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Ice Hearth and shield Changes?

Drygon
Drygon
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Ice hearth was was more of a novelty choice, and seeing that shields got nerfed by beeing critable now shouldn't this set require a look at?

In pvp for example if the new cap is 40% max HP, will this set provide the full shield bonus now?
And even so, shield can get crit and this set is clearly aimed for magicka dps yet all it provides is the critical bonus and some small aoe dps that will dissapear the moment the shield goes down.

Can the dmg proc be separated from the shield? Or should it get reworked?
  • codestripper
    codestripper
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    Drygon wrote: »
    Ice hearth was was more of a novelty choice, and seeing that shields got nerfed by beeing critable now shouldn't this set require a look at?

    In pvp for example if the new cap is 40% max HP, will this set provide the full shield bonus now?
    And even so, shield can get crit and this set is clearly aimed for magicka dps yet all it provides is the critical bonus and some small aoe dps that will dissapear the moment the shield goes down.

    Can the dmg proc be separated from the shield? Or should it get reworked?

    The only reason i've ever seen someone use this set in a PvE senario is on a stamina character in vMA to provide extra survivability. I really don't even see why you'd want to use it anywhere else...
    Since everyone seems to be doing this,
    DPS Builds:
    - Magicka Sorcerer (Pet) [Flawless Conqueror @ 565CP] - 582k
    - Magicka Nightblade [Flawless Conqueror @ 780CP] - 575k
    - Stamina Sorcerer [Flawless Conqueror @ 420CP] - 560k
    - Magicka Classless [Flawless Conqueror @ 810CP] - 540k
    - Magicka Templar [Stormproof] - 550k
    - Magicka Warden [Stormproof] - 510k
    - Stamina Templar [In Development]
    - Stamina DK [In Development]
    - Stamina NB [Under 50]
  • Volckodav
    Volckodav
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    Drygon wrote: »
    Ice hearth was was more of a novelty choice, and seeing that shields got nerfed by beeing critable now shouldn't this set require a look at?

    In pvp for example if the new cap is 40% max HP, will this set provide the full shield bonus now?
    And even so, shield can get crit and this set is clearly aimed for magicka dps yet all it provides is the critical bonus and some small aoe dps that will dissapear the moment the shield goes down.

    Can the dmg proc be separated from the shield? Or should it get reworked?

    The only reason i've ever seen someone use this set in a PvE senario is on a stamina character in vMA to provide extra survivability. I really don't even see why you'd want to use it anywhere else...

    Actually I was using it for my frost warden mage theme, but more from a lore/max ice skill and procs that from a prductive point of view
  • Drygon
    Drygon
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    Drygon wrote: »
    Ice hearth was was more of a novelty choice, and seeing that shields got nerfed by beeing critable now shouldn't this set require a look at?

    In pvp for example if the new cap is 40% max HP, will this set provide the full shield bonus now?
    And even so, shield can get crit and this set is clearly aimed for magicka dps yet all it provides is the critical bonus and some small aoe dps that will dissapear the moment the shield goes down.

    Can the dmg proc be separated from the shield? Or should it get reworked?

    The only reason i've ever seen someone use this set in a PvE senario is on a stamina character in vMA to provide extra survivability. I really don't even see why you'd want to use it anywhere else...

    I know that, when i used this set it was only for the shield, and i really wanna know what it will happen with it now that shields are crittable.

    Still they should either fix the dmg component to actualy make it usefull or remove it and buff the set making it a real defensive set.
  • John_Falstaff
    John_Falstaff
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    I'm all for making this set a more versatile defensive one. It's incredibly useful for stamina in places like vMA.
  • Mystrius_Archaion
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    The 40% cap on shield is not applying to sets, just the sorcerer and light armor specific shield skills.
    It's not stopping stacking of shields, yet at least.

    We don't yet know the exact wording and application of this shield cap, but it would definitely kill some shields that purposefully provide well over that in a single shield if it were applied to all. Thankfully, it is not applying to all shields.

