the EULA.
Well they dont explicitly say that you can create addons that violate their policies so surely that cannot actually be real.
Jokes aside I assumed that if something is allowed it not violating the terms of service would be a given. Because anything that violates the TOS/EULA is not allowed no matter if something else says otherwise since TOS/EULA take precedence. And sure you can probably report add-ons that violate the TOS/EULA.
In the specific case of loot addons I doubt that this helps you in any way since they have been around for over 7 years and in all this time there have been people that complained about it and nothing has been done to change them or to forbid them.spartaxoxo wrote: »And actually specifically because you stated this I actually found that this Add-on may even violate the add-on policy. As it can be argued it unfairly interferes with other players, which is against the rules and an nonpermissable addon. And the EULA about not sharing information about someone else's avatar.
I doubt this helps you simply because the addon itself does not unfairly interfere with anybody. The addon itself creates a few lines of text in a chatbox that you do not see. It does not change anything for you unless someone actually asks you something but what someone does with that information is not the fault of the addon but of the person instead.
An example for an addon that unfairly interfered with other players was Miats before certain functions of it got disabled since it showed you getting attacked by players that you were not able to see on your screen(for example a nightblade in cloak channeling a snipe at you).
I also doubt that you can argue with the information about character section since it says that you are not allowed to save information and to my knowledge the addon does not save any information anywhere.
Politeness is respecting others.
Courage is doing what is fair.
Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
Honor is keeping ones word.1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
my full quote:
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
as you see. I only stated officially allowed.
btw.. pretty low to leave relevant parts of my statement out. And trying to camouflage it by using a carefully cropped screenshot.
It changes nothing about what you stated. I made the statement you cannot call it official, sponsored by and endorsed by ZOS and you stated yes, you could. That's as clear as day. That you added additonal information as to what constitues it being "offical" doesn't change that you stated that you stated very clearly that you CAN say that it was endorsed and sponsored by ZOS. And that you would be right if you said those exact words.
I cutoff irrelevant statements only as they only served to present the logic as to why you believed that and did not change the meaning of what you stated. As that was not what was in dispute, it's not relevant.Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 9:04PM0 -
Nord_Raseri✭✭✭✭✭
✭Goregrinder wrote: »Agreed. People want to hide their loot so they can say "Sorry...didn't loot anything bud...see ya!.."others to respect their privacy/boundaries. But ZOS a 3rd party addon(Not in any way affiliated with ZOS, as per ZOS' official statement on addons) says you can't hide your loot from me, and that's all that matters in the end. People can feel however they want about it, but I'm going to see everything you loot so you can't lie haha.
Fixed that for you.Veit ég aðég hékk vindga meiði á nætr allar níu, geiri undaðr og gefinn Oðni, sjálfr sjálfum mér, á þeim meiði er manngi veit hvers hann af rótum rennr.9 -
remosito✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
my full quote:
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
as you see. I only stated officially allowed.
btw.. pretty low to leave relevant parts of my statement out. And trying to camouflage it by using a carefully cropped screenshot.
It changes nothing about what you stated. I made the statement you cannot call it official, sponsored by and endorsed by ZOS and you stated yes, you could. That's as clear as day.
Wrong! You statedIn no way can you make the claim that any individual Add-on is allowed, endorsed, or sponsored by ZOS. Only ZOS can make that claim.
Note the "or" you originally used. not an "and" like you claim now you have used.
with an "or" I only "claim" one of the three. not all three. which of the three I explicitly refered to afterwards.
As I said. I only ever said addons are officially allowed.Edited by remosito on March 19, 2021 9:22PMShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Sanguinor2 wrote: »In the specific case of loot addons I doubt that this helps you in any way since they have been around for over 7 years and in all this time there have been people that complained about it and nothing has been done to change them or to forbid them.
Sure. I do think the amount of time they have permitted this add-on to exist indicates they probably have decided to just allow it. It's a very compelling argument.
My issue is moreso about against people who say any individual addon is officially allowed by zos by virtue of it's ability to be created. They actually have rules in there about not violating people's privacy with Add-ons or interfering with other users experience. Which they logically would not have if it wasn't possible to create an addon using the api that violates the EULA or other users privacy.Sanguinor2 wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »And actually specifically because you stated this I actually found that this Add-on may even violate the add-on policy. As it can be argued it unfairly interferes with other players, which is against the rules and an nonpermissable addon. And the EULA about not sharing information about someone else's avatar.
I doubt this helps you simply because the addon itself does not unfairly interfere with anybody. The addon itself creates a few lines of text in a chatbox that you do not see. It does not change anything for you unless someone actually asks you something but what someone does with that information is not the fault of the addon but of the person instead.
