Where is the auction house?

Anotherone773 · January 2021

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Anotherone773 wrote: »

The fractured market system is far superior for a healthy economy and making sure you can find pretty much everything you need..

You mean "making sure you can't find anything", because it's scattered across a million different NPCs buried behind dozens of loading screens.

Mostly, I find the trader system here to be utterly worthless for anyone who isn't a Serious Trader™. I know that I don't bother at all with the "healthy economy", because it's absurdly tedious to engage with that economy in any way. /shrug

edit: which I suppose is the point - it makes the economy "healthy" for those Serious Traders, by severely limiting how much competition they might have from other sources of goods. When most of the server can't dump their copy of Set Piece X onto the auction, prices are kept artificially high.

I buy off traders often. Some people make millions a week buying off traders. Weird how it seems to work me and them? I either use TTC or i go to high traffic traders when i am shopping. A load screen is like 15 seconds and i usually dont need to go to more than 2 locations to find what i want.

Yeah its good that they can't dump their copy of X onto a trader. Over supply would drop the price drastically to near worthless. People would vendor it or deconstruct it then when someone actually needs it they cant just get off a guild trader, they have to farm it themselves.

We have a healthy economy in the game and there is no logical argument that can be made why we should change it to a system that is notorious for being terrible for in game economies.

iksde · January 2021

Anotherone773 wrote: »

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Anotherone773 wrote: »

The fractured market system is far superior for a healthy economy and making sure you can find pretty much everything you need..

You mean "making sure you can't find anything", because it's scattered across a million different NPCs buried behind dozens of loading screens.

Mostly, I find the trader system here to be utterly worthless for anyone who isn't a Serious Trader™. I know that I don't bother at all with the "healthy economy", because it's absurdly tedious to engage with that economy in any way. /shrug

edit: which I suppose is the point - it makes the economy "healthy" for those Serious Traders, by severely limiting how much competition they might have from other sources of goods. When most of the server can't dump their copy of Set Piece X onto the auction, prices are kept artificially high.

I buy off traders often. Some people make millions a week buying off traders. Weird how it seems to work me and them? I either use TTC or i go to high traffic traders when i am shopping. A load screen is like 15 seconds and i usually dont need to go to more than 2 locations to find what i want.

Yeah its good that they can't dump their copy of X onto a trader. Over supply would drop the price drastically to near worthless. People would vendor it or deconstruct it then when someone actually needs it they cant just get off a guild trader, they have to farm it themselves.

We have a healthy economy in the game and there is no logical argument that can be made why we should change it to a system that is notorious for being terrible for in game economies.

and people are doing this already because most of iteams is worthless anyway so people dont bother even pickuping this if they dont ahve auto loot on

so nothing special would have changed than that everyone would ahve access to thing to list item for sell and not be forced to be in trade guild with minimum sales required

always to not screw economy with this we could have cut chance for set items drops instead 100% so worth sets still would have their worth

Starlight_Whisper · January 2021

I enjoy the system. If any complains then we just need more traders... like why does vukel guard only have 1...

Waseem · January 2021

We don't need an Auction house In ESO because it's negative effect on economy is destructive
Thanks for participating in ESO forums

Eedat · January 2021

Oh boy time for this thread again. Lets summarize how this entire thread goes for the thousandth time.

People who want a central market are outnumbered somewhere between 2:1 to 3:1.

People who don't want to put any effort into an aspect of the game demand that it be catered to them. Thats not really limited to just trading though. You get people demanding every aspect of the game people have put literal years of effort in to be gutted and reworked to cater to people who put absolutely none in.

Then you get a flurry of "but X game does Y". Cool, not every game has to be a clone of each other.

You get the ridiculous theories of how the trade guild leaders are illuminati conspirators that hold secret meetings to maintain their global control.

You get claims that not everybody can even get into a trade guild which is ridiculously easy to disprove by just going to guild finder and seeing there are plenty of open positions in trade guilds.

You get people insist that the trade guild system somehow causes price fixing by the rich overlords despite the blatantly obvious reasons why it's a hundred times easier to do that with a central market.

Eedat · January 2021

Raideen wrote: »

For some reason ZOS thought it was important to limit the amount of people who can sell through a guild trader to 98,500.

There are 197 Guild Traders in game with 500 member slots each.
197x500=98500 Guild Trader player slots available

except that everyone can be in 5 guilds. I am in 5 trade guilds, so I take 5 of those slots, or 4 extra.

If everyone in game who did trading had 5 trade guilds there would only be 19,700 people trading at guild traders. Of course not everyone has 5 guild traders, but many do have 3. Which would then limit the amount of individual players who are using guild traders to 32,833.

