Oh by the way, it looks like the collector's edition bag controversy got even worse.

The "influencers", as in the folks who get the free stuff to promote the game on their youtube channels, got real canvas ones. That's some serious salt in the wound after their previous attempt to appease everyone with five bucks worth of in game currency.

Bethesda is now in full damage control mode, on their hands and knees begging for forgiveness and promising to send out genuine canvas bags to their customers.

Vahrokh wrote: »

CyrusAntivirus wrote: »

Did you ever played other games? Try litlle of wow and you will see what they done to it,a *** slot machine,you play dungeon for 40min and finaly open chest at end and get nothing

On the contrary, since ZOS hired the "crown store marketing gurus" it's becoming pure nickel and dime.

Come on, "Gift crown store stuff and get a pet"?

Imagine if ZOS put 1/100, just 1/100 of their gargantuan crown store efforts into fixing their game. Just a bit.

This was one of the predicted outcomes when they announced the Crown Store, and later, Crown Crates. When a major source of revenue, which I assume Crowns are, is not tied to the game itself, then I see the only reason for the studio to invest in the game is altruism and attracting people so they buy Crowns. Altruism does not exist in US corporate culture. The second can be accomplished by quarterly DLC, which only need to be good enough to attract attention.

Anyway... That's the prediction from 2015 and 2016. Time will tell.

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

Hiring 20 or 30 more troubleshooters would cost them less than losing 1% of ESO+ subscribers.

I doubt your numbers reflect reality, but if they hired an additional 20-30 troubleshooters, I figure they would be assigned to Game 2, not ESO. Game 2 is the future of ZOS, not ESO. Putting a major investment into ESO would be encouraging, but this game is already mature.

Vahrokh wrote: »

Why are Fallout players so much more vocal and effective than ESO players?

As you might probably know, Fallout is not exactly scoring well...SNIP

They aren't. It's apples and oranges.

The launch of this game vs. the launch of FO76 were very very different. This game had more than its share of issues, had a lot of complaints, has been losing players since the start (they've just done well at constantly gaining new players as well). But not nearly on the level of FO76. And even then, ZoS still has made a ton of changes to keep the game successful, like One Tamriel and a variety of other improvements.

ESO is also very much an MMO, it's a different beast. Sure you had plenty of Skyrim players that were expecting Skyrim online and upset that it was different, but FO76 was very much built to literally be like FO4 online. Not just capture the same players attention, but to be exactly that. ESO used a completely different engine, different mechanics, builds, etc. (They even added stuff like first person after players complained no first person wasn't ES enough). FO76 was a flat FO4 port with all the work done into just making multi-player work on their existing engine (which is probably why not enough work went into other parts of the game).

ESO had its own unique sets of bugs and issues, where-as FO76 had bugs that were known for several volumes of games going back to FO4, Skyrim, FO3, etc. - bugs fixed in unofficial mod patches where Bethesda could have literally looked at existing mod patches to fix a laundry list of bugs that they were too lazy to do.

The main thing that has helped Bethesda over the years isn't just "they made a good game so we can look past the bugs", but also the mods - not just adding stuff, but being able to add needed fixes and not wait for a patch, or to open console and fix something and go on with your game. I knew without either of those abilities FO76 would not succeed as a Bethesda game the way their earlier ones had (and that's not even counting the other issues).

And outside of the buggy mess, FO76 just isn't a great game. It has some good parts, but as a whole, just doesn't offer as much playability as ESO does and combined with the technical issues don't make a great outcome.

I also think ZoS has done a better job of communicating with fans than Bethesda ever has. Bethesda might "Peter Molyneaux" the heck out of a game announcement vs. ZoS when we watch big events, but it ends there. We've seen them saying they will make a bigger effort to communicate, but are still coming up short. You can't run an online game and be as closed door as Bethesda usually is (even if it is a different wing of BGS in Austin doing the game, they seem to have that same bad habit of slow to communicate). So all those pissed off FO76 players got nothing for their complaints vs. the back and forth ZoS was giving players from launch (even if we were still upset changes were slow or wanted more communication). And now got a half hearted apology and a promise to fix a few of the bugs within the next few weeks.

