Starlight_Whisper wrote: »

Stahlor wrote: »

In pvp:
Light armour will get even more slaughtered in Elder Stamina Online. Not only will they receive more physical damage, they take even more when blocking.
Medium Armour will be king.

In pve: They are going to hit tanks even more. It will be a mess in some trials. On pts they already started tanking some content in light armour.

Is it because medium has no penalties? Also why light amour on tanks?

Because it'll give you higher mitigation for magicka damage compared to heavy armour e.g. VCR.

I find it strange that no changes to armor penalties and benefits were made during the entire PTS.
The post from Brian even said, they would await player feedback. I have not seen a single person saying light armor is looking good. Everyone seems to agree that these changes will make it even worse for pvp.

They could be better but overall i think they are a step in the right direction. One of my biggest problems is that ZOS is changing to much to fast as always.

JoSePHRiNG wrote: »

Heavy Armor makes you so tanky when you are immune to CC(which can be activated all the time in PVP)
+ CP also reduces damage taken.

and Malacath causes heavy armor build deal damage and proc set meta still exists.

I am not a PVP player myself but everyone can understand good and bad.

Thats not a problem of Heavy Armor or PvP. Its a problem of trying to balance PvE and PvP in one go instead of giving items splitted bonuses for PvE and PvP.

Faded wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I find it strange that no changes to armor penalties and benefits were made during the entire PTS.
The post from Brian even said, they would await player feedback. I have not seen a single person saying light armor is looking good. Everyone seems to agree that these changes will make it even worse for pvp.

This is the week to look for changes based on feedback. But you've been around long enough to know listening to what players think and making changes is the exception, not the rule. They do what they want and walk it back in tiny increments over the course of years.

Edit: or whiplash it too far the other direction one patch later. That's also an option.

@Faded
I thought last week's patch was supposed to be the big feedback recognition patch?
I anticipated there will be nothing but minor bug fixes now.

Faded wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Faded wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

I find it strange that no changes to armor penalties and benefits were made during the entire PTS.
The post from Brian even said, they would await player feedback. I have not seen a single person saying light armor is looking good. Everyone seems to agree that these changes will make it even worse for pvp.

This is the week to look for changes based on feedback. But you've been around long enough to know listening to what players think and making changes is the exception, not the rule. They do what they want and walk it back in tiny increments over the course of years.

Edit: or whiplash it too far the other direction one patch later. That's also an option.

@ Faded
I thought last week's patch was supposed to be the big feedback recognition patch?
I anticipated there will be nothing but minor bug fixes now.

Yeah, it's usually week three. They were pretty occupied with the CP rework last week. This is my attempt at optimism.

Actually, you could be right. I have went back to check last update's .2 and .3 patch (.3 is what comes this monday) and both are similar in amount of combat and set changes they brought. Was mostly bug fixes in both, but in quantity, they were comparable.

I am more concerned about racial skills imbalance. You can change armor easier than race (and many people don t want to change race anyway).

oscarovegren wrote: »

Heavy mag mist form builds will be king in PvP. You are CC immune in mist, which gives even more mitigation from the new heavy passives and mist form builds doesnt even need to roll dodge so thats no penalty at all. 1 light now gives almost 1k pen, which gives higher procdmg.

Mist form procbuilds with mala will be everywhere. They counter heavy stambuilds since both have less martial damage taken but more magical damage taken. Basicly free minor protection and minor vulnerability in favor for the heavy mag build.

I think the passive only applies when you have the actual buff making you immune to CC, which is proced by break free and immovability pots, not abilities like mistform that make you immune to CC... unless it is working that way then ZOS needs to fix that ASAP.

oscarovegren wrote: »

Heavy mag mist form builds will be king in PvP. You are CC immune in mist, which gives even more mitigation from the new heavy passives and mist form builds doesnt even need to roll dodge so thats no penalty at all. 1 light now gives almost 1k pen, which gives higher procdmg.

Mist form procbuilds with mala will be everywhere. They counter heavy stambuilds since both have less martial damage taken but more magical damage taken. Basicly free minor protection and minor vulnerability in favor for the heavy mag build.

Technically, the mitigation bonus should only be in effect when you are under the CC immunity status effect (swirls by your feet). Unless, under the hood, mist form is coded to passively grant you this specific effect as opposed to it's own unique modifier buff, in which case that should be fixed ofc.

Vevvev wrote: »

oscarovegren wrote: »

Heavy mag mist form builds will be king in PvP. You are CC immune in mist, which gives even more mitigation from the new heavy passives and mist form builds doesnt even need to roll dodge so thats no penalty at all. 1 light now gives almost 1k pen, which gives higher procdmg.

Mist form procbuilds with mala will be everywhere. They counter heavy stambuilds since both have less martial damage taken but more magical damage taken. Basicly free minor protection and minor vulnerability in favor for the heavy mag build.

I think the passive only applies when you have the actual buff making you immune to CC, which is proced by break free and immovability pots, not abilities like mistform that make you immune to CC... unless it is working that way then ZOS needs to fix that ASAP.

I can confirm that this CC immunity damage reduction does get triggered by Mistform. While in Mistform, you get the 14% damage mitigation. So enjoy.

Nothing was done to finally balance Mistform. It will only get stronger, as will the obnoxious meta we had since months.

These changes make no sense, light armor bonuses are concentrated around stamina use, while we usually use magicka. Penalty with increased damage taken is also stupid, it's already weak in defense, why make it even more weaker?

PvE will become more difficult for me, the magcro, I do not mind.

At the same time, I will finally learn to cast shields when necessary.

I feel the changes are different. Different in the sense that players can blend more armor weights together than the static 5/1/1 which was primarily done for the Undaunted passive. Five being the limitation, whereas the changes redresses that minimum number should you want the armor ultimate skill. The Armor Ultimate should scale the cost based on the number of armor pieces equipped, which each armor weight equipped (light, medium, heavy) reduces from the baseline ultimate cost per piece.

The damage penalties between the Light and Heavy armors can be mitigated with CP under the 2.0 system (10 CP/-1%) but this would be an off-set not a cancellation of the armor passives. This is also true with other armor penalties. When we are looking at the changes, we are accustomed to the current damage output in both PVP/PVE gameplay. First, there are double nodes that reduce damage (slotted and unslotted passives) at a steep cost of 100 CP minimum plus prerequisite CP nodes. Second, the Exploiter (+10% damage to off-balanced targets) does not exist in the current 2.0 CP system, as with other CP passive nodes that grant "free" extra damage on targets.

In PVP, this means the famous D-swing -> off-balance to stun will be less effective when you calculate -% damage while under CC immunity - That is correct. D-Swing will immediately grant their target -% damage reduction (upwards to -24% with CP investment with only a +10% off-set for bonus damage to direct damage. The points being, Light Armor has the advantage to rebound from CC effects quickly and with CP investment can extend CC immunity by 15%; hence, gaining +14% damage reduction. Paired with the Survival tree nodes that improve damage shields, and Light Armor can fall back on damage shields benefits outside the Warfare tree unlike Medium and Heavy armor users - but at a cost.

Overall the new armor changes does have some hand-in-hand synergies with the new 2.0 CP system. Magic damage (fire, frost, lightning, magic...) proliferates the world: it's like gaining the vampire vulnerability flaw but quite invincible against martial attacks. Whereas, light armor gains the vulnerability flaw to martial attacks; but with cost reductions that enable the player to mitigate martial direct attacks i.e. D-swing. I feel there is a lot of trade offs on using different armor weights in the Update 29 but its not too bad when you're not limited to the old 5/1/1, 5/2, or 6/1 weight system.