MartiniDaniels wrote: »No, they are not dead, they are imo best PVE part of the game. Problem is that like any content after completing them several times there is no incentive to do that again... as was discussed many times, vDLC pledge should have higher rewards. At least something like 2 keys/2+ transmutes for non-HM and 3 keys/4+ transmutes for HM.
As for now if you want to farm keys and have multiple toons it's faster and easier to do fast and easy pledges on several toons then complete vDLC ones.
Some actual stats for the Xbox via the achievement system (not the in-game achievements that tell you nothing)...
Achievement for finishing vet mazzatun was unlocked by .32% of gamers
Normal mazzatun 1.54% of gamers
Normal Scalecaller peak .96% of gamers
Normal Fang Lair 1.00% of gamers
Maybe someone on PlayStation can post some numbers? I think it tracks things the same way...
OP pretty close with their 1% statement.
Agree with OP. It's not that they are "hard," but that they are "fake hard." As in "learn the script" hard as in "arcade game hard" "console level hard" and not "PC game hard" or "tactical combat hard."
I am not keeping a *** spreadsheet or notebook to refer back to 100 different bosses, miscellaneous side games, pad standing and lever pulling straight, and that's from a perspective of someone who has been playing these games for decades, a serious raider going back 20 years. That shark was jumped long ago after a few years of people burning out on WOW. I expect modern games to cultivate a set of skills in players and then those skills and not SCRIPTS are generally used to do the content. ESO gets a flat F in that department, and would wager tens of thousands of the player base agree, forum cheerleaders notwithstanding.
And yeah, demand "proof" that only a tiny % of players do the content when every one posting here has pugged into a random normal Frostvault and watched the team instantly dissolve, likely many times. Don't lie and say you haven't. So other than the vocal forumites and fanbois, no, a majority of players do not do this content.
In better, more popular games, Warframe as one of many possible examples, they BOOT content or rework it when only a small percentage of players do or complete it. No idea why investors haven't stepped in and done the same in this game, it is costing them serious money.
To make a rant constructive, this would be so easy to fix. Strip out ALL the gotcha sidegames, one shots, etc. from ALL dungeons, regular and DLC, dumb them down, and reserve those for a hard mode that is selected at the start and must be selected by all team members, and trials. None of the gear in the DLC dungeons is as good as trial gear anyway, so no need for the tryhards to gripe if the average player base can have access to it. It's a no brainer this would improve the game and the number of players doing that content would skyrocket.
It's a game that people pay for. I dread to think how many of the typical player base I pug tank for daily buy DLCs thinking they will be "fun" who have no hope of completing them.
The reason the new motifs aren't in guildstores is because they're bugged.
For a good amount of the playerbase, running DLC dungeons and achievement hunting within them are still the cream of the crop of ESO content, so no worries.
But yeah, a lot of people actively avoid going into PVP so let's get rid of PVP plz
pvp has not received a content update in years (bridges don't count) and has been on the forefront of ESO's declining performance for just as long.
really hard to watch pvp streams because everyone is just disappointed and mad.
I have been around long enough to see the absolute rage when pvp gets a content update and pve gets nothing (IC) so yeah, dungeons are not even close.
I think the devs kind of know this now though, I suspect its why dragonhold did not have dungeons.
More content would be bad for PvP. PvP needs players concentrated in one area to work well. That is why there are choke points in Cyrodiil. Spreading out an already thin PvP population isn't a good idea.
Some actual stats for the Xbox via the achievement system (not the in-game achievements that tell you nothing)...
Achievement for finishing vet mazzatun was unlocked by .32% of gamers
Normal mazzatun 1.54% of gamers
Normal Scalecaller peak .96% of gamers
Normal Fang Lair 1.00% of gamers
Maybe someone on PlayStation can post some numbers? I think it tracks things the same way...
OP pretty close with their 1% statement.
