Just kicked 2 players from a dungeon

Cillion3117 · April 2019

I'm antisocial and hate doing things with strangers. So I just solo the pledges on normal to get thr boxes. If I get one I can't solo, I just skip it.

Gordon906 · April 2019

Davor wrote: »

Drako_Ei wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Oh, another person who needs to tell others how to play the game.

Honestly? He is saying to not queue as tank for vet dlc if you cant tank

I should have put this in the quote.

It's your decision to dedicate yourself to only one of them but then act accordingly.

so basically telling people if they are not dedicated they shouldn't be playing.

Dedicate yourself? Really? for some people they want to just have fun and not be a "gamer jock". There is an even going on. So lots of people who normally stay away want to participate. After all, isn't that what it is suppose to do? Bring us all together and try something we normally don't do?

What the original poster should do is form a group of like minded people then he can be kicked out for not being so good.

If you join a vet dlc dungeon, you should be dedicated. Or no one wins.

Tsar_Gekkou · April 2019

SkillzMFG wrote: »

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

Don't join Veteran DLC Dungeons if you're clueless.

But how else are people going to learn to play it through? At some point in time you also joined a dungeon and were clueless, don't be so insensitive towards players who got to the DLC vet content a bit later than you did.

Of course If you don't beat the first boss after 10 tries something is off, but you don't have to be an arse about it. Just suggest a better set, rotation and cp allocation and move on with your life.

You do it on normal a few times until you have the basic mechanics down, and then you start to try it on vet afterwards so you aren't getting completely screwed by the additional vet mechanics on top of the normal ones. You don't go into a vet dlc dungeon blind unless you're with friends who agree to it. The only insensitivity is someone screwing over others because they didn't bother testing the water before diving into the deep end while expecting everyone else to keep them from drowning.

Verbal_Earthworm · April 2019

I only play tanks in dungeons and if I don't like the way things are going I just leave the group and exit.

It's far less dramatic than kicking and frees me up instantly to go and do something less annoying.

me_ming · April 2019

Raiden_Gekkou wrote: »

SkillzMFG wrote: »

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

Don't join Veteran DLC Dungeons if you're clueless.

But how else are people going to learn to play it through? At some point in time you also joined a dungeon and were clueless, don't be so insensitive towards players who got to the DLC vet content a bit later than you did.

Of course If you don't beat the first boss after 10 tries something is off, but you don't have to be an arse about it. Just suggest a better set, rotation and cp allocation and move on with your life.

You do it on normal a few times until you have the basic mechanics down, and then you start to try it on vet afterwards so you aren't getting completely screwed by the additional vet mechanics on top of the normal ones. You don't go into a vet dlc dungeon blind unless you're with friends who agree to it. The only insensitivity is someone screwing over others because they didn't bother testing the water before diving into the deep end while expecting everyone else to keep them from drowning.

Lol why do people think normal has the basic mechanics? They don't never have never will. I find it really pathetic why people who have done it can't teach people who are new to the game. I mean, I get it sometimes, I don't have the patience to be with someone who hasn't done it before, but I don't kick anyone, I politely leave the group instead. But in most cases, I don't mind explaining mechanics at all. Like as what was mentioned before, everyone of us has been through not knowing how a dungeon is done. We have people who has done it explain to us.

I honestly really hate these new players who are between CP400-600+. they seem to not have the culture of helping newer people. That is NOT the culture here in ESO. If that is what you have in your previous game, don't bring that here. Those are the type of people that I kick immediately in game. Most max'd or higher CP players I know will gladly teach other people, but honestly, these CP400-600+ have the guts to kick someone who has lower CP than them and are honestly more toxic than the elites. It's disgusting.

Normals =/= training ground for vet. Normals is too easy, I could half asleep doing them-- which I literally have a couple of times. Normals is when you want to queue up for random normals and get more xp, or just to level up your undaunted. There is ZERO mechanic to be learn in Normal dungeons. Now if you are doing mechanic on normals, then the problem is YOU. YOU don't have enough for vets. And that is probably why you can't have someone who was new to the dungeon with you on vet, because you need someone who was better than you so they can carry you.

Now if you are a new to a dungeon, the best suggest I can give is go watch a tutorial on how to do it. There are a lot of resources you can find on the internet. DON'T do normal mode of the dungeon. Trust me it WON'T help.

Goregrinder · April 2019

Androconium wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Yup, that's why we showed no mercy when you guys entered Cyrodiil.

^^ Seal clubber. The good news is that after being chastised for not spending the time to research an appropriate Alcast build, I finally id so. I learned two things: I was already on the same wavelength anyway as far as build structures go; and now that I have a reasonably efficient build, I have way more confidence and a better understanding of how to use what skills I have.

More importantly, I noticed (in random normal) that our tank was MIA. When I did a "player_name ?" in the group chat, he came running up. "Sorry, I was in "Guild Chat". About two minutes later the other two players left.

