Let classes fulfill their role properly.

MaleAmazon · May 2019

Where´s the dislike button?

All of this all classes should be able to do all roles equally is nonsense. What’s the point of a class then? If you need a breakdown of how classic MMO Classes work here you go.

Point of a class is to separate skills and aesthetics into manageable chunks which have identity.

ESO and TES represent RPG progress. If we didn´t have that, we would still be sitting around in basements rolling dice.

There are 3 basic roles to fulfill in ESO. That is quite enough. Skyrim and Fallout 4 got it right when they opened up progression and largely removed caps. Go back and play old interfaces and level 30 caps, "be a useless elf in underpants but you have to decide before we let you out of this starting room if you are a fire mage or Legolas" etc.. it is just painful to me.

TriangularChicken · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Enough with the whole every class can play every role. If you want to do that then you shouldn’t have multiple character slots. If you want to run healer then run Templar or warden. If you want damage then run sorc if you want to run a rogue glass cannon then run nightblade. If you want to run a tank then be a dk. At most a class should be able to fulfill 1 of 2 roles. If you want to run a different role then go back to character selection and choose the appropriate class. All of this all classes should be able to do all roles equally is nonsense. What’s the point of a class then? If you need a breakdown of how classic MMO Classes work here you go.

1 rogue type- high burst damage low-medium defense medium sustain
2 tank- low damage high survival great resource sustain
3 healer class- low to medium survival great resource sustain low damage. ( meant to be protected by group to keep group alive)
4 fighter- medium damage medium to high defense medium resource sustain
5 mage dps-high damage low defense high resource sustain.

Those are the classics class roles. And when you play these roles you sacrifice one thing for another. It doesn’t mean that every class should have high defense high dps and high sustain. At the very least we shouldn’t be able to build our toons that way. If I want to build my nb to quickly burst a target down then I shouldn’t be able to survive extended fights or against multiple opponents. The same should be said for tanks and mages tanks shouldn’t be able to dish out damage like a dps does. And mages shouldn’t be able to dish out damage and tank people with shields.

OK, so then we have to get rid of cloak, because suppressing DoTs while healing and not getting damage is not medium defense.

Uryel · May 2019

Nope, nope, NOPE.

If anything, the game doesn't go far enough to allow more flexibility. Out with the damage tied to your maximum ressource pool, and then we can have proper hybrids. Let any weapon recharge the most depleted pool, not just the one they are arbitrary tied to. And if anything, devs should stop trying to shoehorn races in roles while calling it a "racial balance", too.

Enough with the narrow mind of "class X should have role Y". Crawl back to WoW if you enjoy limited options, you troll.

Only thing that bothers me is people who register as a tank or healer to get a pick up group faster, when they are not.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · May 2019

Uryel wrote: »

Nope, nope, NOPE.

If anything, the game doesn't go far enough to allow more flexibility. Out with the damage tied to your maximum ressource pool, and then we can have proper hybrids. Let any weapon recharge the most depleted pool, not just the one they are arbitrary tied to. And if anything, devs should stop trying to shoehorn races in roles while calling it a "racial balance", too.

Enough with the narrow mind of "class X should have role Y". Crawl back to WoW if you enjoy limited options, you troll.

Only thing that bothers me is people who register as a tank or healer to get a pick up group faster, when they are not.

Amen, well said

Grianasteri · May 2019

Tasear wrote: »

No ty I like my 8 healers of all sorts different classes and playstles.

Wow, I thought I was bad with 3 healers! Soon to be 4 with a Necromancer...

Templar, Warden and Nightblade - which works surprisingly well. Cant wait for the Necromancer, it looks like fun.

Flameheart · May 2019

Grianasteri wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

No ty I like my 8 healers of all sorts different classes and playstles.

Wow, I thought I was bad with 3 healers! Soon to be 4 with a Necromancer...

Templar, Warden and Nightblade - which works surprisingly well. Cant wait for the Necromancer, it looks like fun.

I play all my magicka classes in my signature in all three roles on a regular base. Outfitter and three gear sets are your friend. For the most content you don't even need to change your CP config, the DD config is enough....and I like that.

BigBragg · May 2019

Classes are not roles.

