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Medium Armor is weak
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Deathlord92✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yeah I have always thought medium armor should give physical resistance passive.1 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Medium armor is already strong and doesnt need any changes. Heavy armor stam is meta due to heavy armor damage sets, not because of any inherent weakness in medium.
This guy gets it.I'm done with this game because of ZOS pushing us into Vengeance, because they don't know how to fix Cyrodiil.3 -
WoppaBoem✭✭✭✭✭Medium Armor is fine. If you want to be as bulky as heavy armor build for it. You want to feel like heavy armor while being in medium, I hope you understand how that sounds....
Build for the dodge and burst or build for tankiness in sustain fights. You can have it all.Xbox EU & NA - PVP Only1 -
WoppaBoem✭✭✭✭✭universal_wrath wrote: »Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »master_vanargand wrote: »Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »It has sneak cost reduction and sneak detection size reduction.
Certainly there are unique Medium Armor Skills.
But that's the same with Light Armor Skills and Heavy Armor Skills.
Heavy Armor Skill has increased Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance, This is understandable.
Light Armor Skill has increased Spell Resistance, This is understandable too.
Medium Armor Skill...can't increased Physical Resistance...WTF?
Medium armor also gets Dodge cost reduction, something that is more powerful then armor.
Wrong, dodge roll is cluncky and does not work majority of the time. You need to have optimal ping and lots of skills hits you while dodge rolling. I say heavy armor is stronger due to other passives that help it sustain fights more than medium armor.
I have 20K stam on my light armor DK, roll dodge is awesome, everything is cluncky sometimes but that is the games fault not specific to anything at all.Xbox EU & NA - PVP Only1 -
master_vanargand✭✭✭✭✭
✭Medium Armor is fine. If you want to be as bulky as heavy armor build for it. You want to feel like heavy armor while being in medium, I hope you understand how that sounds....
Build for the dodge and burst or build for tankiness in sustain fights. You can have it all.
Heavy Armor can have high attack and high defense and high resource recovery.
Is not it unfair?1 -
jaysins✭✭✭I actually think resource management is easier on heavy as you get both resources back for being hit and the additional stam back on heavy attacks. The real problem for me with medium is the snares and roots, as your movement advantage can easily be taken away. The shuffle changes are a huge buff to medium and will help with that, as well as I wish the speed buff was to movement speed instead of sprint. Instead of the sneak passive, I think a temporary buff after roll dodging would be warranted, such as gaining a small bit of penetration or your next heal casted heals for a small bit more. Something that would help with their hit and run playstyle.Jaisins -AD Stamsorc. Can't outrun an orc sorc
Bearingitall -EP Warden. Lions and tigers and especially Bears oh my4 -
Lord_Eomer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭universal_wrath wrote: »Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »master_vanargand wrote: »Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »It has sneak cost reduction and sneak detection size reduction.
Certainly there are unique Medium Armor Skills.
But that's the same with Light Armor Skills and Heavy Armor Skills.
Heavy Armor Skill has increased Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance, This is understandable.
Light Armor Skill has increased Spell Resistance, This is understandable too.
Medium Armor Skill...can't increased Physical Resistance...WTF?
Medium armor also gets Dodge cost reduction, something that is more powerful then armor.
Wrong, dodge roll is cluncky and does not work majority of the time. You need to have optimal ping and lots of skills hits you while dodge rolling. I say heavy armor is stronger due to other passives that help it sustain fights more than medium armor.
You made me laugh!dodge roll is cluncky1 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »It has sneak cost reduction and sneak detection size reduction.
Good thing my stamDk is a natural beast for ganking.4 -
Jabbs_Giggity✭✭✭✭✭Medium Armor: For each piece of Medium armor you have a chance to save a Dwarf, become Knight of the Blackwater and be swifter & quieter - because Heavy Armor is too clunky and loud...it slows you down and catches the light.
In all seriousness, why can't medium armor inherently boost Crit Resists, or Increase base Movement Speed, or increase Stamina Recovery...there are plenty of ways to make Medium Great Again!
#MMAGA3 -
Mettaricana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I think all 3 types of armor would be better if they did away with the 5pc system passives and make everything a per peice and have the passives adjusted accordingly so build with say 4 heavy 2 medium 1 light cpuld be a thing allowing us to customize our builds a lil better2 -
Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭Deathlord92 wrote: »Yeah I have always thought medium armor should give physical resistance passive.
It does. If you wear 5 pieces, Medium Armour Focus CP gives up to 5280 physical resistance.