I often see it promoted that this game is super healthy, making tons of money and has a player base of about 3 million. Divide that 3 million by 4 for PCNA, PCEU, XBOX, and PS and you have 750,000 players per server type on average. This means that roughly 700,000 people will not be allowed to trade at guild traders.

My question is, why limit the amount of people who can buy and sell through guild traders? Why not have a central auction house so the entire player base has a fair chance of selling stuff.

Makes more sense to me.

This is a completely ridiculous argument. It can be factually disproven by simply going to guild finder and literally viewing all the empty spots available in dozens of trade guilds. Like it's not even a difference of opinion. It's just completely false and factually disprovable in seconds lol

iksde · January 2021

Eedat wrote: »

Raideen wrote: »

For some reason ZOS thought it was important to limit the amount of people who can sell through a guild trader to 98,500.

There are 197 Guild Traders in game with 500 member slots each.
197x500=98500 Guild Trader player slots available

except that everyone can be in 5 guilds. I am in 5 trade guilds, so I take 5 of those slots, or 4 extra.

If everyone in game who did trading had 5 trade guilds there would only be 19,700 people trading at guild traders. Of course not everyone has 5 guild traders, but many do have 3. Which would then limit the amount of individual players who are using guild traders to 32,833.

I often see it promoted that this game is super healthy, making tons of money and has a player base of about 3 million. Divide that 3 million by 4 for PCNA, PCEU, XBOX, and PS and you have 750,000 players per server type on average. This means that roughly 700,000 people will not be allowed to trade at guild traders.

My question is, why limit the amount of people who can buy and sell through guild traders? Why not have a central auction house so the entire player base has a fair chance of selling stuff.

Makes more sense to me.

This is a completely ridiculous argument. It can be factually disproven by simply going to guild finder and literally viewing all the empty spots available in dozens of trade guilds. Like it's not even a difference of opinion. It's just completely false and factually disprovable in seconds lol

and so hop between trade guild every week yes? because as playing casually and still wanting to sell stuff you wont have enough sells in good spots with sure to have items sold while in cheaper guilds with bad spots you will wait much longer to sell same item keeping its price to be worth, no lowering it for your disadvantage

it always annoyed me so much even as I always sit only in top guilds it just annoy me how casual unfriendl this system is....or you just dont sell items because you wont meet requirments for good trade guilds or you will stay in weak guild putting yourself on disadvantage by selling items with lower price to get them sold because of so bad place with trader....this is so unfair for people who want to play casually, chilled this game without need to care of if they will stay in good trading gild or not

Eedat · January 2021

iksde wrote: »

and so hop between trade guild every week yes? because as playing casually and still wanting to sell stuff you wont have enough sells in good spots with sure to have items sold while in cheaper guilds with bad spots you will wait much longer to sell same item keeping its price to be worth, no lowering it for your disadvantage

it always annoyed me so much even as I always sit only in top guilds it just annoy me how casual unfriendl this system is....or you just dont sell items because you wont meet requirments for good trade guilds or you will stay in weak guild putting yourself on disadvantage by selling items with lower price to get them sold because of so bad place with trader....this is so unfair for people who want to play casually, chilled this game without need to care of if they will stay in good trading gild or not

Why would you need to hop between guilds? Let me help you out. I am currently looking at a trade guild in Vivec which is pretty much tied with Mournhold for top trading cities in the game that has literally zero sales requirements. The requirement is "don't be in the bottom 5% of contributions for a 30 day period". I'm actually in another Vivec guild where there is zero dues. The requirements are quote, "no fees or dues or minimums - but you are required to list items for sale in the store and will be purged if you do not". There is another in Alinor which is a good spot that has no contribution requirements and the only requirements are a 14 day inactivity policy and no selling things in guild chat. I see two guilds in Belkarth with no requirements at all. One in Elden Root with a 5k a week contribution requirement. Another in Rawl that has a 2k per week contribution requirement.

Those are just a few that I took 2 minutes to look at right now in guild finder.

How exactly is this not casual friendly? You can get into top trading spots with little to no requirements.

This notion that you have to tryhard to get into a good trade guild is completely fabricated. People make it up as an argument against trade guilds but it's 100% false.

kargen27 · January 2021

Eedat wrote: »

iksde wrote: »

and so hop between trade guild every week yes? because as playing casually and still wanting to sell stuff you wont have enough sells in good spots with sure to have items sold while in cheaper guilds with bad spots you will wait much longer to sell same item keeping its price to be worth, no lowering it for your disadvantage

it always annoyed me so much even as I always sit only in top guilds it just annoy me how casual unfriendl this system is....or you just dont sell items because you wont meet requirments for good trade guilds or you will stay in weak guild putting yourself on disadvantage by selling items with lower price to get them sold because of so bad place with trader....this is so unfair for people who want to play casually, chilled this game without need to care of if they will stay in good trading gild or not

Why would you need to hop between guilds? Let me help you out. I am currently looking at a trade guild in Vivec which is pretty much tied with Mournhold for top trading cities in the game that has literally zero sales requirements. The requirement is "don't be in the bottom 5% of contributions for a 30 day period". There is another in Alinor which is a good spot that has no contribution requirements and the only requirements are a 14 day inactivity policy and no selling things in guild chat. I see two guilds in Belkarth with no requirements at all. One in Elden Root with a 5k a week contribution requirement. Another in Rawl that has a 2k per week contribution requirement.

