Elder Scrolls Online 2
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starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭pls no. but i found something interesting about the Elders Scrolls founders.
https://www.denofgeek.com/us/games/elder-scrolls/283476/elder-scrolls-veterans-new-game-studio
In the range of tempering people's expectations. LaFey's focus was more on creating a "fantasy world sim," style of RPG. This isn't bashing him, by the way. Just saying, expect something more like Mount and Blade than Morrowind or Oblivion.Edited by starkerealm on September 30, 2019 4:33AM0 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Do I think ZOS, specifically ZOS, should make ESO 2? 🤔
I think ZOS have done a great job with this game, considering all the technical limitations. Yes, they chose to make the game in the Hero Engine, but they also started development in 2007 so their options were limited.
They've done a great job with actual content and balancing the fine line between tedium and fun in an MMO. ESO is a breath of fresh air compared to the grind fests you typically find in this genre.
The combat team has also had to work within the gameplay limits imposed by their predecessors years ago (many of the original combat devs are no longer with ZOS). I have no doubt that if they were to make a new game, combat would be vastly improved.Edited by MLGProPlayer on September 30, 2019 5:01AM3 -
max_only✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Do I think ZOS, specifically ZOS, should make ESO 2? 🤔
I think ZOS have done a great job with this game, considering all the technical limitations. Yes, they chose to make the game in the Hero Engine, but they also started development in 2007 so their options were limited.
They've done a great job with actual content and balancing the fine line between tedium and fun in an MMO. ESO is a breath of fresh air compared to the grind fests you typically find in this genre.
The combat team has also had to work within the gameplay limits imposed by their predecessors years ago (many of the original combat devs are no longer with ZOS). I have no doubt that if they were to make a new game, combat would be vastly improved.
They’ve made a fun and engaging fantasy game. I continue to play and recommend it.
But do I think ZOS, specifically Zos, should make an ELDER SCROLLS game after the way I’ve seen them treat the Elder Scrolls universe? That’s a question that is tough to answer. Maybe another game studio would treat 25 years of Tamriel precedent with more deference. Maybe. Won’t ever find out though.#FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
#OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
|| CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Do I think ZOS, specifically ZOS, should make ESO 2? 🤔
I think ZOS have done a great job with this game, considering all the technical limitations. Yes, they chose to make the game in the Hero Engine, but they also started development in 2007 so their options were limited.
They've done a great job with actual content and balancing the fine line between tedium and fun in an MMO. ESO is a breath of fresh air compared to the grind fests you typically find in this genre.
The combat team has also had to work within the gameplay limits imposed by their predecessors years ago (many of the original combat devs are no longer with ZOS). I have no doubt that if they were to make a new game, combat would be vastly improved.
They’ve made a fun and engaging fantasy game. I continue to play and recommend it.
But do I think ZOS, specifically Zos, should make an ELDER SCROLLS game after the way I’ve seen them treat the Elder Scrolls universe? That’s a question that is tough to answer. Maybe another game studio would treat 25 years of Tamriel precedent with more deference. Maybe. Won’t ever find out though.
*looks at Blades*
*looks back at Max*
*looks back at Blades*
*looks at Max*
I dunno.2 -
max_only✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Elder Scrolls Blades is a cash register in a flimsy disguise. I played early release. They didn’t even try to hide it. Literally they were selling daedric artifacts to use in the arena against other players.#FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
#OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
|| CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom0 -
max_only✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I was thinking like Obsidian.
Eh. What does it matter in the end.#FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
#OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
|| CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom0 -
zyk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This is pure speculation, but I tend to think TES 6 will be ESO 2 in many ways. At least the profitable parts.
It will probably have a microtransaction store that sells most of the same things we have in ESO and it would be surprising if they didn't make use of the multiplayer capabilities added to Creation Engine for Fallout 76.
I doubt there will be an ESO 2 unless aspects of ESO like Battlegrounds suddenly became extremely popular.Edited by zyk on September 30, 2019 6:40AM1 -
Solid_Metal✭✭✭✭✭ZoS just need to improve
1. color pallet
2. zone design in almost every zone, which most are arguably smaller than they should be
3. fix their Expension scheme, as of right now, IMHO these "chapters" are overprice for the content they offer, rather than expelling [snip] every so often, i rather they have proper expansive "chapter" like how GW2 did it, before you said it, yes, i bought every story dlcs and chapters ZoS release so far, no one give a crap with the dungeons dlc
4. add more variety in the content, just a simple jumping puzzle like how GW2 did its enough to make it fun and interesting
[Edited for profanity]Edited by ZOS_Bill on October 7, 2019 9:39PM"i will walk through the fog, as i welcome death"0 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »To be fair, and from what I've been told, Destiny 2 was a massive step down from D1, and it took them nearly a year to get back to where they were. At that point, D2 probably would have made more sense as an extension of the D1 SKU, with new systems added on top.
