Emmagoldman wrote: »

So changes are going live as is or its in pts...very different

In the history of this game - no its not different at all. I think OP is jumping the gun with doom and gloom - but everybody should be aware at this point, after all these years, that PTS is just a glorified demo of the live build. They almost never change anything from PTS even with overwhelming feedback.

We need to stop pretending PTS actually functions as it is intended to, it simply doesn't happen like that.

Sabbathius wrote: »

You can't begrudge ZOS making some extra money off of folks. I mean, that's what this change is all about - to get people to fork over 3,000-3,500 crowns, per character. That's all this is. It's not about balance, it's about additional money injection into the game.

Oh really? Because so many people are going to buy race change tokens now.

Frozen_Heart246 wrote: »

Vhozek wrote: »

I really don't want High Elves to somehow regenerate Stamina and Dark Elves to lose Flame Damage. Dark Elves are literally High Elves but with Stamina points, so why the hell are High Elves getting this?

^this

The biggest Joke is, that even a Khajiit (!!) outperforms a Dunmer on Mag NB now. Not by much... but bb lore, bb Telvanni, bb Dunmer

Bouldercleave wrote: »

lagrue wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

The funniest part of this whole thing is that this is something that WE asked for, begged for, and DEMANDED for months.
Well boys and girls - they listened and you got exactly what you all asked for.
We as a community are an absolute hilarious tragedy.

Logical fallacy. Not everybody in the community asks for the same things. I understand ZOS can't address everybody individually but what you're saying is just a tad silly. This guy may have never asked for or wanted racial passive changes.

I know I never asked for it (not that I care anyway.) We as a community aren't a communist society, we don't share one communal idea.

Logical fallacy my lily white ass. This has been asked for for months if not years. He and you may not have asked for it individually, but it has definitely been a HUGE topic of conversation.

By how many people? Any metrics outside of "dozens of threads?" Do you have any concrete evidence what % of the community of this game (including off forums) wanted this?

Yes, it is a logical fallacy. You are pinning results on somebody who never asked for them because other people did, it makes no sense.

You're ridiculing somebody for nothing.

I welcome the changes. Hopefully they can give CP the same treatment too.

Bouldercleave wrote: »

lagrue wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

lagrue wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

The funniest part of this whole thing is that this is something that WE asked for, begged for, and DEMANDED for months.
Well boys and girls - they listened and you got exactly what you all asked for.
We as a community are an absolute hilarious tragedy.

Logical fallacy. Not everybody in the community asks for the same things. I understand ZOS can't address everybody individually but what you're saying is just a tad silly. This guy may have never asked for or wanted racial passive changes.

I know I never asked for it (not that I care anyway.) We as a community aren't a communist society, we don't share one communal idea.

Logical fallacy my lily white ass. This has been asked for for months if not years. He and you may not have asked for it individually, but it has definitely been a HUGE topic of conversation.

By how many people? Any metrics outside of "dozens of threads?" Do you have any concrete evidence what % of the community of this game (including off forums) wanted this?

Yes, it is a logical fallacy. You are pinning results on somebody who never asked for them because other people did, it makes no sense.

You're ridiculing somebody for nothing.

I don't need metrics, percentages, or concrete evidence to support my statement, because I simply don't care enough. The fact that you are demanding this kinda "data" pretty much proves my point.


Personally, I just want to watch the world burn.

It doesn't prove anything except that you ramble on about things and accuse people of things without providing the proof... which the burden is placed on you when you make a claim.

"I don't care" is a nice tactic though, it's always fun to watch people abandon their positions after being called out.

Speak to you later, comrade.

TO bad argonians wont much be able to experience breathing underwater...

Bouldercleave wrote: »

The funniest part of this whole thing is that this is something that WE asked for, begged for, and DEMANDED for months.

There are dozens of threads pushing for the racial passives to be reworked, eliminated, or "balanced".



Well boys and girls - they listened and you got exactly what you all asked for. Now people are nerd rage quitting because the races have been re balanced and mean less then they did. What did you think was going to happen?

We complain when they don't fix something, and we complain when they do. And to top it all off, we complain when they don't respond to each and every individual complaint.

We as a community are an absolute hilarious tragedy. It's like a train wreck of biblical proportions that we all have a front row seat to. Don't get me wrong - I am 100% included in the train wreck and sometimes, just SOMETIMES - I'm the conductor...

If I ask you to change your underwear because you smell like pee, it doesnt mean you get to change it to one that smells like poop and say I can never be happy.

