ZOS, what do your customers need to do to get you to FIX something?

MinarasLaure · June 2018

I quit cyrodiil last week and boy, I forgot how smooth this game can be.
Last time I left cyro was when summerset launched and it was a pain even in Pve areas, but now everything feels smoother (apart when I get kicked out randomly)
I'm all in for a x days black out tho, if that would mean better performance in cyrodiil, even a month, I don't care, but at this stage I really want to stay away from there, it's just pointless

Phelaen · June 2018

i am on PC and its not just Cyrodiil
the whole game feels off, timing is missing, heavy attacks get pushed in being it doesnt keep up with the light attack + skills.

and now health amounts are bugged https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/420538/heavy-armor-not-scaling-correctly#reply-anchor

FIX YOUR GAME!

Vahrokh · June 2018

Just recall the last ZOS hiring advertisment: they were searching for a marketing professional, specialized into how to best monetize crowns content.

That is, they did not look to hire developers, but people able to study how to squeeze out even more money with cosmetic gadgets.

Jaavaa · June 2018

Really? HP scaling broken now? Ridiculous. Really. I can’t find words for this. Lol

JD2013 · June 2018

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

Jaavaa · June 2018

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

The Solution is:

- cancle eso+ if you have it
- don’t buy crowns
- stop playing until it’s fixed

JD2013 · June 2018

Jaavaa wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

The Solution is:

- cancle eso+ if you have it
- don’t buy crowns
- stop playing until it’s fixed

Only that’s not a solution. That’s just protesting.

Bhaal5 · June 2018

If you want to speak their language..

Stop paying for a service that doesnt provide, stop eso+ and stop buying crowns
If you continue to do so for the "craftbag" youcre encouraging this corporate behavior and you're only apart of the problem

MTijhuis · June 2018

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

The solution to this problem, is don't release content until its ready!! It's absolutely ridiculous that a million dollar company, can't release content without game breaking bugs. Not to mention that it takes weeks or months to get them fixed. Every single quartly update comes with gigantic bugs.

The fact that we have to wait weeks on the console to get a fix, is ridiculous. If they really cared about there player base and game, they would pay Microsoft and Sony for a fast autorization process. Then within 48 hours a patch with fixes can be live.

But all Zenimax cares about is $$. They have their money from the chapter, why work on the bugs? Until they change that my wallet stays closed.

Aesthier · June 2018

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

You hit the nail on the head!

The engine is old and leading to several real service issues like disconnects, long loading screens, infinite launcher loops and crashes, etc...

Cyrodil is the place that usually is the most affected because of the points you brought out above.

What they need is the time and money to develop or translate everything to a newer engine and then translate all current accounts to the new engine and server to release it as an overhaul patch (when really it is just a server swap) to a new stable environment.

But I just don't see them having the resources to do that (or the investors willing to make that jump).

The sad part is that creating a separate team to get this up and running could really pay off in the long run. I can't begin to cover all the possibilities having a new updated engine could bring not only for the players but the cash shop as well. The downfall is if they were to implement something like this they would have had to have started just before the game came into its prime otherwise the release would come long after the game loses its flavor which is already happening.

I am just afraid that either they won't upgrade the engine and the game will die because of all the issues we are "CURRENTLY" having or that they will kill the game by releasing an ESO2 version which means players would lose everything they have worked on for the last several years.

Just really makes me sad because I don't see the game surviving and I have come to enjoy it above all ohers.

Aurielle · June 2018

My sub expired yesterday. I’ve not yet renewed it, and am not sure when I will.

I love this game, but I’m so tired of updates launching with scores of game-breaking issues that were detected in the PTS. What is the point of the PTS, if not to detect and FIX problems?

Gnozo · June 2018

I am out too, fix game and i will renew it.

Nyladreas · June 2018

DanteYoda wrote: »

Stop paying them money and play something else... thats the only way changes will ever happen.

Thats never going to happen. Tons of people pay and all they do is explore, RP and mess around.... I know 7 people like that.

