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Why do people want to turn ESO into WOW?
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Inaya✭✭✭✭✭
✭WoW does have some aspects that are cool. Flying mounts. crafting in your garrison, hunter pets that can be tamed, guild bank tabs. Sure, I would love to see these things in ESO because it is the better game, and still has the potential to be great. ESO is ascending while WoW is descending rapidly. I think they could add some QoL functions without comprising their uniqueness.
I agree with some QOL changed but not necessarily just from WOW.
No thanks on the flying mounts as I really do think that change would be bad for ESO. There are enough wayshrines that make travel easy and just as quick (if not quicker) than flying mounts would.
Garrison were a disaster. Worst attempt at housing as I have ever seen. We can already craft in the guild halls and our own homes with crafting stations. Crafting in WOW is horrendous, boring and almost a waste of time except for a few things like pets and potions.
Guild bank tabs would be great. Taming pets would be awesome. I'd like to see more collection related achievements similar to those in EQ2 also.2 -
Nairinhe✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭That's perfectly understandable if someone played WOW, liked the feature and thinks it would be good to see it in ESO
Edit to add: I'm more interested in why when someone mentions something that happens to be in WOW too, some people get so agitatedEdited by Nairinhe on July 7, 2020 2:12PM2 -
crowfl56✭✭✭✭✭Heck you still have to many WOW addicts that say it was the first MMO out. LOL
When it was just a straight up copy of EQ, now that was the best MMO for the time it came out.
Most players today couldn't even play EQ, it took skill.
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Raisin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭TequilaFire wrote: »TequilaFire wrote: »[snip]
[snip]
[snip]ToxicFireWolf wrote: »Just because an idea people suggest happens to be a feature in WoW, doesn't mean people are suggesting it because of WoW. If people independently see the need for a feature, there's a reason for that. Doesn't mean it's a good idea, but dismissing it simply because it reminds you of another game would be very..... very not smart.
it doesnt mean they suggesed it from wow, but i took wow as an example of a generic mmo, a lot of their "change ideas" are drastic changes that would change eso (and maybe even ruin it). But then again, i remember when wow people came to eso and bombarded the forums with more drastic changes bc it didnt look like wow (talking about time when bfa came out and ppl started going to eso)
Drastic changes are part of an MMOs lifecycle though, and have been made to ESO in the past. As I said, not all ideas are good, but they are being suggested because people perceive a design flaw (often QOL related) that they want to suggest a solution for. And if it's a concept that exists in a different game and works there, I'd argue that while it won't necessarily work for ESO, one can at least say it works in theory. As someone else has said, unique isn't necessarily good, and ESO should not prioritize having a feature that is different over having a feature that is good. I just think "people want ESO to be more like (other game)" is a very wrong conclusion to draw in regards to suggestions being made. As an example, I have and always will be against AOE taunt, and I think that suggestion fits very well here because yanking in ESO does function differently than in WoW. I think that's a good difference, and that's why it should stay different, but this is a common suggestion and it's because people play ESO and feel like this is a skill that are missing. Their experience playing ESO makes them perceive a subjective design flaw that they seem to fix. Has nothing to do with what other games have. And while it's up for debate whether something is a flaws or not, on theory flaws should not be subject of the "but that's what makes ESO, ESO" argument.
[edited for baiting & to remove quote]Edited by ZOS_Icy on March 24, 2024 6:28PM4 -
ToxicFireWolf✭✭✭Red_Feather wrote: »Did those topics say WoW in them.
Some do, some dont but you can still see that their idea came from wow, also, idk how ling u were playing but when bfa came out there were a lot of posts saying to add things specifically from wow.PC EU0 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Probably the same reason people suggest features from other games: they like those games and wish features they enjoy were in this game. Its very natural to think "I like this feature from this game and this feature from this other game. If we combine them, we get the best of both worlds!"
Unfortunately, there lies the path of trying to please everyone, which is fraught with pitfalls for game devs.3 -
ToxicFireWolf✭✭✭VaranisArano wrote: »Probably the same reason people suggest features from other games: they like those games and wish features they enjoy were in this game. Its very natural to think "I like this feature from this game and this feature from this other game. If we combine them, we get the best of both worlds!"
Unfortunately, there lies the path of trying to please everyone, which is fraught with pitfalls for game devs.
quality of life features and improvements that dont drastically change the games mechanics are fine by me (like we got multiple stacks refining or multiple item deconstruction for crafting), but adding some of things that change major parts of game is stupid to mePC EU0 -
BXR_Lonestar✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't want to turn ESO into WoW. I've never played WoW before, truth be told, and I enjoy ESO for what it is. That said, I definitely would like to see them get rid of animation canceling in order to normalize combat, because I think animation cancelling is the primary culprit for why the DPS gap between the average players and the elite players is so vast, and when you have that big of a gap, it makes it very difficult for them to balance content.
