Mag and Stam DK here. You are not alone. The levels of stupidity are incomprehensible right now. I was fairly annoyed back in the morrowind patch when the warden took basically all the major buffs from templar and DK.....but this is something else..

It honestly feels like a case of the right hand not knowing what the left hand is doing, they've been at this for 4 years and it feels like they've learned nothing they trust their metrics far too much and not their common sense.

Epicasballs wrote: »

I'm giving them until Monday before I rage out. They have promised combat changes. Time will tell if they listened or not.

Source?

I'm waiting for other classes to get a paper and scissor skill so I can play rock paper scissors with them instead of tickling them with my dots.

lordrichter wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

TLDR; NOTHING in the article is true in the game for a stamDK. NOTHING.

U24 is not the completion of this work, but just some quick updates as they work on it longer term:

We consider these changes to be stop-gap measures while the team evaluates more holistic improvements for each class in the future. We’re not yet ready to share details on those long-term efforts

ZOS has been saying that for years.

I'd believe it if there were any evidence that the dev team has an actual vision these updates are moving toward and there was discernible progress update after update toward that vision.

What has been happening for years is the devs just spring on us some radical change to entire systems: whether it's redoing healing, massive DPS increase to DOTs, Morrowind sustain nerfs, reworking blocking and tanking to make it more "fun," "standardization" for every ability in the game such that the only difference was the color of the skill, shields, etc. There is no vision they build on.

Epicasballs wrote: »

OG_Kaveman wrote: »

Epicasballs wrote: »

I'm giving them until Monday before I rage out. They have promised combat changes. Time will tell if they listened or not.

Source?

@OG_Kaveman the first paragrah of 5.2.1 patch notes.

You mean this?-

.Please note as with previous PTS cycles, the majority of combat changes will be in next week’s patch.

I see no promises there

lordrichter wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

TLDR; NOTHING in the article is true in the game for a stamDK. NOTHING.

U24 is not the completion of this work, but just some quick updates as they work on it longer term:

We consider these changes to be stop-gap measures while the team evaluates more holistic improvements for each class in the future. We’re not yet ready to share details on those long-term efforts

ZOS has been saying that for years.

I'd believe it if there were any evidence that the dev team has an actual vision these updates are moving toward and there was discernible progress update after update toward that vision.

What has been happening for years is the devs just spring on us some radical change to entire systems: whether it's redoing healing, massive DPS increase to DOTs, Morrowind sustain nerfs, reworking blocking and tanking to make it more "fun," "standardization" for every ability in the game such that the only difference was the color of the skill, shields, etc. There is no vision they build on.

However, Rob and Brian have not been saying that for years.

so here's Rob's intake on it. https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/57025

Now that it's confirmed what DK's identity should be, I'm going to log off ESO until "flame and fury" comes into realization.

hopefully, this "holistic improvements" comes sooner than later.

Davadin wrote: »

forgot to add... an excerpt from the article too...

What we don’t want is to create scenarios where, to be effective, you feel obligated to fill a majority of your hotbar slots with non-class abilities.

LOL @ZOS_RobGarrett u ever played StamDK?

No no no, I know u wrote u realize its not the case with many classes.....

but bruh...


Have you, or your team, ever played StamDK? One of the most popular class build which, surprise surprise, uses more non-class skills than DK skills.

I think my StamDK has maybe 2 or 3 actual DK skills slotted at the moment. Don't really remember 'cause I haven't played him in a long while... I wonder why

but bruh... damn

Davadin wrote: »

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

I mean, if the goal is to have a "fire and fury" focus on the DK, shouldn't that be built into giving them more spammables, more reactive buffs, more options where a DK lashes out constantly, with vicious attacks?

Right now (pre-patch) DKs are the class that sticks 15 million DoTs on the target and go makes a cup of coffee while they wait.

There's nothing fire and fury about a StamKnight, and nothing furious about a MagKnight. They're just DoT machines, slowly melting their foes into puddles.

I mean, I like that proposed class identity, but if that's the end point, we've got a long way to go.

Joy_Division wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

TLDR; NOTHING in the article is true in the game for a stamDK. NOTHING.

U24 is not the completion of this work, but just some quick updates as they work on it longer term:

We consider these changes to be stop-gap measures while the team evaluates more holistic improvements for each class in the future. We’re not yet ready to share details on those long-term efforts

ZOS has been saying that for years.

I'd believe it if there were any evidence that the dev team has an actual vision these updates are moving toward and there was discernible progress update after update toward that vision.

What has been happening for years is the devs just spring on us some radical change to entire systems: whether it's redoing healing, massive DPS increase to DOTs, Morrowind sustain nerfs, reworking blocking and tanking to make it more "fun," "standardization" for every ability in the game such that the only difference was the color of the skill, shields, etc. There is no vision they build on.