That method of creating "sequels" is annoying, made worse when they make you pay to continue upgrading until you get to the level of the previous game. I have gotten off of franchise party trains for this very reason. If a studio is going to do a sequel, I don't want it to be a sequel of the base game with a few twists. I want to pick up where I left off. Otherwise, why do I care about the new game? The previous one is, in many ways, better.
Imagine an ESO 2 that was just Cyrodiil and a few outlying zones. Just a sequel to the base game, with a few differences to make it marketable. Ugh.But do I think ZOS, specifically Zos, should make an ELDER SCROLLS game after the way I’ve seen them treat the Elder Scrolls universe? That’s a question that is tough to answer. Maybe another game studio would treat 25 years of Tamriel precedent with more deference. Maybe. Won’t ever find out though.
[warning]This could keep you up at night.[/warning] What has Todd Howard learned from ESO that he will incorporate into the next TES game?XBox EU/NA:@ElsonsoJannus
PC NA/EU: @Elsonso
PSN NA/EU: @ElsonsoJannus
Total in-game hours: 11321
X/Twitter: ElsonsoJannus1 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lordrichter wrote: »But do I think ZOS, specifically Zos, should make an ELDER SCROLLS game after the way I’ve seen them treat the Elder Scrolls universe? That’s a question that is tough to answer. Maybe another game studio would treat 25 years of Tamriel precedent with more deference. Maybe. Won’t ever find out though.
[warning]This could keep you up at night.[/warning] What has Todd Howard learned from ESO that he will incorporate into the next TES game?
I have a better horror story to keep you up at night: What has Todd Howard learned from Fallout 76, that will appear in all future BGS releases?1 -
Cadbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lordrichter wrote: »
[warning]This could keep you up at night.[/warning] What has Todd Howard learned from ESO that he will incorporate into the next TES game?starkerealm wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »But do I think ZOS, specifically Zos, should make an ELDER SCROLLS game after the way I’ve seen them treat the Elder Scrolls universe? That’s a question that is tough to answer. Maybe another game studio would treat 25 years of Tamriel precedent with more deference. Maybe. Won’t ever find out though.
[warning]This could keep you up at night.[/warning] What has Todd Howard learned from ESO that he will incorporate into the next TES game?
I have a better horror story to keep you up at night: What has Todd Howard learned from Fallout 76, that will appear in all future BGS releases?
Edited by Cadbury on September 30, 2019 10:54AM"If a person is truly desirous of something, perhaps being set on fire does not seem so bad."0 -
cyberjanet✭✭✭✭✭Jeesh, I haven't caught up to One Tamriel yet. They bring out new content so fast we're probably already in Elder Scrolls Online IV without realising it.Favourite NPC: Wine-For-All
Mostly PC-EU , with a lonely little guy on NA.1 -
Knootewoot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Facefister wrote: »What gives you the idea that ESO has the "best" combat out there? It's different from other games, but it's most definitely not the best. It has still issues with the animations and the animation canceling.
Well it's subjective I'll admit. But when compared to the combat from other games it's definitely on the better side of things in my opinion.
What MMO do you believe has a better combat system?
Well, i like BDO's better. But sometimes, yes chase me away with pitchforks and torches, i even like tab targetting better like in ArcheAge.
ESO is not fluid combat even with animation cancelling. Compared to BDO it feels wonky, laggy and unresponsive. And that is if there is no lag.٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶
"I am a nightblade. Blending the disciplines of the stealthy agent and subtle wizard, I move unseen and undetected, foil locks and traps, and teleport to safety when threatened, or strike like a viper from ambush. The College of Illusion hides me and fuddles or pacifies my opponents. The College of Mysticism detects my object, reflects and dispels enemy spells, and makes good my escape. The key to a nightblade's success is avoidance, by spell or by stealth; with these skills, all things are possible."0 -
Kuratius✭✭✭vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »
Let me see.
Over-reliance on client side calculations which made the game susceptible to cheat engine alterations followed by a frantic switch to server side calculations which tanked perfomance. Repeated (and I mean repeated) resurfacing of bugs that were supposed to be fixed but somehow came back when some other unrelated thing was changed. Visual and gameplay bugs that are present since beta. Generally poor perfomance. Reducing campaign population cap 5x times to help with perfomance (still failed to fix it, btw). Group finder that stops working under heavy load. Battlegrounds that are not working reliably since the day they were introduced. Absolute mess in ability scaling where random things scale from MAA and thaumaturge without any rhyme or reason. Oh, and of course a poor homebrew engine that is just not capable of staying relevant just 5 years later.
