Why are they nerfing dungeons?

mcagatayg · March 2019

Especially old ones like Cradle of Shadows and Bloodroot etc... They are already easy to complete compared to new ones, and they were easy to do with 3 DDs. Now there is no need for a healer.

Maotti · March 2019

They're nerfing them?

SaintSubwayy · March 2019

well....see the bright side, that makes it easier to grind undaunted, cause you'll get stuff like speedrun / HM / nodeath now nearly for free, so extra points towards undaunted skilline

but why they nerf them I dunno....maybe they have a Idea on how to progress with CP changes, and are already wokring on adjustments for the content.

Ladislao · March 2019

Then more people will be able to complete this.

Although I would not call Wolfhunter easier than Wrathstone.

mcagatayg · March 2019

Maotti wrote: »

They're nerfing them?

Check the patch notes, a lot of "decreased damage" in dungeon section...

Vildebill · March 2019

The bull in bloodroot got a big nerf. Sad, since almost all extra damage could be avoided by just following mechanics.

KhajiitFelix · March 2019

To make them possible for PvPers because they complain that they are too hard.

Maotti · March 2019

mcagatayg wrote: »

Maotti wrote: »

They're nerfing them?

Check the patch notes, a lot of "decreased damage" in dungeon section...

Yeah i see it now. I wasn't aware the patch notes were already out.

Namarkas · March 2019

Just wow. Some changes here that completly remove any interesting stuff some fights had to offer.
Dungeons

White Gold Tower
Planar Inhibitor
Heat Stroke will now be fully cleansed from a player that disrupts the Inhibitor Pinion.
Heat Stroke now correctly appear as a debuff, and no longer stacks beyond 12.
Fixed an issue with the visual effects for Heat Stroke not appearing correctly.
The Inhibitor Pinion now reactivates faster after interacting with it.
Your character will no longer suffer a stacking snare during Daedric Catastrophe when being chased by the Planar Inhibitor.
Added a targeting telegraph to the player that the Planar Inhibitor is chasing during Daedric Catastrophe.
Increased the time it takes for Plane Meld Rifts to summon the first Dremora.
Plane Meld Rifts now only summon a single Dremora total.
Magma Diver and Cataclysmic Geyser can now be dodged.
Updated various telegraphs to be more visible and informative.

I mean what is left in that encounter after this? it's just another boring "tank takes it" boss

Drako_Ei · March 2019

Im really mad about the Plannar nerf, it used to be one of my favourites to tank, now its just garbage.

One shots for the dps still exist (instead of 80k it will be 60k now), but why remove the pressure from the tank? Healers will be more useless than ever, other than DPS buffing machines

LiraTaurwen · March 2019

Sad to see these changes too, I didn't even get the chance to try them on veteran mode yet and now they have been nerfed

Thevampirenight · March 2019

Well if they make them easier for casuel/Roleplayers like me. Maybe they could add a elite mode for those that like it hardcore hard. While leaving all the skins and personalities in vet mode. Maybe give special titles for elite mode! And allow Casuels a chance of getting the personalities and skins.

chris211 · March 2019

mcagatayg wrote: »

Especially old ones like Cradle of Shadows and Bloodroot etc... They are already easy to complete compared to new ones, and they were easy to do with 3 DDs. Now there is no need for a healer.

cus pugs be pugs

Rikumaru · March 2019

Because of some entitled people who believe they should be able to complete every single piece of content in the game without actually working to improve at the game. Welcome to gaming in 2019.

Vildebill · March 2019

It's laughable to think back of when White Gold Tower launched in 2015. I completed the dungeon on launch day, and since then there has been a lot of nerfs on the dungeon itself, plus a lot of champion points, new OP sets and stuff that's raised the DPS ceiling tremendously. And yet this dungeon needs a nerf three and a half years later.

If you aren't able to complete this dungeon, the content is not the problem. Not even remotely close.

Tyrion87 · March 2019

Yep, I am very disappointed with today's patch.

They erased these mechanics that were making particular bosses interesting and unique.

Like the Galchobar - now without stone atros (?!) and with shalks with decreased health and damage from their lava balls (it already could be shielded...)?!

Planar Inhibitor without a stacking snare during the blue phase?! (this boss is already nuked by many but still.... for weaker groups they just deleted the unique mechanic with touching the pinion in turns)

And nerfing the boss in MoS without even fixing the bug with fighting him outside the room....

They literally tell us: our 4-man content does not need a healer anymore.

code65536 · March 2019

What. The. Hell?!

Removed the Stone Atronachs from the encounter.
Heat Stroke will now be fully cleansed from a player that disrupts the Inhibitor Pinion.
Your character will no longer suffer a stacking snare during Daedric Catastrophe when being chased by the Planar Inhibitor.

Left4Daud · March 2019

Has to be based on their completion metrics for the relevant fights.

