Bbsample197 wrote: »

The only reason why people are against this is because it will ruin their capitalization on resources, believe me ive been in a lot of guilds who gets mad if the prices of flowers and motifs goes down because the majority of the playerbase can get it

to anyone whos against it, i cannot see any downside care to enlightened me what will be the negative effect of sharing nodes? and saying that theres already alot of nodes in the game is not a great argument some player could only play during peak times due to real life reasons, what are you gonna do about places like craglorns where its the only main place to get nirn during peak times? that place is a barren wasteland during those times

The problem is not the sharing nodes per se. The problem is that in order to make that change (à la GW2), then you would have to have 1/10 of the nodes we have today PLUS a far longer respawn timer.

Nodes in ESO are plentiful and they respawn within a few minutes.

Nodes in GW2 are much more scarce and I don't even know how long they take to respawn, but they take at least an hour.

So the systems are different, but the end result is the same: There are enough mats to go around as along as people are willing to gather.

The fact that someone gets to a node before you some times does not significantly affect the availability of mats. It's the willingness of people to stop and gather that does that. A lot of mats sell barely above their vendoring price. I don't know how you want them to be even cheaper than that, so that's not the issue.

I personally like the balance that ESO has between individual/shared things. Nodes and open world chests are first come, first served, loot and containers are instanced. Chests in dungeons and trials are also instanced so each player can loot them.

There are enough options for each play style to be happy.

So, in ESO, I'd rather have the plethora of nodes we have now, even if sometimes someone else gets to the node faster. The node will respawn in a few minutes anyway.

lihentian wrote: »

yes that would be nice.. it will also encourage group play.

I don't think anyone has needed a healer or a tank to go gathering since Craglorn first came out and the wasps were OP.

Gathering is a solitary activity whether the nodes are shared or not.

And I've never hesitated to show guildies any mat or chest farm spots that I have found useful.

This sort of thing only appeals to the solo player that wants everything for themselves and doesn't want to work for anything or buy anything from other players.

"Endgame" for me is grinding for mats, doing writs, farming, crafting and selling stuff... take that away and suddenly a big chunk of my enjoyment from the game is gone.

It's not about me being "greedy", it's about the fact that it costs 2mill+ gold to decorate a house so we have to be able to make gold SOMEWHERE. If you remove the ability to make gold off of mats then how do we make gold to pay for the numerous gold sinks ZOS throws at us?

AlnilamE wrote: »

Gathering is a solitary activity whether the nodes are shared or not.

This is simply not true. This is the perspective of someone who's only ever played games where gathering is competitive. In Guild Wars 2, there are guilds that actually go gathering together so that they can chat whilst gathering. In Ultima Online it was commonplace to hook up with people you met while out gathering to be sociable. Then you'd go from gathering to doing content together and it was lovely.

I'd say that gathering is actually the cornerstone of whether an MMO is more social or not. It's like it sets the mood. If, out in the world, you feel cagey about other players being around because you don't want to have to fight for resources? You're not going to want to walk with those players and do content with them later. If, however, you can walk with other people and gather? You will want to do content with them.

Having global gathering nodes actually leads to a more antisocial MMO. If anything would help fix ESO's solo-only problem, this is it.

Edited to fix broken quote tags. Whoops.

Edit: Think about it, which sounds more social?

a.) A system which encourages players to compete over resources so that players are anxious about seeing other players, resulting in a system where each player tries to find an area of the world which has the least player congestion in order to be able to get what they need.

b.) A system which allows the player to go wherever they want to accomplish the same task; A system where players would be happy to see one another and could work together. A system where if one person sees a node, they can direct everyone else to it in a friendly way, fostering friendship and connections between people that will give the game a more positive feeling to it.

Which sounds more social to you? I remember what Ultima Online was like. I don't know how old you are or if you ever played Ultima Online, but it was a more social experience because people could work together. If you actively stop people from working together however they want, it's going to work against the game being a social one.

