Can anyone check if they fixed sload's breaking cloak please?
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Murador178✭✭✭✭If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness(what does ur effectiveness determine: I think its the salt level of the sload pugzerged group) is determined with the e-function
. Maybe its even factorial growth .
Edited by Murador178 on May 18, 2018 9:30AM1 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Murador178 wrote: »If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness is determined with the e-function .
I used a different definition for X.
My X is allies-enemy players meaning 0 = 1v1 and 1=2v1 etc.
Also i assumed x is the number of players focusing a single enemy.
As its effectiveness increases exponentially the exponential function seemed to be the best way to determine it
Almost any pvp performance Chart has to be determined with exp(x) because the difficulty of fights doesn't follow a gradual slope and a 1v4 is almost impossible to win against players of the same skill level.
That's why i chose exp over a different function.
0 -
Murador178✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness is determined with the e-function .
I used a different definition for X.
My X is allies-enemy players meaning 0 = 1v1 and 1=2v1 etc.
Also i assumed x is the number of players focusing a single enemy.
As its effectiveness increases exponentially the exponential function seemed to be the best way to determine it
Almost any pvp performance Chart has to be determined with exp(x) because the difficulty of fights doesn't follow a gradual slope and a 1v4 is almost impossible to win against players of the same skill level.
That's why i chose exp over a different function.
hmm I though ur talking only about how much harder it gets with a sload pug zerg vs a normal pug zerg.
Ur x doesnt make senes because a 12v10 would be same hard as 1v3. Thats why i changed the definition of ur X to make it more realistic.
But we could also determine our X:
p*X(BohnT)+(1-p)X(myX)
with p ϵ [0;1]
Edited by Murador178 on May 18, 2018 9:58AM1 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Murador178 wrote: »Murador178 wrote: »If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness is determined with the e-function .
I used a different definition for X.
My X is allies-enemy players meaning 0 = 1v1 and 1=2v1 etc.
Also i assumed x is the number of players focusing a single enemy.
As its effectiveness increases exponentially the exponential function seemed to be the best way to determine it
Almost any pvp performance Chart has to be determined with exp(x) because the difficulty of fights doesn't follow a gradual slope and a 1v4 is almost impossible to win against players of the same skill level.
That's why i chose exp over a different function.
hmm I though ur talking only about how much harder it gets with a sload pug zerg vs a normal pug zerg.
Ur x doesnt make senes because a 12v10 would be same hard as 1v3. Thats why i changed the definition of ur X to make it more realistic.
But we could also determine our X:
p*X(BohnT)+(1-p)X(myX)
with p ϵ [0;1]
That sounds like a good compromise.
But i think everyone gets the just of it that Sload is unbalanced especially in outnumbered situations0 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
2k hits in PvP aren't low, considering that Vigor heals around 1.5k on a high stat build.I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.1 -
Killset✭✭✭✭
What about the time you said you killed 3 people with Incap in 10 seconds?
BohnT spreads more lies, misinformation, and exaggerations in these forums than almost any other poster I have come across.thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
it's not theoretical that's what i got from using the set for 6 months now.
That's because you just Play magsorc and are Always visible for your enemy magblade can evade and 99% of the Players in cyro have to attack something all the time
Dear, that's math. The daedroth has 5,9k tooltip damage roughly. That gets reduced to 2,9k in pvp and then we always have CP, resistances. You won't even get a 3k hit from this. It can't crit, which you are surely aware of after 6 months.
And you are hopefully aware that testing by tooltip is ***?
Also the Deadroth deals 25% more damage against vamps as it deals flame damage.
Whatever it is, you are not dealing 5k hits as you claim, never. Not without daedric prey.
I noticed in many of your posts, that you tend to tell pve numbers and not pvp numbers. Which is very misleading and not happening in pvp. In this thread alone it happened 2 times.
Dude go to OW pvp use the set and see how you can reach 5k hits with that pet.
Better go back to your Sorc posts and cry that sorcs are useless
What Sorc posts and where am I crying ? Seems like someone is a bit displeased that his theoretical numbers are not waterproof.
I am dealing between 4-5k against pve mobs, so in what world will you deal the same amount to players ? It's simply impossible and that's what I wanted to make clear. Your theory in all honor, but don't make up numbers yes ?
You are crying in every post how bad sorcs are in every single post.
Well i guess my pvp experience is just theory while your theoretical testing in PvE is actual testing?
Create a magnb with the same build (because you don't have one to begin with) then go to pvp and test it.
