starkerealm wrote: »vesselwiththepestle wrote: »So when you are insinuating either dishonesty or incompetence you should provide a better argument.
No, this is his thing to work through.
He is "testing" someone else's build, and returning numbers that are well below that build's ceiling on an Iron Attro. Also, the heavy attacks are not hitting nearly as hard as they should for that build. Something is not right here.
This is also not the first time he's put his thumb on the scale when testing Xynode's work. Again, the infamous Alkosh as a DPS set "test" comes to mind. So, in that case, it's worth understanding that, in addition to the resist debuff that made Woeler slap Alkosh on the tank, there's also a significant DoT on the set. (This works out to be slightly under 20k, depending on CP and gear quality. Base gold 160 is about 12k over 10 seconds.) That DoT is applied when you trigger a synergy, but, very importantly, there is no cooldown, and the DoT is self-stacking. (That, self stacking thing is very important. This isn't just 1200-1800/1900 DPS from the set, you get that for each synergy you hoover up, and you can grab a lot in a hectic fight. Especially now that stuff like Orbs is non-competitive.)
So, Teh "tested" it by using the trial dummy, which provides you with shards, but no other synergies. Which means you have a set that can, potentially (and, yes, I do mean in a live situation here, not just, "on paper"), deal a lot of damage (even if it doesn't crit), but you can't see that on a trial dummy because you need to proc it off of synergies, and there's only two synergies in the game that can be taken by the player generating them. (This creates a theoretically ceiling of around 6k DPS from the set, though in a practical sense, you're talking more like 4k, because one of those sources is a set that won't be doing your DPS any favors.)
EDIT: In a live situation, if you can hoover up three or four synergies in ten seconds, that could easily be 6-8k damage per second from a set, on top of the resists debuffs, if you're not already getting those from the tank. It's a medium armor set, it's not "supposed to be" used for tanking.
Hell, in this thread, he's argued that the bonus damage from UI cannot crit, which is flatly untrue because it's not proc set damage, it's a buff that applies to the light and heavy attacks, which can still crit, modifying said bonus.
So, he has a history of being economical with the truth when he decides he's going to go after Xynode.
The combat metrics buff configuration is, basically trivial right now, it's a sideshow that doesn't matter, because looking at the numbers provided, I can already say, "something is not right here."
FWIW, I tested both IA and UI on the PTS just now.kylewwefan wrote: »Infallible Aether Supposedly only does extra damage now with the last tick. It used to do and extra 900 or so Damage every tick of the lightning stave heavy attack. So that could change things a bit. I dont know?
(...)
With those changes to Infal only doing extra damage on the last tick, I do question if undaunted Infaltrator received the same treatment? If that is the case, I could see that severely hurting the build and then all this conversation is for nothing.
Milambersf wrote: »...the only denied part is the “BiS” many of you seem to assume and that Xynode did NOT claim.
bongtokin420insd16 wrote: »FYI, it took me about 12 runs to get the UI i needed. Not really bad, though i suspect i got a little lucky. Tanked it on vet, max 20 minute runs. So about 4 hours? Seems worth it to me, and easier than grinding trials.
What is the goal here? I've never heard Xynode refer to the easy sorc build having anything to do with the gear at all, rather the rotation.
bongtokin420insd16 wrote: »FYI, it took me about 12 runs to get the UI i needed. Not really bad, though i suspect i got a little lucky. Tanked it on vet, max 20 minute runs. So about 4 hours? Seems worth it to me, and easier than grinding trials.
starkerealm wrote: »What is the goal here? I've never heard Xynode refer to the easy sorc build having anything to do with the gear at all, rather the rotation.
It's both. The build is the skills, the rotation, and the gear. That said, there is flexibility on the gear, UI+IA performs best on the setup, but it's not the only loadout. The old version (actually the version of Easy Sorc I used to run) was Spider Cultist + Netch's Touch. Swapping those out (for IA and UI) will improve performance dramatically, however.
EDIT: minor modification for clarity.
Grianasteri wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »What is the goal here? I've never heard Xynode refer to the easy sorc build having anything to do with the gear at all, rather the rotation.
It's both. The build is the skills, the rotation, and the gear. That said, there is flexibility on the gear, UI+IA performs best on the setup, but it's not the only loadout. The old version (actually the version of Easy Sorc I used to run) was Spider Cultist + Netch's Touch. Swapping those out (for IA and UI) will improve performance dramatically, however.
EDIT: minor modification for clarity.