Those are just a few that I took 2 minutes to look at right now in guild finder.

How exactly is this not casual friendly? You can get into top trading spots with little to no requirements.

This notion that you have to tryhard to get into a good trade guild is completely fabricated. People make it up as an argument against trade guilds but it's 100% false.

The trade guild I am in requires either a 3,000 dues each week or participation in a farming event. The farming event is one hour where you farm materials and donate what you farm to the guild. I joined maybe eight months ago and we didn't get our bid one time. When that happened we were all given a week with no dues due. When I try I can hit over three million sales in one day with this guild. They are looking for members and are very active beyond just trading.

iksde · January 2021

Eedat wrote: »

iksde wrote: »

and so hop between trade guild every week yes? because as playing casually and still wanting to sell stuff you wont have enough sells in good spots with sure to have items sold while in cheaper guilds with bad spots you will wait much longer to sell same item keeping its price to be worth, no lowering it for your disadvantage

it always annoyed me so much even as I always sit only in top guilds it just annoy me how casual unfriendl this system is....or you just dont sell items because you wont meet requirments for good trade guilds or you will stay in weak guild putting yourself on disadvantage by selling items with lower price to get them sold because of so bad place with trader....this is so unfair for people who want to play casually, chilled this game without need to care of if they will stay in good trading gild or not

Why would you need to hop between guilds? Let me help you out. I am currently looking at a trade guild in Vivec which is pretty much tied with Mournhold for top trading cities in the game that has literally zero sales requirements. The requirement is "don't be in the bottom 5% of contributions for a 30 day period". I'm actually in another Vivec guild where there is zero dues. The requirements are quote, "no fees or dues or minimums - but you are required to list items for sale in the store and will be purged if you do not". There is another in Alinor which is a good spot that has no contribution requirements and the only requirements are a 14 day inactivity policy and no selling things in guild chat. I see two guilds in Belkarth with no requirements at all. One in Elden Root with a 5k a week contribution requirement. Another in Rawl that has a 2k per week contribution requirement.

Those are just a few that I took 2 minutes to look at right now in guild finder.

How exactly is this not casual friendly? You can get into top trading spots with little to no requirements.

This notion that you have to tryhard to get into a good trade guild is completely fabricated. People make it up as an argument against trade guilds but it's 100% false.

what I have seen in most guilds was 100k-300k weakly sales or 5k-10k donations in guild with good spots to be able to sell items with decent price without waiting month to get it sold or without special lowering price to get this sold which is putting you at this in disadvange if you are in weaker guild, in worse spot

and as for someone who doesnt run endgame like dlc dungs for motifs etc, who play more for fun than actually monitoring prices for every single part of set form overaland to see if this is worth something more or not I will say 100k per week will be very much for someone who will want to play more chilled, casually
as current system with guild requirments is just harsh to stay in them if you want to sell anything in decent time with good price but you dont have time or willings, power to play additional trading game in game

sorry but as it was said before....current system is just trading game in game and people who like this will be always against other system of trading giving more freedom with trading for more players at once

like you may like this system becasue you like I will name it "trade minigame" so you have time for this and willings...while many others who want to just play this game are forced for this "trade minigame" to have gold for anything or they just leave it and so they stay without higher amount of gold by just playing game

Eedat · January 2021

iksde wrote: »

what I have seen in most guilds was 100k-300k weakly sales or 5k-10k donations in guild with good spots to be able to sell items with decent price without waiting month to get it sold or without special lowering price to get this sold which is putting you at this in disadvange if you are in weaker guild, in worse spot

You can say this all you want but it just flat out isnt true. Would you like me to post actual screenshots of the guilds proving this is incorrect? If you don't want to join a guild with hgher requirements, then you just dont lol. You can still get into the absolute top tier trading locations with little to no requirements.

Besides, how is 5k a week not casual friendly? You can farm over 100k in a single hour picking mats off ground in craglorn without getting a single potent nirn. Thats almost half a year of dues in a single hour of terrible luck farming in crag.