One Tamriel happened so the community wouldn't be so divided. If one person wanted to do a quest in Reaper's March, but others weren't high enough level, it couldn't happen. Now, people can group and go anywhere. This happening to resource nodes should've happened with One Tamriel, because it's in the same spirit of it.

Resource nodes being instanced to the player is very much in the spirit of group play. Any Ultima Online player would tell you that. I remember when large fishing groups happened in Ultima Online... I just miss it. Why does it have to be this soulless competition? What do you get out of it?

Edit 2: This is something that old MMOs actually got right. If you allow social groups to form naturally by letting the game feel social, you don't need to force them. The reason that modern MMOs have forced grouping (like trials) is because they've forced the game to be antisocial in a number of other areas. When you force people into situations like this, it only gets more toxic.

Force people to be competitive over resource nodes? This makes them cagey and anxious, it introduces toxic behaviours. Force those people to then work together in trials? This makes them even more toxic because they're already cagey of and distrustful about other players. If you make your game feel more social in a natural way, you don't need to force grouping in trials. Then you could have trials scale down to one player, but more people would be playing them in a group because everything would feel less forced.

I wish modern designers understood this.

AuldWolf wrote: »

Sheezabeast wrote: »

why give everyone a participation trophy?

I'm genuinely concerned by the selfishness and antisocial thinking I see on these forums.

Why is it bad that everyone has fun? Why is it bad that everyone gets a chance? What do you have against that? Why are you specifically against people enjoying themselves? Why should it be only the person who gets there first, or the person who has the best addon to plot out the best route, that gets the resources?

It absolutely would be better if the nodes were instanced to the player, instead of globally, so that everyone could have their own nodes to loot. There's no good reason to not do that. It would reduce social anxiety, which would make the game more inviting to even more people. Nodes introduce conflict. I know I don't feel comfortable being around other people when I'm gathering so I try to find the most out of the place spot for resource gathering. It nurtures a paranoia that blossoms into an actively antisocial gaming experience.

Back in Ultima Online, everyone could loot nodes. So you could go gathering with other people, imagine that. You could actually hang around with gatherers and chat it up. It was lovely. Then... I don't know if it was Everquest or FF XI that started it, but I first saw it in FF XI. My friends and I noticed everyone diving on nodes and being competitive. Suddenly, the welcoming, lovely experience of gathering became something more akin to League of Legends with people being hostile to one another, distrusting one another.

That's fine, if you're antisocial.

I'm not.

I'm asocial sometimes, which means I can be nervous around people and I can occasionally be shy and choose not to interact, but sometimes I do like to interact. ESO doesn't give me (or others) that opportunity. It creates a hostile environment of competition. That's never a good thing in PvE. Perhaps nodes in PvP should be like that, but not PvE.

In my opinion, ESO would be more welcoming to more kinds of people if gathering was fun. People who actually play crafting games would get involved, then, if they felt like they could gather in a social way.

Which is better:

a.) You can gather with other people. If you meet someone on the road you can actually hang out with them. You can invite them to come along with you, you can show them the best spots, and you can share with them your route for the best mining results. You can talk about different things, even roleplay, whilst gathering nodes. You can feel comfortable and at ease with other players around, fostering the more social experience ZOS seems to want.

b.) You can have harvesting be a paranoid, antisocial experience where you have to hide from other players because there are only so many resources to go around. This artificial scarcity creates a sort of enforced tribalism where you have players being actively hostile in order to guard what they believe is theirs, you have people trying to avoid one another and getting very anxious and aggressive when others are around as everyone struggles for the same resources.

Which sounds better to you? I pick option a.

no

I don't see how it will drive down prices by anything more than a trivial amount. People who buy mats, generally do so because they have more gold than time. As others have said, there are lots of nodes everywhere, so people who want to farm, WILL farm. Having nodes instanced will just reduce the stress and frustration.

So yes, I support it.

It would make it too easy to farm nodes. I think a few things should get more drops like plants. One per node sucks.

No because they will break something else

AuldWolf wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

Gathering is a solitary activity whether the nodes are shared or not.

