Selling crowns for gold is a SCAM and RIPOFF!

JiDul · July 2018

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns. Some people are total rip offs in these games and the fact that this is becoming the market for selling crowns makes me kind of sick. The ESO market is very expensive, things are sold in the thousands, meaning I could go and buy a Motif for 20k or a Ring of something for 40k some stuff goes for the hundred-thousands.. Its unfair that i'm supposed to give you 47 real dollars for an amount of gold that will get me 3 things before i'm broke in game again and have to go and spend 47 more dollars.. on 3 things that are in game and have no use to me outside of this game. Also the amount of people who have 100k in their bank vastly outnumbers the amount of people who own millions of gold. So the market for this is going to continue to drop because people are going to be unwilling to pay so much for crowns and the people who do have the gold to afford it will stop paying so much because the price dropped. Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

redspecter23 · July 2018

If you get offered a bad ratio don't take it and look for a better one. I've seen offers as high as 500g per crown and I'm sure some are offering more than that.

Graydon · July 2018

It’s jusf a game dude.

Keep working.

midgetfromtheshire · July 2018

redspecter23 wrote: »

If you get offered a bad ratio don't take it and look for a better one. I've seen offers as high as 500g per crown and I'm sure some are offering more than that.

^This. If you don't like the exchange rate being offered then move onto the next person.

Graydon · July 2018

Don’t you mean Buying Crowms for Gold is a rip-off??

Colecovision · July 2018

How much gold is a mundus stone?

LadyLavina · July 2018

JiDul wrote: »

Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

Not a chance lol. The market would never bare such an exchange rate.

seipher09 · July 2018

Truth be told as crown items are not pay to win and cosmetic type stuff I see no issue.

I'm broke in the game due to the fact I work a lot. As i work a lot i can simply buy crowns for whatever i need.

Others play a lot thus have more gold then I. If someone wants to pay me gold which I really need for crown store item no ones really losing.

dovakiin5574 · July 2018

WoW has a token to gold system in place.... It was only a matter of time until something similar happened to ESO

Soella · July 2018

Current situation is far better than gold sellers - and hopefully reduce number of bots. Even better would be tokens we can sell in trade guilds, it would help to setup fair price much faster.

Sheezabeast · July 2018

Definitely make sure both people agree on the price. 50 dollars to one person may be worth more to them than someone else who may have had to work harder for that money, the same goes for gold. It should definitely be worked out between people, like when people sell AP or telvar.

dave011 · July 2018

Colecovision wrote: »

How much gold is a mundus stone?

I ended up buying some of them and was paying guildies 1.25mil per but that is only 300 per crown

Shad0wfire99 · July 2018

JiDul wrote: »

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns. Some people are total rip offs in these games and the fact that this is becoming the market for selling crowns makes me kind of sick. The ESO market is very expensive, things are sold in the thousands, meaning I could go and buy a Motif for 20k or a Ring of something for 40k some stuff goes for the hundred-thousands.. Its unfair that i'm supposed to give you 47 real dollars for an amount of gold that will get me 3 things before i'm broke in game again and have to go and spend 47 more dollars.. on 3 things that are in game and have no use to me outside of this game. Also the amount of people who have 100k in their bank vastly outnumbers the amount of people who own millions of gold. So the market for this is going to continue to drop because people are going to be unwilling to pay so much for crowns and the people who do have the gold to afford it will stop paying so much because the price dropped. Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

The solution is to not sell them for that amount. Go out and grind your mats and make your gold that way.