LalMirchi · January 2021

iksde wrote: »

Eedat wrote: »

iksde wrote: »

and so hop between trade guild every week yes? because as playing casually and still wanting to sell stuff you wont have enough sells in good spots with sure to have items sold while in cheaper guilds with bad spots you will wait much longer to sell same item keeping its price to be worth, no lowering it for your disadvantage

it always annoyed me so much even as I always sit only in top guilds it just annoy me how casual unfriendl this system is....or you just dont sell items because you wont meet requirments for good trade guilds or you will stay in weak guild putting yourself on disadvantage by selling items with lower price to get them sold because of so bad place with trader....this is so unfair for people who want to play casually, chilled this game without need to care of if they will stay in good trading gild or not

Why would you need to hop between guilds? Let me help you out. I am currently looking at a trade guild in Vivec which is pretty much tied with Mournhold for top trading cities in the game that has literally zero sales requirements. The requirement is "don't be in the bottom 5% of contributions for a 30 day period". I'm actually in another Vivec guild where there is zero dues. The requirements are quote, "no fees or dues or minimums - but you are required to list items for sale in the store and will be purged if you do not". There is another in Alinor which is a good spot that has no contribution requirements and the only requirements are a 14 day inactivity policy and no selling things in guild chat. I see two guilds in Belkarth with no requirements at all. One in Elden Root with a 5k a week contribution requirement. Another in Rawl that has a 2k per week contribution requirement.

Those are just a few that I took 2 minutes to look at right now in guild finder.

How exactly is this not casual friendly? You can get into top trading spots with little to no requirements.

This notion that you have to tryhard to get into a good trade guild is completely fabricated. People make it up as an argument against trade guilds but it's 100% false.

what I have seen in most guilds was 100k-300k weakly sales or 5k-10k donations in guild with good spots to be able to sell items with decent price without waiting month to get it sold or without special lowering price to get this sold which is putting you at this in disadvange if you are in weaker guild, in worse spot

and as for someone who doesnt run endgame like dlc dungs for motifs etc, who play more for fun than actually monitoring prices for every single part of set form overaland to see if this is worth something more or not I will say 100k per week will be very much for someone who will want to play more chilled, casually
as current system with guild requirments is just harsh to stay in them if you want to sell anything in decent time with good price but you dont have time or willings, power to play additional trading game in game

sorry but as it was said before....current system is just trading game in game and people who like this will be always against other system of trading giving more freedom with trading for more players at once

like you may like this system becasue you like I will name it "trade minigame" so you have time for this and willings...while many others who want to just play this game are forced for this "trade minigame" to have gold for anything or they just leave it and so they stay without higher amount of gold by just playing game

Hyperbole, there are very few guilds with such requirements (100k-300k weakly sales bad spelling included) Try again?

robpr · January 2021

Fractured system is a pain to the buyer, but good for sellers and overall economy.
Guilds bid for every spot every week and that removes tons of gold out of circulation, halting inflation. Sellers also have easier to keep the prices to their favor due to harder times of comparing them.
Central AH is good for the buyer but doesnt remove any gold unless there are hard taxes. Popular items prices goes down while something really rare goes up to ridiculous levels and its hard to keep it in check.

AH system could coexist with guild trader system probably, reserved only for bidding without buyouts.

BlueRaven · January 2021

Eedat wrote: »

Oh boy time for this thread again. Lets summarize how this entire thread goes for the thousandth time.

People who want a central market are outnumbered somewhere between 2:1 to 3:1.

People who don't want to put any effort into an aspect of the game demand that it be catered to them. Thats not really limited to just trading though. You get people demanding every aspect of the game people have put literal years of effort in to be gutted and reworked to cater to people who put absolutely none in.

Then you get a flurry of "but X game does Y". Cool, not every game has to be a clone of each other.

You get the ridiculous theories of how the trade guild leaders are illuminati conspirators that hold secret meetings to maintain their global control.

You get claims that not everybody can even get into a trade guild which is ridiculously easy to disprove by just going to guild finder and seeing there are plenty of open positions in trade guilds.

You get people insist that the trade guild system somehow causes price fixing by the rich overlords despite the blatantly obvious reasons why it's a hundred times easier to do that with a central market.

This post is pretty brilliant.

I keep saying that if my “no dues just log in once per two weeks” housing guild can retain a trader, there is nothing wrong with the system.

Kiralyn2000 · January 2021

Eedat wrote: »

People who don't want to put any effort into an aspect of the game demand that it be catered to them.

Whereas I've never seen trading/etc to be an "aspect of the game" to be "catered to" (like those wheeler-dealers who keep demanding that everything be made BoE, because they don't already have enough things to profit off of), but rather a basic game system, like chat or travel. Do games with central AH's have something for the "I wanna play Fantasy Market Mogul 2020" crowd? Sure. Meanwhile, your position seems to be that the economy should be built for/around those people, as an "aspect of the game" for them.

Question - what does the person who randomly wants to sell 0-5 items a week do in this game? And 'yell in chat' is a useless answer.

