PSA - STOP THE WEREWOLF/VAMPIRE GRIEIFING - Want to be a were/vamp? Think again!

WhiteTigerex · April 2014

Hatti wrote: »

which precu you mean? jedi village or level all professions? in both scenarios you knew when you will get to jedi.. there was no super random spawn needed like vamp/ww
sure it was pain in the *** but everyone knew, there is a specific time, when they will archieve it...

edith says:

dont forget, in both scenarios, you had to do anything and not camping hours of hours for nothing..

No, the PRE-CU with Holocrons, where you DIDNT know how to get it.
I got mine as the second on the damn server, hours after the first got his. I mastered ALL the proffesions through holocrons, the first one missed 3.
We never knew, no one did, and that was the point of it. And most players didnt get it, it was hard, and it wasnt given away to anyone that just didnt bother doing the work to find out how. And, we had permadeath to begin with. I didnt even complain about that.

And dont get med started on the FRS. People here that whine, came from WoW, and just want to get handed *** because they are used to it. And it pisses me off that they want to be able to exploit the game mechanics for everyone to get it.

Il quote myself incase you didnt read it.

Plus, you wanna talk exploiting, or bending the intention of the developers? Its the people whos NOT killing them.
Getting hit, running away, resetting the mobs so everyone in the zone gets access to what was intended to be a side thing to actually being in a fight where you kill the mobs?

Thats just as much, if not more, exploiting than the people who kill them. Its just more beneficial to the crybabies, and bad players who dont deserve to get it in the first place.

Crowtac · April 2014

Easy fix would be to have were and vamps spawn randomly anywhere on level 40+ zones...the griefers could'nt cover all areas on all maps then.

tordr86b16_ESO · April 2014

Doowie wrote: »

I kill the werewolves as soon as I see them. This is so I can still make players give me 15k to 30k gold ingame for my bite

I'm playing the game as Zenimax allows me too. If I happen to run by and those werewolves aggro me ... well I better kill them to make them stop and oh look I get crafting materials from as well.

But I can taste the tears of people in this thread, nom nom nom

There is a special word for people like you, and the word is "***". Also, you can run away, stop being a ***.

SafeForSure · April 2014

eldermpsmithrwb17_ESO wrote: »

With regard to stealing, it is not stealing, that is taking an item from someone with the intent of permanently depriving them of it. This is more like fraud/scam, these persons are intentionally exploiting the system in order to get $ from the less informed. Fraud is completed when persons gain personal benefit from it. Because it is not physical property it is not "technically" an offence. However it is immorality at its finest. It is a sad shame that when a mix if this many people are put into the same space there will inevitably be unethical behaviour.
Zenimax done a great job with this game and trust it will do nothing but improve. Please fix because I really looking forward to this part of the game. I subscribe but don't have the endless hours to find a work around for these exploiters.

I have news for you several people in the netherlands were being fined cause they extorted some runescape items from a classmate and the judge said that it was the same as stealing.

WhiteTigerex · April 2014

Hexi wrote: »

Hatti wrote: »

which precu you mean? jedi village or level all professions? in both scenarios you knew when you will get to jedi.. there was no super random spawn needed like vamp/ww
sure it was pain in the *** but everyone knew, there is a specific time, when they will archieve it...

edith says:

dont forget, in both scenarios, you had to do anything and not camping hours of hours for nothing..

Jedi, yes. Knight? Not so much. The monsters you needed to kill for the trials were completely random and rare. As a DJK myself, I happen to know this.

Try again.

As I said, dont get me started on the FRS. (DJK too).
People who doesnt have a clue, and hasnt played games where everyone dont get everything (most other games than World of GivemeeverythingforfreeWarcraft), please quiet down and leave the conversation while the grownups talk about how its possible to prevent BOTH camping it to manually keep prices up for bites, AND to exploiting it so everyone in the damn zone can get the bites with little to no effort while the things get reset over and over.