An example for an addon that unfairly interfered with other players was Miats before certain functions of it got disabled since it showed you getting attacked by players that you were not able to see on your screen(for example a nightblade in cloak channeling a snipe at you).
I also doubt that you can argue with the information about character section since it says that you are not allowed to save information and to my knowledge the addon does not save any information anywhere.
Well being asked constantly (which is the purpose of the app is to empower people to ask for loot) is clearly interfering with some users experience. And since it says even sharing information about someone's avatar could be a privacy violation, it seems entirely plausible that ZOS didn't provide this information for this functionality. It maybe the case that Zos put that information into the api so that app creators could share that information with other people that use the app, and it was never intended to be used the way it's currently used where the entire playerbase is effectively forced to use the app to share their loot.
It could very well be that zos let this slide because if nobody is bothered by it, then it can't be said to interfere with others. Thus it could also just be a matter of zos ignoring it since it never go significant enough pushback.Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 9:21PM1 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
my full quote:
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
as you see. I only stated officially allowed.
btw.. pretty low to leave relevant parts of my statement out. And trying to camouflage it by using a carefully cropped screenshot.
It changes nothing about what you stated. I made the statement you cannot call it official, sponsored by and endorsed by ZOS and you stated yes, you could. That's as clear as day.
Wrong! You statedIn no way can you make the claim that any individual Add-on is allowed, endorsed, or sponsored by ZOS. Only ZOS can make that claim.
Note the "or" you originally used. not an "and" like you claim now you have used.
with an "or" I only need to claim one of the three. not all three.
No, the "or" is attached to sponsored. It's just a synonym. And considering how you have consistently disagreed with me over and over when I say this app is not encouraged, sponsored, etc by ZOS. I don't believe that was your intention. I think you said what you meant the first time.
That the individual apps are officially apart of the game until such time as zos removes them or their functionality.Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 9:25PM1 -
RedMuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭Septimus_Magna wrote: »Septimus_Magna wrote: »Looking at the answers here I can understand why many players dont want to group up. I never had a problem with someone asking for something I looted, if I needed it myself I never received a salty or annoying reply. Personally Im just happy to give someone an item that they were looking for that I would otherwise sell or decon.
Congratulations on only having had positive experiences, I envy you. Personally for every person taking no for an answer nicely, I've had 3-4 that got salty, aggressive or outright toxic. Hence why I just slap an ignore on them these days and move on.Septimus_Magna wrote: »If you get annoyed but dont need the item you can always charge the player, you make some gold and the player is happy to get the item they're looking for.
Why would I give something to someone who annoys me? Even for (in-game) money? I'm not a shopkeeper, my living or survival does not depend on me selling something, so why in the world would I? Do you habitually do nice things for people who aggravate you in real life? Personally I don't unless it is part of my job and I can't avoid it, I'm not a door mat, and I see no reason why I should do so in a game I play for my enjoyment.
There is a difference between someone asking nicely and someone demanding something they didnt loot themselves. In the first case you can only blame yourself if you feel some form of irritation because its not their intent to be unpleasant.
In the second case I can understand the irritation, but its still your choice how you respond. If you dont want to 'reward' that bad behavior thats completely fine and your right to do so. If you want to leverage it for a price at least you get something positive out of it.
I ask again, how is this positive? No really. What about that is positive? I already have more gold in the game than I know what to do with. Which makes me sound a lot richer than I am, I just don't spend a lot of money and prefer to do my own farming for mats and such.0 -
remosito✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
my full quote:
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
as you see. I only stated officially allowed.
btw.. pretty low to leave relevant parts of my statement out. And trying to camouflage it by using a carefully cropped screenshot.
It changes nothing about what you stated. I made the statement you cannot call it official, sponsored by and endorsed by ZOS and you stated yes, you could. That's as clear as day.
Wrong! You statedIn no way can you make the claim that any individual Add-on is allowed, endorsed, or sponsored by ZOS. Only ZOS can make that claim.
Note the "or" you originally used. not an "and" like you claim now you have used.
with an "or" I only need to claim one of the three. not all three.
No, the "or" is attached to sponsored. And considering how you have consistently disagreed with me over and over when I say this app is not encouraged, sponsored, etc by ZOS. I don't believe that was your intention. I think you said it right there.
I am not a native english speaker but my understanding is if someone says
"he was drunk, high or just stupid". the or is on all three. he was one out of the three.
"he was drunk, high and just stupid". the and is on all three. he was all three.
if you want the or only apply to the third. you would say "he was drunk and high or just stupid"
but might be mistaken. as I said. english is not my native language.ShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)0 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
just because you dont like it doesn't make it false.