Turelus · May 2019

I would argue the other way and say ZOS needs to do some radical changes to make each class fulfil any role better.

Alsaroth · May 2019

And necromancer fit in what role?

And nope; performing quite nicely with my nord sorc. mag./stam. hybrid (frost staff and sword and shield). Is fun:D

Minyassa · May 2019

That would be incredibly boring.

Shadowasrial · May 2019

What is the point of multiple characters when you have one character who can do everything? Yes ever class can fulfill every role but at current stage in game they are almost able to fulfill every role at the same time and that is what is wrong with the game.

Marcus684 · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

What is the point of multiple characters when you have one character who can do everything? Yes ever class can fulfill every role but at current stage in game they are almost able to fulfill every role at the same time and that is what is wrong with the game.

If that's you view, then maybe this game isn't for you, because ZOS has explicitly stated that as their goal, and numerous patch notes have reiterated that.

Dark_Lord_Kuro · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Enough with the whole every class can play every role. If you want to do that then you shouldn’t have multiple character slots. If you want to run healer then run Templar or warden. If you want damage then run sorc if you want to run a rogue glass cannon then run nightblade. If you want to run a tank then be a dk. At most a class should be able to fulfill 1 of 2 roles. If you want to run a different role then go back to character selection and choose the appropriate class. All of this all classes should be able to do all roles equally is nonsense. What’s the point of a class then? If you need a breakdown of how classic MMO Classes work here you go.

1 rogue type- high burst damage low-medium defense medium sustain
2 tank- low damage high survival great resource sustain
3 healer class- low to medium survival great resource sustain low damage. ( meant to be protected by group to keep group alive)
4 fighter- medium damage medium to high defense medium resource sustain
5 mage dps-high damage low defense high resource sustain.

Those are the classics class roles. And when you play these roles you sacrifice one thing for another. It doesn’t mean that every class should have high defense high dps and high sustain. At the very least we shouldn’t be able to build our toons that way. If I want to build my nb to quickly burst a target down then I shouldn’t be able to survive extended fights or against multiple opponents. The same should be said for tanks and mages tanks shouldn’t be able to dish out damage like a dps does. And mages shouldn’t be able to dish out damage and tank people with shields.

I currently have 15 charaters 5 stam(1 of each class)/6 mag(each class+ pet sorc)/ 2heal (temp+nb) / 2 tank(dk+nb)and in june 3 more (necros) and all play differently

With your way i would only have 6
So explain how exactly i shoulnt have more charater slot

Shadowasrial · May 2019

Marcus684 wrote: »

Shadowasrial wrote: »

What is the point of multiple characters when you have one character who can do everything? Yes ever class can fulfill every role but at current stage in game they are almost able to fulfill every role at the same time and that is what is wrong with the game.

If that's you view, then maybe this game isn't for you, because ZOS has explicitly stated that as their goal, and numerous patch notes have reiterated that.

So you think that it’s right that you have players running around in basically god mode because they can have extreme dps tanking ability healing and resource sustain? All in one build? No I’m sorry there needs to be something sacrificed for there to be balance. This thread is filled with some lazy people who don’t want to do the work to build a character for a role. They just want zos to cater to them and let them do everything on one toon.

bmnoble · May 2019

Kind a nice seeing what builds people come up with.

So long as it works I don't care what class people use to fill a role.

Would rather see people experimenting with what works for them, than all players using a cookie cutter build.

Shadowasrial · May 2019

I love how everyone here thinks I’m saying that each class shouldn’t be able to do each role. I SIMPLY DONT WANT EACH CLASS TO BE ABLE TO DO EACH ROLE AT THE SAME TIME. No character should be able to be a dps tank healer all in one. You should be limited to being able to build 1-2 roles on one character but not all of them at the same time. That throws out any balance. You guys want healers to be able to kill people as well as a sorc or a nb you want dps to be able to heal as well as a healer etc but if you want game balance then there needs to be a limit to how many roles you can build for at the same time. Otherwise zos will continue to nerf every class until eventually there is no difference between any of the classes

Kel · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

I love how everyone here thinks I’m saying that each class shouldn’t be able to do each role. I SIMPLY DONT WANT EACH CLASS TO BE ABLE TO DO EACH ROLE AT THE SAME TIME. No character should be able to be a dps tank healer all in one. You should be limited to being able to build 1-2 roles on one character but not all of them at the same time. That throws out any balance. You guys want healers to be able to kill people as well as a sorc or a nb you want dps to be able to heal as well as a healer etc but if you want game balance then there needs to be a limit to how many roles you can build for at the same time. Otherwise zos will continue to nerf every class until eventually there is no difference between any of the classes

That doesn't have anything to do with classes or roles, but how Zos has insisted on ramping up damage and CC's while trying to do away with things such as defile, making healing insane. And because of CC's and break free being wonky as f#$k, players are forced to be tanky.

