Selling crowns for gold is a SCAM and RIPOFF!

ZarkingFrued

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

ZarkingFrued wrote: »

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

Can you elaborate on how cosmetics are P2W?

@ZarkingFrued , ironically, he's saying that the one selling the Crowns is Paying2Win...

Take a minute to wrap your head around that one.

(Purchased gear, purchased mats, hell, even purchased carries are not going to magically make you awesome at this game.)

smh

Yes I suppose I did read that wrong. Yea as easy as it is to have everything I need for a character to be created, leveled, and geared I cant even start to entertain that as pay to win. The only hard part is grinding levels and undaunted passives, no way to buy that unless you're using the gold to buy a carry your guild could honestly give you free. Literally the only thing there is to spend gold on is making new characters in game. Maybe pay to have all the upcoming new outrageously hard to get grifon motifs if anything, and who really cares there lol.

JKorr

Cpt_Teemo wrote: »

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Uh.... if anything, being able to buy Crown items for gold makes the game LESS "pay 2 win". Because someone who didn't pay $, can get the things in the cash shop.

P2W is when the game has stuff that 1) you can ONLY get by dropping cash, which 2) gives you an otherwise-unobtainable advantage over non-$ players.


Open-world/Free-for-all/take your victim's gear PvP MMOs where you can get "insurance" against getting your stuff stolen, but only with $. Games where to be competitive you need your gear upgraded to "+15", but the only way to do that is with piles of $upgrade $consumables. Games where they just straight out sell stronger gear in the cash shop.

ESO is none of these things. And again, opening up crown items to be obtained by anyone for gold takes it further away from that.

98% of the stuff on the crown store you cannot obtain in game, it is many of those things

You can't get the stuff in game. Please explain what advantage I've gained because my character is riding a black lion senche instead of a horse you could only buy with gold in the game. Before they started the "get a horse at level 10" system. Pay to win is buying items that give you an advantage you can't get any other way. Don't say riding lessons; those you can get in game with gold and time. What do I win if, temporarily, my mount is faster than yours? My character is wearing the Thane costume from the crown store. What kind of advantage does it give me? I'm planning on getting stuff from the upcoming crown store, if the mounts and pets I want to buy aren't in the rng/gamble boxes. Will any of them give my character the overwhelming advantage I need to make Emperor? Or make my character uber leet enough to breeze through Maelstrom Area and get the weapons I want?

And you know, no matter how much gold I could accumulate by spending RL money for crowns and gifting for gold, all the gold in the game will still NOT give me/my character the skills/abilities to be emperor or make the leaderboards.

imrilaoi

JKorr wrote: »

*** snipped *** Please explain what advantage I've gained because my character is riding a black lion senche instead of a horse you could only buy with gold in the game. *** end snip ***

Thats the thing, no one has yet to list anything in the crown store that is actually pay to win.

Someone mentioned the Imperial race. What, exactly, is P2W about the Imperial race? I've owned the Imperial upgrade for some time - yet I don't have any Imperial characters. Why? Because the race isn't "the best" for anything.

• Want a magicka character? That would be Dark Elf or High Elf.
• Stamina character? Redguard or Khajiit.
• Tank? Argonian. Everyone I asked in all of my guilds flat out said "Argonian", not "or X race" - and I had to ask I don't play a tank.

All three of which are basic, non-crown races.
I bought the Imperial upgrade solely for access to the Imperial style houses, because I like them.

Ring's of Mara were also mentioned. Oh, my. Rings of Mara. Man, that 10% exp is so, sooo winning ESO, especially when I have to equip it to get its 10% exp bonus, while the other person has to also be online. Know what this means? I'm losing stats, probably losing a set bonus, all for... 10% exp. And, it only applies while the other person is online (maybe with you? I forget.), so its not a permanent 10% bonus like ESO+ is. Mine was just used for its roleplay value (oh dear, I paid to win at roleplaying).

Generally speaking, I don't consider any experience bonus to be pay to win. There are reasons for this - for one, leveling faster doesn't make you 'win'. For two, leveling faster gives you less of a chance to figure out how to play a particular class or spec, so if anything, its pay to be worse at the game. The exception might be CP levels, but again, those only help if you already know how to play. The many, many posts complaining about high CP characters in dungeons who don't know how to play are evidence enough of this.

Crown-exclusive motifs? Well, maybe... except, I've yet to get or see a Master Writ that asks me for a crown exclusive style. Its entirely possible, don't get me wrong - I've just not seen it. There are only three that are exclusive to the crown store - Harlequin, Frostcaster and Tsaesci. All of the rest that were or are offered on the Crown or Crown Gem store are obtainable in some manner in-game.


Lets see, what else is offered exclusively via the crown store? Hmm.