It's what we just wish for.

Pixel_Zealot · June 2018

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

That's all well and good, but hundreds of thousands of players don't pay their ESO+ sub to give solutions.

CiliPadi · June 2018

Hit them where it hurts, their pockets.

JD2013 · June 2018

Pixel_Zealot wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

That's all well and good, but hundreds of thousands of players don't pay their ESO+ sub to give solutions.

And so all we get is people shouting into the dark and hyperbole, which gets nobody anywhere.

Graydon · June 2018

Ooooh yes do a temporary blackout! That would show them! For sure.

Why don’t you do what most unsatisfied consumers do? Take your business elsewhere.

Lol @ week long blackout. Like you will be missed. Like that will have any affect? Are you even a subscriber? Are you paying your subscription on a weekly basis?

Even more worthless if you’re not a subscriber.

Tan9oSuccka · June 2018

Easy there, killer.

They’re working on it. This is more complex than most of you armchair MMO/IT specialists realize.

Blobsky · June 2018

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Easy there, killer.

They’re working on it. This is more complex than most of you armchair MMO/IT specialists realize.

They have been working on it since Beta in 2014. I've playes since then, and excluding the 2fps bug (2 months long) in patch 1.2 the performance has unquestionably got worse every patch

pmn100b16_ESO · June 2018

I'm all for a blackout, this sort of joint consumer action is sorely needed in this industry. We really do need to stick together rather than divide ourselves into PvEers and PvPers. However saying that, if we organised a blackout over PvP performance, I can just imgaine hords of PvEers saying, "but my daily writs" lol.

On the subject of Cyrodiil performance. It will never support hundreds of players on the screen at once as they advertised at launch. They used to be able to do it back at launch but they had lots of client side processing that allowed the game to be hacked. Loads of code got shoved over to the server one patch (where it should have been all along) to avoid the hacking and the performance inevitably died and has never recovered.

There's a reason Camelot Unchained has had to develop their own engine from the ground up to support hundreds of players fighting at once, because there isn't an engine capable of it right now, certainly not the aging Hero trash used here at ESO.

Inoki · June 2018

Morgul667 wrote: »

Id be in for a blackout

Would not lose much with the state of the game anyway

I'm in.

Tan9oSuccka · June 2018

Blobsky wrote: »

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Easy there, killer.

They’re working on it. This is more complex than most of you armchair MMO/IT specialists realize.

They have been working on it since Beta in 2014. I've playes since then, and excluding the 2fps bug (2 months long) in patch 1.2 the performance has unquestionably got worse every patch

I’ve played since midnight release on console. I guess I haven’t seen the same problems. Things have been pretty smooth all things considered on PS4 the past three years.

The lag and freezing post Summerset feels similar to that after Morrowind dropped.

Eventually, I trust they’ll figure it out and it will get better. Cyrodiil seemed somewhat less annoying last night with load screens, but some player interactions were pretty sketchy.

Inoki · June 2018

The CP system should be completely removed. Just lag from passive procs and power creep.

Doctordarkspawn · June 2018

Also a problem: PC NA has been kicking players to login nonstop and no ammount of port forwarding has consistantly fixed this.

ZOS has many problems with their game that they simply refuse to fix.

The whole 'if we stop making content we stop geting players' thing is a myth, disproved by Operation Health from Siege and other projects like it, if you stop to improve your game, it sometimes gets more attention then new release content.

It's time to nut up, ZOS. Sit down, take the first quarter next year to take some time to polish your game, instead of doing a chapter. It'd go along a way toward player goodwill, which means more profits in future. Short term dip, long term payoff.

valeriiya · June 2018

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Easy there, killer.

They’re working on it. This is more complex than most of you armchair MMO/IT specialists realize.

They've been "working on it" for years, that's what you white knights don't seem to get

Doctordarkspawn · June 2018

JD2013 wrote: »

Jaavaa wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

The Solution is:

- cancle eso+ if you have it
- don’t buy crowns
- stop playing until it’s fixed

Only that’s not a solution. That’s just protesting.