Eedat wrote: »

Besides, how is 5k a week not casual friendly? You can farm over 100k in a single hour picking mats off ground in craglorn without getting a single potent nirn. Thats almost half a year of dues in a single hour of terrible luck farming in crag.

If all you're trying to sell is less than 5k worth of stuff (or, rather, "5k + the vendor cost of the stuff")? Having to pay to do so isn't the best.

(seriously, that's how I've used AH's in many other games. I either think 'huh, that item might be worth something, it'd be nice to get more than it's vendor cost" or "oh, someone might have a use for this." I go to the AH, search to see if it actually has value, and then throw it on there with a small undercut so it'll move within an hour or two. I get a small amount of gold, but it's more than if I just vendored the thing, so it's a success.

I don't run around farming specific things to keep my trades slots stocked, to keep a steady cashflow, and maximize my profit™. That sounds like work. And isn't what I'm interested in - in those games I've spent less than a couple minutes a week 'selling'. I do plenty of buying, though - because you can search the AH for the things you're looking for and find the best price. Which, again, only takes a few minutes a week.)

what_the · January 2021

Kalik_Gold wrote: »

I honestly miss the bazaar system in EQ or the tunnel live shouting system.

ohh, now you are showing your age...

validifyedneb18_ESO · January 2021

TTC is the auction house. It adds a lot to the game, the bidding and selling on key trade locations as a guild.

Deal hunters will travel to obscure locations searching for a good price (i will when for example looking for expensive motifs or materials), but its intended that many people will spend more for convenience. Vvardenfel traders are always hellishly expensive for example, the players who sell on them have massive mark ups on all their prices.

But vvardenfel traders often have the most accessible wares of all types - the best traders get into the best trading guilds, and the best trading guilds get the best guild trader spots.

iksde · January 2021

Eedat wrote: »

iksde wrote: »

what I have seen in most guilds was 100k-300k weakly sales or 5k-10k donations in guild with good spots to be able to sell items with decent price without waiting month to get it sold or without special lowering price to get this sold which is putting you at this in disadvange if you are in weaker guild, in worse spot

You can say this all you want but it just flat out isnt true. Would you like me to post actual screenshots of the guilds proving this is incorrect? If you don't want to join a guild with hgher requirements, then you just dont lol. You can still get into the absolute top tier trading locations with little to no requirements.

Besides, how is 5k a week not casual friendly? You can farm over 100k in a single hour picking mats off ground in craglorn without getting a single potent nirn. Thats almost half a year of dues in a single hour of terrible luck farming in crag.

so here we go with few examples

iksde · January 2021

robpr wrote: »

Fractured system is a pain to the buyer, but good for sellers and overall economy.
Guilds bid for every spot every week and that removes tons of gold out of circulation, halting inflation. Sellers also have easier to keep the prices to their favor due to harder times of comparing them.
Central AH is good for the buyer but doesnt remove any gold unless there are hard taxes. Popular items prices goes down while something really rare goes up to ridiculous levels and its hard to keep it in check.

AH system could coexist with guild trader system probably, reserved only for bidding without buyouts.

in most games I was playing with global AH there was average 10% of tax and everything was fine so and this wont be problem here along with much better gold sink than just 3.5% from price

iksde · January 2021

and thank you very much @Kiralyn2000 for better explaining than mine and adding thing about which I also mean while writing for casual players

like for real for some here like for me 5k isn't much, as I was statiung before Im myself only in top spots in trade guilds but it just annoy me how someone casually want to sell just few cheap items and he cant without guild or even wont sell it in weak guild for decent price not waiting weeks, months to sell this lets say for 5k.....5k easily to sell in good spot but in bad spot you should lower price even 2x more like this to be sure it will be sold earlier or later but if you list it for 5k in this bad spot....you wont be sure it will be sold after 2-4 weeks becasue nobody will mind to go for this into bad spot

JKorr · January 2021

I've had the opposite experience. Currently in 4 guilds. Three have traders, one doesn't bother. The only requirement for any of the guilds is to log in. No gold or sales requirements. I put up some flowers, some tempers, and a chromium grain. Not the full allotment of slots for one no-dues, no-fees guild. I check prices with MM so I see what items are selling for in my guilds, and set my prices a little lower. Everything sold in about a half hour. The three guilds that have traders are NOT in a hub town.

Sometimes I wonder what I could make if I filled all the slots for my four guilds, even though one would be in a guild sale only. If the player doesn't need to make a billion gold in an hour, not being in a guild that needs a 100k from each member to hold their super prime location, it is possible to make more than enough gold in a no-dues guild.

relentless_turnip · January 2021

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Eedat wrote: »

People who don't want to put any effort into an aspect of the game demand that it be catered to them.