It really doesn't matter if I'm any good or not...

A lot of people dont "get" dolmen running. All I can say is that there is none of this toxicity there. Everyone just jumps in and does what they can to kill as much as possible. Apart from some of the lag issues, its mindless, impersonal fun.

If only the rewards were better...

Lick for a lick.

Jhalin · April 2019

me_ming wrote: »

Raiden_Gekkou wrote: »

SkillzMFG wrote: »

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

Don't join Veteran DLC Dungeons if you're clueless.

But how else are people going to learn to play it through? At some point in time you also joined a dungeon and were clueless, don't be so insensitive towards players who got to the DLC vet content a bit later than you did.

Of course If you don't beat the first boss after 10 tries something is off, but you don't have to be an arse about it. Just suggest a better set, rotation and cp allocation and move on with your life.

You do it on normal a few times until you have the basic mechanics down, and then you start to try it on vet afterwards so you aren't getting completely screwed by the additional vet mechanics on top of the normal ones. You don't go into a vet dlc dungeon blind unless you're with friends who agree to it. The only insensitivity is someone screwing over others because they didn't bother testing the water before diving into the deep end while expecting everyone else to keep them from drowning.

Lol why do people think normal has the basic mechanics? They don't never have never will. I find it really pathetic why people who have done it can't teach people who are new to the game. I mean, I get it sometimes, I don't have the patience to be with someone who hasn't done it before, but I don't kick anyone, I politely leave the group instead. But in most cases, I don't mind explaining mechanics at all. Like as what was mentioned before, everyone of us has been through not knowing how a dungeon is done. We have people who has done it explain to us.

I honestly really hate these new players who are between CP400-600+. they seem to not have the culture of helping newer people. That is NOT the culture here in ESO. If that is what you have in your previous game, don't bring that here. Those are the type of people that I kick immediately in game. Most max'd or higher CP players I know will gladly teach other people, but honestly, these CP400-600+ have the guts to kick someone who has lower CP than them and are honestly more toxic than the elites. It's disgusting.

Normals =/= training ground for vet. Normals is too easy, I could half asleep doing them-- which I literally have a couple of times. Normals is when you want to queue up for random normals and get more xp, or just to level up your undaunted. There is ZERO mechanic to be learn in Normal dungeons. Now if you are doing mechanic on normals, then the problem is YOU. YOU don't have enough for vets. And that is probably why you can't have someone who was new to the dungeon with you on vet, because you need someone who was better than you so they can carry you.

Now if you are a new to a dungeon, the best suggest I can give is go watch a tutorial on how to do it. There are a lot of resources you can find on the internet. DON'T do normal mode of the dungeon. Trust me it WON'T help.

Normal is a training ground for players new to dungeons. Obviously it’s not for training players who already know how combat works, but I’ve gotten a cp400 in nRoM, and they died to trash, they died to adds, they didn’t know what was going on, so clearly some people really are not even ready for some normal dungeons.

Vet is not a training ground, and it’s not a place for newbie players to get carried. Of course they get kicked when they can’t stay alive, can’t do mechanics, or can’t provide sufficient dps.

Goregrinder · April 2019

Jhalin wrote: »

me_ming wrote: »

Raiden_Gekkou wrote: »

SkillzMFG wrote: »

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

Don't join Veteran DLC Dungeons if you're clueless.

But how else are people going to learn to play it through? At some point in time you also joined a dungeon and were clueless, don't be so insensitive towards players who got to the DLC vet content a bit later than you did.

Of course If you don't beat the first boss after 10 tries something is off, but you don't have to be an arse about it. Just suggest a better set, rotation and cp allocation and move on with your life.

You do it on normal a few times until you have the basic mechanics down, and then you start to try it on vet afterwards so you aren't getting completely screwed by the additional vet mechanics on top of the normal ones. You don't go into a vet dlc dungeon blind unless you're with friends who agree to it. The only insensitivity is someone screwing over others because they didn't bother testing the water before diving into the deep end while expecting everyone else to keep them from drowning.

Lol why do people think normal has the basic mechanics? They don't never have never will. I find it really pathetic why people who have done it can't teach people who are new to the game. I mean, I get it sometimes, I don't have the patience to be with someone who hasn't done it before, but I don't kick anyone, I politely leave the group instead. But in most cases, I don't mind explaining mechanics at all. Like as what was mentioned before, everyone of us has been through not knowing how a dungeon is done. We have people who has done it explain to us.

I honestly really hate these new players who are between CP400-600+. they seem to not have the culture of helping newer people. That is NOT the culture here in ESO. If that is what you have in your previous game, don't bring that here. Those are the type of people that I kick immediately in game. Most max'd or higher CP players I know will gladly teach other people, but honestly, these CP400-600+ have the guts to kick someone who has lower CP than them and are honestly more toxic than the elites. It's disgusting.