The ability or inability to cancel animations with light attacks, blocks, bashes, etc. shouldn't determine your overall viability for endgame content, but because DPS is all that matters in this game, its basically a gatekeeper for certain content, which is not healthy for the game. Until they address that issue, its just going to make it more and more difficult for them to balance the game IMO, and that is not healthy.6 -
Dusk_Coven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Why so fixated on WOW?
In fact ESO feels like the only MMO that doesn't use a decades-tried-and-true global auction house system.
It's a failed experiment gone on so long that third party addons are used to bypass its cumbersome features and simulate a global store format.
And animation cancelling is another failed experiment gone too long. So many other games REMOVE unintended animation cancelling because they recognize it as the bug and exploit it is. Fast paced combat is possible without people spouting garbage about having to mash buttons and cancel animations. TERA has a good pace -- and there you can even actually miss your target because you have to aim and there isn't a generous aim assist. When they do allow you to cancel animations, it is intended and they tell you specifically what few things cancel or modify or hasten what.
Flying mounts are both a gimmick and a fix for badly designed overland where people feel it is so tedious they just want to get from A to B after the novelty of the new zone has long gone stale. As long as ESO doesn't screw it up (e.g., implement "veteran overland" or other short-sighted demands) we won't need a fix like that.No thanks on the flying mounts as I really do think that change would be bad for ESO.
Edited by Dusk_Coven on July 7, 2020 3:11PM3 -
FatherDelve✭✭✭Because every new expansion brings WoW Refugees to us. They simply wont realize that the reason why their game stinks, and BfA was such a failure was, because Blizzard listend for years to their outcry for simplifications.1
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ToxicFireWolf✭✭✭Dusk_Coven wrote: »Why so fixated on WOW?
In fact ESO feels like the only MMO that doesn't use a decades-tried-and-true global auction house system.
It's a failed experiment gone on so long that third party addons are used to bypass its cumbersome features and simulate a global store format.
never had an issue with guild stores, and i actually like them, also i have very rarely used ttc site to find lowest price.
to answer why so fixated of wow: most of posts that had this sort of thing were posts that said "wow does it better" or "its better in wow", also the storm of posts at the time of bfa was mostly wow posts. but i could have said generic mmo instad of wow and it would be samePC EU1 -
SpacemanSpiff1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭1) cartoons are immersive
2) skill cooldowns make gameplay more fluid
3) giant pauldrons are the ***
4) "WoW."- Owen Wilson4 -
knightblaster✭✭✭BXR_Lonestar wrote: »animation canceling in order to normalize combat, because I think animation cancelling is the primary culprit for why the DPS gap between the average players and the elite players is so vast, and when you have that big of a gap, it makes it very difficult for them to balance content.
The ability or inability to cancel animations with light attacks, blocks, bashes, etc. shouldn't determine your overall viability for endgame content, but because DPS is all that matters in this game, its basically a gatekeeper for certain content
But ... animation canceling is common in action/fighter games, which is why it's such a great addition to an RPG like ESO. If they were to "fix the bug", you'd have a much lower skill cap -- the people who are attracted to ESO's combat are attracted to it precisely because it allows for a high skill cap due to the developers embracing the exploit of the animation canceling bug and incorporating it into the game.
And besides, players can always learn how to animation cancel properly. It's more a case of "git gud nub" ... which is really nothing at all like WoW's playerbase at all, right?
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Dusk_Coven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ToxicFireWolf wrote: »Dusk_Coven wrote: »Why so fixated on WOW?
In fact ESO feels like the only MMO that doesn't use a decades-tried-and-true global auction house system.
It's a failed experiment gone on so long that third party addons are used to bypass its cumbersome features and simulate a global store format.
never had an issue with guild stores, and i actually like them, also i have very rarely used ttc site to find lowest price.
That you use it's features even occasionally makes your opinion hypocritical.Edited by Dusk_Coven on July 7, 2020 3:22PM2 -
ToxicFireWolf✭✭✭SpacemanSpiff1 wrote: »1) cartoons are immersive
2) skill cooldowns make gameplay more fluid
3) giant pauldrons are the ***
4) "WoW."- Owen Wilson
1) Indeed, wow looks like a cartoon, like a kids game, graphics still not updated since release (and if they have been, they are still bad)
2) Skill cooldowns are stupid, why wouldnt someone be able to poke their enemy 10 times with 2 knives, but nooooo, cooldown would make the game more fluid ... lets wait a bit of the fight out just bc i cant use my ability ...