At this point they are one and the same.

The only thing that -gets- to corporate is when the cash stops flowing. Only then will they seriously consider puting new content aside to try to fix old content.

You dont have any other options. We've tried protesting the forums, we've tried talking, we've tried outright trying to talk to these people in person about it, you want ZOS to drop content production and take an actual wrench to the game to fix it? The spice has to stop flowing.

MinarasLaure · June 2018

JD2013 wrote: »

You can organise your blackouts as much as you like. The fact of the matter is that Cyrodiil has been broken for a long while now, and will remain broken.

The problem is something that ZOS have tried and tried to fix. As an outsider with no real understanding of game engines and the calculations involved behind the scenes, I would say that it’s probable that the reason it isn’t fixed is because there’s a problem with the engine of the game that just can’t handle the calculations of all those abilities, all of those CP calculations, all of those different set calculations and all of the extra stuff under the hood.

Back when the game launched, it could. Because we had veteran levels and no CP. less armour sets, the lighting patch wasn’t in, and there was no DLC added into the game. They’ve built and built upon it, and that would only have exacerbated problems within the code.

ZOS have not got enough time to sit and take a long, hard dig into the performance of the game. They have a content cadence that leaves very little wiggle room. They are always working on something.

So, do they stop creating content until they take a long and hard look under the hood? That would not be profitable for them. And let’s face it, they are a business. I was here for the year they were focusing on the console release, and no content came besides things like the justice system. That almost killed the game.

So, without shouting, without hyperbole, without insults to anyone, what is the real solution here?

I can think of FFXIV and how they solved the problem with the vanilla version of the game.
That is probably way to drastic but it worked for them.
FFXIV was awful, they killed the game and a year later they launched FFXIV a realm reborn.
And it worked.
I do understand zos is not as big as square, but this is a precedent.
Eso is not as bad as FFXIV when first launched, but is clear that it suffers major problems that, up until now, zos either ignored or couldn't fix.
And those problems are game breaking.
Closing down the servers and put hands on their engine may not be profitable, but if they keep going down this path, eso will die soon as player base will look elsewhere, zos will lose credibility and it'll be pretty impossible for them to be part of another major project.
So what's worse?

Vercingetorix · June 2018

It's very simple what you can do and everyone already knows the answer:

- Stop logging in
- Stop spending money on crowns
- Cancel your ESO+ subscription

When the money stops flowing in and their board sees a dip in profits, the dev team will be yelled at to fix the issues customers are complaining about so the company execs can go back to lining their pockets. ZoS is a business - the best way to pressure a business into action is to endanger their profits. As long as continue ignoring what I've posted above, you are essentially telling ZoS that ESO is a satisfactory product with negligible issues.

Charliff1966 · June 2018

Vercingetorix wrote: »

It's very simple what you can do and everyone already knows the answer:

- Stop logging in
- Stop spending money on crowns
- Cancel your ESO+ subscription

When the money stops flowing in and their board sees a dip in profits, the dev team will be yelled at to fix the issues customers are complaining about so the company execs can go back to lining their pockets. ZoS is a business - the best way to pressure a business into action is to endanger their profits. As long as continue ignoring what I've posted above, you are essentially telling ZoS that ESO is a satisfactory product with negligible issues.

Already doing that. Playing Tera atm. Will be back when ZOS gets their act together.

Tan9oSuccka · June 2018

valeriiya wrote: »

Tan9oSuccka wrote: »

Easy there, killer.

They’re working on it. This is more complex than most of you armchair MMO/IT specialists realize.

They've been "working on it" for years, that's what you white knights don't seem to get

Yes, they have been working on it.

Did you ever stop to think that with three unique platforms and limited staff...these issues may take some time?

I want things fixed and perfect just like everyone else. This game has evolved so much over the years. They’ve delivered on many things already.

Let’s give them some credit and let them work their magic.