Normals =/= training ground for vet. Normals is too easy, I could half asleep doing them-- which I literally have a couple of times. Normals is when you want to queue up for random normals and get more xp, or just to level up your undaunted. There is ZERO mechanic to be learn in Normal dungeons. Now if you are doing mechanic on normals, then the problem is YOU. YOU don't have enough for vets. And that is probably why you can't have someone who was new to the dungeon with you on vet, because you need someone who was better than you so they can carry you.

Now if you are a new to a dungeon, the best suggest I can give is go watch a tutorial on how to do it. There are a lot of resources you can find on the internet. DON'T do normal mode of the dungeon. Trust me it WON'T help.

Normal is a training ground for players new to dungeons. Obviously it’s not for training players who already know how combat works, but I’ve gotten a cp400 in nRoM, and they died to trash, they died to adds, they didn’t know what was going on, so clearly some people really are not even ready for some normal dungeons.

Vet is not a training ground, and it’s not a place for newbie players to get carried. Of course they get kicked when they can’t stay alive, can’t do mechanics, or can’t provide sufficient dps.

Yup, just like how Cyrodiil is not a training ground for PVP. If you come into Cyrodiil to do a quest, but have no idea how to PVP, not our problem. Better strap on your ADIDAS and hope the spirit of Usain Bolt carries you in the wind.

DenMoria · April 2019

I wonder how you're ever supposed to learn anything in ESO with so few people actually willing to teach anybody anything.

You can't enter PvP without knowing how to PvP, but you can't learn PvP without entering PvP.

You can't learn veteran mechanics of runs w/out actually doing them, but you're not allowed to do them without out knowing how to do them.

Something seems really wrong with the system here.

Maybe there really should be a 2 tiered system where all those folks with 810 out there (or 640 or whatever) who think they know everything and enjoy ganking everybody and treating people like trash really should have their own little arenas where nobody else ever goes and leave the rest of us to play the game.

Oh, I forgot... as the meta's always say... Watch videos and do you build exactly as your instructed to even if it's no fun for you and you aren't enjoying yourself. After all, the only thing that's important is to win and be the top of the boards. Nothing else matters.

p00tx · April 2019

Raiden_Gekkou wrote: »

SkillzMFG wrote: »

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

Don't join Veteran DLC Dungeons if you're clueless.

But how else are people going to learn to play it through? At some point in time you also joined a dungeon and were clueless, don't be so insensitive towards players who got to the DLC vet content a bit later than you did.

Of course If you don't beat the first boss after 10 tries something is off, but you don't have to be an arse about it. Just suggest a better set, rotation and cp allocation and move on with your life.

You do it on normal a few times until you have the basic mechanics down, and then you start to try it on vet afterwards so you aren't getting completely screwed by the additional vet mechanics on top of the normal ones. You don't go into a vet dlc dungeon blind unless you're with friends who agree to it. The only insensitivity is someone screwing over others because they didn't bother testing the water before diving into the deep end while expecting everyone else to keep them from drowning.

Not necessarily. Three of us pugged into vDoM on release day with a tank and 2 DDs without trying normal first. We did just fine. The healer who got stuck with us was an actual healer, which made things go super slow, but we did just fine and got our complete. It wasn't that bad, but we were also in the appropriate gear, hitting 35k and 45k respectively, and knew how to run a proper rotation. I would NEVER bring one of my PvP toons into there, under any circumstances. That just seems like common sense (apparently not though).

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · April 2019

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

So I just entered Veteran Frostvault with my healer. Tank had 25k hp and a 2H. One of the DDs had 1h&Shield. We couldn't get past the first boss.

While in general I agree, there are few things to know.
a) 25K HP 2h tank, is OK if the guy knows how to tank, can taunt and his resistances are over 20,000 EACH.
If Warden then has Major Fracture, otherwise need to use NMG.

My solo build, only ice staff wielding, Warden has 24,000 HP yet tanks vet Frostvault (and all vet dungeons, non HM) without issue. For her to die, means that got lag and missed some mechanics, and the healer was dead alongside all the DDs for 5+ minutes. The worse thing is that most of the time I am outdamaging 1 of the DDs if not both also.

b) S&B DD is not game breaking depending sets and what skills are used. If you use Crushing Weapon for spammable (stam Sorc good example) then it's damage is barely 2K dps bellow DW and 2k dps over 2H. Hell, S&B in medium armour (with dps set) spamming Crushing Weapon + LA with S&B (around 14K dps), would outdamage the significant majority of DDs out there by factor of 2x if not 3x. That includes many magicka builds also.

tyggerbob · April 2019

I've offered advice on mechanics or tanking many times if it looks like they're struggling. I have had a FEW listen and be polite and thank you, but a majority of times it's "healer sucks", "this is normal. We dont need a tank" as they die from a untainted boss mechanic or just plain rudeness. I do that care if they're PVP or PVE. That's when the kick boot comes out.

