xylena_lazarow wrote: »Zero risk for the caster, makes it near impossible for outnumbered players to engage or escape. At launch, the longest range stuns were 20m, maybe 25m, and unaffected by PvP passives, for good reason. The fact that Destructive Reach and Draining Shot are cheap and spammable just adds insult to injury. You dodge or block the first few Draining Shots, here comes another 17 of them.
If max range stuns are going to remain in the game, they should be extremely expensive and punishing to spam. Otherwise, reduce the range and make ranged stun spammers risk actual PvP engagement. No, I'm not joining an organized ball zerg, nor am I going to run a build that holds block for 40 seconds straight.
Toc de Malsvi wrote: »If you are standing in the open not blocking/dodging large groups of players you need to L2P.
If you were 41 meters away from your opponent, and you still lost because of one stun, then you would have lost even if you were 4 meters away. The only difference being that you would have lost a lot faster.
Bogdan_Kobzar wrote: »Wow, I notice those with 5+ stars reply with "L2P" or "gitgud", so sad.
As a PvP novice, I've needed to give up Cyrodiil since the Necro's came out, it's really awesome to get goliath bashed THROUGH a postern wall or a keep door, maybe I just need to learn to play better to be able to dodge roll out of those.
And the better ones are getting snipe ganked from above by a leaping invisible enemy player while standing on the top level on the inside keep balcony that is controlled by your faction, I guess that's another one of those "L2P" issues
Oh, and unlike the rest of the Grand Poo Poo's running under level 50 characters with gold gear and questionably ToS leagal add ons that alert the player as to when someone stealthed is in range or when to dodge roll.
My guild mates, only 350 of them have left ALL Cyrodiil campaigns because of the issues. So, you can have more fun in Cyrodiil. Enjoy rekting the novice players.
xylena_lazarow wrote: »Zero risk for the caster, makes it near impossible for outnumbered players to engage or escape. At launch, the longest range stuns were 20m, maybe 25m, and unaffected by PvP passives, for good reason. The fact that Destructive Reach and Draining Shot are cheap and spammable just adds insult to injury. You dodge or block the first few Draining Shots, here comes another 17 of them.
If max range stuns are going to remain in the game, they should be extremely expensive and punishing to spam. Otherwise, reduce the range and make ranged stun spammers risk actual PvP engagement. No, I'm not joining an organized ball zerg, nor am I going to run a build that holds block for 40 seconds straight.
killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »max ranged cc should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
xylena_lazarow wrote: »As previously stated I'd have no problem with max range stuns if it were cripplingly expensive to spam them. The people here defending spamming range stuns are just knee-jerking to the thought of it being harder for them to zerg solos from complete safety. If your first five Draining Shots or Fire Reaches get countered, you should be out of resources, not spamming another 17 of them until a target you're afraid to personally engage is stunned and zerged down.
Toc de Malsvi wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »max ranged cc should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Executes should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Roots should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Smart healing should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Anything can be placed in that slot because your statement is ignorant and foolish. Further Snipe has a longer range than any of those CC's so none of those CC's are "max range".
DocFrost72 wrote: »Increasing the cost wouldn't help you when outnumbered though, you still have multiple people launching salvos of stuns at you.
xylena_lazarow wrote: »DocFrost72 wrote: »Increasing the cost wouldn't help you when outnumbered though, you still have multiple people launching salvos of stuns at you.
The best is the enemy of the better...
It wouldn't have me suddenly winning 1v20, but it would at least give me either an opportunity to create distance between myself and the zerg when they pause to regain resources, or occasionally an opportunity to get into melee range and kill one of the guys who exhausted his entire resource bar spamming stuns.
I'll mention again that there were no max range stuns at launch, stun abilities topped out at 20-25m and were not buffed by PvP passives. The original Combat Team recognized that stuns should require risk of actual PvP engagement, not wielded by risk-averse wallflowers against outnumbered players simply trying to disengage from the zerg and reach areas where they can use LoS or be supported by allies in large scale combat.
killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »max ranged cc should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Executes should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Roots should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Smart healing should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Anything can be placed in that slot because your statement is ignorant and foolish. Further Snipe has a longer range than any of those CC's so none of those CC's are "max range".
First of all, thanks for proving my point. Now we know where we stand. Ill try to treat you in a respectful manner nevertheless, so to answer your points; Executes. Whithout executes game would be even worse than where we are now with the HA meta. Next; Roots; Roots should have a diminishing returns. Im close to agreeing with you. Smart healing; Healing in CP campaign is way too overtuned and should indeed be tuned a lot down. So we agree on some things, but lets stick to what THIS topic is about; ranged CC. Btw, whataboutism is the foe of the free world.
Dude your 'refutation' post was a case study on whataboutism by over generalizing his point and naming THREE unrelated game mechanics to the thread.Toc de Malsvi wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »max ranged cc should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Executes should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Roots should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Smart healing should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Anything can be placed in that slot because your statement is ignorant and foolish. Further Snipe has a longer range than any of those CC's so none of those CC's are "max range".
First of all, thanks for proving my point. Now we know where we stand. Ill try to treat you in a respectful manner nevertheless, so to answer your points; Executes. Whithout executes game would be even worse than where we are now with the HA meta. Next; Roots; Roots should have a diminishing returns. Im close to agreeing with you. Smart healing; Healing in CP campaign is way too overtuned and should indeed be tuned a lot down. So we agree on some things, but lets stick to what THIS topic is about; ranged CC. Btw, whataboutism is the foe of the free world.
It isn't a whataboutism, your statement was myopic. Your statement was essentially:
"I'm right your wrong, if you think I'm wrong its cause you are bad, end of story."
That's not an argument, thats not rational or reason. That is the statement of a child who is upset the world isn't going their way.
Dude your 'refutation' post was a case study on whataboutism by over generalizing his point and naming THREE unrelated game mechanics to the thread.Toc de Malsvi wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Toc de Malsvi wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »max ranged cc should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Executes should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Roots should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Smart healing should not be part of a pvp game. Nothing more to say. If you disagree its cause you crutch on it, because you cant do better. Now lets see by the responses who needs a crutch in pvp.
Anything can be placed in that slot because your statement is ignorant and foolish. Further Snipe has a longer range than any of those CC's so none of those CC's are "max range".
First of all, thanks for proving my point. Now we know where we stand. Ill try to treat you in a respectful manner nevertheless, so to answer your points; Executes. Whithout executes game would be even worse than where we are now with the HA meta. Next; Roots; Roots should have a diminishing returns. Im close to agreeing with you. Smart healing; Healing in CP campaign is way too overtuned and should indeed be tuned a lot down. So we agree on some things, but lets stick to what THIS topic is about; ranged CC. Btw, whataboutism is the foe of the free world.
It isn't a whataboutism, your statement was myopic. Your statement was essentially:
"I'm right your wrong, if you think I'm wrong its cause you are bad, end of story."
That's not an argument, thats not rational or reason. That is the statement of a child who is upset the world isn't going their way.
You also just did what you accused him of doing.
He responded to each point and you responded saying "hurr durr your short-sighted words show the intellect of a child". Trying to avoid the ad hominem charge by calling his words "myopic and petulant" (pretty much what you said, mister)?
Sit down black kettle. Or better yet, provide a counter argument.