Whereas I've never seen trading/etc to be an "aspect of the game" to be "catered to" (like those wheeler-dealers who keep demanding that everything be made BoE, because they don't already have enough things to profit off of), but rather a basic game system, like chat or travel. Do games with central AH's have something for the "I wanna play Fantasy Market Mogul 2020" crowd? Sure. Meanwhile, your position seems to be that the economy should be built for/around those people, as an "aspect of the game" for them.

Question - what does the person who randomly wants to sell 0-5 items a week do in this game? And 'yell in chat' is a useless answer.

Eedat wrote: »

Besides, how is 5k a week not casual friendly? You can farm over 100k in a single hour picking mats off ground in craglorn without getting a single potent nirn. Thats almost half a year of dues in a single hour of terrible luck farming in crag.

If all you're trying to sell is less than 5k worth of stuff (or, rather, "5k + the vendor cost of the stuff")? Having to pay to do so isn't the best.

(seriously, that's how I've used AH's in many other games. I either think 'huh, that item might be worth something, it'd be nice to get more than it's vendor cost" or "oh, someone might have a use for this." I go to the AH, search to see if it actually has value, and then throw it on there with a small undercut so it'll move within an hour or two. I get a small amount of gold, but it's more than if I just vendored the thing, so it's a success.

I don't run around farming specific things to keep my trades slots stocked, to keep a steady cashflow, and maximize my profit™. That sounds like work. And isn't what I'm interested in - in those games I've spent less than a couple minutes a week 'selling'. I do plenty of buying, though - because you can search the AH for the things you're looking for and find the best price. Which, again, only takes a few minutes a week.)

I sell 0-5 things a week... I pay my 5k to guild trader and make it back on one character doing writs in 2 mins or earn it incidentally by playing 10minutes of basically any content.

Guild traders are a unique and immersive part of this game. I see that even with my minimal interaction with it. Shops are run by players which is a great thing in an mmo. It could be better improved and perhaps satisfy these complaints by simply adding a building in each major city that acts like TTC and tells you where things are being sold.

tmbrinks · January 2021

iksde wrote: »

and thank you very much @Kiralyn2000 for better explaining than mine and adding thing about which I also mean while writing for casual players

like for real for some here like for me 5k isn't much, as I was statiung before Im myself only in top spots in trade guilds but it just annoy me how someone casually want to sell just few cheap items and he cant without guild or even wont sell it in weak guild for decent price not waiting weeks, months to sell this lets say for 5k.....5k easily to sell in good spot but in bad spot you should lower price even 2x more like this to be sure it will be sold earlier or later but if you list it for 5k in this bad spot....you wont be sure it will be sold after 2-4 weeks becasue nobody will mind to go for this into bad spot

5k is 1 character doing writs 1 time per week. 10k is doing writs 2 times per week... it's such a small amount of gold that it's insane to even consider it a "fee"

And with the number of guilds that advertise daily in this game... they have plenty of space.

Edit: additional thought. The guild trader bids are arguably the largest gold sink in the game. What is the proposition to have an equivalent gold sink? Does the tax need to be 20%, 30% to compensate? Then people will just sell in zone, an option you already have.

AlnilamE · January 2021

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

I don't run around farming specific things to keep my trades slots stocked, to keep a steady cashflow, and maximize my profit™. That sounds like work. And isn't what I'm interested in - in those games I've spent less than a couple minutes a week 'selling'. I do plenty of buying, though - because you can search the AH for the things you're looking for and find the best price. Which, again, only takes a few minutes a week.)

I don't do that either. All the stuff I list on traders is a by-product of me playing the game for things I want myself. And yet I manage to keep 150 slots filled without too much effort. Not all those guilds have traders, but I list stuff anyway.

It doesn't feel like work.

Spending hours in front of a target dummy to increase my DPS so that a boss can die 0.1% faster, on the other hand...

And 90% of the time, I find what I want to buy in my own guilds, which is where I always start searching. At the bank.

iksde wrote: »

robpr wrote: »

Fractured system is a pain to the buyer, but good for sellers and overall economy.
Guilds bid for every spot every week and that removes tons of gold out of circulation, halting inflation. Sellers also have easier to keep the prices to their favor due to harder times of comparing them.
Central AH is good for the buyer but doesnt remove any gold unless there are hard taxes. Popular items prices goes down while something really rare goes up to ridiculous levels and its hard to keep it in check.

AH system could coexist with guild trader system probably, reserved only for bidding without buyouts.

in most games I was playing with global AH there was average 10% of tax and everything was fine so and this wont be problem here along with much better gold sink than just 3.5% from price

BDO has a 35% tax, which you can about halve is you subscribe. They also don't let players trade to each other directly. Everything has to go through their marketplace.

GW2 has a 5% listing fee and a 10% sales fee.

SWL has a 10% listing fee.

In none of those games does any casual player have enough stuff to sell that they can afford to buy the stuff they need.