And while I feel your PvP pain, you have to remember Zos doesn't separate the two, so while this might affect PvP, it would homogenize PvE. If you don't care about one or the other, you shouldn't be talking about balance at all in ESO, because it affects both areas.

srfrogg23 · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Enough with the whole every class can play every role. If you want to do that then you shouldn’t have multiple character slots. If you want to run healer then run Templar or warden. If you want damage then run sorc if you want to run a rogue glass cannon then run nightblade. If you want to run a tank then be a dk. At most a class should be able to fulfill 1 of 2 roles. If you want to run a different role then go back to character selection and choose the appropriate class. All of this all classes should be able to do all roles equally is nonsense. What’s the point of a class then? If you need a breakdown of how classic MMO Classes work here you go.

1 rogue type- high burst damage low-medium defense medium sustain
2 tank- low damage high survival great resource sustain
3 healer class- low to medium survival great resource sustain low damage. ( meant to be protected by group to keep group alive)
4 fighter- medium damage medium to high defense medium resource sustain
5 mage dps-high damage low defense high resource sustain.

Those are the classics class roles. And when you play these roles you sacrifice one thing for another. It doesn’t mean that every class should have high defense high dps and high sustain. At the very least we shouldn’t be able to build our toons that way. If I want to build my nb to quickly burst a target down then I shouldn’t be able to survive extended fights or against multiple opponents. The same should be said for tanks and mages tanks shouldn’t be able to dish out damage like a dps does. And mages shouldn’t be able to dish out damage and tank people with shields.

No. They shouldn't dumb down the classes just because you want cliche and archaic RPG tropes for easier character building.

Neyane · May 2019

Nope nope and more nope. I have three tanks - sorc, dk and warden, with several dds - stamdk magdk, stam warden, all sorts. This is what makes eso fun and different. I don’t want that to ever change

mague · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

I SIMPLY DONT WANT EACH CLASS TO BE ABLE TO DO EACH ROLE AT THE SAME TIME.

People are not reading

However, it is good that we can solo v1 group dungeons or overland bosses. It is good that we can be different. And the door swings both sides. I do not wish to be forced to use a destro just because i am a magtoon. Usually i play only one main and i went back to my Templar because he still has his own flavor.

PvP is a different animal. Even BG and noCP vs CP are different builds. But at a certain point of dedication players fill their role whole and spec all heal or tank or dps in relation to the requirements of the map. Personally i play 30 day campaigns but i group not often. The group window update is lagging me more then often. So i am a tanky, heal, dps support build. But i am not all of it, but rather Jack of all trades, master of nothing.

On the other side i play overland questing unarmed and i enjoy this freedom

Dark_Lord_Kuro · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Marcus684 wrote: »

Shadowasrial wrote: »

What is the point of multiple characters when you have one character who can do everything? Yes ever class can fulfill every role but at current stage in game they are almost able to fulfill every role at the same time and that is what is wrong with the game.

If that's you view, then maybe this game isn't for you, because ZOS has explicitly stated that as their goal, and numerous patch notes have reiterated that.

So you think that it’s right that you have players running around in basically god mode because they can have extreme dps tanking ability healing and resource sustain? All in one build? No I’m sorry there needs to be something sacrificed for there to be balance. This thread is filled with some lazy people who don’t want to do the work to build a character for a role. They just want zos to cater to them and let them do everything on one toon.