Grianasteri wrote: »Most people are not undertaking DLC dungeons on a regular basis, with Vet DLC being even less frequented. It is also fair to say that most people who do undertake normal or vet DLC dungeons, are doing so mainly for gear, in particular Monster Helms with Vet DLC - and once that gear is acquired will be unlikely to revisit the dungeon other than to help friends/guildies.
The reason of course is that most of the DLC dungeons are significantly more challenging than the average base game dungeons, by design, its on purpose. This is positive, not something to complain about. It provides progression in difficulty of dungeons and a challenge for more capable players and groups.
There are for instance some DLC dungeons that it is very rare to find a pug capable of completion. Why should it be? The dungeons are being designed with teamwork, knowledge of the mechs, high dps in mind, specifically to provide progression from base game normal and vet dungeons.
This can make for some frustrating experiences and grinds for gear, but on balance the challenge available is positive. I also think it is positive that not just anyone can jump into a pug and get some of the best gear in the game.
I would say the progression is (not including hard modes):
Base game normal
Base game vet
DLC normal
DLC vet
Base game vet and DLC normal can be similar and some bosses and mechs can be more challenging or easy in either. Normal Forstvault for instance, I would say is more difficult than Fungal Grotto vet.
I find I am unsure what the OP is actually asking for or suggesting. I mean DLC dungeons are hard and therefore not many people run them regularly. Fine. So what?
Freakin_Hytte wrote: »Some actual stats for the Xbox via the achievement system (not the in-game achievements that tell you nothing)...
Achievement for finishing vet mazzatun was unlocked by .32% of gamers
Normal mazzatun 1.54% of gamers
Normal Scalecaller peak .96% of gamers
Normal Fang Lair 1.00% of gamers
Maybe someone on PlayStation can post some numbers? I think it tracks things the same way...
OP pretty close with their 1% statement.
Normal scalebreaker is 0,4% and vet is 0,1%
Normal Wrathstone is 0,6% and vet is 0,1%
Normal MoS is 1,1% and normal MHK is 0,9 and completing both on vet is 0,2%
Normal Dragon bones is 1,7% while vet is 0,3%
Normal Shadows of the hist is 2,6% and vet is 0,5%
Normal Horns of the reach is 1,8% and vet is 0,3%
Those are the percentages on the dlc dungeon achievements from ps4.
So according to this not even 0,5% do both on vet 👍 and not even 3% do the normal ones.
Freakin_Hytte wrote: »Some actual stats for the Xbox via the achievement system (not the in-game achievements that tell you nothing)...
Achievement for finishing vet mazzatun was unlocked by .32% of gamers
Normal mazzatun 1.54% of gamers
Normal Scalecaller peak .96% of gamers
Normal Fang Lair 1.00% of gamers
Maybe someone on PlayStation can post some numbers? I think it tracks things the same way...
OP pretty close with their 1% statement.
Normal scalebreaker is 0,4% and vet is 0,1%
Normal Wrathstone is 0,6% and vet is 0,1%
Normal MoS is 1,1% and normal MHK is 0,9 and completing both on vet is 0,2%
Normal Dragon bones is 1,7% while vet is 0,3%
Normal Shadows of the hist is 2,6% and vet is 0,5%
Normal Horns of the reach is 1,8% and vet is 0,3%
Those are the percentages on the dlc dungeon achievements from ps4.
So according to this not even 0,5% do both on vet 👍 and not even 3% do the normal ones.
This again? If you are going to throw around achievement numbers which count every account ever created including the ones during free weekends and players who left the game before some of the dungeons were even released why don't you also include the percentage of players who got "Level 50" achievement so we have at least some point of reference?
I don't do vet DLC dungeons, the TLDR is that I simply find them too hard and not fun, and its getting to the point that I don't even bother to run them once on normal because why even?