Oh wow. How can there be so many mistakes and lies in a single post. Gladly will I add a screenshot of my maxed out and geared up Nightblade. You haven't even met me in game, so you know nothing. At least I have never seen any of your chars before, raising the question if you're even playing.
So and what build exactly ? There is little what can affect a proc set tooltip other than CP. Or are you telling me, that 8% from merciless resolve will add 3k damage to that thing ? Right now, I'm beginning to wonder if we are having a big misunderstanding here, because you can't possibly be that confused. Are you proposing that Maw deals 3-5k damage with a single blow or over its entire duration ? I was assuming we are speaking about a single hit. Spread over the entire duration, that number would seem more realistic for a mBlade.
Well maybe you don't see my chars because I'm not running around in the Ic even though i killed you there few times but that's been more than a year ago, haven't seen you either.
25% from flame damage
20% from incap
8% minor vulnerability
8% minor berserk
25% major beserk (not even used but possible)
Necro isn't reflected in the tooltip
That's how you get that thing to hit for 5k
I have been in Cyrodiil more often than I was in IC the past few weeks and I have not seen you or anytime before, provided your forum @ is the same as in game. And since I can not remember ever being killed by a single player alone while I was in IC unless it was an Emperor, I highly doubt in the truth of that story either. I hear these "Oh, I killed you X times ago"-stories all the time. According to these, even the Inn-Wife of Daggerfall has beaten me up before.
And there we have it, you are merely spreading theories that you haven't even tested yourself. Your Major Berserk point proves that perfectly. Just stop darling, it never happened.
Can you quote/link some lies and misinformation?
He will probably link the Nb post as he didn't understand how i can hit 9/10 incaps.
And we know how things work here:
If i can't do it no one can, if others can still do it they lie or are cheating
1 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
What about the time you said you killed 3 people with Incap in 10 seconds?
BohnT spreads more lies, misinformation, and exaggerations in these forums than almost any other poster I have come across.thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
it's not theoretical that's what i got from using the set for 6 months now.
That's because you just Play magsorc and are Always visible for your enemy magblade can evade and 99% of the Players in cyro have to attack something all the time
Dear, that's math. The daedroth has 5,9k tooltip damage roughly. That gets reduced to 2,9k in pvp and then we always have CP, resistances. You won't even get a 3k hit from this. It can't crit, which you are surely aware of after 6 months.
And you are hopefully aware that testing by tooltip is ***?
Also the Deadroth deals 25% more damage against vamps as it deals flame damage.
Whatever it is, you are not dealing 5k hits as you claim, never. Not without daedric prey.
I noticed in many of your posts, that you tend to tell pve numbers and not pvp numbers. Which is very misleading and not happening in pvp. In this thread alone it happened 2 times.
Dude go to OW pvp use the set and see how you can reach 5k hits with that pet.
Better go back to your Sorc posts and cry that sorcs are useless
What Sorc posts and where am I crying ? Seems like someone is a bit displeased that his theoretical numbers are not waterproof.
I am dealing between 4-5k against pve mobs, so in what world will you deal the same amount to players ? It's simply impossible and that's what I wanted to make clear. Your theory in all honor, but don't make up numbers yes ?
You are crying in every post how bad sorcs are in every single post.
Well i guess my pvp experience is just theory while your theoretical testing in PvE is actual testing?
Create a magnb with the same build (because you don't have one to begin with) then go to pvp and test it.
Oh wow. How can there be so many mistakes and lies in a single post. Gladly will I add a screenshot of my maxed out and geared up Nightblade. You haven't even met me in game, so you know nothing. At least I have never seen any of your chars before, raising the question if you're even playing.
So and what build exactly ? There is little what can affect a proc set tooltip other than CP. Or are you telling me, that 8% from merciless resolve will add 3k damage to that thing ? Right now, I'm beginning to wonder if we are having a big misunderstanding here, because you can't possibly be that confused. Are you proposing that Maw deals 3-5k damage with a single blow or over its entire duration ? I was assuming we are speaking about a single hit. Spread over the entire duration, that number would seem more realistic for a mBlade.
Well maybe you don't see my chars because I'm not running around in the Ic even though i killed you there few times but that's been more than a year ago, haven't seen you either.