ZarkingFrued · July 2018

If you cant afford the going rate then maybe you shouldnt sell crown items for eso gold.. I dont. I buy them with eso gold instead because I can't even afford to buy my own supply of crowns let alone throw away cash for an in game currency. Obviously selling crown items for in game gold or items is not for someone who doesnt have a lot of actual cash to throw away, and the ones who do have tons of money will be willing to go to low gold prices to undercut others. This is kind of relative to all things in life, dont hope or try to get a Corvette when all you can afford is Kia. Just get grinding and chin up buttercup.

swippy · July 2018

it isn't necessarily that people don't understand money; it's usually that their relative values differ from yours. if you're not willing to be a seller at the rates you find, then maybe you'd do well as a buyer? if that's no good for you either, then it just isn't the market for you. there's nothing wrong with that.

it sounds like you're disappointed that you aren't going to turn your paycheck into millions of gold, but you haven't taken into account the people who farm 18 hours a day, and the people who make orders of magnitude more just from trading items. maybe they have more time to spend on the game than you, along with their gold accumulation skills. that still doesn't give them any reason to value your time more highly, no matter how you spent it.

if you want to play a market successfully, you have to bring numbers that are valued by others, as well as yourself. not everyone's cut out for every available market.

swippy · July 2018

i'm not sure if i should double-post, but i'm gonna reply to OP from what i think is a completely different angle; that's why it's not an edit.

so in the original example given, you admitted that you make $47 for crowns in a few hours, and that you could farm 480k gold in a few hours and that those values trade equivalently. either way, that's a few hours. a few hours is a few hours; that's another equivalence.

you seem to be placing a higher value on your time, because yours was "hard labor" and theirs was "mindless drone farming" but that 's not how it works. some people enjoy the challenge of an honest day's work and could never tolerate the maddening tedium of doing deskwork. i know this for sure. i'm not sure if you're deriving the value of those few hours from your misery, but other people aren't going to be assigning extra value to how those few hours made you feel. they assign value to what they can acquire in relation to what they'll pay.

i feel like i said the same thing two different ways, but i hope it was different enough to not be redundant.

at the end, it sounds like for you the market is actually perfectly balanced. crowns are gold and gold is crowns, and you weren't able to find yourself an edge in all that balance. i'm really sorry if you had higher hopes for this market. that doesn't always work out. if you really want to feel like you're getting ahead in this game, you could pick a different market (other than crowns > gold) or wait for this one to change? maybe even hunt harder for buyers; it's possible.

S1ipperyJim · July 2018

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

Urvoth · July 2018

JiDul wrote: »

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns. Some people are total rip offs in these games and the fact that this is becoming the market for selling crowns makes me kind of sick. The ESO market is very expensive, things are sold in the thousands, meaning I could go and buy a Motif for 20k or a Ring of something for 40k some stuff goes for the hundred-thousands.. Its unfair that i'm supposed to give you 47 real dollars for an amount of gold that will get me 3 things before i'm broke in game again and have to go and spend 47 more dollars.. on 3 things that are in game and have no use to me outside of this game. Also the amount of people who have 100k in their bank vastly outnumbers the amount of people who own millions of gold. So the market for this is going to continue to drop because people are going to be unwilling to pay so much for crowns and the people who do have the gold to afford it will stop paying so much because the price dropped. Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

If you don't like the system, don't participate in it. Simple as that.

runagate · July 2018

JiDul wrote: »

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns. Some people are total rip offs in these games and the fact that this is becoming the market for selling crowns makes me kind of sick. The ESO market is very expensive, things are sold in the thousands, meaning I could go and buy a Motif for 20k or a Ring of something for 40k some stuff goes for the hundred-thousands.. Its unfair that i'm supposed to give you 47 real dollars for an amount of gold that will get me 3 things before i'm broke in game again and have to go and spend 47 more dollars.. on 3 things that are in game and have no use to me outside of this game. Also the amount of people who have 100k in their bank vastly outnumbers the amount of people who own millions of gold. So the market for this is going to continue to drop because people are going to be unwilling to pay so much for crowns and the people who do have the gold to afford it will stop paying so much because the price dropped. Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

I have no interest in this "controversy" except to state that, if someone runs around farming things for remuneration is that not their real labor? Certainly I'm not going to spend hours farming things, I'd rather play the game.

Also, since people make a variety of different wages per hour, there's no 1:1 correlation between what someone is willing to pay them for their hour of real labor.