Runkorko · April 2019

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

So I just entered Veteran Frostvault with my healer. Tank had 25k hp and a 2H. One of the DDs had 1h&Shield. We couldn't get past the first boss. When I saw PvE players talking about kicking PvP players from dungeons last week, I just thought that it was a joke (because from my perspective, most of the PvP players are good at PvE anyway) but apparently this is a thing indeed, those group members also had high Alliance Rank so I guess it's true that there are PvP players that suck in PvE. Maybe don't join Veteran next time? Normal difficulty pledges give the reward box anyway.

I play both PvP and PvE frequently and I don't think it's too hard to do both. It's your decision to dedicate yourself to only one of them but then act accordingly. Those PvE players complaining about Cyrodiil were ridiculous enough and now we get this? At least PvE players' complains didn't affect my in-game experience but now this is going to affect me. Don't join Veteran DLC Dungeons if you're clueless.

Dont divide comunity to pvp and pve.
Those are not bad pvp players, they was just bad players. Thats all.
High pvp rank dont mean you are pvper. Neither hard pve dungeon achivments mean that you are good pve player.
You had bad expirience. We have it every day. Just close this page and go on.
Good luck

me_ming · April 2019

Cryptical wrote: »

dtsharples wrote: »

Managed vICP pretty easily yesterday with a full group of PVP characters.
All 'DD's' with one guy rocking a ranged taunt.
The thing is, if you can PVP well you can PVE pretty easily too as a result - Why? Because you have the self awareness to avoid the ridiculously easy mechanics, have self heals / shields and if you aren't a total turd have plenty of DPS to bring down the bosses - and trash mobs just melt.

And don't presume that all PVPers are wearing full Impen, it's genuinely not the case as there are other options out there.
Sure there are plenty of 'PVPers' who just slot tank armour and block with no damage, I feel sorry if you get one of those guys in your group because they are useless in both PVP & PVE.

But, if I do unfortunately have to slum it in a pug, I do make sure to remove any indication that I PVP, as the hysterical screeching from PVE try-hards makes my ears bleed.
Without any indication like a Title, we get the job done efficiently and everyone says 'GG' and leaves without any hassle.

That is the first dlc. It lacks a number of advanced mechanics that have been invented and implemented in later dungeons.

Do your 4 dps pvp build in vBloodroot, vScale, vFalkreath, vFrost. I’d be entertained watching 4 pvp dps dancing around chudan in vMazz, or scrambling around avoiding Balorgh when he electrifies the water in vMarch. It would be awesome to see your 4 pvp dps gang try to butt-tank the lava geysers from Galchobhar the Minotaur boss. Let’s see your crew handle the white werewolf in vMoonhunter. You called them easy mechanics, cherry picking the very first dlc put out.

Step it up to the harder stuff and let’s see your group support your boasting.

Lol. I find it very funny how most noob PvE on this forum post as all PvP-er wear the same gear when they play PvE. Tell you what, I am no hardcore PvP player, I would have been though if it weren't for the lag, but I will tell you this there a lot, A LOT of PvP players who are a ton better than PvE than most of the so-called PvE-ers here. Don't you think those people at the leaderboards of vMA and trials, and those that are selling skins in PvE don't PvP? They have to PvP. lol. They may not be the best at PvP, but trust me they are just as PvP players as much as they PvE.

Look I get it, it is annoying to have someone wreck your day in a dungeon, I've been there. But as what was advised before, don't pug. Build your own group. Otherwise, expect everything, because let's face it, if this week wasn't dungeons and trials week we'd still be complaining at people who doesn't meet your expectations in a dungeon. And honestly, the problem is you. If you know the dungeon so well, teach don't whine.

MrBrownstone · April 2019

I personally love teaching people a dungeon, that's why I mostly pug. However, those people weren't ready for any actual veteran content.

On my first vFrostvault run, I looked at a guide and jumped into the group finder, and still asked for help about the mechanics. Things went smooth. I like to teach about mechanics too. But you know you can't teach them anything when your tank dies to troll mobs at the beginning of the dungeon. Their lack of knowledge is not limited to that dungeon... They should L2P first.

Osteos · April 2019

@me_ming has a valid point about normal dungeons.

They really don't teach you mechanics. Either you kill everything too quickly to even see the mechanics or the damage is scaled down too much so you don't even realize until vet that -blank- will instant kill you.

Three decent players should be able to successfully help an inexperienced player through a vet dungeon. Inexperienced is different from a bad player. I don't pug much anymore but we used to queue for our forth. Never knew what the queue would bring. Yes you should go into vet prepared but sometimes you need to experience it to know if you are ready or not.

Jeremy · April 2019

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Canned_Apples wrote: »

It's not that they suck...it's that they don't bother changing out their abilities, gear, or even CP.
You also have to remember that the majority of pvp players run in zergs- so there's even less "skill" involved than for pve.