25% from flame damage
20% from incap
8% minor vulnerability
8% minor berserk
25% major beserk (not even used but possible)
Necro isn't reflected in the tooltip
That's how you get that thing to hit for 5k
I have been in Cyrodiil more often than I was in IC the past few weeks and I have not seen you or anytime before, provided your forum @ is the same as in game. And since I can not remember ever being killed by a single player alone while I was in IC unless it was an Emperor, I highly doubt in the truth of that story either. I hear these "Oh, I killed you X times ago"-stories all the time. According to these, even the Inn-Wife of Daggerfall has beaten me up before.
And there we have it, you are merely spreading theories that you haven't even tested yourself. Your Major Berserk point proves that perfectly. Just stop darling, it never happened.
Can you quote/link some lies and misinformation?
He will probably link the Nb post as he didn't understand how i can hit 9/10 incaps.
And we know how things work here:
If i can't do it no one can, if others can still do it they lie or are cheating
Well that's pretty easy.
Start the fight with incap and then nuke the enemy with reverse slice and asylum 2h and Bloodspawn proc
60 ult from that kill + LA ulti points
Next guy eats incap
I eat 2 ults and potion up + major heroism from CP
Guy eats 2 more reverse slices and i got incap again
3rd guy eats incap and gets rekt
That's how it's done, no exaggeration or anything just pure NB rampage with an ulti gen build0 -
Killset✭✭✭✭
I haven't dueled any decent rollerblade on my stamnb or magblade for a long time now, the OW plebs eat my incaps aswell as other duel builds in Bergama.Murador178 wrote: »
BohnT spreads more lies, misinformation, and exaggerations in these forums than almost any other poster I have come across.thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
it's not theoretical that's what i got from using the set for 6 months now.
That's because you just Play magsorc and are Always visible for your enemy magblade can evade and 99% of the Players in cyro have to attack something all the time
Dear, that's math. The daedroth has 5,9k tooltip damage roughly. That gets reduced to 2,9k in pvp and then we always have CP, resistances. You won't even get a 3k hit from this. It can't crit, which you are surely aware of after 6 months.
And you are hopefully aware that testing by tooltip is ***?
Also the Deadroth deals 25% more damage against vamps as it deals flame damage.
Whatever it is, you are not dealing 5k hits as you claim, never. Not without daedric prey.
I noticed in many of your posts, that you tend to tell pve numbers and not pvp numbers. Which is very misleading and not happening in pvp. In this thread alone it happened 2 times.
Dude go to OW pvp use the set and see how you can reach 5k hits with that pet.
Better go back to your Sorc posts and cry that sorcs are useless
What Sorc posts and where am I crying ? Seems like someone is a bit displeased that his theoretical numbers are not waterproof.
I am dealing between 4-5k against pve mobs, so in what world will you deal the same amount to players ? It's simply impossible and that's what I wanted to make clear. Your theory in all honor, but don't make up numbers yes ?
You are crying in every post how bad sorcs are in every single post.
Well i guess my pvp experience is just theory while your theoretical testing in PvE is actual testing?
Create a magnb with the same build (because you don't have one to begin with) then go to pvp and test it.
Oh wow. How can there be so many mistakes and lies in a single post. Gladly will I add a screenshot of my maxed out and geared up Nightblade. You haven't even met me in game, so you know nothing. At least I have never seen any of your chars before, raising the question if you're even playing.
So and what build exactly ? There is little what can affect a proc set tooltip other than CP. Or are you telling me, that 8% from merciless resolve will add 3k damage to that thing ? Right now, I'm beginning to wonder if we are having a big misunderstanding here, because you can't possibly be that confused. Are you proposing that Maw deals 3-5k damage with a single blow or over its entire duration ? I was assuming we are speaking about a single hit. Spread over the entire duration, that number would seem more realistic for a mBlade.
Well maybe you don't see my chars because I'm not running around in the Ic even though i killed you there few times but that's been more than a year ago, haven't seen you either.
25% from flame damage
20% from incap
8% minor vulnerability
8% minor berserk
25% major beserk (not even used but possible)
Necro isn't reflected in the tooltip
That's how you get that thing to hit for 5k
I have been in Cyrodiil more often than I was in IC the past few weeks and I have not seen you or anytime before, provided your forum @ is the same as in game. And since I can not remember ever being killed by a single player alone while I was in IC unless it was an Emperor, I highly doubt in the truth of that story either. I hear these "Oh, I killed you X times ago"-stories all the time. According to these, even the Inn-Wife of Daggerfall has beaten me up before.
And there we have it, you are merely spreading theories that you haven't even tested yourself. Your Major Berserk point proves that perfectly. Just stop darling, it never happened.