Do I have to keep going? Yeah sorry, those things are not subjective.
Sounds like they should do a full rework like FF14ARR did.
I don't think making the calculations server side was a good choice. They should've left things client side and just worked on obfuscating it better/implementing sanity checks. I can imagine ways of implementing client side calculations that require very little server side calculation while being quite resilient to cheat engine attacks. Say for example the server checks a random skill cast every 10 seconds or so for validity if invalid boot the player from the game, don't accept updates from clients that are older than 2 seconds etc. They could've made it work, they just didn't have the imagination to.0 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I agree, however it should be smarter ways to do it, say you calculate on client, however this is also done on server for random players all the time.vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »
Let me see.
Over-reliance on client side calculations which made the game susceptible to cheat engine alterations followed by a frantic switch to server side calculations which tanked perfomance. Repeated (and I mean repeated) resurfacing of bugs that were supposed to be fixed but somehow came back when some other unrelated thing was changed. Visual and gameplay bugs that are present since beta. Generally poor perfomance. Reducing campaign population cap 5x times to help with perfomance (still failed to fix it, btw). Group finder that stops working under heavy load. Battlegrounds that are not working reliably since the day they were introduced. Absolute mess in ability scaling where random things scale from MAA and thaumaturge without any rhyme or reason. Oh, and of course a poor homebrew engine that is just not capable of staying relevant just 5 years later.
Do I have to keep going? Yeah sorry, those things are not subjective.
Sounds like they should do a full rework like FF14ARR did.
I don't think making the calculations server side was a good choice. They should've left things client side and just worked on obfuscating it better/implementing sanity checks. I can imagine ways of implementing client side calculations that require very little server side calculation while being quite resilient to cheat engine attacks. Say for example the server checks a random skill cast every 10 seconds or so for validity if invalid boot the player from the game, don't accept updates from clients that are older than 2 seconds etc. They could've made it work, they just didn't have the imagination to.
If difference is to large, all is moved to server. it can be cheating but it can also be lag causing it.
This is however an patch not an rework, its something you do in the background. its also something you could turn off if you wanted and go back to existing system.
As for ESO 2, why as in who functions could you not just add to ESO but need an new game?
And yes ESO 2 would have the same issues as ESO.Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭cyberjanet wrote: »Jeesh, I haven't caught up to One Tamriel yet. They bring out new content so fast we're probably already in Elder Scrolls Online IV without realising it.
We're in ESO5 now.0 -
Faulgor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭lordrichter wrote: »[warning]This could keep you up at night.[/warning] What has Todd Howard learned from ESO that he will incorporate into the next TES game?
Hopefully dodge roll.Alandrol Sul: He's making another Numidium?!?
Vivec: Worse, buddy. They're buying it.0 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭MeadDrinker02 wrote: »Do you guys think ZOS should make an Elder Scrolls Online 2?
No they cant even make the first one right. If you have to write developer letters explaining the reason the game has game breaking design is because your player base is playing the game wrong. You have serious frigging issues .1 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »
Let me see.
Over-reliance on client side calculations which made the game susceptible to cheat engine alterations followed by a frantic switch to server side calculations which tanked perfomance. Repeated (and I mean repeated) resurfacing of bugs that were supposed to be fixed but somehow came back when some other unrelated thing was changed. Visual and gameplay bugs that are present since beta. Generally poor perfomance. Reducing campaign population cap 5x times to help with perfomance (still failed to fix it, btw). Group finder that stops working under heavy load. Battlegrounds that are not working reliably since the day they were introduced. Absolute mess in ability scaling where random things scale from MAA and thaumaturge without any rhyme or reason. Oh, and of course a poor homebrew engine that is just not capable of staying relevant just 5 years later.
Do I have to keep going? Yeah sorry, those things are not subjective.
Spot on. I had to LOL at the developer letter . They almost insinuated that the player base just plays the game wrong that's why role definition balance are bad. The engine is horrible , it cant even do water lol0 -
LiquidPony✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Facefister wrote: »
You forgot to add that the ever decreasing content per DLC/Chapter release. The ever increasing of monetization trhough microtransactions. The general ignorance of the developers about the classes and overall balancing of PvE and PvP elements.vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »
Let me see.
Over-reliance on client side calculations which made the game susceptible to cheat engine alterations followed by a frantic switch to server side calculations which tanked perfomance. Repeated (and I mean repeated) resurfacing of bugs that were supposed to be fixed but somehow came back when some other unrelated thing was changed. Visual and gameplay bugs that are present since beta. Generally poor perfomance. Reducing campaign population cap 5x times to help with perfomance (still failed to fix it, btw). Group finder that stops working under heavy load. Battlegrounds that are not working reliably since the day they were introduced. Absolute mess in ability scaling where random things scale from MAA and thaumaturge without any rhyme or reason. Oh, and of course a poor homebrew engine that is just not capable of staying relevant just 5 years later.