Don't get me wrong. ZoS/ESO still has its issues with bugs and balance and stability, but it's not the fans reacting differently to the same problems. It's the different scale of problems. That being said, ESO does need to take a look in the mirror so they don't become a min version of FO76 and get issues with game balance, server stability, and micro-transaction overkill under control. Hopefully they don't get over focused on their next project and only let ESO be good enough to stay afloat until that one is ready.

lordrichter wrote: »

Vahrokh wrote: »

CyrusAntivirus wrote: »

Did you ever played other games? Try litlle of wow and you will see what they done to it,a *** slot machine,you play dungeon for 40min and finaly open chest at end and get nothing

On the contrary, since ZOS hired the "crown store marketing gurus" it's becoming pure nickel and dime.

Come on, "Gift crown store stuff and get a pet"?

Imagine if ZOS put 1/100, just 1/100 of their gargantuan crown store efforts into fixing their game. Just a bit.

This was one of the predicted outcomes when they announced the Crown Store, and later, Crown Crates. When a major source of revenue, which I assume Crowns are, is not tied to the game itself, then I see the only reason for the studio to invest in the game is altruism and attracting people so they buy Crowns. Altruism does not exist in US corporate culture. The second can be accomplished by quarterly DLC, which only need to be good enough to attract attention.

Anyway... That's the prediction from 2015 and 2016. Time will tell.

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

Hiring 20 or 30 more troubleshooters would cost them less than losing 1% of ESO+ subscribers.

I doubt your numbers reflect reality, but if they hired an additional 20-30 troubleshooters, I figure they would be assigned to Game 2, not ESO. Game 2 is the future of ZOS, not ESO. Putting a major investment into ESO would be encouraging, but this game is already mature.

We warned people. Myself and a mere handful of others were in every thread warning everyone what was going to happen with the announcement of crates. Less and less resources were going to be used towards the game and less actual game content would be focused on. Everything we said was going to happen has happened.

Glurin wrote: »

Oh by the way, it looks like the collector's edition bag controversy got even worse.

The "influencers", as in the folks who get the free stuff to promote the game on their youtube channels, got real canvas ones. That's some serious salt in the wound after their previous attempt to appease everyone with five bucks worth of in game currency.

Bethesda is now in full damage control mode, on their hands and knees begging for forgiveness and promising to send out genuine canvas bags to their customers.

Oh jeez- yeah that definitely doesn’t sound good.
I’m laughing though because I bought a Molag bal statue off amazon- just the statue- I love it but idk if it should’ve been $120-

NBrookus wrote: »

Played the FO76 beta with a free code. ESO is in a way better state than this, if only because ESO knows what kind of game it wants to be. FO76 is a bunch of new ideas for sandbox/survival games looking for the ones that stick. We didn't need an ARK clone, so I'll give them credit for trying new stuff. But there's only so long you can kill radioactive roaches and collect trash. I got bored really fast.

It's not a survival game: survival aspects are trivial and nothing bad happens if you die.

As a sandbox, it's limited. You can't change the world in any meaningful way. You can't get to know your neighbors and establish trade or RP or run a business, because next time you log in you don't know what server you'll be on.

In a game that has huge potential to be Fallout with Friends, it's hard to connect with anyone. You can't make a clan and pool resources nor build a permanent base together.

I was pretty glad I didn't play $60 for it.

ESO still has bugs from 5 years ago, FO76 literally just came out last month.

Cpt_Teemo wrote: »

Salvas_Aren wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAHX_foGYHA

Found it by accident, jump to 6:24.

Not only that but the FTC is looking to shut down loot boxes for good I think in online gaming

Hey ZoS ya gunna put out the Storm Atro Crates before this happens?