Can you quote/link some lies and misinformation?
He will probably link the Nb post as he didn't understand how i can hit 9/10 incaps.
And we know how things work here:
If i can't do it no one can, if others can still do it they lie or are cheating
I hope u are talking about against openworld pugs - I doubt u hit that many on @Ragnaroek93 or any other decent stamblade.
@BohnT indigitially just outplay his opponents hard in his videos .
But you know that I'm not dueling every day so the 9/10 is 80% OW and 20% duels vs non rollerblades.
Ahhh. I get it. So now your 9/10 is 80% and 20% against anyone who is not a potato. This is the problem I have with your posts. You exaggerate and mislead to bolster your argument. You site experiences that are completely unique to you or just downright untrue.
When I fight or duel good players on my NB I do NOT land 90% of my incaps. When I fight or duel good NB’s they do NOT land 90% of their incaps on me. Ever. I get that everyone is given to exaggeration and hyperbole. I get that everyone tends to perceive their unique experiences as something that is happening across the game on every platform. But when you do it with the agenda of nerfing the NB class with such voracity as you have I start to take issue.
I have no issue with nerf NB discussions. But when people invent scenarios or grossly exaggerate to make their case I have to speak up.
P.S. To keep us on topic, nerf Sloads.
Edited by Killset on May 18, 2018 12:58PM3 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
I haven't dueled any decent rollerblade on my stamnb or magblade for a long time now, the OW plebs eat my incaps aswell as other duel builds in Bergama.Murador178 wrote: »
BohnT spreads more lies, misinformation, and exaggerations in these forums than almost any other poster I have come across.thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
it's not theoretical that's what i got from using the set for 6 months now.
That's because you just Play magsorc and are Always visible for your enemy magblade can evade and 99% of the Players in cyro have to attack something all the time
Dear, that's math. The daedroth has 5,9k tooltip damage roughly. That gets reduced to 2,9k in pvp and then we always have CP, resistances. You won't even get a 3k hit from this. It can't crit, which you are surely aware of after 6 months.
And you are hopefully aware that testing by tooltip is ***?
Also the Deadroth deals 25% more damage against vamps as it deals flame damage.
Whatever it is, you are not dealing 5k hits as you claim, never. Not without daedric prey.
I noticed in many of your posts, that you tend to tell pve numbers and not pvp numbers. Which is very misleading and not happening in pvp. In this thread alone it happened 2 times.
Dude go to OW pvp use the set and see how you can reach 5k hits with that pet.
Better go back to your Sorc posts and cry that sorcs are useless
What Sorc posts and where am I crying ? Seems like someone is a bit displeased that his theoretical numbers are not waterproof.
I am dealing between 4-5k against pve mobs, so in what world will you deal the same amount to players ? It's simply impossible and that's what I wanted to make clear. Your theory in all honor, but don't make up numbers yes ?
You are crying in every post how bad sorcs are in every single post.
Well i guess my pvp experience is just theory while your theoretical testing in PvE is actual testing?
Create a magnb with the same build (because you don't have one to begin with) then go to pvp and test it.
Oh wow. How can there be so many mistakes and lies in a single post. Gladly will I add a screenshot of my maxed out and geared up Nightblade. You haven't even met me in game, so you know nothing. At least I have never seen any of your chars before, raising the question if you're even playing.
So and what build exactly ? There is little what can affect a proc set tooltip other than CP. Or are you telling me, that 8% from merciless resolve will add 3k damage to that thing ? Right now, I'm beginning to wonder if we are having a big misunderstanding here, because you can't possibly be that confused. Are you proposing that Maw deals 3-5k damage with a single blow or over its entire duration ? I was assuming we are speaking about a single hit. Spread over the entire duration, that number would seem more realistic for a mBlade.
Well maybe you don't see my chars because I'm not running around in the Ic even though i killed you there few times but that's been more than a year ago, haven't seen you either.
25% from flame damage
20% from incap
8% minor vulnerability
8% minor berserk
25% major beserk (not even used but possible)
Necro isn't reflected in the tooltip
That's how you get that thing to hit for 5k
I have been in Cyrodiil more often than I was in IC the past few weeks and I have not seen you or anytime before, provided your forum @ is the same as in game. And since I can not remember ever being killed by a single player alone while I was in IC unless it was an Emperor, I highly doubt in the truth of that story either. I hear these "Oh, I killed you X times ago"-stories all the time. According to these, even the Inn-Wife of Daggerfall has beaten me up before.