They've done a great job of undoing some of the stupidity over the previous 4 years and bringing some semblance of sanity.

People got used to and then accepted a D grade system that was about as neat and congruent as a plate of spaghetti. Of course no one ever actually said that - got a lot of "devs suck more balance!!!11!1!" "fire Wrobel!!!1!". But now when the thing people were absolutely clamoring for, a balanced system, begins to come to order ITS COMPLETE *** CHAOS THE CHILDREN ARE BURNING GOD SAVE THE QUEEN.

Of course it's going to be a fairly tumultuous adventure lol. I have and will continue to maintain that the previous combat system was busted garbage and could not be balanced and was absolutely worth nuking. I will maintain the optimism that the system in development will allow for much greater latitude in appropriate skill/passive adjustment as everything is being reduced to a baseline performance that it should have been at launch.

usmcjdking wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

TLDR; NOTHING in the article is true in the game for a stamDK. NOTHING.

U24 is not the completion of this work, but just some quick updates as they work on it longer term:

We consider these changes to be stop-gap measures while the team evaluates more holistic improvements for each class in the future. We’re not yet ready to share details on those long-term efforts

ZOS has been saying that for years.

I'd believe it if there were any evidence that the dev team has an actual vision these updates are moving toward and there was discernible progress update after update toward that vision.

What has been happening for years is the devs just spring on us some radical change to entire systems: whether it's redoing healing, massive DPS increase to DOTs, Morrowind sustain nerfs, reworking blocking and tanking to make it more "fun," "standardization" for every ability in the game such that the only difference was the color of the skill, shields, etc. There is no vision they build on.

They've done a great job of undoing some of the stupidity over the previous 4 years and bringing some semblance of sanity.

People got used to and then accepted a D grade system that was about as neat and congruent as a plate of spaghetti. Of course no one ever actually said that - got a lot of "devs suck more balance!!!11!1!" "fire Wrobel!!!1!". But now when the thing people were absolutely clamoring for, a balanced system, begins to come to order ITS COMPLETE *** CHAOS THE CHILDREN ARE BURNING GOD SAVE THE QUEEN.

Of course it's going to be a fairly tumultuous adventure lol. I have and will continue to maintain that the previous combat system was busted garbage and could not be balanced and was absolutely worth nuking. I will maintain the optimism that the system in development will allow for much greater latitude in appropriate skill/passive adjustment as everything is being reduced to a baseline performance that it should have been at launch.

Not really. everything people didn't like about the old combat team has been amplified under the new combat team. nothing has actually changed other than the fact that the new combat team apparently doesn't understand the combat system and is just making a mess... The reason i didn't like where Wrobel was going was homogenization, the new dev team is 1000X worse in that regard. i think what people are starting to realize is that homogenization was probably not Wrobel's choice. I'm playing a class for visuals at this point, there is no other reason i play this class over that class, they're all basically the same right now.

one main things people didn't like for example: was over-nerfing and over-buffing things..... yeah, not like they became any more tempered.

Davadin wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

TLDR; NOTHING in the article is true in the game for a stamDK. NOTHING.

U24 is not the completion of this work, but just some quick updates as they work on it longer term:

We consider these changes to be stop-gap measures while the team evaluates more holistic improvements for each class in the future. We’re not yet ready to share details on those long-term efforts

ZOS has been saying that for years.

I'd believe it if there were any evidence that the dev team has an actual vision these updates are moving toward and there was discernible progress update after update toward that vision.

What has been happening for years is the devs just spring on us some radical change to entire systems: whether it's redoing healing, massive DPS increase to DOTs, Morrowind sustain nerfs, reworking blocking and tanking to make it more "fun," "standardization" for every ability in the game such that the only difference was the color of the skill, shields, etc. There is no vision they build on.

However, Rob and Brian have not been saying that for years.

so here's Rob's intake on it. https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/57025

Now that it's confirmed what DK's identity should be, I'm going to log off ESO until "flame and fury" comes into realization.

hopefully, this "holistic improvements" comes sooner than later.

But they have done it.

Now we want to burn this to ashes, since we are pretty furious about the changes

ZoS logic

The entire reason DK in general is dot centered with zero passives or skills in the class tool kit that do executes was the whole class identity philosophy.

Its pretty pathetic the state they are pushing the class. You nerf its main kit to oblivion and then make zero skill or passive changes to compensate.

luen79rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Hey don't leave out stamina sorcerers that now throw knives... some godamn class identity there!

*** i wish DK have throw-knives skill.

The_Lex wrote: »

.

thanks for the bump? lol


i bet u this post would still be relevant next *** year.

i don't mind. The problem is the class identity and their blatant ignorance on implementing it in-game.

i just picked DK coz it's the class i play, but it's true for all class.