Hexi · April 2014

WhiteTigerex wrote: »

Hexi wrote: »

Hatti wrote: »

which precu you mean? jedi village or level all professions? in both scenarios you knew when you will get to jedi.. there was no super random spawn needed like vamp/ww
sure it was pain in the *** but everyone knew, there is a specific time, when they will archieve it...

edith says:

dont forget, in both scenarios, you had to do anything and not camping hours of hours for nothing..

Jedi, yes. Knight? Not so much. The monsters you needed to kill for the trials were completely random and rare. As a DJK myself, I happen to know this.

Try again.

As I said, dont get me started on the FRS. (DJK too).
People who doesnt have a clue, and hasnt played games where everyone dont get everything (most other games than World of GivemeeverythingforfreeWarcraft), please quiet down and leave the conversation while the grownups talk about how its possible to prevent BOTH camping it to manually keep prices up for bites, AND to exploiting it so everyone in the damn zone can get the bites with little to no effort while the things get reset over and over.

That's how I got mine, well sort of. I just asked in /zone who wants to be smart about it, we made a raid with 2 people/suspected spawn with 1 heal in each and waited. They spawned, the entire raid got vampirism, then whoever else was in the zone. Prollie 40-100 people got vampirism from a single spawn but I can't be sure, as I bolted to the quest giver immediately.

It did take me roughly 8h of camping to see the spawn though.

Khuul99 · April 2014

Seems like a nonissue to me.

Right this moment it might be plausible but they will miss stuff and 2-3 months from now their efforts is going to be totally wasted.

All everyone need to do is to just not pay the prices they want. Just wait sometime and the vampire/werewolf will be common and not worth trying to monopolize.

Dixa · April 2014

Johnny_NO_skillz wrote: »

Hello guys - wanted to drop a line at ya real quick about some despicable shiz I just heard.

Apparently there are guilds forming now, that will camp Werewolf/Vampire spawn sites, killing off the beasts ONLY to prevent other players from getting bit.

They keep the mobs for themselves so when a player wants to become one, they can EXPLOIT the player for inordinate amounts of money. I've seen bites sell for 20k all the way up to 40k... there is even talk of these guilds using paypal accounts for people to pay them.

DON'T DO THIS - THEY WILL SCAM YOU
I REPEAT IT IS A SCAM

Selling bites is NOT ILLEGAL in the game, but there is no system to ensure you will be bitten.

ZENIMAX - Stop these low-life griefers - I am NOT paying $15 a month to pay a scammer in game to exploit a skill tree that should be open FOR ALL PLAYERS.

Any thoughts?

this is considered griefing. report them when you see it happen.

Gnelfie · April 2014

Pity that the cooldown on a bite is 7 days or I would not mind to make anyone who would so wish to be a werewolf.

tordr86b16_ESO · April 2014

eurydiceshadowcryub17_ESO wrote: »

They should make it like it was in Skyrim, when fighting any were/vamp there is a very small chance of being infected with the disease. It will make it fair for everyone, instead of making everyone stand around hoping a were/vamp will appear only to have others kill it.

I was thinking yes, do it. But then we will have the same problem we are facing now. People will just camp the places and kill all the were/vamp mobs.

WhiteTigerex · April 2014

Hexi wrote: »

WhiteTigerex wrote: »

Hexi wrote: »

Hatti wrote: »

which precu you mean? jedi village or level all professions? in both scenarios you knew when you will get to jedi.. there was no super random spawn needed like vamp/ww
sure it was pain in the *** but everyone knew, there is a specific time, when they will archieve it...

edith says:

dont forget, in both scenarios, you had to do anything and not camping hours of hours for nothing..

Jedi, yes. Knight? Not so much. The monsters you needed to kill for the trials were completely random and rare. As a DJK myself, I happen to know this.

Try again.

As I said, dont get me started on the FRS. (DJK too).
People who doesnt have a clue, and hasnt played games where everyone dont get everything (most other games than World of GivemeeverythingforfreeWarcraft), please quiet down and leave the conversation while the grownups talk about how its possible to prevent BOTH camping it to manually keep prices up for bites, AND to exploiting it so everyone in the damn zone can get the bites with little to no effort while the things get reset over and over.