And there we have it, you are merely spreading theories that you haven't even tested yourself. Your Major Berserk point proves that perfectly. Just stop darling, it never happened.
Can you quote/link some lies and misinformation?
He will probably link the Nb post as he didn't understand how i can hit 9/10 incaps.
And we know how things work here:
If i can't do it no one can, if others can still do it they lie or are cheating
I hope u are talking about against openworld pugs - I doubt u hit that many on @Ragnaroek93 or any other decent stamblade.
@BohnT indigitially just outplay his opponents hard in his videos .
But you know that I'm not dueling every day so the 9/10 is 80% OW and 20% duels vs non rollerblades.
Ahhh. I get it. So now your 9/10 is 80% and 20% against anyone who is not a potato. This is the problem I have with your posts. You exaggerate and mislead to bolster your argument. You site experiences that are completely unique to you or just downright untrue.
When I fight or duel good players on my NB I do NOT land 90% of my incaps. When I fight or duel good NB’s they do NOT land 90% of their incaps on me. Ever. I get that everyone is given to exaggeration and hyperbole. I get that everyone tends to perceive their unique experiences as something that is happening across the game on every platform. But when you do it with the agenda of nerfing the NB class with such voracity as you have I start to take issue.
I have no issue with nerf NB discussions. But when people invent scenarios or grossly exaggerate to make their case I have to speak up.
P.S. To keep us on topic, nerf Sloads.
Wrong, i said that my experience of hitting an average of 9/10 incaps Comes from how i spent my playtime. 80% in OW pvp and 20% in Duels, that means i have days in OW and duels where i hit every incap and days and fights when People get hit by Maybe 6/10 incaps but in the end 9/10 incaps on target is what turned out to be a save bet.0 -
Aznox✭✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness is determined with the e-function .
I used a different definition for X.
My X is allies-enemy players meaning 0 = 1v1 and 1=2v1 etc.
Also i assumed x is the number of players focusing a single enemy.
As its effectiveness increases exponentially the exponential function seemed to be the best way to determine it
Almost any pvp performance Chart has to be determined with exp(x) because the difficulty of fights doesn't follow a gradual slope and a 1v4 is almost impossible to win against players of the same skill level.
That's why i chose exp over a different function.
Can you tell me why you think Sload or any oblivion damage like SB would be "exponentially better" in Xv1 ?
The difficulty of the fight can very well follow a gradual slope (strictly proportional) and when the level of incoming damage (Oblivion or not) surpass the healing/sustain/defense capacity of the 1vX'er then he dies.
I think i know why people see (and in this specific case, it is somewhat true) oblivion damage as a strong Xv1 tool : because in the case of your typical magsorc, while the shield line of defense can burst it's effectiveness to defend against 2-5+ opponents (depending on how bad they are), the healing is only sized to repair the occasional damage overflowing the shield defense.
If critsurge is the only healing mechanism, then the healing output is fixed :
one SB user -> no problem
two SB user -> dead
Outside of this specific scenario, i don't see why oblivion damage would scale better than any other sort of damage.
Aznox
PC EU
Khajiit Orc Bosmer Stamina Sorcerer and Werewolf Stage 3 Vampire
I live in Battlegrounds
Theorycrafting enthusiast
Official Cheese Lord
CP1500+ club1 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Murador178 wrote: »If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness is determined with the e-function .
I used a different definition for X.
My X is allies-enemy players meaning 0 = 1v1 and 1=2v1 etc.
Also i assumed x is the number of players focusing a single enemy.
As its effectiveness increases exponentially the exponential function seemed to be the best way to determine it
Almost any pvp performance Chart has to be determined with exp(x) because the difficulty of fights doesn't follow a gradual slope and a 1v4 is almost impossible to win against players of the same skill level.
That's why i chose exp over a different function.
Can you tell me why you think Sload or any oblivion damage like SB would be "exponentially better" in Xv1 ?
The difficulty of the fight can very well follow a gradual slope (strictly proportional) and when the level of incoming damage (Oblivion or not) surpass the healing/sustain/defense capacity of the 1vX'er then he dies.
I think i know why people see (and in this specific case, it is somewhat true) oblivion damage as a strong Xv1 tool : because in the case of your typical magsorc, while the shield line of defense can burst it's effectiveness to defend against 2-5+ opponents (depending on how bad they are), the healing is only sized to repair the occasional damage overflowing the shield defense.