• Furnishings - no 'win' factor there.
• Mundus Stones - again, no real win factor there, they just save you a few minutes trip.
• Houses? Sorry, as much as I looooove housing, houses offer to way to 'win' at the game.
• Crafting stations? Well, sure, the Clockwork stations look kind of cool, but they offer nothing that the in-game obtainable stations don't already offer, its just a style change.
• Mounts? Different mounts are just for appearance. And, even if they didn't give you a mount at level 10, it would still be cheaper to just buy a mount from the stable. I forget what they cost, as I've bought them all to eventually place in houses, but I think they're all something like 50k gold?
• Experience Scrolls - Again, I don't see these as pay to win. Personal opinion, true. But, you can get exp boosts in-game anyway, with things like Psijic Ambrosias - and they don't stack. You can only have one or the other active.
• Costumes? Sorry, this isn't Black Desert Online, where the costumes give us something besides "Man, I look cool!".
• Um. Ummm. What else? Oh! Mimic Stones! - ok, Mimic Stones I do love. I think I've used all of the crown gems the myriad free crates have given me to buy Mimic Stones, so I could get Culanda Lacquer. I could have sold them, but instead, I used them to make furniture for my own house. Still, not winning, except in my own head (I do like how that house turned out...)

I think that covers pretty much everything in the store, except DLC's.

Now, for the other side of the argument - selling crowns to win with gold. Let me emphasize this, as I've already said it before in this thread:

You can have the best sets for your spec, the best race for your spec, and you can have fully gold'd out gear, and you will still not 'win' at the game. The 'best' gold gear only helps you if you already know how to play. Its not going to automagically throw the person wearing it to the top of any leaderboard.

griffkhalifa

JiDul wrote: »

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns. Some people are total rip offs in these games and the fact that this is becoming the market for selling crowns makes me kind of sick. The ESO market is very expensive, things are sold in the thousands, meaning I could go and buy a Motif for 20k or a Ring of something for 40k some stuff goes for the hundred-thousands.. Its unfair that i'm supposed to give you 47 real dollars for an amount of gold that will get me 3 things before i'm broke in game again and have to go and spend 47 more dollars.. on 3 things that are in game and have no use to me outside of this game. Also the amount of people who have 100k in their bank vastly outnumbers the amount of people who own millions of gold. So the market for this is going to continue to drop because people are going to be unwilling to pay so much for crowns and the people who do have the gold to afford it will stop paying so much because the price dropped. Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

Are you 14 years old? If the deal isn't worth it to you then don't do it; as you said, it's easier to go farm for that gold so go do it. Jesus Christ will people stop complaining about optional things in this game.

Vahrokh

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO wrote: »

I actually like this...I wish they would let us buy ESO+ packs with crowns so we can trade and use those packs or sell em via guild store...much like Aion has/had...

EvE Online does that with PLEX too.

Ackwalan

The other day, someone was selling raffle tickets for a chance to win a crown item. He didn't say how much gold each ticket cost.

DaveMoeDee

There are ways to make a lot of gold that don't involve hours of farming and bring with them a sense of accomplishment. I am not a major seller in any way, but I probably have about 3 million gold right now and probably made half of that in a week flipping rings when Summerset was released.

I have no problem with people buying gold with crown gifts. It isn't generating any gold from scratch which means no deflation. It doesn't make my accomplishments selling any less satisfying. It also doesn't allow them to surpass any power cap by spending more. If they can more quickly buy craftable or overland BiS gear, whatever. Good for them. I'm happy getting them through playing games. I could buy shortcuts I suppose, but that would mean missing out on enjoying the game.

Chicharron

swippy wrote: »

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

However ZOS have spinelessly decided to remain silent when asked to confirm that this is against the TOS or not, despite multiple requests for a statement from them, including @ messages to Gina Bruno etc on these forums.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

that's not true. they gave the okay. you must have missed it. they also said to take screenshots of the contracts in case of scams because then Customer Service might be able to help, which i thought seemed generous and like a lot to take on. someone will have the link soon, i'm sure.

It's half true.

A player tried to scam me for 500k gold in my alternate account. Luckily record the whole process report the player speak to support and this they said.

Ihatenightblades

Quit your crying dude nobody is making you convert your real hard earned money for gold. Your are just to complaining you arent getting the deal you want.

You do realize everybody is different when i comes to ratios.

Maybe u need to negotiate a lil better? I myself would trade 5k crowns for 600k gold thats fair to me. And if it aint fair guess what? I decline the offer and life goes on.

D0PAMINE

Lol you're not forced to buy anything for any price.

midgetfromtheshire

JKorr wrote: »

Cpt_Teemo wrote: »

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Uh.... if anything, being able to buy Crown items for gold makes the game LESS "pay 2 win". Because someone who didn't pay $, can get the things in the cash shop.