That's how I got mine, well sort of. I just asked in /zone who wants to be smart about it, we made a raid with 2 people/suspected spawn with 1 heal in each and waited. They spawned, the entire raid got vampirism, then whoever else was in the zone. Prollie 40-100 people got vampirism from a single spawn but I can't be sure, as I bolted to the quest giver immediately.

It did take me roughly 8h of camping to see the spawn though.

Good for you. Thats 10 times the exploiting that the people who are killing them are doing.

Hexi · April 2014

WhiteTigerex wrote: »

.

Good for you. Thats 10 times the exploiting that the people who are killing them are doing.

Exploiting?!

Please, with no sarcasm, explain that to me.

WhiteTigerex · April 2014

Hexi wrote: »

WhiteTigerex wrote: »

.

Good for you. Thats 10 times the exploiting that the people who are killing them are doing.

Exploiting?!

Please, with no sarcasm, explain that to me.

I made a new thread about it, that offers the full explanation.
And to give you an insight about where im coming from, Ive worked in the gaming industry for several years, so its not a troll post. Its a serious, and valid arguement.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/83203/please-adress-the-exploiters-resetting-the-vampire-and-werewolf-spawns-to-avoid-them-dying?new=1

Link for you.

Valerien · April 2014

In an MMO anything is achievable except if stopped because of griefing and exploiting or as we often find a bug.

Which means that the method of becoming a Vampire or Werewolf is going to happen if you invest enough time and effort into it. After all its a lot easier than completing a 12 man raid just have to let them beat on you a lot.

With this in mind, I like the method that the disease are passed, it takes me back to days of daggerfall. BUT by creating a system that punishes causal players and leaves itself open to exploitation something needs to be done to change this.

It shouldn't be possible or desirable for these places to be camped, it should be a result of tracking them down and putting some work in. But able to be done without waiting on a rare spawn then competing with a bunch of other people to get bit. It really devalues the entire experience.

Neferath · April 2014

Well than there to start ... i visited Rift at lvl 25 in order to become a Vampire and set up a how to guide for my guild mates. That was something like a week ago. It actually really, was very hard to get the infection before dozens of other players wiped down the spawn but i managed to get infected and guess what ... it felt great, it felt like a real achievement (not to speak about the great feeling to successfully solve the lvl 42 vampire quest solo afterwards).

Of course i understand that it has become even harder nowadays and how frustrating it is if you aren't able to get your infection or run into a scammer that logs off with the gold you've offered for the bite. And yes, at least regarding to the scammers action is needed.

But also, it's a legit part of the game for all those who want to lvl up their Warriors Guild skill tree line to kill vampires and werewolves at sight. Especially in Rift or the corresponding regions of DC and AD.

Also, it's a legit way of gameplay for all the roleplaying lovers out there that aim to erase this "disease" from Nirn or keep it at least at the lowest possible level.

Also, the harder it is to get infected, the more "special" vampires and werewolves will feel in this game, giving this "condition" a lot more meaning than just a new (in both cases still bugged) skill tree to level.

And last but not least ... it always was meant to be hard to become a vampire / werewolve from the first day on and it should stay that way.

So yes Zenimax, have a look at all these scammers.
Punish people who get reported several times and punish them hard but for the sake of god, don't listen to folks who want you to turn vampirism or lycanthropy into a trivial sidequest wich doesn't need any effort to fullfill at all.

Don't change the game mechanics in a way that will ensure that the servers are flooded with thousands over thousands of vampires and werewolves.

Both of them - player and npc wise - should be and stay rare.

PS: Well and since i know what is about to come now ... i haven't bitten a single person by now despite the fact that iam capable of doing it, neither for gold nor for anything else. This might change in the future but by now, i'll reserve this "gift" for those who deserve it.

