Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Carve/Brawler is a decent spammable. It needs a pretty significant buff though.

Lose the slow bleed, increase the burst point of impact damage.

Buffing Brawler is a good idea, more balanced too. Good suggestion

HankTwo wrote: »

I already wrote this elsewhere but I'll write it again:

Imo, dizzying swing shouldn't break animation just because the target 'bumps' into you. The cast should continue as long as the target stays in the 7m radius of the skill. Wrecking blow on the other hand needs a bigger change, and I like the idea of a morph with no cast time but reduced damage.

agreed on the going through part, getting out of range should be the only counter to this already clunky skill

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

I agree that Dizzying Swing and Wrecking Blow are both outdated skills in the current state of the game, but would you rather have them reworked, or obtain more convincing offensive stamina morphs for sorc, warden, and DK?

if Wrecking blow became a instant spammable, it would help out in making 2h competitive in pve in theory, and would be more viable in pvp as well. Making it a instant spammable would make help give a tool for sorcs, wardens, and dks to use. People who want the cc will stick to dizzying swing anyway

Ectheliontnacil wrote: »

It's a zero skill/high dmg ability, so it should be easily countered.

Also there's a lot of ppl who don't have major issues with dizzying swing, since they've learned how to use the skill correctly.

zero skill? It is the most counterable skill out there and it takes skill to getting it to land against good players. Have you seen two good players try to land dizzying swings on each other? My issues with the skill arose with the speed meta

My only gripe is Wrecking blow, the new LA empower change made the skill useless & instead of changing it to be somewhat similar to what we had before, it just remained the same. I really miss that 20% extra damage when your wrecking blow connected but nowadays there's simply no reason to use that skill whereas dizzing swing still gets it's knock back.

I havn't used this skill in PvP much, but I just thinking... would something like this work?

1. Place a Mages guild rune in front of you (Only used for the stun), or maybe sorc mines, or something similar.
2. Use silver leach to pull enemy on rune. Stunned or immobalized on arrival. (Silver leach does not give CC immunity?)
3. Whack with Wrecking blow.
4. Finish with execute.

Mag skills can often be used for utility, even if you're not really using them for their damage.

Wouldn't Swarm mother/wrecking blow be a great combo against ranged?
Kinda disorienting getting pulled i'm guessing.

Or maybe some tactic similar to that? Pulling and locking them in place long enough to land wrecking?

_Salty_ wrote: »

You can move during the windup to better line it up or even kite your opponent to set up another combo.

You don't have to just stand there waiting for it to go off.

Clearly anyone that has run dizzying swing doesn't stand still, anyone that stands still doesn't know what they are doing

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

I agree that Dizzying Swing and Wrecking Blow are both outdated skills in the current state of the game, but would you rather have them reworked, or obtain more convincing offensive stamina morphs for sorc, warden, and DK?

Personally, I'd rather rework the weapon line skills. It is perfectly fine that some classes do not have a spammable. This is coming from someone that mains mag sorc and stam sorc. There is more than 1 way to pressure an opponent, and this is what gives class offensives their unique identity.

For instance, giving a magsorc a good spammable would require nerfing its burst (or rather not buffing it in its current state). However, in doing so it detracts from the burst identity of magsorcs and forces them to compete with the magblade playstyle. A magblade will always be a better magblade than a mag sorc because the rest of their kit better supports it. A magSorc still applies a significant amount of pressue, but in a different way than a magblade. A magblade is constantly throwing out damage and applies mental pressure with the threat of a Incap+Merciless burst if your health gets too low. A magsorc is all about the mental pressure every 3.5 seconds. The constant threat of being bursted from 100-0 is the magsorcs pressure that forces opponents to turtle up or over extend their offensive to pressure the magsorc.

Stamina sorc is in a weird place due to lack of class identity. It is currently very strong in the speed meta (surprise that the king of mobility excels in a speed meta). Stam DK also lacks strong class identity. however, these classes do not need a spammable similar to Jabs, Surprise Attack or Whip. They need something similar to Deep Breath, Curse or Vampire's Bane--skills players cast in every rotation, not as a spammable but as a means to apply pressure by creating a combat scenario that is favorable to them.

Stam sorc is based around high mobility. Constant movement that optimizes into hit and run tactics in high end PvP. Kind of like a stamblade. Giving the class a spammable turns them into lesser versions of stamblades, because while both have the benefit of choosing favorable engagements, stamblade does it better. Fighting a stamsorc requires opponents to spend resources staying on them or risk the stam sorc Dark Dealing to reset the fight in their favour. Emphasis needs to be placed on punishing players for not being as mobile as a stam sorc, not giving stam sorc a spammable. Stam sorc pressure does not come from direct damage, but from forcing enemy players to keep up or risk all their work being wasted by a single Dark Deal and than being bursted after their defensive buffs drop or having expended all their resources keeping up.

sDK should not be given a spammable. Period. The entire class screams "wear-down your opponent". The skills suggest the class should be DoT based (despite the fact that the DoTs suck) and the artwork variance between mag and stam supports this. MagDK has very flashy and explosive animations that represent the feeling of a constant burn that erupts. Stam Dk animations are more subtle hints of green that indicate a slow, creeping death. The problem is, this slow creeping death is non-existent. StamDKs apply no pressure, either situation-wise or damage-wise. This is why they are the weakest PvP class right now outside of Magden who have neither class identity nor effective offensive skill synergy.

As for Dizzy and WB, turn WB into a spammable for PvE purposes. Dizzy works great if it hits, it just needs some fine tuning to account for the increased lag and mobility. Turning both morphs into a spammable detracts from the 2h combat flow and encroaches on DW. DW will always DW better than 2h. Homogenization is not the way to go.

Dizzying Swing/WB is most useful in small group battles. If your opponent is concentrated on one of your group members it is much much easier to land a DS or WB from the side or behind. If you are outnumbered, well you are screwed.

IMO the biggest nerf to Dizzying Swing came when ZOS changed the whole animation priority a while back (Orsinium or Imperial City?). On console it is very difficult to animation cancel just about any skill. The whole animation of your char following through on a light/heavy attack can really suck.

Personally I hate the style of gameplay you are forced into by using DS as your main damage dealer. Yea it can work at times but god knows how often I accidentally double tap 'X' or whatever and cancel it on myself. Feel like I die more often trying to land the skill as well. As a StamDK using sword and board you can do a better job applying constant pressure to your enemy.

Really wish ZOS would revert to the previous animation priority. Ever since the change, combat mechanics have become clunky, something that has been very detrimental to the game as a whole. This was a direct result of losers QQ animation canceling on forums most of whom are now bitching on Fortnite forums no doubt. I cannot imagine the change was well thought out by ZOS. To change a core mechanic, even with the unintended consequence of animation canceling , is crazy. If combat mechanics feel smooth and consistent; if you can create an edge by making subtle adjustments while working within said mechanics is really what makes certain games mainstays of the gaming world while others are just games you used to play.

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Still think Wrecking Blow should be instant cast with lower dmg.

Dizzy Swing could have a little less cast time but otherwise its not a bad skill if you can land it.

Such a thing exists... It's called cleave.

As was mentioned, the only fix I would like is to have the animation continue when a character bumps through you. Breaking the skill this way is gimicky. The only counters should be roll dodging, out-ranging or stunning the caster mid blow.

As far as the skill being outclassed by speed, I run speed pots myself and combine with a snare. Add in some swift jewelry and you are GTG. The skill is still good but you have to build for it.