If critsurge is the only healing mechanism, then the healing output is fixed :
one SB user -> no problem
two SB user -> dead
Outside of this specific scenario, i don't see why oblivion damage would scale better than any other sort of damage.
Because if you are playing 1vX you will naturally play more defensively which is completely ignored by oblivion Damage also in pvp the pressure applied by sload becomes very hard to outheal very fast for many builds, most stambuild won't be able to outheal 3 sload procs on them the 4th one will be way more punishing then, also at one Point you are Eating so much Damage that anything is effecive enough to kill the enemy, oblivion Damage just gets to ignore any attempt your enemy will try to defend himslef won't help him unlike against other sorts of Damage.
0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Murador178 wrote: »If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness is determined with the e-function .
I used a different definition for X.
My X is allies-enemy players meaning 0 = 1v1 and 1=2v1 etc.
Also i assumed x is the number of players focusing a single enemy.
As its effectiveness increases exponentially the exponential function seemed to be the best way to determine it
Almost any pvp performance Chart has to be determined with exp(x) because the difficulty of fights doesn't follow a gradual slope and a 1v4 is almost impossible to win against players of the same skill level.
That's why i chose exp over a different function.
Can you tell me why you think Sload or any oblivion damage like SB would be "exponentially better" in Xv1 ?
The difficulty of the fight can very well follow a gradual slope (strictly proportional) and when the level of incoming damage (Oblivion or not) surpass the healing/sustain/defense capacity of the 1vX'er then he dies.
I think i know why people see (and in this specific case, it is somewhat true) oblivion damage as a strong Xv1 tool : because in the case of your typical magsorc, while the shield line of defense can burst it's effectiveness to defend against 2-5+ opponents (depending on how bad they are), the healing is only sized to repair the occasional damage overflowing the shield defense.
If critsurge is the only healing mechanism, then the healing output is fixed :
one SB user -> no problem
two SB user -> dead
Outside of this specific scenario, i don't see why oblivion damage would scale better than any other sort of damage.
I just want to follow-up on the bolded part - I know you only gave an example - but somebody else also stated earlier that crit-surge deals with shieldbreaker... It doesn't.
The shortest cooldown on light-attacks is the bow at 0.6 seconds - which is why most SB users have it on the bow.
Shieldbreaker, from bow-la spam = 2250/0.6 = 3750 dps.
power-surge (the mag version) = 2550 per second / 2(battle-spirit) = 1275 hps. Assuming you attack every second and crit every second to proc it.. reality is probably half that.. more like 600 hps. As long as you're not defiled, that is.. :-)
Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.1 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Murador178 wrote: »If this set makes it into the live version we'll have huge balance issues especially in outnumbered situations.
Sloads general effectiveness is roughly determined by the following graph: exp(2x)+ ε(x)
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ (-∞;0)
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ [0;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies - enemy players)
As everyone can see Sloads performs very well in 1v1 and gets better the more people are using it on outnumbered targets.
It's performance in outnumbered fights is rather weak because you can only apply the dot on one enemy.
Considering pug focusing is completely random:
ε(x)=0 ∀x ϵ [-∞;1]
ε(x)= q ∀x ϵ ]1;∞]
q > 1 determined by different factors (class, build etc.)
x is the result of (allies/enemy players)
So i dont see how u come to the result that sloads effectiveness is determined with the e-function .
I used a different definition for X.
My X is allies-enemy players meaning 0 = 1v1 and 1=2v1 etc.
Also i assumed x is the number of players focusing a single enemy.
As its effectiveness increases exponentially the exponential function seemed to be the best way to determine it
Almost any pvp performance Chart has to be determined with exp(x) because the difficulty of fights doesn't follow a gradual slope and a 1v4 is almost impossible to win against players of the same skill level.
That's why i chose exp over a different function.
Can you tell me why you think Sload or any oblivion damage like SB would be "exponentially better" in Xv1 ?
The difficulty of the fight can very well follow a gradual slope (strictly proportional) and when the level of incoming damage (Oblivion or not) surpass the healing/sustain/defense capacity of the 1vX'er then he dies.
I think i know why people see (and in this specific case, it is somewhat true) oblivion damage as a strong Xv1 tool : because in the case of your typical magsorc, while the shield line of defense can burst it's effectiveness to defend against 2-5+ opponents (depending on how bad they are), the healing is only sized to repair the occasional damage overflowing the shield defense.
If critsurge is the only healing mechanism, then the healing output is fixed :
one SB user -> no problem
two SB user -> dead
Outside of this specific scenario, i don't see why oblivion damage would scale better than any other sort of damage.