Using Netch now is massively sub optimal, it used to be that literally everything in the build did shock damage, this is no longer the case. Now youd probably be better off with something like Mothers Sorrow or Julianos etc.
starkerealm wrote: »Grianasteri wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »What is the goal here? I've never heard Xynode refer to the easy sorc build having anything to do with the gear at all, rather the rotation.
It's both. The build is the skills, the rotation, and the gear. That said, there is flexibility on the gear, UI+IA performs best on the setup, but it's not the only loadout. The old version (actually the version of Easy Sorc I used to run) was Spider Cultist + Netch's Touch. Swapping those out (for IA and UI) will improve performance dramatically, however.
EDIT: minor modification for clarity.
Using Netch now is massively sub optimal, it used to be that literally everything in the build did shock damage, this is no longer the case. Now youd probably be better off with something like Mothers Sorrow or Julianos etc.
Might actually get value out of New Moon Acolyte if you have access to it, it'd take some further tinkering to avoid overpen, but resources shouldn't be much of an issue.
Bobby_V_Rockit wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »Grianasteri wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »What is the goal here? I've never heard Xynode refer to the easy sorc build having anything to do with the gear at all, rather the rotation.
It's both. The build is the skills, the rotation, and the gear. That said, there is flexibility on the gear, UI+IA performs best on the setup, but it's not the only loadout. The old version (actually the version of Easy Sorc I used to run) was Spider Cultist + Netch's Touch. Swapping those out (for IA and UI) will improve performance dramatically, however.
EDIT: minor modification for clarity.
Using Netch now is massively sub optimal, it used to be that literally everything in the build did shock damage, this is no longer the case. Now youd probably be better off with something like Mothers Sorrow or Julianos etc.
Might actually get value out of New Moon Acolyte if you have access to it, it'd take some further tinkering to avoid overpen, but resources shouldn't be much of an issue.
It loses out on max magicka though
There's a gold undaunted infiltrator necklace at the golden vendor in cyrodiil this weekend for anyone running this build who has deep pockets.
kylewwefan wrote: »In lieu of last weeks Xynode appreciation thread, I was compelled to try out this easy Sorc build.
Simple put it’s Undaunted Infaltrator, Infallible Aether, Grothdar.
Xynode recommends an Undaunted Infaltrator Lightning stave...I spent much time trying to acquire with no success. So, I made some changes.
To complete the sets, I’m using 2 medium armor, 5 light, and an IA Lightning staff because I had a few of them lying around. I do indeed have more Maelstrom staves than could ever possibly need, but realize this build is likely designed to help someone acquire them.
Transmuted the jewelry to infused/ bloodthirsty. It’s purple with purple enchants. My IA staff is purple and precise. Grothdar is 2 light, Because I had them to make the sets line up.
My character is dark elf he recommends high elf.
How does it play?
It’s like old school pet Sorc, but with no pet. Massive AOE damage everywhere. lacks in the single target a little bit. That’s not such a bad thing when you got that much hard hitting AOE everywhere.
It feels stronger than Pet build....you can use pets too. It’s versatile. I like it. Had a lot of fun.
If you run out of resources, you’re doing something terribly wrong. I was skeptical using weapon damage enchant and shock enchant with no Absorb magic enchant, but the heavy attacks more than make up for recovery.
I’ve never been good with Sorc. So I left the Lightning form skill un morphed. It made me move too fast and couldn’t see the guy and lightning everywhere is makes it tuff for me to tell wth is going on. Did not need the speed buff too.
It’s very strange not having a real spammable on the front bar. Daedric tomb is kind of wonky, diddnt really like. Or clench. Pulsar though, fits the theme; adds utility, hits good. I like it.
I soloed the daily Undaunted pledges. Easily.
I had a much more difficult time doing them in Siroria/ Mother Sorrow/Zaan.
I ran Maelstrom one time with the setup. It was pretty good in there actually. MS Siroria Zaan would be laughable. Guarantee. I’m not the best Sorc ever, but this setup is solid. I’d recommend it to anyone wanting to try something different.
Some other things
Having the 2 medium body pieces and jewelry may not be %100 optimal, but it did insure the 5 piece Undaunted Infaltrator Buff was always on. Lost a little bit for no 511, but still right around 40k mag 3k Spell Damage buffed. Could be a little better if some things were golded out or wat not.
Undaunted Infiltrator is a weird freaking set. Medium armor. Has 2 add magic bonus. Weapon Crit, not spell Crit, then the light attack does 700 extra damage, heavys do 1100 extra damage. Because the Damage adds every tick of lightning staff heavy it makes it really good for lightning staff heavy attack.