3) Giant pauldrons look clunky, and would weigh you down, also wouldnt be able to swing a giant sword properly
4) "Owen Wilson"-WOWPC EU4 -
Sanctum74✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭As much as I don’t like Wow, i have no problem with people suggesting ideas. My only problem is when they spam the same thread with dozens of posts, insulting anyone that disagrees with them, and trying to push their opinions off as facts.
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ToxicFireWolf✭✭✭BXR_Lonestar wrote: »I don't want to turn ESO into WoW. I've never played WoW before, truth be told, and I enjoy ESO for what it is. That said, I definitely would like to see them get rid of animation canceling in order to normalize combat, because I think animation cancelling is the primary culprit for why the DPS gap between the average players and the elite players is so vast, and when you have that big of a gap, it makes it very difficult for them to balance content.
The ability or inability to cancel animations with light attacks, blocks, bashes, etc. shouldn't determine your overall viability for endgame content, but because DPS is all that matters in this game, its basically a gatekeeper for certain content, which is not healthy for the game. Until they address that issue, its just going to make it more and more difficult for them to balance the game IMO, and that is not healthy.
being able to click a mouse in between abilities is what separates the "average" (more like starter players) from elites ..... damn .... didnt think it would be that easyPC EU5 -
ToxicFireWolf✭✭✭As much as I don’t like Wow, i have no problem with people suggesting ideas. My only problem is when they spam the same thread with dozens of posts, insulting anyone that disagrees with them, and trying to push their opinions off as facts.
I like ideas too, but some of them are too much, if they would change the game so drastically it would be a totally different game or removing already existing mechanics i dont want itPC EU2 -
Magenpie✭✭✭✭✭Btw, I think quite a lot of people play ESO AND WoW, and can like them both at the same time.4 -
FierceSam✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Your post reeks of fear.
Only those who are afraid will avoid any types of criticism or comment.
So there are ESO players who think some features from other games make sense and would like them implemented (or at least discussed). You'd rather simply dismiss them than consider whether they make sense and would make the game better.
Personally I think an AoE taunt is unnecessary (and rubbish), but I can see some benefits in a global auction house. However, these, like many other ideas are worth discussing. If nothing else they help us articulate what we find to be unique/positive/effective in the game.
Every creative/art form borrows from both those forms around it and those within it. And it's the collaboration of ideas rather than their dismissal that usually leads to innovation and genuine creative uniqueness. Those who are brave recognise that some of the time it might be others who have the best answers.
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ToxicFireWolf✭✭✭Your post reeks of fear.
Only those who are afraid will avoid any types of criticism or comment.
So there are ESO players who think some features from other games make sense and would like them implemented (or at least discussed). You'd rather simply dismiss them than consider whether they make sense and would make the game better.
Personally I think an AoE taunt is unnecessary (and rubbish), but I can see some benefits in a global auction house. However, these, like many other ideas are worth discussing. If nothing else they help us articulate what we find to be unique/positive/effective in the game.
Every creative/art form borrows from both those forms around it and those within it. And it's the collaboration of ideas rather than their dismissal that usually leads to innovation and genuine creative uniqueness. Those who are brave recognise that some of the time it might be others who have the best answers.
As u can see I reply to almost every comment given so idk what u mean by saying "my post reaks of fear", and criticism is good imo. I just dont want to see the game go in wrong direction in terms of updates just bc of some people who came here for a short amount of time. bc lets be real, if wow or other generic mmos ever got fixed some of the people would just dissapear from eso, never to come back. and if the changes they proposed ever got through to the game, the game would be ruined.
But looking at your post again i can say that my post does reek in fear, a fear that people who dont primarily play eso would ruin the game for the rest of the communityPC EU4 -
Katahdin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Because they secretly really just want to play WoW?
Edited by Katahdin on July 7, 2020 4:23PMBeta tester November 20132 -
vibeborn✭✭✭✭✭I've been wanting an AOE taunt ever since someone whispered to me that I should use one.
Never in a million years does that equal to me wanting to play WOW.
And even if ESO are taking ideas from WOW, so what? What's wrong with being inspired when it comes to features?2 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Let those auctioneers and animation lovers a place to be, there always would be some people shouting at clouds because x and y, also z.0 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Because, although WoW is a flawed game and many of its features are a curate's egg, some of them are good (or partially good) and have a proven track record.
Plus, a lot of people have played it, or at least are aware of it, so it's easier to give it as an example of something than a less widely played game would be.Edited by Tigerseye on July 7, 2020 5:32PM0 -
Tigerseye✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Because they secretly really just want to play WoW?
Well, considering they can just do that, if they want to, I'm going to have to say no to that one.
The truth is, there are pros and cons to all these games and the best game would take the (objectively) best features from all of them and combine them into one, near perfect, MMO.
Instead, they don't do that and we continue to allow ourselves to be divided and ruled... 1
