How can i hide my stuff for the Group-Loot Add-On

ZOS_Lunar · March 2021

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robertthebard · March 2021

perfiction wrote: »

robertthebard wrote: »

Except that, w/out the addon, it doesn't share that loot information, right? So what we're actually dealing with is more akin to spyware.

Let's say you turned off radio in your car because you didn't like the currently played song. Does it mean that you disabled the transmitter and noone else can listen to that radio anymore? .

Seriously stopped right here, unless you're telling me that you're whispering everyone in the game about getting their drops?

perfiction · March 2021

robertthebard wrote: »

Seriously stopped right here, unless you're telling me that you're whispering everyone in the game about getting their drops?

That was example for ESO addon API and how group loot log addons utilize it, not for whispering other people to get their gear. I just wanted to emphasize that it is not about other players spying on you, stealing your data and peeking into your backpack without your permission - your loot log is public for all group members because ZOS made it that way.

Viewsfrom6ix · March 2021

Hallothiel wrote: »

So glad on console so don’t have to deal with this.

And you know what? We manage to share & trade stuff just fine without spying on others.
Just either ask in chat beforehand or again at end. If want to trade something, link in group chat, others players then check & see if need it & trade if required. Quite simple & polite.

Why on earth was there the need for this add-on? Does seem very greedy.

And its not ‘everyone’s’ loot; it’s mine until I wish to share it.

This add-on is a massive time saver. Some people just don't read or talk in group chat.

In one occasion, I was looking for a specific weight on a monster helm which seemed to have eluded me for the longest time. I always ask for it in group chat first after the dungeon is over. No one responded and the group disbanded. I look at the add-on and saw it dropped for someone. I whispered him and he gladly gave it to me and I gave him some gold for it too. I get my monster helm and he gets some gold. Everyone wins.

Elsonso · March 2021

DigiAngel wrote: »

Choose to make that event a character building moment: "Well, I was going to post it in chat to give away, but since you used that crappy addon I'm keeping it."

This response is actually worse than the original offense, and contributes to why online games get reputations for having a toxic community. Please, don't do it.

Personally, I do believe that this add-on should not exist. ZOS should have this in the UI as part of the base game.

kringled_1 · March 2021

I don't use a group loot add on, but I can certainly see how it would improve efficiency especially with group members who aren't paying attention to their own drops. I won't keep something out of spite because someone else is running one. They can definitely enable some less than considerate behavior, though, which is why I'm not using one.
Story 1 (very mild). Run finishes, one of my team mates asks for items from set x. I link everything I got in that set. I then get a whisper about a different item, and I have to explain that it doesn't matter whether I need it or not, I cannot share that item because it came from the coffer and is already bound. While both of us were polite during this, I was thinking to myself "why am I even having this conversation given that I already linked what I was willing to give away"
Story 2. One of the very first very trials I completed, vHRC, in the interest of time we didn't loot most chests until after the warrior was dead. I got an AY dagger out of one chest just beyond the horn/gargoyles trash fight. I already had 2 daggers in the bank from long before nhrc runs, so I was willing to share. But I cannot share one weapon with two other players, both of whom knew the moment I opened that chest. Discussion between them got a bit heated, and one left the guild.

amm7sb14_ESO · March 2021

DinoZavr wrote: »

@AngryOldMan

AngryOldMan wrote: »

... What settings do i need to adjust to protect my precious loot from prying eyes? If its not something i can adjust in settings, which Add-On is hiding my highly valued loot? If there aint an Add-On yet, can someone please make it so i can have my beloved loot for myself? ...

Sorry to say that, but you can do nothing about that.

ZoS coded the game to have your loot information broadcasted to your group members. So, no "Loot Blocker" addon is possible at your side as the game server sends the information about all the drops (yours included) directly to other players (and your client is out of these communication paths (from server to other clients) and cannot affect that anyhow) .
Unless the Game-makers change the existing mechanics to add you controls upon the said server behaviour, you are helpless.

The game doesn't broadcast loot. An add-on does.

And I agree with OP. I hate it. Its very rude for other people to be seeing my inventory and asking for gear.

Zyva · March 2021

I love the addon. a lot of people, especially low level characters, have no idea the gear they get is something I might need, and simply bind it automatically now with sticker book or even toss it. so when they get it, i politely ask if they need it, and if not, if i might buy it. I dont wait to the end of the dungeon or trial because by then its often too late and the opportunity is lost; this idea that that is the "tradition" is really only an opinion.