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Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »Medium Armor: For each piece of Medium armor you have a chance to save a Dwarf, become Knight of the Blackwater and be swifter & quieter - because Heavy Armor is too clunky and loud...it slows you down and catches the light.
In all seriousness, why can't medium armor inherently boost Crit Resists, or Increase base Movement Speed, or increase Stamina Recovery...there are plenty of ways to make Medium Great Again!
#MMAGA
Humm dont you realize that Medium Armor/Stamina is currently king on PvE? And do you really want to make it even greater? Shrug...3 -
SevenSinsGER✭✭charley222 wrote: »but about evasion= mean 100% damage reduction the time you evade
You do realise that minor/major evasion don't actually make you evade attacks anymore do ya?2 -
Mettaricana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭SevenSinsGER wrote: »charley222 wrote: »but about evasion= mean 100% damage reduction the time you evade
You do realise that minor/major evasion don't actually make you evade attacks anymore do ya?
Evasion reallllllly needs to be renamed0 -
Xogath✭✭✭Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »master_vanargand wrote: »Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »It has sneak cost reduction and sneak detection size reduction.
Certainly there are unique Medium Armor Skills.
But that's the same with Light Armor Skills and Heavy Armor Skills.
Heavy Armor Skill has increased Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance, This is understandable.
Light Armor Skill has increased Spell Resistance, This is understandable too.
Medium Armor Skill...can't increased Physical Resistance...WTF?
Medium armor also gets Dodge cost reduction, something that is more powerful then armor.
Heavy wearers with capped resistances would say otherwise.
Oh, boy, one extra dodge roll in comparison to 40% extra damage mitigation! WOO!
That aside, from a PvP point of view, the best thing that can happen with armor types is to normalize the amount they all give. Since we have three types, and Medium is in the middle, we adjust Light Armor to give more, up to the Medium amount, and Heavy to give less.. down to the Medium amount.
Then, the armor line passives and attribute points put in to Health would dictate how tanky a person was (along with set bonuses).. which would not be anywhere near as tanky as they can be now. But that still leaves CP-enabled PvP, which is still laughable and should just be disabled across all forms of PvP anyway, to make balance that much easier.
That, and it would free up some campaigns in Cyrodiil and make performance there a teeeeensy bit better as well.
But that's none of my business.Edited by Xogath on July 29, 2019 5:26PM0 -
ProzTh3Almighty✭✭✭If we could just roll back the dodge chance on shuffle and elude medium would be fine. I like that they tried to make reactive defense a thing except like someone stated the server performance is bad an you will get hit with every single target ability an its second cousin mid dodgeroll all the time.2
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Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Medium armor is pretty trash. The medium armor builds which work "well" are either Nbs or tank builds which would do better by slotting heavy armor.I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.1 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭It doesn't make any sense that a warrior in heavy armor can't do as much as damage as a warrior in medium armor. In fact, given the laws of physics, heavy attacks and things like Dizzying Swing should hit harder when wearing heavy armor, as the arm should have more momentum. What logical sense does it make that a 400 pound Orc or Nord in Heavy can't hit as hard as 100 pound Bosmer or 200 pound Redguard in Medium? That idea certainly complies little with TES or Western RPG tradition, to my knowledge.
The trade-off ought to be, and generally is, sustain and mobility. In my opinion, although Medium is already substantially stronger offensively than Heavy in Dueling and No CP, the reason the Constitution passive seems to outperform Windwalker and Athletics is the disabling of Stam Regen during roll-dodging and blocking.
Especially for blocking - if you block for 1.9 seconds, you will lose 1 tick of Stam Regen. If you block for 2.01 seconds, you will lose 2 ticks of Stam Regen. AFAIK.
Edit: Another logical trade-off would be attack speed of course, but I suppose that's not a viable adjustment within this game's mechanics.Edited by Urzigurumash on July 29, 2019 9:53PMXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Mettaricana wrote: »I think all 3 types of armor would be better if they did away with the 5pc system passives and make everything a per peice and have the passives adjusted accordingly so build with say 4 heavy 2 medium 1 light cpuld be a thing allowing us to customize our builds a lil better
I very much agree. This would also make Itemization, and especially Monster shoulder farming, much less laborious.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Ajax_22✭✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »It doesn't make any sense that a warrior in heavy armor can't do as much as damage as a warrior in medium armor. In fact, given the laws of physics, heavy attacks and things like Dizzying Swing should hit harder when wearing heavy armor, as the arm should have more momentum. What logical sense does it make that a 400 pound Orc or Nord in Heavy can't hit as hard as 100 pound Bosmer or 200 pound Redguard in Medium? That idea certainly complies little with TES or Western RPG tradition, to my knowledge.