    Also, Ice Heart is actually better in PVE because npc monsters don't crit players and it benefits from resistance now so lasts longer and mitigates more overall.
    Edited by Mystrius_Archaion on September 28, 2018 5:39AM
  • WrathOfInnos
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    Ice Heart is about to be a lot more useful after the shield nerfs. It will make up some of the defense we are losing.
  • Drygon
    Drygon
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    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.
  • Mystrius_Archaion
    Mystrius_Archaion
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    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.
  • Drygon
    Drygon
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    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    Ohhh, ok, i get it, and what about battle spirit? Do you presume it will affect Ice Hearth?
    Edited by Drygon on September 28, 2018 6:38AM
  • Mystrius_Archaion
    Mystrius_Archaion
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    Drygon wrote: »
    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    Ohhh, ok, i get it, and what about battle spirit? Do you presume it will affect Ice Hearth?

    I have no idea about that part. I would assume same as it is on live.
  • olsborg
    olsborg
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    Id love for the majority of sets (mostly old ones) to get a complete revamp.
    Altmer Sorceror, magicka
    Bosmer Nightblade, stamina.
    Imperial Templar, stamina
    Redguard Warden, stamina

    Aldmeri Dominion!
    PC EU
    PvP only
  • Biro123
    Biro123
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    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    You're wrong.
    Minalan owes me a beer.

    PC EU Megaserver
    Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
    Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
    Aidee - Magsorc - DC
    Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
    Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.
  • Flaminir
    Flaminir
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    Biro123 wrote: »
    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    You're wrong.
    Drummerx04 wrote: »
    Okay, I appreciate the overall direction... but 40% of my health bar on a 24k sorc shield? So Basically why run hardened ward because I'll always be so far over the health cap?

    Is this 40% for ALL shields stacking or just each shield individually?
    Shields still stack the same way as before. We didn't change that behavior. The health-based cap is applied per individual shield.
    EU/EP
    Sorcerer Flaminir (Magicka) / Staminir (Stamina)
    Sorcerer Idalliin 'The Wrobel-ator' build crit tank!
    Templar Elixiia (Magicka/Healer) / Lotti Velooni (Magicka)
    DragonKnight Xalora Flaminar (Tank) / Unholy-Dragon-Toad (Tank)
    Nightblade Aimee Owlious (Magicka) / Myttens (Stamina)
    Warden: Frosti-Tute (Magicka/Healer) Great-Big-Frog (Stamina/Tank)
  • Biro123
    Biro123
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    Flaminir wrote: »
    Biro123 wrote: »
    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    You're wrong.
    Drummerx04 wrote: »
    Okay, I appreciate the overall direction... but 40% of my health bar on a 24k sorc shield? So Basically why run hardened ward because I'll always be so far over the health cap?

    Is this 40% for ALL shields stacking or just each shield individually?
    Shields still stack the same way as before. We didn't change that behavior. The health-based cap is applied per individual shield.

    Where was that stated?
    Minalan owes me a beer.

    PC EU Megaserver
    Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
    Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
    Aidee - Magsorc - DC
    Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
    Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.
  • Flaminir
    Flaminir
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    Rob Garret posted it as a follow up to the class rep meeting notes a few hours ago... click on the dev tracker link at the top of the screen is probably the quickest way to get to it.
    EU/EP
    Sorcerer Flaminir (Magicka) / Staminir (Stamina)
    Sorcerer Idalliin 'The Wrobel-ator' build crit tank!
    Templar Elixiia (Magicka/Healer) / Lotti Velooni (Magicka)
    DragonKnight Xalora Flaminar (Tank) / Unholy-Dragon-Toad (Tank)
    Nightblade Aimee Owlious (Magicka) / Myttens (Stamina)
    Warden: Frosti-Tute (Magicka/Healer) Great-Big-Frog (Stamina/Tank)
  • Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
    Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
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    Biro123 wrote: »
    Flaminir wrote: »
    Biro123 wrote: »
    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    You're wrong.
    Drummerx04 wrote: »
    Okay, I appreciate the overall direction... but 40% of my health bar on a 24k sorc shield? So Basically why run hardened ward because I'll always be so far over the health cap?

    Is this 40% for ALL shields stacking or just each shield individually?
    Shields still stack the same way as before. We didn't change that behavior. The health-based cap is applied per individual shield.

    Where was that stated?

    Click on @ZOS_RobGarrett and go through his history. It is right there.
  • Waffennacht
    Waffennacht
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    If nothing really changes, Ice heart suddenly becomes a very viable option for PvE
    Gamer tag: DasPanzerKat NA Xbox One
    1300+ CP
    Battleground PvP'er

    Waffennacht' Builds
  • ccmedaddy
    ccmedaddy
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    Iceheart is already amazing for PvE. It's how I "cheesed" Flawless on a couple of mag charcs that I don't really play that much lol. :tongue:
  • Mystrius_Archaion
    Mystrius_Archaion
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    Biro123 wrote: »
    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    You're wrong.