There's some people that'll pay me $5 to dress up in a (pantsless) monkey costume and dance for them for 10 minutes. Not sure how that correlates to in-game gold nor crowns.

swippy · July 2018

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

However ZOS have spinelessly decided to remain silent when asked to confirm that this is against the TOS or not, despite multiple requests for a statement from them, including @ messages to Gina Bruno etc on these forums.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

that's not true. they gave the okay. you must have missed it. they also said to take screenshots of the contracts in case of scams because then Customer Service might be able to help, which i thought seemed generous and like a lot to take on. someone will have the link soon, i'm sure.

swippy · July 2018

runagate wrote: »

JiDul wrote: »

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns. Some people are total rip offs in these games and the fact that this is becoming the market for selling crowns makes me kind of sick. The ESO market is very expensive, things are sold in the thousands, meaning I could go and buy a Motif for 20k or a Ring of something for 40k some stuff goes for the hundred-thousands.. Its unfair that i'm supposed to give you 47 real dollars for an amount of gold that will get me 3 things before i'm broke in game again and have to go and spend 47 more dollars.. on 3 things that are in game and have no use to me outside of this game. Also the amount of people who have 100k in their bank vastly outnumbers the amount of people who own millions of gold. So the market for this is going to continue to drop because people are going to be unwilling to pay so much for crowns and the people who do have the gold to afford it will stop paying so much because the price dropped. Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

I have no interest in this "controversy" except to state that, if someone runs around farming things for remuneration is that not their real labor? Certainly I'm not going to spend hours farming things, I'd rather play the game.

Also, since people make a variety of different wages per hour, there's no 1:1 correlation between what someone is willing to pay them for their hour of real labor.

There's some people that'll pay me $5 to dress up in a (pantsless) monkey costume and dance for them for 10 minutes. Not sure how that correlates to in-game gold nor crowns.

do you have any plans for this Friday?

S1ipperyJim · July 2018

swippy wrote: »

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

However ZOS have spinelessly decided to remain silent when asked to confirm that this is against the TOS or not, despite multiple requests for a statement from them, including @ messages to Gina Bruno etc on these forums.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

that's not true. they gave the okay. you must have missed it. they also said to take screenshots of the contracts in case of scams because then Customer Service might be able to help, which i thought seemed generous and like a lot to take on. someone will have the link soon, i'm sure.

Link please.

If true this is reprehensible and short sighted.

hamsterontherocksb16_ESO · July 2018

JiDul wrote: »

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns.

First of all, how many hours are a "few hours"? almost 500k with the current market situation would take me maybe... 5 hours? Prices have plummeted considerably and unless you got a steady group for vSP and vFL 5 hours seems realistic.

So now lets see:
5 hours of farming vs 50$ (roudned) IRL money. Thats 10$ per hour.
Now ask yourself: Is one hour of my life worth 10$? Would you accept one hour of work you do not enjoy for 10$? Would you work 5 hours on something you not enjoy if you got paid 50$ in the end? Or would you rather do something you enjoy?

If someone offered me 10$ to just sit idly for 1 hour I would decline. I would decline sitting idly for 5 hours even when paid 50$. But that is me. You have to decide that for yourself. Would you rather do something fun and pay more or do something boring to save some money?

swippy · July 2018

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

swippy wrote: »

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

However ZOS have spinelessly decided to remain silent when asked to confirm that this is against the TOS or not, despite multiple requests for a statement from them, including @ messages to Gina Bruno etc on these forums.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

that's not true. they gave the okay. you must have missed it. they also said to take screenshots of the contracts in case of scams because then Customer Service might be able to help, which i thought seemed generous and like a lot to take on. someone will have the link soon, i'm sure.

Link please.

If true this is reprehensible and short sighted.

i've hunted it down for you as far as i'm willing to. there are relevant posts in the Dev Tracker of this forum around June 7th of this year. the topic name should be a good tip-off. the Dev Tracker link is near the top left of my tablet's Chrome forum interface. it's not a spoon-fed link, but you can do it.

DanteYoda · July 2018

So if i want to give 3k to 5k worth crowns away how much should i be looking at getting in return?