I just want to follow-up on the bolded part - I know you only gave an example - but somebody else also stated earlier that crit-surge deals with shieldbreaker... It doesn't.
The shortest cooldown on light-attacks is the bow at 0.6 seconds - which is why most SB users have it on the bow.
Shieldbreaker, from bow-la spam = 2250/0.6 = 3750 dps.
power-surge (the mag version) = 2550 per second / 2(battle-spirit) = 1275 hps. Assuming you attack every second and crit every second to proc it.. reality is probably half that.. more like 600 hps. As long as you're not defiled, that is.. :-)
shieldbreaker deals 2100 on Gold so dps is a bit lower but still impossible to outheal not even doable on most magnb builds0 -
Sureshawt✭✭✭✭arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
3 -
Killset✭✭✭✭
Exactly.arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
0 -
Killset✭✭✭✭
In your original post you claimed to hit 9/10 Incaps as a basis for the skill being nerfed. In this post you claim to hit 8/10 Incaps in open world, 2/10 Incaps in duels, days where every Incap lands and other days where only 6/10 land. Then through some extremely complicated algorithm or just plain sorcery you arrive at 9/10 Incaps landing. Just stop.
I haven't dueled any decent rollerblade on my stamnb or magblade for a long time now, the OW plebs eat my incaps aswell as other duel builds in Bergama.Murador178 wrote: »
BohnT spreads more lies, misinformation, and exaggerations in these forums than almost any other poster I have come across.thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
it's not theoretical that's what i got from using the set for 6 months now.
That's because you just Play magsorc and are Always visible for your enemy magblade can evade and 99% of the Players in cyro have to attack something all the time
Dear, that's math. The daedroth has 5,9k tooltip damage roughly. That gets reduced to 2,9k in pvp and then we always have CP, resistances. You won't even get a 3k hit from this. It can't crit, which you are surely aware of after 6 months.
And you are hopefully aware that testing by tooltip is ***?
Also the Deadroth deals 25% more damage against vamps as it deals flame damage.
Whatever it is, you are not dealing 5k hits as you claim, never. Not without daedric prey.
I noticed in many of your posts, that you tend to tell pve numbers and not pvp numbers. Which is very misleading and not happening in pvp. In this thread alone it happened 2 times.
Dude go to OW pvp use the set and see how you can reach 5k hits with that pet.
Better go back to your Sorc posts and cry that sorcs are useless
What Sorc posts and where am I crying ? Seems like someone is a bit displeased that his theoretical numbers are not waterproof.
I am dealing between 4-5k against pve mobs, so in what world will you deal the same amount to players ? It's simply impossible and that's what I wanted to make clear. Your theory in all honor, but don't make up numbers yes ?
You are crying in every post how bad sorcs are in every single post.
Well i guess my pvp experience is just theory while your theoretical testing in PvE is actual testing?
Create a magnb with the same build (because you don't have one to begin with) then go to pvp and test it.
Oh wow. How can there be so many mistakes and lies in a single post. Gladly will I add a screenshot of my maxed out and geared up Nightblade. You haven't even met me in game, so you know nothing. At least I have never seen any of your chars before, raising the question if you're even playing.
So and what build exactly ? There is little what can affect a proc set tooltip other than CP. Or are you telling me, that 8% from merciless resolve will add 3k damage to that thing ? Right now, I'm beginning to wonder if we are having a big misunderstanding here, because you can't possibly be that confused. Are you proposing that Maw deals 3-5k damage with a single blow or over its entire duration ? I was assuming we are speaking about a single hit. Spread over the entire duration, that number would seem more realistic for a mBlade.
Well maybe you don't see my chars because I'm not running around in the Ic even though i killed you there few times but that's been more than a year ago, haven't seen you either.
25% from flame damage
20% from incap
8% minor vulnerability
8% minor berserk
25% major beserk (not even used but possible)
Necro isn't reflected in the tooltip
That's how you get that thing to hit for 5k
I have been in Cyrodiil more often than I was in IC the past few weeks and I have not seen you or anytime before, provided your forum @ is the same as in game. And since I can not remember ever being killed by a single player alone while I was in IC unless it was an Emperor, I highly doubt in the truth of that story either. I hear these "Oh, I killed you X times ago"-stories all the time. According to these, even the Inn-Wife of Daggerfall has beaten me up before.