If someone tells me no, i dont get offended, I just say thank you or no worries and keep rolling. If someone is rude to me or tries to get a rise out of me by saying "oh im going to DECON IT OMG HOW DARE YOU WHISPER ME" , i just figure they dont want my gold or good will. I'm more likely to ignore them for being frisky and waking up on the wrong side of the bed that morning xD I'm just here to play the game and have a good time, and there is always another run and more fun people to play with.

perfiction · March 2021

amm7sb14_ESO wrote: »

The game doesn't broadcast loot. An add-on does.

The game broadcasts loot with EVENT_LOOT_RECEIVED event. Add-on only receives that broadcast. (edit to be more specific: technically this is multicast not broadcast, since only group members are receiving it, not all players)

Add-ons cannot really send data between the players because there is no API for that (aside from Hodor Reflexes, Bandit's UI or other addons utilizing map pins in clever way to send very small ammount of data, for example current ultimate ability percentage. In this case only players using specific addons can send and receive that data).

SilverBride · March 2021

The biggest problem I see with this add on is it is completely one sided.

There are givers and takers in game, just like in the real world. This add on is tailored just for the takers.

If it were really a tool to share drops it wouldn't just let you look at another players drops... it would broadcast your drops in chat to the rest of the group, too. Because they know not everyone in the group is likely to have this installed.

I think most people against this, myself included, don't like someone virtually rummaging around in their stuff and whispering "Gimme! Gimme!" It's violating.

tmbrinks · March 2021

The problem isn't with the add-on

The problem is a people problem.

People who feel they're entitled to things. Asking never hurt anybody. Having additional knowledge in an MMO doesn't hurt anybody.

And if you're offended because somebody asked nicely, that's a you problem.

If you're offended because they were rude, that's a them problem, and in two clicks you will never hear from them again.

Elsonso · March 2021

amm7sb14_ESO wrote: »

DinoZavr wrote: »

@AngryOldMan

AngryOldMan wrote: »

... What settings do i need to adjust to protect my precious loot from prying eyes? If its not something i can adjust in settings, which Add-On is hiding my highly valued loot? If there aint an Add-On yet, can someone please make it so i can have my beloved loot for myself? ...

Sorry to say that, but you can do nothing about that.

ZoS coded the game to have your loot information broadcasted to your group members. So, no "Loot Blocker" addon is possible at your side as the game server sends the information about all the drops (yours included) directly to other players (and your client is out of these communication paths (from server to other clients) and cannot affect that anyhow) .
Unless the Game-makers change the existing mechanics to add you controls upon the said server behaviour, you are helpless.

The game doesn't broadcast loot. An add-on does.

And I agree with OP. I hate it. Its very rude for other people to be seeing my inventory and asking for gear.

Actually, game does. That is how the add-on works. What ZOS did was leave the presentation of that information to an add-on.

They are not seeing your inventory. They are seeing what you are picking up off the floor. Just because someone sees you take something off the shelf at Walmart does not mean that they are rooting through your pockets.

SilverBride · March 2021

Elsonso wrote: »

Just because someone sees you take something off the shelf at Walmart does not mean that they are rooting through your pockets.

It's funny that you use that example. I went to a department store because I needed a 9" square baking pan. There was only one left on the shelf so I picked it up and put it in my cart. A woman walked up, saw the empty shelf, looked in my cart and said "Did you just take the last 9" pan?" I don't know if she expected me to give it to her or what but her tone was very accusatory. I replied "Yes, I did." and walked away.

So yes this woman did inspect my cart and made it clear that she wanted what I had.

This add on can make other players feel violated just as I felt at the department store that day.

tmbrinks · March 2021

Even the store example is a poor analogy.

Better would be going to a company function and everybody is given a grab bag at the door when they come in... and as you're looking at your stuff, somebody notices that you got the blue item... and they got the green item.

They'd prefer the blue item. So they ask if you're willing to trade for their green one. You can say yes, or you can say no. Maybe you'd prefer green, maybe you prefer the blue one. Maybe you already have 30 of the things because you've been working at the company for 30 years and they give away the same thing every year, so you just give it to them.