P2W is when the game has stuff that 1) you can ONLY get by dropping cash, which 2) gives you an otherwise-unobtainable advantage over non-$ players.


Open-world/Free-for-all/take your victim's gear PvP MMOs where you can get "insurance" against getting your stuff stolen, but only with $. Games where to be competitive you need your gear upgraded to "+15", but the only way to do that is with piles of $upgrade $consumables. Games where they just straight out sell stronger gear in the cash shop.

ESO is none of these things. And again, opening up crown items to be obtained by anyone for gold takes it further away from that.

98% of the stuff on the crown store you cannot obtain in game, it is many of those things

You can't get the stuff in game. Please explain what advantage I've gained because my character is riding a black lion senche instead of a horse you could only buy with gold in the game. Before they started the "get a horse at level 10" system. Pay to win is buying items that give you an advantage you can't get any other way. Don't say riding lessons; those you can get in game with gold and time. What do I win if, temporarily, my mount is faster than yours? My character is wearing the Thane costume from the crown store. What kind of advantage does it give me? I'm planning on getting stuff from the upcoming crown store, if the mounts and pets I want to buy aren't in the rng/gamble boxes. Will any of them give my character the overwhelming advantage I need to make Emperor? Or make my character uber leet enough to breeze through Maelstrom Area and get the weapons I want?

And you know, no matter how much gold I could accumulate by spending RL money for crowns and gifting for gold, all the gold in the game will still NOT give me/my character the skills/abilities to be emperor or make the leaderboards.

Clearly you aren't in the know of how the crown store items are P2W. Someone gifted me the eternity tunic the other day and my dps went up to 50mil and I managed to solo vAS+2 in 10 seconds. Clearly OP and definitely P2W!

Valen_Byte

1 crown for 10k gold, thats what Ill sell mine for. Seller sets the price. Take it or lose it. You dont have to sell cheaper than you want too. Just sayin.

swippy

Chicharron wrote: »

swippy wrote: »

S1ipperyJim wrote: »

Selling Crowns for Gold makes the game P2W.

However ZOS have spinelessly decided to remain silent when asked to confirm that this is against the TOS or not, despite multiple requests for a statement from them, including @ messages to Gina Bruno etc on these forums.

It's tragic that people like the OP want to come on the official forums and whine about not receiving enough in game gold for your crowns.

that's not true. they gave the okay. you must have missed it. they also said to take screenshots of the contracts in case of scams because then Customer Service might be able to help, which i thought seemed generous and like a lot to take on. someone will have the link soon, i'm sure.

It's half true.

A player tried to scam me for 500k gold in my alternate account. Luckily record the whole process report the player speak to support and this they said.

well, these are different conversation points. the thing i said was "not true" was the accusation from (i'm sure accidental) ignorance that ZOS hadn't yet answered his question. his question had been addressed, which is what i said wasn't true.

when i elaborated about any possible Customer Service, i still think i nailed it. they definitely said they might be able to help if there's enough documentation, and your post proves that all also true.

i want to thank you for publicizing (or at least just notifying me) that they have a one-time policy on the system i described. i hope a lot of people saw your post. that is very useful information. really good to know.

i'm also happy that your exemption applied to a sum that's somewhat sizable. half a million is not a tiny amount to a lot of players, so i hope you feel it wasn't a waste to cash in on that one. i hope you find only honest traders in the future.

Rawkan

Seems to me like the high end trading guilds are mad that their monopoly is being challenged.

abelsgmx

And he route to pay to win has started

Androconium

JiDul wrote: »

I think a lot of what this has to do with is people don't understand the value of real life money. People wanting to buy 6k crowns for 80:1 ratio? That's 480k for $47 of money I worked hard for. I can go out and farm 480k worth of materials in a few hours of sitting at my desk mindless drone farming. Where as me and a lot of other people had to work 4-5 real hard real life working hours of real labor just to earn that money to sell you crowns. Some people are total rip offs in these games and the fact that this is becoming the market for selling crowns makes me kind of sick. The ESO market is very expensive, things are sold in the thousands, meaning I could go and buy a Motif for 20k or a Ring of something for 40k some stuff goes for the hundred-thousands.. Its unfair that i'm supposed to give you 47 real dollars for an amount of gold that will get me 3 things before i'm broke in game again and have to go and spend 47 more dollars.. on 3 things that are in game and have no use to me outside of this game. Also the amount of people who have 100k in their bank vastly outnumbers the amount of people who own millions of gold. So the market for this is going to continue to drop because people are going to be unwilling to pay so much for crowns and the people who do have the gold to afford it will stop paying so much because the price dropped. Soon you will be seeing a ratio of 1:1 because of how this market works.

Mother wants you to work at the mill.

YOU ARE somebody's slave.

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