(the longer is I kind of already did my time of meta chasing, small man, time trial, leaderboard, sweat fest in another MMO and im just not about that life anymore, on top of it not being fun in ESO)
that said I do watch guild stores and what not for motifs if I want them, and you know what?
nothing. . .
been checking major trade hubs daily and have not seen a single page of the new motifs, maybe I might have seen one but I just cannot remember at this point, and im sure it was probably priced in the 100's of thousands due to scarcity because. . .
nobody is doing this content.
cry all you want about get gud, or whatever, but it does suck to see so much development time and effort, encounter design, new rewards in cosmetics, motifs, skins, armor sets, monster sets, etc. all for nothing.
going to a dungeon that only about 1% will play for a few runs, until they get the monster set if its relevant, and then never touch again. (the % amount is actually less then that, completions of older DLC dungeons were only around 2-3% of the player base and that number has only declined)
people go out of their way to avoid them, advertising in zone "non DLC dungeons" only running group finder on sub 50 characters as DLC dungeons to not enter the queue until you hit 50, simply dropping group if they get a DLC dungeon.
yup, people are going out of their way to avoid content, I would not even buy them if not for just being included in ESO plus, and I know MANY are in the same boat.
@ZOS_GinaBruno
@ZOS_RichLambert
Emma_Overload wrote: »Grianasteri wrote: »Most people are not undertaking DLC dungeons on a regular basis, with Vet DLC being even less frequented. It is also fair to say that most people who do undertake normal or vet DLC dungeons, are doing so mainly for gear, in particular Monster Helms with Vet DLC - and once that gear is acquired will be unlikely to revisit the dungeon other than to help friends/guildies.
The reason of course is that most of the DLC dungeons are significantly more challenging than the average base game dungeons, by design, its on purpose. This is positive, not something to complain about. It provides progression in difficulty of dungeons and a challenge for more capable players and groups.
There are for instance some DLC dungeons that it is very rare to find a pug capable of completion. Why should it be? The dungeons are being designed with teamwork, knowledge of the mechs, high dps in mind, specifically to provide progression from base game normal and vet dungeons.
This can make for some frustrating experiences and grinds for gear, but on balance the challenge available is positive. I also think it is positive that not just anyone can jump into a pug and get some of the best gear in the game.
I would say the progression is (not including hard modes):
Base game normal
Base game vet
DLC normal
DLC vet
Base game vet and DLC normal can be similar and some bosses and mechs can be more challenging or easy in either. Normal Forstvault for instance, I would say is more difficult than Fungal Grotto vet.
I find I am unsure what the OP is actually asking for or suggesting. I mean DLC dungeons are hard and therefore not many people run them regularly. Fine. So what?
The problem is that ZOS is asking players to pay for content that is not designed for most players. This has really been getting on my nerves for years now, and I have NOT purchased the last couple of dungeon DLC because of this. Unfortunately, I'm already paying for ESO+ this whole time, so I am directly subsidizing content that I do not like and do not want. This is especially infuriating because I would be happy if ZOS designed some new "medium" difficulty content like the base game Vet dungeons, but ZOS refuses to do this.
Some actual stats for the Xbox via the achievement system (not the in-game achievements that tell you nothing)...
Achievement for finishing vet mazzatun was unlocked by .32% of gamers
What are you talking about when it comes to this? Literally no one I know that regularly does vet DLC dungeons does this. Nobody.
Grianasteri wrote: »Most people are not undertaking DLC dungeons on a regular basis, with Vet DLC being even less frequented. It is also fair to say that most people who do undertake normal or vet DLC dungeons, are doing so mainly for gear, in particular Monster Helms with Vet DLC - and once that gear is acquired will be unlikely to revisit the dungeon other than to help friends/guildies.
The reason of course is that most of the DLC dungeons are significantly more challenging than the average base game dungeons, by design, its on purpose. This is positive, not something to complain about. It provides progression in difficulty of dungeons and a challenge for more capable players and groups.
There are for instance some DLC dungeons that it is very rare to find a pug capable of completion. Why should it be? The dungeons are being designed with teamwork, knowledge of the mechs, high dps in mind, specifically to provide progression from base game normal and vet dungeons.