Do I have to keep going? Yeah sorry, those things are not subjective.
None or most of those things you and he mention have anything to do with the game's foundation.
The only example I saw that could be considered structural in nature and difficult to build or improve upon would be the performance issues regarding Cyrodil - and they are currently at work on trying to fix that. Though I'll admit the jury is still out on whether they will succeed or not.
But everything else was just bugs and balance disagreements. And considering this game still has some of the best combat and graphics on the MMO market today - I see no evidence that its engine is incapable of competing.
If the "jury is still out" on whether they can fix Cyrodiil performance ... literally 5.5 years after release, the jury's never coming back.
ESO has a good theoretical foundation. The "action combat" is fun and engaging. It's pretty nice to look at. The gearing and crafting systems are interesting enough.
But the technical foundation of the game is absolute trash. Performance has been a dumpster fire for years, and this is not just a Cyrodiil issue. How on earth do we still need to reset PvE instances every ~hour (or less) to keep framerates from dropping to a slideshow? How do we got literally months where enemies telegraph attacks out of their mouths but shoot flames out of their asses (we're going on 5 months of this bug persisting on Pinnacle Factotum, btw)? On console, players have gone months on end with premier PvE content completely broken and unplayable. How do we still have to rely on addons for basic functionality like buff/DoT tracking and gear organization/swapping? I mean seriously, the base game buff tracker functions like an intern coded it up in a weekend.
ESO's got a lot of great ideas but the execution of those ideas has been consistently sub-par.
And honestly I've got less faith in the team than ever before. Hating Wrobel was a meme, but Christ if this new team doesn't just irk me in every possible way. A great mix of condescension and cluelessness capped off by a lead gameplay designer who seems to do nothing but play buzzword bingo all day.Edited by LiquidPony on October 1, 2019 6:33AM1 -
Deathlord92✭✭✭✭✭
✭No I think they should work on making eso a better game then starting all over.0 -
Vanos444✭✭✭✭✭No! To ESO2!
Instead, release TES VI !!!!!
It's been a decade and that lazy todd as not given us that we seek the most...Edited by Vanos444 on October 1, 2019 8:14AM0 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No! To ESO2!
Instead, release TES VI !!!!!
It's been a decade and that lazy todd as not given us that we seek the most...
Honestly, I am not all that much in agreement. Years ago, I would have agreed with you, but then... Fallout 76 came out. That missed the target so bad that I'm not sure they even knew what the target was. I now have zero confidence that Starfield will be worth playing, and am very concerned about what he is going to do with TES 6.
I am of the opinion that Bethesda, and yes ZOS, games are a "wait and see". If the game is doing OK 6 months in, and the game is not monetized too badly, then maybe pick it up on sale and try to avoid the cash shop as much as possible. The days of trust and pre-orders went out the window along with the last fragments of the idea that games are being made for entertainment.
ESO may be the last Elder Scrolls game I buy.XBox EU/NA:@ElsonsoJannus
PC NA/EU: @Elsonso
PSN NA/EU: @ElsonsoJannus
Total in-game hours: 11321
X/Twitter: ElsonsoJannus1 -
Dark_Lord_Kuro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I could see them doing something like ff14 did or a cataclysm like wow eventually but not nowEdited by Dark_Lord_Kuro on October 1, 2019 12:16PM0 -
ParaNostram✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The concept of sequels to MMOs makes zero sense to me. These games cost way too much money to develop and they usually only get better with time, so why make a sequel unless the original was just absolutely terrible and you want another go at it? (I.E. Destiny was awful so they tried again with Destiny 2, spoiler alert, also awful)"Your mistake is you begged for your life, not for mercy. I will show you there are many fates worse than death."
Para Nostram
Bosmer Sorceress
Witch of Evermore
"Death is a privilege that can be denied by it's learned scholars."
Order of the Black Worm0 -
kathandira✭✭✭✭✭
✭MeadDrinker02 wrote: »Do you guys think ZOS should make an Elder Scrolls Online 2?
Once the story catches up to the Tiber Septim story, then ESO II would be a good idea.PS4-NA. Breton Templar Healer, Bosmer Stamplar, Breton Magplar, Orsimer StamDK, Dunmer MagDK, Khajiit StamNB, Dunmer MagNB, Argonian Warden Tank, Altmer Magsorc0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztVMib1T4T4