This is simply not true. This is the perspective of someone who's only ever played games where gathering is competitive. In Guild Wars 2, there are guilds that actually go gathering together so that they can chat whilst gathering. In Ultima Online it was commonplace to hook up with people you met while out gathering to be sociable. Then you'd go from gathering to doing content together and it was lovely.

I'd say that gathering is actually the cornerstone of whether an MMO is more social or not. It's like it sets the mood. If, out in the world, you feel cagey about other players being around because you don't want to have to fight for resources? You're not going to want to walk with those players and do content with them later. If, however, you can walk with other people and gather? You will want to do content with them.

Having global gathering nodes actually leads to a more antisocial MMO. If anything would help fix ESO's solo-only problem, this is it.

Edited to fix broken quote tags. Whoops.

Edit: Think about it, which sounds more social?

a.) A system which encourages players to compete over resources so that players are anxious about seeing other players, resulting in a system where each player tries to find an area of the world which has the least player congestion in order to be able to get what they need.

b.) A system which allows the player to go wherever they want to accomplish the same task; A system where players would be happy to see one another and could work together. A system where if one person sees a node, they can direct everyone else to it in a friendly way, fostering friendship and connections between people that will give the game a more positive feeling to it.

Which sounds more social to you? I remember what Ultima Online was like. I don't know how old you are or if you ever played Ultima Online, but it was a more social experience because people could work together. If you actively stop people from working together however they want, it's going to work against the game being a social one.

One Tamriel happened so the community wouldn't be so divided. If one person wanted to do a quest in Reaper's March, but others weren't high enough level, it couldn't happen. Now, people can group and go anywhere. This happening to resource nodes should've happened with One Tamriel, because it's in the same spirit of it.

Resource nodes being instanced to the player is very much in the spirit of group play. Any Ultima Online player would tell you that. I remember when large fishing groups happened in Ultima Online... I just miss it. Why does it have to be this soulless competition? What do you get out of it?

Edit 2: This is something that old MMOs actually got right. If you allow social groups to form naturally by letting the game feel social, you don't need to force them. The reason that modern MMOs have forced grouping (like trials) is because they've forced the game to be antisocial in a number of other areas. When you force people into situations like this, it only gets more toxic.

Force people to be competitive over resource nodes? This makes them cagey and anxious, it introduces toxic behaviours. Force those people to then work together in trials? This makes them even more toxic because they're already cagey of and distrustful about other players. If you make your game feel more social in a natural way, you don't need to force grouping in trials. Then you could have trials scale down to one player, but more people would be playing them in a group because everything would feel less forced.

I wish modern designers understood this.

Option B is clearly better. That's why Guild Wars 2 is so successful.

I am all for competition but running to a node and mining it before someone else is not really a competition. You could both press the key at the same time and the player with a lower ping will win.

Think about it for a second, what is wrong with letting everyone mine the nodes? It's not going to hurt anyone.

No. As in real life, some level of competition is necessary for healthy development. So no.

VaranisArano wrote: »

DuskMarine wrote: »

Knowledge wrote: »

In other titles like Guild Wars 2 the crafting nodes are shared similarly to how we share locked chests in dungeons. Would you support the nodes being adjusted to be universal and for everyone to loot?

yes please because you litterally have invisble people mining them now(ive seen pets following litterally no one node to node). so yes itd make like alot better.

You mean people using the Kollopi Essence disguise? Or actually not visible players?

There have been actual invisible bots. I noticed one who would turn visible just while picking up the node. I personally only saw this once.

I could honestly care less if they're shared or not. I have been sniped MAYBE 4 - 5 times in about two years of play.

Why even bother worrying about this, when there's still aspects of the game people are still complaining about that have far greater impact?

I think the nodes have a fast enough respawn timer that shared nodes isn't necessary. For example, I mined an ore node, started fishing and before the fishing hole dried out, the node had already respawned.

Why stop with universal nodes? Just give everyone unlimited materials!