Thank you for reading,
Neferath

Hexcaliber · April 2014

WhiteTigerex wrote: »

Hatti wrote: »

which precu you mean? jedi village or level all professions? in both scenarios you knew when you will get to jedi.. there was no super random spawn needed like vamp/ww
sure it was pain in the *** but everyone knew, there is a specific time, when they will archieve it...

edith says:

dont forget, in both scenarios, you had to do anything and not camping hours of hours for nothing..

No, the PRE-CU with Holocrons, where you DIDNT know how to get it.
I got mine as the second on the damn server, hours after the first got his. I mastered ALL the proffesions through holocrons, the first one missed 3.
We never knew, no one did, and that was the point of it. And most players didnt get it, it was hard, and it wasnt given away to anyone that just didnt bother doing the work to find out how. And, we had permadeath to begin with. I didnt even complain about that.

And dont get med started on the FRS. People here that whine, came from WoW, and just want to get handed *** because they are used to it. And it pisses me off that they want to be able to exploit the game mechanics for everyone to get it.

Il quote myself incase you didnt read it.

Plus, you wanna talk exploiting, or bending the intention of the developers? Its the people whos NOT killing them.
Getting hit, running away, resetting the mobs so everyone in the zone gets access to what was intended to be a side thing to actually being in a fight where you kill the mobs?

Thats just as much, if not more, exploiting than the people who kill them. Its just more beneficial to the crybabies, and bad players who dont deserve to get it in the first place.

Grinding classes in swg was a cake walk, I could do any crafting and combat proff except BE in around 6 -8 hours without ever touching a macro, all you needed was money for resources and the will to do it. BE and BH were probably the hardest to grind quickly, but even they did not take all that long if you used a little common sense.

Further, holocrons were introduced later, to help increase the rate of unlocks, as it was taking longer than SOE had planned to populate BH mission terminals across all the servers. I did it pre holocron, when I was challenged to grind all the proff’s by a guild mate and it took me just over a week. Unlocking Jedi was an unexpected bonus, but there was nothing hard about it, even post village the whole thing was easy; anyone who would claim otherwise is blowing smoke out of their ass.

However, none of that has a damn thing to do with this game, SWG is dead, long gone, this is a different game, and mmo as a whole have moved on. EVERYONE who plays, pays the same, and whether you like it or not, all have the same right to content access without sanctimonious self-righteous prick's who would imagine they have a right to content others do not getting in their way.

WhiteTigerex · April 2014

Regarding that SWG doesnt apply here, Id agree with you. However, the mindset thats causing these discussions do. Thats what my entire point was, not the mechanics behind it. But thats neither here nor there.

I disagree with you that everyone should EASILY have access to everything though. Id say that everyone should have access, but some things should require more time and effort then whats currently the situation. AND, that griefers shouldnt be allowed to do what they are currently doing..

Id say the mechanic about how you get it should get a little revamp. Thats all.
Now, feel free to trash talk and flame, and call me a sanctimonious self-righteous prick all you want, but thats my view on it.

jpsgamingb14_ESO · April 2014

Why not just report the spawn campers?

Its technically harrasment for other players.

Zenimax said to report them.

vencibushy · April 2014

I don't see anything wrong with people selling their precious BITE for in game gold. As long it's not for goods outside of the game it isn't an issue to me.

As long as there is a demand for "vampire bites" there will be people willing to go the easy way and pay for this "privilege" of being a vampire/werewolf.

Raice · April 2014

Hatti wrote: »

which precu you mean? jedi village or level all professions? in both scenarios you knew when you will get to jedi.. there was no super random spawn needed like vamp/ww
sure it was pain in the *** but everyone knew, there is a specific time, when they will archieve it...

edith says:

dont forget, in both scenarios, you had to do anything and not camping hours of hours for nothing..

That isn't exactly true about the Jedi.

For the first three or four months of the game - no one knew how to unlock Jedi. The simplicity of why no one knew how is because a few people had already unlocked it, but they simply weren't in the game at the time.

Originally, Jedi weren't introduced into the game until the devs put the Holocrons in the game. The Holocrons would tell you your next step in order to unlock Jedi. Basically, all you had to do was master a certain Profession. The problem was that Holocrons were only dropped by certain mobs.