If ESO developed an AH system of any kind, a tax of 35% at MINIMUM would be required to make up for the gold sink that is trader bids.

UGotBenched91 · January 2021

Where the guild store concept fails is that I have to use outside sources to search for items. I don’t understand why there’s not a search feature in game. This game depends way too much on outside help to have concepts that have been in games over 10 years ago.

Taleof2Cities · January 2021

UGotBenched91 wrote: »

Where the guild store concept fails is that I have to use outside sources to search for items. I don’t understand why there’s not a search feature in game. This game depends way too much on outside help to have concepts that have been in games over 10 years ago.

You have a search feature in the Guild Store UI at every trader, @UGotBenched91.

Having a central "auction house" search would go against the spirit of the Guild Trader system.

Anotherone773 · January 2021

iksde wrote: »

what I have seen in most guilds was 100k-300k weakly sales or 5k-10k donations in guild with good spots to be able to sell items with decent price without waiting month to get it sold or without special lowering price to get this sold which is putting you at this in disadvange if you are in weaker guild, in worse spot

It is if you want to be in mournhold. The trading guild i am in( I only need one because i can sell 20-30 items a day) has never had dues or requirements. They survive solely on the generosity of members and raffles and the little they make of a guild trader. We are one of the top trading locations most of the time. Typically Elden Root, Wayrest, or Rawl. I have been in multiple guilds that have no dues or 1k a week and keep a trader in a middle tier trading city every week.

There should be more guild traders though. Actually every trader booth should just have two traders stuck at it at least in the major locations. But ZOS sees the outrageous trader bids as a money sink.

and as for someone who doesnt run endgame like dlc dungs for motifs etc, who play more for fun than actually monitoring prices for every single part of set form overaland to see if this is worth something more or not I will say 100k per week will be very much for someone who will want to play more chilled, casually
as current system with guild requirments is just harsh to stay in them if you want to sell anything in decent time with good price but you dont have time or willings, power to play additional trading game in game

If you want to sell your stuff in a top trading location your going to have to pay for it. Those locations aren't for casual players, those are for the top traders in the game who spend a lot of time acquiring high end items. Don't try to hock wares in time square, new york city and expect cattle crossing, wyoming vendor permit prices.

sorry but as it was said before....current system is just trading game in game and people who like this will be always against other system of trading giving more freedom with trading for more players at once

100% false. You are claiming the AH system gives more freedom and is better. But it has been proven over and over that it kills the economy to the point where no one uses the AH system because no one can make any money off it. You post your items to it for sale and if someone doesn't buy it in a few minutes then it gets buried in the list and you are out your time and the listing fee. This constant competition to have the lowest price drives the price lower and lower. People who farm those items, who spend their time providing you with the item so you don't have to farm it...they stop posting items. The economy goes into freefall and pretty soon you only have noobs that will post stuff for less than what they get the vendor price posting junk items and a few very rare items that people can make money off.

There is no logical reason to go from an economy that has proven success in many games for many years to one that has proven a complete failure in more mmos than you could possibly even imagine. Adapt to this economy.

like you may like this system becasue you like I will name it "trade minigame" so you have time for this and willings...while many others who want to just play this game are forced for this "trade minigame" to have gold for anything or they just leave it and so they stay without higher amount of gold by just playing game

See this is the problem. Instead of adapting to the game, some people want the game to adapt to how they want to play. How to make money in ESO:
1)Daily crafting writs= on a level 50 character this pays 660 per profession x 7 professions. =4600 gold x8 characters=36,800 x7 =257,600 gold a week and that doesnt even including selling ornate or selling intricates and master writs( or master writ voucher acquired items) on a guild trader. Your going on about 5k casually and you can almost make that in 3 minutes doing writs.

2) Stealing = even at level 1 getting the worse loot possible ( assuming you are only stealing treasure items, motifs, and blueprints) you can make 2k gold per character doing this in about 10-15 minutes in the right locations per day.

3) antiquities= You can make decent income with the treasure from this doing it passively while you quest in a zone.

4) guild traders = there are two big differences between top tier traders and lower tier traders. How long it takes to sell something and how much you can get for stuff. For example when i sell in Mournhold which is the best location on my server I can sell for 20-50% more than i can in Elden Root which is another top location. I can also sell anything in Mournhold. People will buy a stack of gnawed bone in Mournhold. If i sell in Skywatch, i will have to sell for about 80-90% of what i sell for in Elden Root and it will still take a little longer. I also can't sell as much of a variety in Skywatch as some stuff doesn't sell well on that tier level of trader. If i have a trader on the Gold coast, i can sell even less variety and i will have to sell it for 70-80% of what i can in Elden Root, sometimes as low as 60%.