I only swap out my gear for vets and some-dlc dungeons.

99% of PvP is basically a numbers game and out-numbering your opponent to where they have little chance at winning - especially in Cyrodil. That is the number one tactic used. So I'll never understand those who think PvP has so much more "skill" involved when compared to PvE.

Except when you're the person fighting the bigger number. There is a lot of skill involved when you're fighting outnumbered. There are players, you know, who don't want to zerg others down and choose to fight in small groups.

I take your point. But that would mean losing (as you are likely going to do if the odds are weighed heavily against you) is not a matter of skill or the lack there of - but merely the fact you were outnumbered and no amount of "skill" is going to save you.

My point was it's more about the numbers than the actual skill of the players involved.

That's not true at all, actually. You can win outnumbered. You build for it, you learn to always expect to be outnumbered, and often you can win. Sure, 2 people aren't going to take out 20, but 2 people can take out 5-10, and that is where the fun and skill comes from that playstyle.

I strictly play none CP PvP - so bear that in mind.

It's also very difficult for me to imagine 2 people taking out 10 people. Those 10 people would have to be god awful - and I'm talking so bad they play with their elbows while blindfolded or something.

So there is just no way you can realistically "build" to take on 5 + people by yourself. It's just not going to happen assuming those people you are up against are of average intelligence and not severely handicapped in some crippling way.

Now maybe in CP campaigns things are different. To that I can't really say. But in none CP PvP what I said is basically true. It's just a numbers game and that determines the outcome in the vast majority of battles. It's not the skill of the individual player rather it's just which side gangs up more effectively on the other. That is almost always the determining factor.

FierceSam · April 2019

Tigerseye wrote: »

DenMoria wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Oh, another person who needs to tell others how to play the game.

It's a valid point.

I'm a PvE player. I work solo or give support to a group.

I am terrible at PvP. I know that.

PvE and PvP are two completely different animals.

PvEers may complain about getting ganked in PvP (lack of skill set), but PvPers refuse to adapt and expect to be carried in PvE.

Not sure why that is, but it is the way things work.

This game is the absolute worst game I have played, to date, in terms of switching skills, CP points, gear (no saved sets) and so on.

Not to mention lack of bag space.

I'm not surprised if no one bothers and if most PVPers just charge in, in their PVP gear and set-up.

+ about 20 million.

I would love to be able to switch my skills, morphs, gear and CP easily so that each of my characters could have a viable PvE and PvP build.

And have the bag space to carry the two totally separate sets of gear required.

Zhoyzu · April 2019

idk wrote: »

It’s a fallacy of to think most PvP players are good at PvE. Many bad PvE players go to PvP because they are bad.

It is also a fallacy to mix alliance rank with skill. Many players have gained a lot of AP via zergs and it merely takes longevity of that behavior to make it to high alliance ranks.

This is not to reflect on all PvP players. There are great PvP players and many are great at PvE. It’s just to say there are many bad players in both PvP and PvE.

to simplify this, Bad players are bad players, and good players are good players.

r34lian · April 2019

Aireal wrote: »

Vietfox wrote: »

dazee wrote: »

Vietfox wrote: »

It is, and mainly pvpers do both things because we are forced to. We just rather spend more time in pvp because pve is boring.

Boring for you. I have more reliable fun in PVE than I ever have in PVP. sure pvp is fun when BG deigns to give you a balanced matchup with a fun close match (very rarely btw) or when you have a good group to run with in cyro.. but you can't get that on demand.

Pve is easy, repetitive and predictable, i can't really see the fun part of it.

Different strokes for different folks?

I come from RPG's.. therefore.. I Role Play. Even my crafters have a role to play.. they help their friends by crafting them good armor, weapons, potions, food.. and setting them up a nice place to live.

Or put in another way.. 4k plus hours playing Skyrim on 360.. I'm at about 3k hr's in Skyrim on PC, 5k hrs total in Oblivion, 2k in Morrowind, about 10k in Dragon Age ( all three ) not to mention Fable I, II, III.. DMC ( 1-4 ) Neverwinter Nights I & II..

Baran, my Altmer Dragon Knight ( lvl 39.). is doing the MQ.. He started wanting his soul back.. now.. He's in a never-ending battle against the "dark" Deadric Princes.

Drystan, Nord Warden ( lvl16),.. is an explorer.. the "Northern" countries... starting in Eastmarch

Ay'Anna Breton Sorceress (lvl 32).. is tangled up with Cyrodillic Collections in Mirkmire..and will probably stay in the 'swampy areas.

T'Sillah , Khajiit Warden..( lvl 22) is doing the Psijic quests and is also helping Raz in his efforts with the Queen.

I don't see how anyone can mindlessly just run through dungeons killing things...to me that's pretty dang boring.. but.. some people skydive.. some people play golf... some do both.