The trade-off ought to be, and generally is, sustain and mobility. In my opinion, although Medium is already substantially stronger offensively than Heavy in Dueling and No CP, the reason the Constitution passive seems to outperform Windwalker and Athletics is the disabling of Stam Regen during roll-dodging and blocking.
Especially for blocking - if you block for 1.9 seconds, you will lose 1 tick of Stam Regen. If you block for 2.01 seconds, you will lose 2 ticks of Stam Regen. AFAIK.
Edit: Another logical trade-off would be attack speed of course, but I suppose that's not a viable adjustment within this game's mechanics.
What do the laws of physics say about the meteor I can call down from space with my mind, or the blizzard I can create in the middle of a desert, or surrounding myself with lightning?Edited by Ajax_22 on July 29, 2019 9:59PM3 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭What do the laws of physics say about the meteor I can call down from space with my mind, or the blizzard I can create in the middle of a desert, or surrounding myself with lightning?
I agree, effects which come down from the sky should hit harder than ones you cast from your staff or body. Note the forthcoming buff to Trinimac's Valor.
But seriously, I understand this is a fantasy environment, however I don't see my point about this matter mentioned very often. There is no good reason why Heavy Armor can't hit as hard per hit - there is good reason why Heavy Armor players can't hit as frequently.
Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Ajax_22✭✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »What do the laws of physics say about the meteor I can call down from space with my mind, or the blizzard I can create in the middle of a desert, or surrounding myself with lightning?
I agree, effects which come down from the sky should hit harder than ones you cast from your staff or body. Note the forthcoming buff to Trinimac's Valor.
But seriously, I understand this is a fantasy environment, however I don't see my point about this matter mentioned very often. There is no good reason why Heavy Armor can't hit as hard per hit - there is good reason why Heavy Armor players can't hit as frequently.
Because balance doesn't give a *** about the laws of physics. In a multiplayer game balance is second only to enjoyability. Balance for this game dictates that heavy armor is for defense, while light, and medium is for the different types of damage.2 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Balance for this game dictates that heavy armor is for defense, while light, and medium is for the different types of damage.
5 years of this game disagree. Heavy is for MORE defense, medium is for MORE damage: not a dichotomy.
Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Anyhow, if we're making Heavy totally defensive, I look forward to the Roll Dodge cost reduction. I'll finally get to put Morihaus to good use. Makes sense, metal is much more slippery than leather, it's definitely easier to roll around on the ground wearing metal than leather.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVYKd_UdgXg Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
master_vanargand✭✭✭✭✭
✭Elude:
Reduced the duration of the Major Expedition granted from this ability by 2 seconds so it will now last between 5 to 7 seconds, rather than 7 to 9 seconds.
The Major Expedition from this ability will now better respect its proc condition on what is considered a “Direct Area of Effect attack”. Note that many item sets that are thematically AoE DoTs may still trigger this effect, due to residual error data, and will be cleaned up in a future update when we shift our focus to auditing item sets.
Elude is trash.
After all, Medium Armor remains weak in PvP.
Shuffle effect time over 5 sec, so what changed?
No changed! People will use heavy armor in PvP.0 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Anyhow, if we're making Heavy totally defensive, I look forward to the Roll Dodge cost reduction. I'll finally get to put Morihaus to good use. Makes sense, metal is much more slippery than leather, it's definitely easier to roll around on the ground wearing metal than leather.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVYKd_UdgXg
You mean slide? I would like them to add that animation. Would be fun to watch.0 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭master_vanargand wrote: »Elude:
Reduced the duration of the Major Expedition granted from this ability by 2 seconds so it will now last between 5 to 7 seconds, rather than 7 to 9 seconds.
The Major Expedition from this ability will now better respect its proc condition on what is considered a “Direct Area of Effect attack”. Note that many item sets that are thematically AoE DoTs may still trigger this effect, due to residual error data, and will be cleaned up in a future update when we shift our focus to auditing item sets.
Elude is trash.
After all, Medium Armor remains weak in PvP.
Shuffle effect time over 5 sec, so what changed?
No changed! People will use heavy armor in PvP.
Have you tried it on pts? The skill is 40 secs long and major expedition ranks from 5-7secs no matter how many pieces of medium you wear5,6, or 7 pieces. And it proc of things like sub assault and DBOS, also and tick of almost any aoe in the game. I think it's nice paired with FM to be sonic in ESO.1