In trial, you can throw in trap beast or Channeled Acceleration somewhere for the minor force.
kylewwefan wrote: »In lieu of last weeks Xynode appreciation thread, I was compelled to try out this easy Sorc build.
Simple put it’s Undaunted Infaltrator, Infallible Aether, Grothdar.
Xynode recommends an Undaunted Infaltrator Lightning stave...I spent much time trying to acquire with no success. So, I made some changes.
To complete the sets, I’m using 2 medium armor, 5 light, and an IA Lightning staff because I had a few of them lying around. I do indeed have more Maelstrom staves than could ever possibly need, but realize this build is likely designed to help someone acquire them.
Transmuted the jewelry to infused/ bloodthirsty. It’s purple with purple enchants. My IA staff is purple and precise. Grothdar is 2 light, Because I had them to make the sets line up.
My character is dark elf he recommends high elf.
How does it play?
It’s like old school pet Sorc, but with no pet. Massive AOE damage everywhere. lacks in the single target a little bit. That’s not such a bad thing when you got that much hard hitting AOE everywhere.
It feels stronger than Pet build....you can use pets too. It’s versatile. I like it. Had a lot of fun.
If you run out of resources, you’re doing something terribly wrong. I was skeptical using weapon damage enchant and shock enchant with no Absorb magic enchant, but the heavy attacks more than make up for recovery.
I’ve never been good with Sorc. So I left the Lightning form skill un morphed. It made me move too fast and couldn’t see the guy and lightning everywhere is makes it tuff for me to tell wth is going on. Did not need the speed buff too.
It’s very strange not having a real spammable on the front bar. Daedric tomb is kind of wonky, diddnt really like. Or clench. Pulsar though, fits the theme; adds utility, hits good. I like it.
I soloed the daily Undaunted pledges. Easily.
I had a much more difficult time doing them in Siroria/ Mother Sorrow/Zaan.
I ran Maelstrom one time with the setup. It was pretty good in there actually. MS Siroria Zaan would be laughable. Guarantee. I’m not the best Sorc ever, but this setup is solid. I’d recommend it to anyone wanting to try something different.
Some other things
Having the 2 medium body pieces and jewelry may not be %100 optimal, but it did insure the 5 piece Undaunted Infaltrator Buff was always on. Lost a little bit for no 511, but still right around 40k mag 3k Spell Damage buffed. Could be a little better if some things were golded out or wat not.
Undaunted Infiltrator is a weird freaking set. Medium armor. Has 2 add magic bonus. Weapon Crit, not spell Crit, then the light attack does 700 extra damage, heavys do 1100 extra damage. Because the Damage adds every tick of lightning staff heavy it makes it really good for lightning staff heavy attack.
In trial, you can throw in trap beast or Channeled Acceleration somewhere for the minor force.
Valkyn_Eltrys wrote: »Queens Elegance is way better for a HA/LA spam does way less damage than I thought.
starkerealm wrote: »Valkyn_Eltrys wrote: »Queens Elegance is way better for a HA/LA spam does way less damage than I thought.
Fixed that for ya.
starkerealm wrote: »Valkyn_Eltrys wrote: »Queens Elegance is way better for a HA/LA spam does way less damage than I thought.
Fixed that for ya.
How is that fixing it? He is 100% correct. Both are bad to use either way, but if going for a light attack spam queens elegance is better.
kylewwefan wrote: »In lieu of last weeks Xynode appreciation thread, I was compelled to try out this easy Sorc build.
Simple put it’s Undaunted Infaltrator, Infallible Aether, Grothdar.
Xynode recommends an Undaunted Infaltrator Lightning stave...I spent much time trying to acquire with no success. So, I made some changes.
To complete the sets, I’m using 2 medium armor, 5 light, and an IA Lightning staff because I had a few of them lying around. I do indeed have more Maelstrom staves than could ever possibly need, but realize this build is likely designed to help someone acquire them.
Transmuted the jewelry to infused/ bloodthirsty. It’s purple with purple enchants. My IA staff is purple and precise. Grothdar is 2 light, Because I had them to make the sets line up.
My character is dark elf he recommends high elf.
How does it play?
It’s like old school pet Sorc, but with no pet. Massive AOE damage everywhere. lacks in the single target a little bit. That’s not such a bad thing when you got that much hard hitting AOE everywhere.
It feels stronger than Pet build....you can use pets too. It’s versatile. I like it. Had a lot of fun.
If you run out of resources, you’re doing something terribly wrong. I was skeptical using weapon damage enchant and shock enchant with no Absorb magic enchant, but the heavy attacks more than make up for recovery.