I like to kill anything that moves

reminds me of witcher 3 the baron's quest where I was bored of fetching stuff and evil spirits asked me to get horse and some thing to set him free I ended up killing it Cuz I was lazy ended up making right decision

Androconium · April 2019

Davor wrote: »

Drako_Ei wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Oh, another person who needs to tell others how to play the game.

Honestly? He is saying to not queue as tank for vet dlc if you cant tank

I should have put this in the quote.

It's your decision to dedicate yourself to only one of them but then act accordingly.

so basically telling people if they are not dedicated they shouldn't be playing.

Dedicate yourself? Really? for some people they want to just have fun and not be a "gamer jock". There is an even going on. So lots of people who normally stay away want to participate. After all, isn't that what it is suppose to do? Bring us all together and try something we normally don't do?

What the original poster should do is form a group of like minded people then he can be kicked out for not being so good.

^^ yes. Some players with a truckload of MMO experience still expect a random selection of teammates to be at the the same level as them. Two issues arise form this:

Firstly, random is just that. If you want a specific group, then form it up for yourself at what ever level you want, with partners from your Guilds; not all guilds are trading guilds. I fail to see why experienced MMO players still have a problem with this fundamental issue.

Secondly, there is a mindset around that says I and other players with lesser experience, are supposed to go to the internet and read or watch what SOMEONE ELSE has done before me; so that I may know and understand what to expect, whence I venture into a new situation.

What ever happened to learning by experience?

To twist tings right around:

What I read is that some players can't be bothered learning something new; they'd rather wait until someone else does it and posts the learning experience online, for them to assess and benefit from.

These same players then argue that they aren't skillful enough to carry lesser uneducated players.

This is not a PvP Vs PvE issue. A fundamental principle of TES games is that you can proceed at your own pace and complete as much or a little as you like.

This is a TES Vs MMO issue. Players with other MMO experience, don't understand that players with a TES background actively choose to do what ever they want, whenever they want.

Build a bridge.
Get over it.

Tsar_Gekkou · April 2019

me_ming wrote: »

Raiden_Gekkou wrote: »

SkillzMFG wrote: »

MrBumblefoot wrote: »

Don't join Veteran DLC Dungeons if you're clueless.

But how else are people going to learn to play it through? At some point in time you also joined a dungeon and were clueless, don't be so insensitive towards players who got to the DLC vet content a bit later than you did.

Of course If you don't beat the first boss after 10 tries something is off, but you don't have to be an arse about it. Just suggest a better set, rotation and cp allocation and move on with your life.

You do it on normal a few times until you have the basic mechanics down, and then you start to try it on vet afterwards so you aren't getting completely screwed by the additional vet mechanics on top of the normal ones. You don't go into a vet dlc dungeon blind unless you're with friends who agree to it. The only insensitivity is someone screwing over others because they didn't bother testing the water before diving into the deep end while expecting everyone else to keep them from drowning.

Lol why do people think normal has the basic mechanics? They don't never have never will. I find it really pathetic why people who have done it can't teach people who are new to the game. I mean, I get it sometimes, I don't have the patience to be with someone who hasn't done it before, but I don't kick anyone, I politely leave the group instead. But in most cases, I don't mind explaining mechanics at all. Like as what was mentioned before, everyone of us has been through not knowing how a dungeon is done. We have people who has done it explain to us.

I honestly really hate these new players who are between CP400-600+. they seem to not have the culture of helping newer people. That is NOT the culture here in ESO. If that is what you have in your previous game, don't bring that here. Those are the type of people that I kick immediately in game. Most max'd or higher CP players I know will gladly teach other people, but honestly, these CP400-600+ have the guts to kick someone who has lower CP than them and are honestly more toxic than the elites. It's disgusting.

Normals =/= training ground for vet. Normals is too easy, I could half asleep doing them-- which I literally have a couple of times. Normals is when you want to queue up for random normals and get more xp, or just to level up your undaunted. There is ZERO mechanic to be learn in Normal dungeons. Now if you are doing mechanic on normals, then the problem is YOU. YOU don't have enough for vets. And that is probably why you can't have someone who was new to the dungeon with you on vet, because you need someone who was better than you so they can carry you.

Now if you are a new to a dungeon, the best suggest I can give is go watch a tutorial on how to do it. There are a lot of resources you can find on the internet. DON'T do normal mode of the dungeon. Trust me it WON'T help.

Normal dlc dungeons don't have mechanics? LOL. I can't count the amount of times i've gone into normal Scalecaller to farm a Jorvuld's lightning staff and have had struggle bus after struggle bus because people couldn't stop getting petrified on the gargoyle boss, or frozen by the giant matriarch, or dying to the poison boss because they refused to step into the antidote circle for a split second to keep the poisons from stacking on them. Base dungeon mechanics on normal are a non-issue, but dlc dungeons actually require a couple of brains cells to bang together unless you have decent dps to burn through the mechanics on normal, which most players don't. People will explain mechanics all the time, but too many pugs are entitled and refuse to listen while continuing to run face-first into a meat grinder because they want to play how they want regardless of how it affects the team, which is why we see so many fake tanks/healers, and dps who only light attack while being allergic to using skills and love standing behind the healer. I'm a CP1140 healer main and i've pugged up and down tamriel so much that all the dead weight I see makes it feel like coldharbour. You give the average dps too much credit if you think they can burn through mechanics in a normal dlc dungeon.