    Looks like I was right.

    Everybody would have seen the obvious answer I saw in what they said if they hadn't jumped to conclusions:
    giphy.webp
  • Biro123
    Biro123
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    Biro123 wrote: »
    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    You're wrong.

    Looks like I was right.

    Everybody would have seen the obvious answer I saw in what they said if they hadn't jumped to conclusions:
    giphy.webp

    Not the way it was worded. You just had a lucky mis-interpretation of something that was incorrectly written.
    Minalan owes me a beer.

    PC EU Megaserver
    Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
    Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
    Aidee - Magsorc - DC
    Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
    Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.
  • Mystrius_Archaion
    Mystrius_Archaion
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    Biro123 wrote: »
    Biro123 wrote: »
    Drygon wrote: »
    That is why I asked because if it remains as it is and not affected by battelspirit it would be a great set now, if they tune it down it will become unusable as it already tries to do two things and if the shield goes down, seeing that the dmg is tied to the shield there will be no point in using it.

    But if they leave it as it is, in some builds it could easly offer shields that hit the 40% cap.

    There is no "40% shield cap".
    There is a "Conjured Ward is capped at 40% of player health" and "Annulment is capped at 40% of player health" in the rep meeting notes, which means those 2 can still stack to 80% of player health.
    Every other shield is not capped any different than on live servers.

    You're wrong.

    Looks like I was right.

    Everybody would have seen the obvious answer I saw in what they said if they hadn't jumped to conclusions:
    giphy.webp

    Not the way it was worded. You just had a lucky mis-interpretation of something that was incorrectly written.

    No.
    I correctly inferred, based on logic, that they wouldn't destroy the skills like Barrier and Magma Armor and Bone Shield's synergy and the Hardening Enchantment and the passive Psijic damage shield and nearly every other shield that obviously would stack very often by making such a change.
    I also paid attention to the fact that they were specifically talking about Conjured Ward and Annulment which were also the only ones that got cast times because none of the other damage shields were problems that were even nerfed. The closest thing any other damage shield got to a nerf was Healing Ward losing the first heal.

    Seriously, it was soooo obvious that they were only capping Conjured Ward and Annulment and per shield not "total stackked shields" because they couldn't do it any other way that would only target those 2 shields.

    It was simply 1+2=3 even if they wrote it like 1 + II = three, which is a number plus roman numeral equals english word(which is gibberish to those who don't know english).
    Edited by Mystrius_Archaion on September 30, 2018 3:06AM
  • Biro123
    Biro123
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    But it isn't 1+2=3, is it. The 1 and 2 are completely independent.
    Apologies for thinking that when they say 1+2=3, they mean 1+2=3, instead meaning of 1<3 and 2<3.
    I obviously must get better at assumptions rather than sticking to the presented information.
    Minalan owes me a beer.

    PC EU Megaserver
    Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
    Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
    Aidee - Magsorc - DC
    Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
    Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.
  • Mystrius_Archaion
    Mystrius_Archaion
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    Biro123 wrote: »
    But it isn't 1+2=3, is it. The 1 and 2 are completely independent.
    Apologies for thinking that when they say 1+2=3, they mean 1+2=3, instead meaning of 1<3 and 2<3.
    I obviously must get better at assumptions rather than sticking to the presented information.

    It's not "assumptions"; it's "understanding meaning" which is the basis of language.

    I read as if I hear it, since text has no "tone of voice". For example, a person can type/say "that was rough" which could mean "difficult" or "physically scaly" or "emotionally negative" or other things.

    We, as intelligent humans, are always interpreting things that are not perfect ever, even without needing to translate from the original language to the reader's native language.

    FYI, my native language is English and thus what they posted was obvious to me knowing how we English speakers talk and write. I then applied that to their past posts including their posted reasons for the changes that they were now changing to add up to the only possible answer that I came to which they later confirmed was correct.

    Stop defending your mistake that made them "dumb down" their explanation, so you could understand, and use this as a lesson in how to interpret them properly in the future.
    This is a learning moment.
    Edited by Mystrius_Archaion on October 1, 2018 3:43AM
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