Bouldercleave wrote: »

The funniest part of this whole thing is that this is something that WE asked for, begged for, and DEMANDED for months.

There are dozens of threads pushing for the racial passives to be reworked, eliminated, or "balanced".



Well boys and girls - they listened and you got exactly what you all asked for. Now people are nerd rage quitting because the races have been re balanced and mean less then they did. What did you think was going to happen?

We complain when they don't fix something, and we complain when they do. And to top it all off, we complain when they don't respond to each and every individual complaint.

We as a community are an absolute hilarious tragedy. It's like a train wreck of biblical proportions that we all have a front row seat to. Don't get me wrong - I am 100% included in the train wreck and sometimes, just SOMETIMES - I'm the conductor...

Aka the vocal minority complained and now the non vocal majority are mad.

Vhozek wrote: »

At least that's what it looks like since they're live on the PTS.
I don't think I want to keep playing this game. I haven't launched it in like 4 days.
I really don't want High Elves to somehow regenerate Stamina and Dark Elves to lose Flame Damage. Dark Elves are literally High Elves but with Stamina points, so why the hell are High Elves getting this?

Can I have your stuff?

Of course they're going through to be tested. That's what is happening. And of course most of these will go through as they are, though perhaps each race will have some slight tweaking.

The big ones for me are:

Altmer sustain mechanic should go to dunmer, if dunmer are going to be hybrids, then commit. Why even refer to stamina in the case of altmer?

Orcs should be more resilient. Devs argued now they do more damage, they should be less tough, but we've already got khajiit if we want pure damage output. Respect orc-lore.

Argonians got whomped - a flat nerf across the board despite the fact that all they needed was a resourceful downgrade, no one was compaining about the excess heals, or the resistances. I see plenty of lizards die in Cyrodiil. And lore-wise they eat poison for fun. Their damage output is pathetic. Now they only have 4% healing, down from 5%, and 5% self heal is gone. I'd be curious to know what that 4% healing is like compared to 258 spell damage, which works for offence and defence.

Bosmer got stealth detect, which is beyond useless. I agree stealth damage had to go, it was cheese. Give em stealth speed or something mildly useful. Speed boost after dodge roll will be ultimate cheese in PvP, cmon.

If ZOS are going to talk about mathematical equality, do hybrid passives get counted as a part of the total sum? What good does weapon damage do a dunmer who is specced for magic. What good does spell crit do a Khajiit specced for stamina. But if those stats are included in the comparison between races, they are paying extra for no benefit.

Race passives should be meaningful, flavourful and interesting. They don't make or break a character's performance, but this is a role-playing game. Altmer are magical, Redguard are physical. If you want to play a lore-breaking character, go for it, I love you, you strange bird. But this collection of changes put together by ZOS are all over the shop and frankly pointless for the most part. All we needed was Nord buff, Argo tune, and Khajiit spell crit.

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

nsmurfer wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=c-HGXW_B7EE

Where is the comparison with Altmer or a Breton there? just a Khajiit magicka build DPS test. It is not self-buffed either. And, it is not multiple tests either to find the mean either. Statistics does not work that way.

It helps to read the comments section of a video sometimes...

Other tests are all there. The DPS range is given for each set of tests (they ran a series for every race, not just one test).

And you never test self-buffed if you want to compare different things. You want to see what your DPS will be like in a group setting since all endgame content is done in groups.

welp if they go through with these changes it will literally be the last day I log in.

Stupidity will kill this game as its been going through that path. And trust me, I aint the only one thats going to be leaving. There will be a mass migration, you can count on it.

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Bouldercleave wrote: »

The funniest part of this whole thing is that this is something that WE asked for, begged for, and DEMANDED for months.

There are dozens of threads pushing for the racial passives to be reworked, eliminated, or "balanced".



Well boys and girls - they listened and you got exactly what you all asked for. Now people are nerd rage quitting because the races have been re balanced and mean less then they did. What did you think was going to happen?

We complain when they don't fix something, and we complain when they do. And to top it all off, we complain when they don't respond to each and every individual complaint.

We as a community are an absolute hilarious tragedy. It's like a train wreck of biblical proportions that we all have a front row seat to. Don't get me wrong - I am 100% included in the train wreck and sometimes, just SOMETIMES - I'm the conductor...

In other words..... be VERY careful what you ask for, as you might actually get it?

We didn't ask for this tho. Racial passives were shifted around but not balanced or reworked and then compiled with more nerfs that no one wanted.