Thavie · April 2019

Now if you are a new to a dungeon, the best suggest I can give is go watch a tutorial on how to do it. There are a lot of resources you can find on the internet. DON'T do normal mode of the dungeon. Trust me it WON'T help.

Now this is very BAD advice. We are talking about DLC vet dungeon and if you didn't complete it on normal you totally should not even try to queue with random people for it. Vet DLC dungeons are f*** hard and also unnecessary for the event. Normal has all the same mechanics that actually WORK. And it does help a ton to learn them before trying veteran.

People in this thread are getting confused thinking that vet DLC dungeons are exactly the same as base ones. THEY ARE NOT. They are much harder even for a group of friends with voice chat. No one is trying to tell you how you should or shouldn't play, no one is trying to tell PvP players they Snow nothing. It is not about you, people! It's just DLC vet dungeons are harder content that requires proper builds and knowledge of mechanics! Can you run them with your PvP build without doing the normal first? Sure you can. You just won't succeed and will waste your time and time of other people. That's just not a nice thing to do to yourself and others.

It's also quite ironic because people tend to believe that ESO is extremely casual and then BOOM they can't get past the first boss and get angry on others who try to explain why this happened. Well guess what, ESO is not completely casual, there is harder content and vet DLC dungeons are part of it. Why do you think people usually run 4 keys pledges, meaning they are down to do hardmode on base vet dungeons but don't want to run even normal DLC dungeon, let alone vet or HM?

These same players then argue that they aren't skillful enough to carry lesser uneducated players.

You see, you can't be carried through 4 (four! not twenty-four where you can sleepwalk while others doing your work) man vet DLC dungeon. Some very good (waaay above the average!) players can help one inexperienced player, but two? Or even three? Nah, simply impossible. They also do not owe you teaching, you shouldn't expect them to do so. And even if they are nice enough to teach you mechanics they can't help you to fix your build. If you do not have what tank should you wouldn't be able to tank. Do your part, prepare yourself or run normal. It's that easy. No one is trying to offend you.

Build a bridge.
Get over it.

This thread is exactly that. People are trying to explain to others that they simply cannot do whatever they want when it comes to harder content. Because - surprise! - it is hard. Normal dungeons are great - they are easy, they show you all the story behind the dungeon, they do not require proper builds or crazy dps. The problem is not TES vs MMO or PvP vs PvE. The problem is some people feel entitled to be taught and carried through ANY content without anyone saying what they need to do (which is impossible if they really want to learn something). That's the problem. Entitlement.

Aireal · May 2019

Aurielle wrote: »

I like to kill anything that moves reminds me of witcher 3 the baron's quest where I was bored of fetching stuff and evil spirits asked me to get horse and something to set him free I ended up killing it Cuz I was lazy ended up making right decision

You know.. I have those days. Generally speaking, I load up a Skyrim Character - non- role playing character.. and go hit Forelhost.. Dead is Dead.. 0 armor rating, just a great sword, no potions, no spells... adept and see how far I get.

~~

You know I'm pretty sure I 'carried' a PvP player through a quest dungeon today.. with my lvl 17 Templar... His/her character was also a Templar, mine did most of the fighting.. his/her's spent a lot of time healing him/her-self. Every time (s)he rushed ahead ( I loot everything ) I would find him ( male Khajiit character) reviving after a death.

From the Chevron next to the player's name, 'veteran' status.. don't know what that mean's in terms of PvP playing..<shrug> don't care.. Every time 'he' died, I waited on him. Why? cause obviously (s)he needed some help getting through the dungeon.

I play solo because I go at my own pace - I have thought about doing enough research to get one good PvP character and find a group ( guild ) to run some dungeons or battles with.. but the truth is after this event and trying a couple of 'group' events.. I'd rather just not get whatever it is the reward is for doing the 'group' PvP event.

IMO if you have issues with a random group.. find some players that you can make a 'team' with .. make up a guild.. "veteran dungeon players guild"... plot out some criteria that works with what you think a "veteran" would have/ know.

It's hard to get experience unless someone is willing to take a chance on you though.

central_scrutinizer · May 2019

zyk wrote: »

I think booting anyone from a Group Finder PUG for performance reasons is pretty toxic. If you join a PUG, you should do your very best to make it work. Otherwise, stick to playing with your friends.

I say that as someone who doesn't use the Group Finder because I'm not prepared to deal with a PUG.

So many players are unwilling to own their decisions. If you go to Cyro, you might get ganked. If you join a pug, it might suck.