You pick a trader location based on how much you are going to trade. If you are only going to do 30 items a week then a Skywatch level trader is about what you need. If you only want to do a few items a week then you need a gold coast trader. If you plan on doing 100 items or more a week then you want to find a reasonably price top 10 location trader. If you are top end trader whose main activity is trading, then you want to be in Mournhold.

Pick your trade location based on how much trading you plan to do because guilds that are at those different tiers have different expectations from members. And Elden Root guild doesn't expect to get a trader that is posting 10 items a week and hoping to make 5k off those items. They are looking for people who are posting 30 items at least 2-3 times a week and doing more than 50k a week in sales because those spots are really expensive like millions a week to maintain.

There are tons of guilds with traders and slots that have no requirements though. You just have to put in the effort.

UGotBenched91 · January 2021

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

UGotBenched91 wrote: »

Where the guild store concept fails is that I have to use outside sources to search for items. I don’t understand why there’s not a search feature in game. This game depends way too much on outside help to have concepts that have been in games over 10 years ago.

You have a search feature in the Guild Store UI at every trader, @UGotBenched91.

Having a central "auction house" search would go against the spirit of the Guild Trader system.

Oh, yes I’m aware of that. I meant that it’s annoying not to be able to search in the entire game. @Taleof2Cities . I’d go against the spirit of the guild trade system anyway for a feature that saves me from running around like a chicken with its head cut off. Games too big for that kind of concept to be efficient. I can’t imagine what people would do if Tamriel trade center wasn’t a thing.

Eedat · January 2021

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Eedat wrote: »

People who don't want to put any effort into an aspect of the game demand that it be catered to them.

Whereas I've never seen trading/etc to be an "aspect of the game" to be "catered to" (like those wheeler-dealers who keep demanding that everything be made BoE, because they don't already have enough things to profit off of), but rather a basic game system, like chat or travel. Do games with central AH's have something for the "I wanna play Fantasy Market Mogul 2020" crowd? Sure. Meanwhile, your position seems to be that the economy should be built for/around those people, as an "aspect of the game" for them.

Question - what does the person who randomly wants to sell 0-5 items a week do in this game? And 'yell in chat' is a useless answer.

Eedat wrote: »

Besides, how is 5k a week not casual friendly? You can farm over 100k in a single hour picking mats off ground in craglorn without getting a single potent nirn. Thats almost half a year of dues in a single hour of terrible luck farming in crag.

If all you're trying to sell is less than 5k worth of stuff (or, rather, "5k + the vendor cost of the stuff")? Having to pay to do so isn't the best.

(seriously, that's how I've used AH's in many other games. I either think 'huh, that item might be worth something, it'd be nice to get more than it's vendor cost" or "oh, someone might have a use for this." I go to the AH, search to see if it actually has value, and then throw it on there with a small undercut so it'll move within an hour or two. I get a small amount of gold, but it's more than if I just vendored the thing, so it's a success.

I don't run around farming specific things to keep my trades slots stocked, to keep a steady cashflow, and maximize my profit™. That sounds like work. And isn't what I'm interested in - in those games I've spent less than a couple minutes a week 'selling'. I do plenty of buying, though - because you can search the AH for the things you're looking for and find the best price. Which, again, only takes a few minutes a week.)

If you dont want to make money one particular way, then just dont. Nothing is forcing you. It is not a requirement to get into a good trade guild. If you want to sell less than 5k gold, you dont even need a prime trade guild to begin with. Do you know how easy it is to make 5k gold? Do crafting writs one day on a single character. That's it lol. But even if you did, you can still get into trade guilds in top tier locations with no requirements.

Here is the listing for a guild I'm in that's in Vivec, which is tied with Mournhold for highest volume locations in the game

Literally zero dues or fees or minimums.

Like how casual friendly does this need to get? Do you need access to the absolute best guild traders by logging in once every two months to sell 1k worth of stuff before it's considered casual friendly or what?

Eedat · January 2021

Alright lets do this. Lets see how only the elite traders can get into primo spots

Wayrest: Dont be in the bottom 1% of contributions:

Rawl'kha: 2k a week

Vivec: No dues or minimums, just have anything listed for sale:

Alinor: No dues or minimums

Mournhold: No minimums, bottom 5% of contributions may be trimmed:

Belkarth: No dues or minimums

Do you want more? Is access to all the major trade cities in the game with little to no requirements not casual friendly enough?

If you dont want to join a guild with high dues, then just dont and go with the one with little to none lol

Again, the argument that you have to be an elite trader who pushes hundreds of thousands or millions in sales per week to get a good trader is completely and utterly made up. The argument that there simply isnt enough space for everyone to get into a good trade guild is also 100% made up. People fabricate these myths so they can attempt to make victims out of people for the sake of their argument. It's completely false. It's easy disproven by spending literally a minute or two in the guild finder.