If they pressure you, or are belligerent, or demand it... it's a them problem. Only you can't just block ignore in real life, so it's worse

Some people are just rude, inconsiderate jerks... many more are online due the anonymity they (think they) have.

SilverBride · March 2021

tmbrinks wrote: »

Even the store example is a poor analogy.

Better would be going to a company function and everybody is given a grab bag at the door when they come in... and as you're looking at your stuff, somebody notices that you got the blue item... and they got the green item.

They'd prefer the blue item. So they ask if you're willing to trade for their green one.

This is also not the best analogy because it doesn't take into account that everyone can see what others pull out of their grab bag, but with the add on only those who have it can see what others have received.

Also players using this don't generally ask for a trade, or to purchase the item from you... they just want to take it out of your hand.

RedMuse · March 2021

p00tx wrote: »

[snip]

[snip] and it's not about entitlement. If you need the drop yourself, you're 100% within your rights to tell the person no and keep the item. No one is arguing to the contrary. I said, and I quote "and you don't need it, why not just give it to them?". I clearly stated the item should be only be shared if it meets those conditions. If not, it's a non-issue. Keep your virtual treasures. I read this entire chain of comments, mostly because I've been frustrated by the rude behavior of players in random dungeon queues who patently ignore me when I give a friendly "Hey all! I'm looking for <item>. If you don't need it yourself, I'd greatly appreciate it", then they get the drop, I private message them, and they leave group and continue to ignore me. No matter how someone feels about the addon, there's no need to treat people like that. Many people in this thread have specifically stated they would keep the item out of spite and even decon it just to avoid sharing it. [snip]

[edited to remove quoted content and baiting]

Yeah, no. If you have terrible manners then I am by no means obligated to a) talk to you, b) give you anything of mine. I'm not swearing at you or anything, I'm just going to ignore you. You seem to want to have others behave in a certain way towards you, but have no consideration for them.

Girl_Number8 · March 2021

AngryOldMan wrote: »

I am an angry old man who find it very intruding when my random group members ask for stuff i have looted, and not linked in chat. If i dont want to share with them, why should the Add-On do it? Where is my right to keep loot a secret? What settings do i need to adjust to protect my precious loot from prying eyes? If its not something i can adjust in settings, which Add-On is hiding my highly valued loot? If there aint an Add-On yet, can someone please make it so i can have my beloved loot for myself?

If you need it tell them NO thanks. If you’re going to break it down for mats or if it is a rare, a very wanted item, Sell it to them. If it is a friend or your spouse increase the price....jk on the last one, maybe

KMarble · March 2021

perfiction wrote: »

I don't understand why seeing your group members loot makes you so mad. Why can't you just write 'no'?

It's about personal boundaries and respect for other people's privacy. I don't like the idea of people looking into my virtual bag to see what pixels I got, and judging by this thread, I'm not the only one.

When I need something from a group content run, I let the rest of the group know before we start. I also ask if anyone else needs anything and make a mental note of it. I don't check loot during the run but do ask after the last boss if anyone needs anything.

If I see a very good drop that I don't need at the moment I will ask in chat for other people to open trade with me. It was what I did for example, on my only run of MoL - I asked the tank to open a trade with me so I could give them the shield of Alkosh, because even though I do have a baby tank, I'm not playing it yet, but the tank could use the shield immediately.

Giving other people loot that I got isn't a problem. Having other people invade my privacy is.

RedMuse · March 2021

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Looking at the answers here I can understand why many players dont want to group up. I never had a problem with someone asking for something I looted, if I needed it myself I never received a salty or annoying reply. Personally Im just happy to give someone an item that they were looking for that I would otherwise sell or decon.

Congratulations on only having had positive experiences, I envy you. Personally for every person taking no for an answer nicely, I've had 3-4 that got salty, aggressive or outright toxic. Hence why I just slap an ignore on them these days and move on.

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

If you get annoyed but dont need the item you can always charge the player, you make some gold and the player is happy to get the item they're looking for.

Why would I give something to someone who annoys me? Even for (in-game) money? I'm not a shopkeeper, my living or survival does not depend on me selling something, so why in the world would I? Do you habitually do nice things for people who aggravate you in real life? Personally I don't unless it is part of my job and I can't avoid it, I'm not a door mat, and I see no reason why I should do so in a game I play for my enjoyment.

zvavi · March 2021

SilverBride wrote: »

The biggest problem I see with this add on is it is completely one sided.