I’ve never been good with Sorc. So I left the Lightning form skill un morphed. It made me move too fast and couldn’t see the guy and lightning everywhere is makes it tuff for me to tell wth is going on. Did not need the speed buff too.
It’s very strange not having a real spammable on the front bar. Daedric tomb is kind of wonky, diddnt really like. Or clench. Pulsar though, fits the theme; adds utility, hits good. I like it.
I soloed the daily Undaunted pledges. Easily.
I had a much more difficult time doing them in Siroria/ Mother Sorrow/Zaan.
I ran Maelstrom one time with the setup. It was pretty good in there actually. MS Siroria Zaan would be laughable. Guarantee. I’m not the best Sorc ever, but this setup is solid. I’d recommend it to anyone wanting to try something different.
Some other things
Having the 2 medium body pieces and jewelry may not be %100 optimal, but it did insure the 5 piece Undaunted Infaltrator Buff was always on. Lost a little bit for no 511, but still right around 40k mag 3k Spell Damage buffed. Could be a little better if some things were golded out or wat not.
Undaunted Infiltrator is a weird freaking set. Medium armor. Has 2 add magic bonus. Weapon Crit, not spell Crit, then the light attack does 700 extra damage, heavys do 1100 extra damage. Because the Damage adds every tick of lightning staff heavy it makes it really good for lightning staff heavy attack.
In trial, you can throw in trap beast or Channeled Acceleration somewhere for the minor force.
What did I just read?
Valkyn_Eltrys wrote: »kylewwefan wrote: »In lieu of last weeks Xynode appreciation thread, I was compelled to try out this easy Sorc build.
Simple put it’s Undaunted Infaltrator, Infallible Aether, Grothdar.
Xynode recommends an Undaunted Infaltrator Lightning stave...I spent much time trying to acquire with no success. So, I made some changes.
To complete the sets, I’m using 2 medium armor, 5 light, and an IA Lightning staff because I had a few of them lying around. I do indeed have more Maelstrom staves than could ever possibly need, but realize this build is likely designed to help someone acquire them.
Transmuted the jewelry to infused/ bloodthirsty. It’s purple with purple enchants. My IA staff is purple and precise. Grothdar is 2 light, Because I had them to make the sets line up.
My character is dark elf he recommends high elf.
How does it play?
It’s like old school pet Sorc, but with no pet. Massive AOE damage everywhere. lacks in the single target a little bit. That’s not such a bad thing when you got that much hard hitting AOE everywhere.
It feels stronger than Pet build....you can use pets too. It’s versatile. I like it. Had a lot of fun.
If you run out of resources, you’re doing something terribly wrong. I was skeptical using weapon damage enchant and shock enchant with no Absorb magic enchant, but the heavy attacks more than make up for recovery.
I’ve never been good with Sorc. So I left the Lightning form skill un morphed. It made me move too fast and couldn’t see the guy and lightning everywhere is makes it tuff for me to tell wth is going on. Did not need the speed buff too.
It’s very strange not having a real spammable on the front bar. Daedric tomb is kind of wonky, diddnt really like. Or clench. Pulsar though, fits the theme; adds utility, hits good. I like it.
I soloed the daily Undaunted pledges. Easily.
I had a much more difficult time doing them in Siroria/ Mother Sorrow/Zaan.
I ran Maelstrom one time with the setup. It was pretty good in there actually. MS Siroria Zaan would be laughable. Guarantee. I’m not the best Sorc ever, but this setup is solid. I’d recommend it to anyone wanting to try something different.
Some other things
Having the 2 medium body pieces and jewelry may not be %100 optimal, but it did insure the 5 piece Undaunted Infaltrator Buff was always on. Lost a little bit for no 511, but still right around 40k mag 3k Spell Damage buffed. Could be a little better if some things were golded out or wat not.
Undaunted Infiltrator is a weird freaking set. Medium armor. Has 2 add magic bonus. Weapon Crit, not spell Crit, then the light attack does 700 extra damage, heavys do 1100 extra damage. Because the Damage adds every tick of lightning staff heavy it makes it really good for lightning staff heavy attack.
In trial, you can throw in trap beast or Channeled Acceleration somewhere for the minor force.
Force Pulse. Elemental Weapon. Heavy attack build...... I mean how dumb is this build........
Undaunted Infiltrator:
(5 PIECES) When you use an ability that costs Magicka, your Light Attacks deal an additional 774 damage and Heavy Attacks deal an additional 1161 damage for 10 seconds.
Set is plain garbage. Queens Elegance is way better for a HA/LA spam. Idk this set up is gna give me a stroke.