Some interesting nerfs.

Tasear · March 2019

There's a lot of damage reduction...and healers aren't needed in non-dlc maybe this is nail in coffin? ⚰️

Maybe this all planned for cp adjustment? I really don't understand though.

LiraTaurwen · March 2019

Tasear wrote: »

There's a lot of damage reduction...and healers aren't needed in non-dlc maybe this is nail in coffin? ⚰️

Maybe this all planned for cp adjustment? I really don't understand though.

Yea this got me worried for the future since I'm playing an healer. Can't understand the reasoning behind these changes, hopefully it has something to do with the cp adjustment but I'm afraid it's just because people are always complaining and asking for easier dungeons

Tyrion87 · March 2019

Tasear wrote: »

There's a lot of damage reduction...and healers aren't needed in non-dlc maybe this is nail in coffin? ⚰️

Maybe this all planned for cp adjustment? I really don't understand though.

Well, if it is some sort of preparation for CP adjustments, then it should come with these adjustments, not now.

Todays nerfs just make all these fights nuke-and-forget type of fights

John_Falstaff · March 2019

Somewhat disappointing.

But some bullet points I can frankly understand. Planar Inhibitor is a tedious and wipe-prone fight if done by the book, probably by majority of groups, and I can imagine dungeon starting with a question: do we have enough damage to nuke Inhibitor? If that filters out a lot of damage dealers, definitely something had to be done (except maybe the right course would've been to prevent the nuke instead of making non-nuke way easier ^^).

mcagatayg · March 2019

Tasear wrote: »

There's a lot of damage reduction...and healers aren't needed in non-dlc maybe this is nail in coffin? ⚰️

Maybe this all planned for cp adjustment? I really don't understand though.

No need to nerf content, even if we lose dps and some defense, player will adapt anyway. This just sucks imo.

siddique · March 2019

This is what you get for constantly moaning about nerfing this or that.

Wolfahm · March 2019

TBH you don't NEED healers for ANY DLC 4 mans before these nerfs. you don't even NEED a healer for 4 man arenas....

esoRevan · March 2019

they might as well replace the bosses with target dummys

Wolfahm · March 2019

vet and HM should be a goal for newer players not a "right" .. you can already 3 ( sometimes 4 DPS ) every 4 man in the game. It is even most times "safer" to do so since you skip most mechs.

Tasear · March 2019

mcagatayg wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

There's a lot of damage reduction...and healers aren't needed in non-dlc maybe this is nail in coffin? ⚰️

Maybe this all planned for cp adjustment? I really don't understand though.

No need to nerf content, even if we lose dps and some defense, player will adapt anyway. This just sucks imo.

Yeah it's just very strange... like usual I am understanding but a lot of dungeons where hit hard with these changes.

r34lian · March 2019

Well this is a good step afterall it's not a souls game and those vet content were being completed only by a minority of playerbase like 2 or 3% which isn't good for playerbase nor the company , most of dlc dungeons were useless cause only high level elitist are able to complete but now it might be for the rest of audience as well!

Wolfahm · March 2019

Soul19reaper wrote: »

Well this is a good step afterall it's not a souls game and those vet content were being completed only by a minority of playerbase like 2 or 3% which isn't good for playerbase nor the company , most of dlc dungeons were useless cause only high level elitist are able to complete but now it might be for the rest of audience as well!

then practices.. and do normal.

code65536 · March 2019

Wolfahm wrote: »

vet and HM should be a goal for newer players not a "right" .. you can already 3 ( sometimes 4 DPS ) every 4 man in the game. It is even most times "safer" to do so since you skip most mechs.

Okay, I'm going to play devil's advocate here.

The whole "healer won't be needed anymore" thing is a red herring. The two fights that got the heaviest nerfs are Planar and Bull. In either of these cases, the things that are nerfed are things that a healer won't have helped you with anyway. Every experienced group (the kind that would go healerless) just straight burn Planar without ever cycling the pinion, so the pinion change doesn't affect them. Getting caught during the blue phase is a guaranteed death that cannot be saved with healing so the snare change just means if I'm PUGing I can handle blue phase solo without relying on the puglets to grab the pinion to save me. (Plus, it's not a very intuitive mechanic--I've spent a lot of keystrokes trying to explain how it works.)

For the bull boss, if you fail to kill the stone atronachs quickly enough, they will wipe you, and a healer will at most buy you a few extra seconds.

So, in practical terms, what actually changed with respect to healer need? Nothing.

So why were these changes made? Well, whenever I queue for a random vet and get Bloodroot and see the blue portal at the entrance, it's always been the bull boss. Same thing with vWGT. If I get queued into a half-completed instance, I already know exactly where that blue portal is going to take me.

The final bosses weren't heavily nerfed. The Hard Modes weren't touched. I suspect ZOS thinks that this makes for a better progression of difficulty through the dungeon.