No. You cannot. Well I mean, you can, but it would be false.If you create an Add-on, You must include the following disclosure in a Readme or similar .txt file: "This Add-on is not created by, affiliated with or sponsored by ZeniMax Media Inc. or its affiliates. The Elder Scrolls® and related logos are registered trademarks or trademarks of ZeniMax Media Inc. in the United States and/or other countries. All rights reserved."
None of the addons are official. The API is official. The addons that use them are not. They are not sponsored by, endorsed by or encouraged by ZOS. You use them at your own risk and they are not affiliated with zos.
i never said they are official. or part of the base game.
all I said they are officially allowed. not the same thing.
and addons being officialky allowed unless blackisted. is all that matters in the end.
my full quote:
Yes I can. And I am right. Any addon that only uses functions of the api specifically made by zos for addons and has not been blacklisted is allowed.
as you see. I only stated officially allowed.
btw.. pretty low to leave relevant parts of my statement out. And trying to camouflage it by using a carefully cropped screenshot.
It changes nothing about what you stated. I made the statement you cannot call it official, sponsored by and endorsed by ZOS and you stated yes, you could. That's as clear as day.
Wrong! You statedIn no way can you make the claim that any individual Add-on is allowed, endorsed, or sponsored by ZOS. Only ZOS can make that claim.
Note the "or" you originally used. not an "and" like you claim now you have used.
with an "or" I only need to claim one of the three. not all three.
No, the "or" is attached to sponsored. And considering how you have consistently disagreed with me over and over when I say this app is not encouraged, sponsored, etc by ZOS. I don't believe that was your intention. I think you said it right there.
I am not a native english speaker but my understanding is if someone says
"he was drunk, high or just stupid". the or is on all three. he was one out of the three.
"he was drunk, high and just stupid". the and is on all three. he was all three.
if you want the or only apply to the third. you would say "he was drunk and high or just stupid"
but might be mistaken. as I said. english is not my native language.
Oh, no problem. What you stated is valid when it's making a list of possibilities to choose from, as in you're example. But when people are just using a bunch of synonyms to describe a situation, person, thing etc like I was doing, they usually mean that those are all words you could use to describe what you're getting at and it's not considered a list for you to choose.Edited by spartaxoxo on March 19, 2021 9:40PM0 -
Sanguinor2✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »
Sure. I do think the amount of time they have permitted this add-on to exist indicates they probably have decided to just allow it. It's a very compelling argument.
My issue is moreso about against people who say any individual addon is officially allowed by zos by virtue of it's ability to be created. They actually have rules in there about not violating people's privacy with Add-ons or interfering with other users experience. Which they logically would not have if it wasn't possible to create an addon using the api that violates the EULA or other users privacy.
Well you are right in the sense that something isnt allowed just because its possible even if it would violate TOS/EULA. Again I assumed that to be a given since TOS/EULA take precedence over anything else related to the game. What I would say is that anything that does not violate TOS/EULA and uses the API provided by Zos is allowed unless said otherwise/actions of Zos prove otherwise. You are of course free to disagree. In the end neither of us can with 100% certainty say what is and is not allowed since that is only up to Zos and can change at any given second for no reason at all.spartaxoxo wrote: »
Well being asked constantly (which is the purpose of the app is to empower people to ask for loot) is clearly interfering with some users experience. And since it says even sharing information about someone's avatar could be a privacy violation, it seems entirely plausible that ZOS didn't provide this information for this functionality. It maybe the case that Zos put that information into the api so that app creators could share that information with other people that use the app, and it was never intended to be used the way it's currently used where the entire playerbase is effectively forced to use the app to share their loot.
It could very well be that zos let this slide because if nobody is bothered by it, then it can't be said to interfere with others. Thus it could also just be a matter of zos ignoring it since it never go significant enough pushback.
Sure, being asked constantly is obviously interfering with someones user experience (which I find silly but anyone is free to think so so my opinion on that is hardly relevant). However the addon is not doing that. People are doing that. The addon enables them to but it is simply a resource and how someone uses it is not the resources fault.
On an unrelated note: Where does it say that sharing information about someones avatar can be a privacy violation btw? I couldnt find it after using CRTL+F for "share" and "sharing" on the EULA and TOS repsectively.
What you said could be true, but I think the chance of that is very slim considering that the addon has been around for 7 years and people have complained about it ever since they knew it was a thing. Zos may change their mind but I assume that they wont.
Politeness is respecting others.
Courage is doing what is fair.
Modesty is speaking of oneself without vanity.
Self control is keeping calm even when anger rises.
Sincerity is expressing oneself without concealing ones thoughts.
Honor is keeping ones word.1 -
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