Now that is something we can agree on. Shared loot should be part of base game, just like the other 1000 things add-ons fix for the game.

DinoZavr · March 2021

@perfiction @Elsonso
Thank you. Your explanations are great. My English is not good enough to say this better.

@amm7sb14_ESO

amm7sb14_ESO wrote: »

..snip
The game doesn't broadcast loot. An add-on does.
..snip

Thanks to @perfiction @Elsonso for their explanations.
@Amm7sb14_ESO you have a picture that some addon installed at your client is spying on your loot and sends it to others.
This is not how i actually works, because of two reasons:
1) to be able to communicate with other players (whose IP addresses you don't know) you have to have to run some external execuatable (like TTC does this, but it communicates with TTC server with know address). ESO Game server basically would not relay inbetween clients messages, as this would simply consume servers' networking resources, so TL/DR; server does this
2) if you examine official ESO API you might notice OnLootReceived
ZO_LootHistory_Keyboard.OnLootReceived()
ZO_LootHistory_Gamepad:OnLootReceived(...)
which basically tells group members:
OnLootReceived(receivedBy, itemLinkOrName, stackCount, itemSound, lootType, lootedBySelf, isPickpocketLoot, questItemIcon, itemId)
- which is: who have received what
Addons like Group Loot Notifier simply catch these server messages and parse them to display you in a convenient format.

The absence off such feature on consoles is not because server does no multicast, it does; but you are just unable to insert and addon parsing and displaying servers messages, because consoles cannot run addons.

Varana · March 2021

I am glad to hear that so many players don't see the need for that kind of addon because they gladly share all of their unneeded loot after a trial/dungeon and wait in group until everyone had a chance to check and respond.
/s

Oreyn_Bearclaw · March 2021

These threads always amuse me. Look at it purely from an RP perspective (which I almost never do). 4 of us kill a big bad monster. You pick up a 4 foot long greatsword. You really think the rest of us didnt see it?

All you have to do is say no. Actually, you don't even have to do that if you want to be anti-social. You can just leave the group at the end of the dungeon.

This is a non issue, and frankly, seeing group loot should be a base game feature. I cant tell you how often someone has been happy to share or sell loot if I make an offer, and vice versa. I am glad others can see my loot because if I dont need it for sticker book, it is just getting decon'ed. Would much rather it go to a friend or even a pug.

Elsonso · March 2021

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

These threads always amuse me. Look at it purely from an RP perspective (which I almost never do). 4 of us kill a big bad monster. You pick up a 4 foot long greatsword. You really think the rest of us didnt see it?

If you look at this from a role playing perspective, by the time most people get through the dungeon, they have picked up enough swords that they look like a porcupine lumbering along with a dozen pieces of armor tied to them.

SilverBride · March 2021

DinoZavr wrote: »

@Amm7sb14_ESO you have a picture that some addon installed at your client is spying on your loot and sends it to others.
This is not how i actually works, because of two reasons:
1) to be able to communicate with other players (whose IP addresses you don't know) you have to have to run some external execuatable (like TTC does this, but it communicates with TTC server with know address). ESO Game server basically would not relay inbetween clients messages, as this would simply consume servers' networking resources, so TL/DR; server does this
2) if you examine official ESO API you might notice OnLootReceived
ZO_LootHistory_Keyboard.OnLootReceived()
ZO_LootHistory_Gamepad:OnLootReceived(...)
which basically tells group members:
OnLootReceived(receivedBy, itemLinkOrName, stackCount, itemSound, lootType, lootedBySelf, isPickpocketLoot, questItemIcon, itemId)
- which is: who have received what
Addons like Group Loot Notifier simply catch these server messages and parse them to display you in a convenient format.

How the add on works doesn't matter. It's the end result that is causing the problem.

This addon gives players information about others drops that they wouldn't have access to without it. And many players don't like like being whispered by others begging them for their loot, which is the only reason players get the addon... so they can see what others have gotten and ask for it.

amm7sb14_ESO · March 2021

SilverBride wrote: »

The biggest problem I see with this add on is it is completely one sided.

There are givers and takers in game, just like in the real world. This add on is tailored just for the takers.