I agree completely, if you can't handle the wildcard aspect of pugging, don't pug, problem completely solved.
Whenever I see this crap where somebody is propping themselves up by disparaging others I just read it as "I really want attention but I don't want to bother with doing anything to earn it so I'll just point at strangers in a game instead".

Casterial · May 2019

Thats okay in the middle of a raid boss I kicked 2 people on WoW :shrug:

DisgracefulMind · May 2019

Jeremy wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Canned_Apples wrote: »

It's not that they suck...it's that they don't bother changing out their abilities, gear, or even CP.
You also have to remember that the majority of pvp players run in zergs- so there's even less "skill" involved than for pve.

I only swap out my gear for vets and some-dlc dungeons.

99% of PvP is basically a numbers game and out-numbering your opponent to where they have little chance at winning - especially in Cyrodil. That is the number one tactic used. So I'll never understand those who think PvP has so much more "skill" involved when compared to PvE.

Except when you're the person fighting the bigger number. There is a lot of skill involved when you're fighting outnumbered. There are players, you know, who don't want to zerg others down and choose to fight in small groups.

I take your point. But that would mean losing (as you are likely going to do if the odds are weighed heavily against you) is not a matter of skill or the lack there of - but merely the fact you were outnumbered and no amount of "skill" is going to save you.

My point was it's more about the numbers than the actual skill of the players involved.

That's not true at all, actually. You can win outnumbered. You build for it, you learn to always expect to be outnumbered, and often you can win. Sure, 2 people aren't going to take out 20, but 2 people can take out 5-10, and that is where the fun and skill comes from that playstyle.

I strictly play none CP PvP - so bear that in mind.

It's also very difficult for me to imagine 2 people taking out 10 people. Those 10 people would have to be god awful - and I'm talking so bad they play with their elbows while blindfolded or something.

So there is just no way you can realistically "build" to take on 5 + people by yourself. It's just not going to happen assuming those people you are up against are of average intelligence and not severely handicapped in some crippling way.

Now maybe in CP campaigns things are different. To that I can't really say. But in none CP PvP what I said is basically true. It's just a numbers game and that determines the outcome in the vast majority of battles. It's not the skill of the individual player rather it's just which side gangs up more effectively on the other. That is almost always the determining factor.

You can do it in no-CP too, I play both (:

Universe · May 2019

Inb4 the OP is kicked from Cyrodiil pugs group

Here is a cookie for your effort:

Jeremy · May 2019

Universe wrote: »

Inb4 the OP is kicked from Cyrodiil pugs group
Here is a cookie for your effort:

Thanks. I'm hungry now and craving chocolate chip cookies.

Jeremy · May 2019

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Canned_Apples wrote: »

It's not that they suck...it's that they don't bother changing out their abilities, gear, or even CP.
You also have to remember that the majority of pvp players run in zergs- so there's even less "skill" involved than for pve.

I only swap out my gear for vets and some-dlc dungeons.

99% of PvP is basically a numbers game and out-numbering your opponent to where they have little chance at winning - especially in Cyrodil. That is the number one tactic used. So I'll never understand those who think PvP has so much more "skill" involved when compared to PvE.

Except when you're the person fighting the bigger number. There is a lot of skill involved when you're fighting outnumbered. There are players, you know, who don't want to zerg others down and choose to fight in small groups.

I take your point. But that would mean losing (as you are likely going to do if the odds are weighed heavily against you) is not a matter of skill or the lack there of - but merely the fact you were outnumbered and no amount of "skill" is going to save you.

My point was it's more about the numbers than the actual skill of the players involved.

That's not true at all, actually. You can win outnumbered. You build for it, you learn to always expect to be outnumbered, and often you can win. Sure, 2 people aren't going to take out 20, but 2 people can take out 5-10, and that is where the fun and skill comes from that playstyle.

I strictly play none CP PvP - so bear that in mind.

It's also very difficult for me to imagine 2 people taking out 10 people. Those 10 people would have to be god awful - and I'm talking so bad they play with their elbows while blindfolded or something.

So there is just no way you can realistically "build" to take on 5 + people by yourself. It's just not going to happen assuming those people you are up against are of average intelligence and not severely handicapped in some crippling way.

Now maybe in CP campaigns things are different. To that I can't really say. But in none CP PvP what I said is basically true. It's just a numbers game and that determines the outcome in the vast majority of battles. It's not the skill of the individual player rather it's just which side gangs up more effectively on the other. That is almost always the determining factor.

You can do it in no-CP too, I play both (:

Out of curiosity, what kind of class/build do you use that allows you take on 5+ characters by yourself in none CP PvP? Because that just sounds impossible to me - assuming they are well-played characters and not terrible. So I would love to get some insight on how you go about accomplishing that. I can maybe (and that's a big maybe) handle two well played-damage dealers - but anything over that and I would be toast.