On my server, Corbantis, we had this Imperial Guild called DARK. Essentially, they built their player city and base around one of the only locations you could actually get a Holocron. It was on Naboo where the Dark Troopers were. If I remember correctly, it was possible to get Holocrons from the Night Sisters on Dathomir, but it was extremely rare.

Basically, DARK prevented all Rebel Alliance people from being able to attack the Dark Troopers, thereby preventing them from being able to unlock Jedi. They were able to do this by how the PvP flagging system worked. If you attacked any factionally aligned NPC in the game, you were flagged for PvP by anyone in the NPC's faction. Since Dark Troopers were Imperial aligned, when you attacked them, you were flagged, which meant that any Imperial Player could attack you. Since DARK had built a PvP base there specifically for this reason - you were pretty much creamed without any chance of getting a Holocron.

Since this was actually a PvP issue, it was legitimately considered "part of the game." The only legitimate complaint about the situation was that Imperial Players could farm these Imperial Aligned NPC's with immunity to the PvP system. In other words, they were not flagged for attacking NPC's in their own faction. Which meant they could stop Rebels, but the Rebels couldn't stop them, without wiping out the whole base. And since this particular guild had the advantage of having several Jedi in their numbers... it was always a losing battle. It was also rumored that the whole operation was actually run by one of the Devs who played the game in his spare time. But whatever...

The reason this example is not akin to the situation here in ESO is because... as I've said before... players cannot police this issue themselves in PvP. The Werewolves and Vampires spawn in PvE zones.

Put these spawns in Cyrodiil, and I guarantee you that this situation of griefing wouldn't be an issue.

Knottypine · April 2014

Doowie wrote: »

I'm playing the game as Zenimax allows me too. If I happen to run by and those werewolves aggro me ... well I better kill them to make them stop and oh look I get crafting materials from as well.

But I can taste the tears of people in this thread, nom nom nom

I gotta say... I don't really see a problem with it. There is definitely some humor in this, but not everyone sees it that way.

Contrabardus · April 2014

If the players who are paying for the game want to turn it into a world mostly populated by Vampires and Werewolves they should be allowed to.

If they want ESO the Masquerade, who are you to say it shouldn't be allowed because you personally want them to remain rare.

At any rate, the real issue here is the lack of the ability to retaliate.

There's nothing a player can do to prevent griefers and campers from taking the spawns from them. The worst they can do is file a report, and that's not very likely to end up with any action taken against the griefer. That puts all the power in the trolls' and griefers' hands.

That's not how it should be. Either provide an unobstructable way to become a vampire or werewolf, such as a quest line that nets you the disease through a dialogue choice or something, or put a small PvP area around the spawn points when the vamp and WW spawns are there and give players the ability to defend the spawns. Make it so the spawns cannot be attacked outside of these zones or pulled from them. Auto level the players all to 50 inside this zone just like any other PvP area.

Or provide a 3-5 minute or till death [whichever is first] duration duel skill that doesn't have a refusal option with a super long 12-24 hour cooldown that auto buffs a player and a single PC target to 50 and allows them to damage each other [but noone else] in PvE areas. Mobs should still give and take normal damage from both players to keep it from being an exploit.

A long cooldown would curb abuse of such a power and prevent PvE from becoming Cyrodiil level PvP. It would also let players help clean up bots and deal with issues like chest and resource ninjas on their own without having to fill out a report that will never see any action taken.

That would allow for role-players to do their thing, allow those looking to net FG xp to continue their activities, and still allow other players a chance to get infected and play the way they want to get played.

If players have the ability to protect the spawns or otherwise disrupt the players trying to kill them then it's a fair deal. If 90% of the population wants to become vamps and WW, then they should be able too. After all, it's supposed to be a game where people can play any way they want and that should cut both ways, currently it doesn't and favors one side over the other excessively.

All the power is on the side of the griefers and spawn campers with no defense against them by the non-infected. That's not rp or game mechanics, it's just poor planning and design.