Riptide · July 2018

I remember back when I was a teenager making 50 dollars for a days work. I earned that trimming trees though, not high finance - so I suppose I didn’t understand money. Had no computer as I had left home, and had a wife and kid to support. The very idea of spending money on virtual currency, well, that would have been a joke.

25 years later I certainly do understand money. Enough that if I don’t know you, or owe you then I’m pushing for deals that benefit me, and isn’t awful to you...not the other way around. Trade is PVP. Thats true from the local food truck to your realtor to everything commerce.

And at a time in my life where I’m comfy....I still farm my own stuff, and sell it at what the market will bear. When that process is recreation, not drudgery to get through before the killin...

...when you realize how quick it is, when you get with a guild so you can move product.....

then you actually understand ESO money

In MMOs money flows to the patient. Most of us work. Many of us have tight schedules.

But time and patience are two different things. It does not follow that because you have two hours of game time you need to skip farming and have what you want right now, thats an excuse. It means you get what you want slower.

Why in heavens name folks pay others to skip hours playing, go hot and heavy with their items for a stretch, get bored, and repeat the process in the next game. Slow down. Keep your hard earned money in your pocket, and with the extra drops you get while farming sell it to people too foolish to do the same, and you’ll never want for gold.

S1ipperyJim · July 2018

swippy wrote: »

i've hunted it down for you as far as i'm willing to. there are relevant posts in the Dev Tracker of this forum around June 7th of this year. the topic name should be a good tip-off. the Dev Tracker link is near the top left of my tablet's Chrome forum interface. it's not a spoon-fed link, but you can do it.

Thanks for trying to find it for me, I've found it now myself. It's very disappointing to say the least.

If ZOS allow this they might as well put everything up for sale in a cash store, since you can now spend real world money to buy crowns to trade for gold to buy BiS items, legendary upgrade items etc rather than earning these playing the game.

swippy · July 2018

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

swippy wrote: »

i've hunted it down for you as far as i'm willing to. there are relevant posts in the Dev Tracker of this forum around June 7th of this year. the topic name should be a good tip-off. the Dev Tracker link is near the top left of my tablet's Chrome forum interface. it's not a spoon-fed link, but you can do it.

Thanks for trying to find it for me, I've found it now myself. It's very disappointing to say the least.

If ZOS allow this they might as well put everything up for sale in a cash store, since you can now spend real world money to buy crowns to trade for gold to buy BiS items, legendary upgrade items etc rather than earning these playing the game.

theoretically i could buy 2 carries to nearly-guarantee that Earthgore helmet i want in whatever weight i prefer, as i'm not so strong in PvE. i would spend more time finding 3 competent takers than i would earning the money, and it would feel like cheating to me. i don't know if that sort of thing dissuades many other people, but to me Bound items are still a giant pain in the ass, which i hope is good for the game. of course i am overflowing with Transmute Gems. and of course i'm now way off-topic.

Beardimus · July 2018

Wow that this thread even exists.

Getting gold in game is pretty easy unsure why anyone would spend real world money on it.

Just weird

Shad0wfire99 · July 2018

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

You have no idea what P2W is. There is no competitive advantage attatched to anything in the the Crown Store. Just saying that something is P2W doesn't make it so.

imrilaoi · July 2018

Shad0wfire99 wrote: »

You have no idea what P2W is. There is no competitive advantage attatched to anything in the the Crown Store. Just saying that something is P2W doesn't make it so.

What he's saying is that being able to obtain in-game gold with RL cash to buy - for example - Tempering Alloy is what makes its P2W. Not that the items within the cash shop are P2W.

He is still wrong, though. All it is is a "Pay to Shortcut", as you could get those same Tempering Alloys on your own, this just saves people with more cash than play time some of that play time.

They also still won't "win" at anything. An unskilled player in all gold gear is still an unskilled player, who is still going to eat dirt in PvE or PvP. Gold gear is such a small increase in terms of DPS and survivability that it isn't going to help someone who doesn't know how to play.