They just want to play the way they like if the want a sorc tank they should be able to have one

kathandira · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Enough with the whole every class can play every role. If you want to do that then you shouldn’t have multiple character slots. If you want to run healer then run Templar or warden. If you want damage then run sorc if you want to run a rogue glass cannon then run nightblade. If you want to run a tank then be a dk. At most a class should be able to fulfill 1 of 2 roles. If you want to run a different role then go back to character selection and choose the appropriate class. All of this all classes should be able to do all roles equally is nonsense. What’s the point of a class then? If you need a breakdown of how classic MMO Classes work here you go.

1 rogue type- high burst damage low-medium defense medium sustain
2 tank- low damage high survival great resource sustain
3 healer class- low to medium survival great resource sustain low damage. ( meant to be protected by group to keep group alive)
4 fighter- medium damage medium to high defense medium resource sustain
5 mage dps-high damage low defense high resource sustain.

Those are the classics class roles. And when you play these roles you sacrifice one thing for another. It doesn’t mean that every class should have high defense high dps and high sustain. At the very least we shouldn’t be able to build our toons that way. If I want to build my nb to quickly burst a target down then I shouldn’t be able to survive extended fights or against multiple opponents. The same should be said for tanks and mages tanks shouldn’t be able to dish out damage like a dps does. And mages shouldn’t be able to dish out damage and tank people with shields.

Even if you were locked to 1 Class per account, we have respecs for Skills and Attributes.

Rather than asking to change the core of a 5 year old game, perhaps this is just not the game for you?

ZonasArch · May 2019

Shadowasrial wrote: »

I love how everyone here thinks I’m saying that each class shouldn’t be able to do each role. I SIMPLY DONT WANT EACH CLASS TO BE ABLE TO DO EACH ROLE AT THE SAME TIME. No character should be able to be a dps tank healer all in one. You should be limited to being able to build 1-2 roles on one character but not all of them at the same time. That throws out any balance. You guys want healers to be able to kill people as well as a sorc or a nb you want dps to be able to heal as well as a healer etc but if you want game balance then there needs to be a limit to how many roles you can build for at the same time. Otherwise zos will continue to nerf every class until eventually there is no difference between any of the classes

The limit to what you can do comes in having only 12 skills, instead of 20 or even 40 like some games. This is where you get restricted.

mikemacon · May 2019

Sounds like you want to play WoW.

Go ahead and play WoW; it's a pretty good game.

ESO, however, is not WoW.

Any class can play any role, in any content.

Yes, that includes vet hard mode trials.

kylewwefan · May 2019

One of these kids said something to me, that’s very applicable to you here. “ Don’t tell me how to play my game old man”

Trials and a couple dungeons need you to follow their roles somewhat proper. Most dungeons and everything else is fair game.

me_ming · May 2019

mikemacon wrote: »

Sounds like you want to play WoW.

Go ahead and play WoW; it's a pretty good game.

ESO, however, is not WoW.

Any class can play any role, in any content.

Yes, that includes vet hard mode trials.

Ummmm... I wouldn't go too far as saying that all classes can play any role in any content. I mean, yeah they could if all the other roles are "meta". But I often wonder if a group consisting of 1 tank sorc, 2 nb healers and all magwarden dps, could complete a vMoL or even vAA or vHRC. Just saying that yeah, one or two people who are off meta, can probably complete it, because the rest are within the meta, sure they'd complete the trial still. But I wonder if these classes can still fulfill those roles when everyone is not within the meta?

Kuramas9tails · May 2019

Goregrinder wrote: »

Classes don't have roles...builds do. This isn't WoW.

Say that to my Mageblade healer who doesn't have Templar passives/skills.

Reverb · May 2019

Class =/= role in ESO, which is one of the ways Zeni has parted from the tired “sameness” of popular MMOs. There are plenty of games out there for you if you want to keep having the WoW experience under a different name over and over.

ZOS_RogerJ · May 2019

Just a friendly reminder to keep the thread civil, constructive and on-topic. While we completely understand everyone has their own opinions, thoughts, feelings and even frustrations, we want the forums to be a civil and constructive platform for the game and it's community as a whole.

Wrathmane · May 2019

I think there shouldn't be classes at all, I think there should be use the open list of skill lines and you pick three of them....... I was shocked when I was making my first toon on ESO.... I couldn't figure out what these classes meant.... this is an Elder Scrolls game..... there are no classes in an elder scrolls game.