If there's a way to defend against spawn killing, and someone wants to buy a bite rather than wait it out, there's no reason why a vampire or WW shouldn't be able to sell it. As it is right now, it's broken and causes nothing but frustration and anger. The fact that chat is constantly filled with complaints about it and it's often the sole subject of conversation is enough to make that clear.

It's a poorly implemented system that needs to be changed to take the overwhelming advantage away from those who seek to prevent players from gaining access to the skill lines.

cheeser123 · April 2014

BenjaminKacher_ESO wrote: »

This is too funny... stop bothering the admins with this nonsense and let them get back to solving real problems like the massive amount of botting in starting areas and items/skill points that go missing.

You really think the forum admins, the GMs in the game policing bots and griefers, and the guy who sits at a terminal tweaking and debugging code, these are all mutually exclusive? You think the millions of dollars in the cash pipe flowing into TESO pays for what, a single solitary employee?

This game has a half dozen game-breaking bugs, dozens of other serious bugs, balance problems, gameplay issues, rampant bots, and ridiculous customer support problems. They should have tons of people working on all of these issues at the same time.

Djuhns · April 2014

Players selling bites are ridiculous but greedy. Can't do anything about that. Thought part of the problem is it may put the inside game economy at risk. That's something Zenimax have to keep in mind. A game with a broken economy will see players fleeing it at some points.

Furthermore, players camping to keep those skill lines for them aren't playing for any challenge. It's like trying to get some loot into an open dungeon with bots. It's not fair for the other players. That some players doesn't care to be fair i can understand because it's unfortunately in human nature. But in this case, it's also preventing players to acces something that were made for them. The phasing are already there to keep it hard to get, no need to make it harder.

pokebreaker · May 2014

Djuhns wrote: »

Players selling bites are ridiculous but greedy. Can't do anything about that. Thought part of the problem is it may put the inside game economy at risk. That's something Zenimax have to keep in mind. A game with a broken economy will see players fleeing it at some points.

Furthermore, players camping to keep those skill lines for them aren't playing for any challenge. It's like trying to get some loot into an open dungeon with bots. It's not fair for the other players. That some players doesn't care to be fair i can understand because it's unfortunately in human nature. But in this case, it's also preventing players to access something that were made for them. The phasing are already there to keep it hard to get, no need to make it harder.

Selling something to another player might put the in-game economy at risk? Really? Sellers don't cause that, buyers do. It is the buyers choice to pay the money.

Also, you seem to expect other players to look for a challenge. Why should anyone else care for a challenge, ESPECIALLY when its with your own faction? Where is the challenge to be had? We won't face each other in PvP, nor will we be against one another in a dungeon. There is NO CHALLENGE, and there is nothing to be fair about. Expecting other players to care about you and your feelings, is what is ridiculous. I'm a very nice person in-game, but seeing people try to pull guilt trips, and project their own personal feelings onto other players, without consideration of anyone else, is quite annoying. In an economy where everyone has the same stuff, nobody gets ahead. So why try to bring down those that take extra "legit" measures to increase their income?

Call it greed, or whatever you want, but as a salesman, I will never make any money (from other players) if I expected every player to be "fair" by paying me what they think something is worth. A seller will try to get as much money as they can from a buyer, and a buyer will try to pay as little as possible to the seller. That's the way it will always work, with the occasional instances of people selling cheap, and buyers intentionally overpaying.

Bulwyf · May 2014

I'm glad my guild has enough vamps/werewolves to freely bite those who want it. I agree with those calling this extorting of other players out for the crap it is.

the.dzeneralb16_ESO · May 2014

I can't wait for another month to pass by when there will be enough people giving away bites that they become virtually worthless and people can stop whining.

Neferath · May 2014

Well once mist form is fixed, ultimate cost reduction is looked at and the aoe cap introduced with patch 1.1 hits we will see much less vamps out there thats for sure and good. well and iam saying this while beeing a vamp.

StrafingTide · May 2014

i wouldn't count on them fixing this. which sux

Neferath · May 2014

well just have a look at:
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/91560/changes-to-pvp-coming-soon#latest