If it were really a tool to share drops it wouldn't just let you look at another players drops... it would broadcast your drops in chat to the rest of the group, too. Because they know not everyone in the group is likely to have this installed.

I think most people against this, myself included, don't like someone virtually rummaging around in their stuff and whispering "Gimme! Gimme!" It's violating.

100% agreed.

I liken it to a panhandler on the street going through my wallet and saying "Can I get that $1?"

I am more than happy to share something if I loot it and you need it, but the minute that you pull up an add-on to look through my loot, it shows me a sense of entitlement to my gear, and I will automatically not give it.

Linaleah · March 2021

I really dislike it when people think they are entitled to a loot that dropped for someone else, just because they saw it drop and they "need" it.

its not that i mind sharing. its this immediate asking that bothers me.

if a person says at a start of a run and then remind at the end that they were looking for a particular item without any sort of "hey dude, i saw this dropped for you, I need it" - chances are I will actualy happily trade them the item if it dropped for me. but if you go after me in whispers and whatnot? well suddenly i have just developed a need for it myself.

personaly, I have that option disabled in an addon that i have for completely unrelated reasons. if people want to trade something - they will. I'm not going to spy on them and I don't appreciate being spied on either. personaly. I will state what I'm looking for and I appreciate when people mention what they are looking for without attaching any expectations to it. and that is as far as I go.

Magdalina · March 2021

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

BeefcakeManwich wrote: »

Haha this always cracks me up. It's group loot. So what if they know what dropped. Some games it's automatically built into it. Just don't respond. Problem solved. But why do I have to because they did and now it's harder for me to be left to myself in an mmo. Oh the run arounds of first world problems.

If it's group loot, then everybody in the group should get it.

If each person in the group got different loot, then it wasn't "group loot."

IMHO; YMMV and clearly does.

This type of "What's yours is mine" mentality is all the more reason not to play in a group, AFAIC.

How is asking 'can I have that (if you don't need it) please?' (from a player who just fought alongside you in a group activity but just had worse rng than you, not just a totally random player) an example of 'what yours is mine' mentality? Isn't it a prime example of team communication which is, you know, the very heart of an MMO? If such things make you feel uncomfortable, perhaps you should consider either not playing MMOs, avoiding group activities in MMOs, or perhaps work on that insecurity of yours a bit (I say that without the smallest intention of offence, it just is what it is - there's absolutely no reason that some stranger asking for something in text chat in a game should make you feel quite that uncomfortable).

amm7sb14_ESO · March 2021

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

These threads always amuse me. Look at it purely from an RP perspective (which I almost never do). 4 of us kill a big bad monster. You pick up a 4 foot long greatsword. You really think the rest of us didnt see it?

"Look at it purely from an RP perspective"... coming from the same online community that demonizes roleplayers by using "RP'er" as a derogatory term...

amm7sb14_ESO · March 2021

Magdalina wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

BeefcakeManwich wrote: »

Haha this always cracks me up. It's group loot. So what if they know what dropped. Some games it's automatically built into it. Just don't respond. Problem solved. But why do I have to because they did and now it's harder for me to be left to myself in an mmo. Oh the run arounds of first world problems.

If it's group loot, then everybody in the group should get it.

If each person in the group got different loot, then it wasn't "group loot."

IMHO; YMMV and clearly does.

This type of "What's yours is mine" mentality is all the more reason not to play in a group, AFAIC.

How is asking 'can I have that (if you don't need it) please?' (from a player who just fought alongside you in a group activity but just had worse rng than you, not just a totally random player) an example of 'what yours is mine' mentality? Isn't it a prime example of team communication which is, you know, the very heart of an MMO? If such things make you feel uncomfortable, perhaps you should consider either not playing MMOs, avoiding group activities in MMOs, or perhaps work on that insecurity of yours a bit (I say that without the smallest intention of offence, it just is what it is - there's absolutely no reason that some stranger asking for something in text chat in a game should make you feel quite that uncomfortable).

You think that's how it gets asked? lmao

"<item> plz" is how it gets asked.

On the same token, how is saying "I'm looking for <item> if anybody loots any they don't need" at the beginning of a dungeon such a problem? Why do you have to download an app that goes through player's inventories so you can approach them like a panhandler with your hand out asking "gimme gimme gimme"?