And there we have it, you are merely spreading theories that you haven't even tested yourself. Your Major Berserk point proves that perfectly. Just stop darling, it never happened.
Can you quote/link some lies and misinformation?
He will probably link the Nb post as he didn't understand how i can hit 9/10 incaps.
And we know how things work here:
If i can't do it no one can, if others can still do it they lie or are cheating
I hope u are talking about against openworld pugs - I doubt u hit that many on @Ragnaroek93 or any other decent stamblade.
@BohnT indigitially just outplay his opponents hard in his videos .
But you know that I'm not dueling every day so the 9/10 is 80% OW and 20% duels vs non rollerblades.
Ahhh. I get it. So now your 9/10 is 80% and 20% against anyone who is not a potato. This is the problem I have with your posts. You exaggerate and mislead to bolster your argument. You site experiences that are completely unique to you or just downright untrue.
When I fight or duel good players on my NB I do NOT land 90% of my incaps. When I fight or duel good NB’s they do NOT land 90% of their incaps on me. Ever. I get that everyone is given to exaggeration and hyperbole. I get that everyone tends to perceive their unique experiences as something that is happening across the game on every platform. But when you do it with the agenda of nerfing the NB class with such voracity as you have I start to take issue.
I have no issue with nerf NB discussions. But when people invent scenarios or grossly exaggerate to make their case I have to speak up.
P.S. To keep us on topic, nerf Sloads.
Wrong, i said that my experience of hitting an average of 9/10 incaps Comes from how i spent my playtime. 80% in OW pvp and 20% in Duels, that means i have days in OW and duels where i hit every incap and days and fights when People get hit by Maybe 6/10 incaps but in the end 9/10 incaps on target is what turned out to be a save bet.
P.S. Nerf SloadsEdited by Killset on May 18, 2018 5:47PM0 -
BohnT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
In your original post you claimed to hit 9/10 Incaps as a basis for the skill being nerfed. In this post you claim to hit 8/10 Incaps in open world, 2/10 Incaps in duels, days where every Incap lands and other days where only 6/10 land. Then through some extremely complicated algorithm or just plain sorcery you arrive at 9/10 Incaps landing. Just stop.
I haven't dueled any decent rollerblade on my stamnb or magblade for a long time now, the OW plebs eat my incaps aswell as other duel builds in Bergama.Murador178 wrote: »
BohnT spreads more lies, misinformation, and exaggerations in these forums than almost any other poster I have come across.thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
it's not theoretical that's what i got from using the set for 6 months now.
That's because you just Play magsorc and are Always visible for your enemy magblade can evade and 99% of the Players in cyro have to attack something all the time
Dear, that's math. The daedroth has 5,9k tooltip damage roughly. That gets reduced to 2,9k in pvp and then we always have CP, resistances. You won't even get a 3k hit from this. It can't crit, which you are surely aware of after 6 months.
And you are hopefully aware that testing by tooltip is ***?
Also the Deadroth deals 25% more damage against vamps as it deals flame damage.
Whatever it is, you are not dealing 5k hits as you claim, never. Not without daedric prey.
I noticed in many of your posts, that you tend to tell pve numbers and not pvp numbers. Which is very misleading and not happening in pvp. In this thread alone it happened 2 times.
Dude go to OW pvp use the set and see how you can reach 5k hits with that pet.
Better go back to your Sorc posts and cry that sorcs are useless
What Sorc posts and where am I crying ? Seems like someone is a bit displeased that his theoretical numbers are not waterproof.
I am dealing between 4-5k against pve mobs, so in what world will you deal the same amount to players ? It's simply impossible and that's what I wanted to make clear. Your theory in all honor, but don't make up numbers yes ?
You are crying in every post how bad sorcs are in every single post.
Well i guess my pvp experience is just theory while your theoretical testing in PvE is actual testing?
Create a magnb with the same build (because you don't have one to begin with) then go to pvp and test it.
Oh wow. How can there be so many mistakes and lies in a single post. Gladly will I add a screenshot of my maxed out and geared up Nightblade. You haven't even met me in game, so you know nothing. At least I have never seen any of your chars before, raising the question if you're even playing.
So and what build exactly ? There is little what can affect a proc set tooltip other than CP. Or are you telling me, that 8% from merciless resolve will add 3k damage to that thing ? Right now, I'm beginning to wonder if we are having a big misunderstanding here, because you can't possibly be that confused. Are you proposing that Maw deals 3-5k damage with a single blow or over its entire duration ? I was assuming we are speaking about a single hit. Spread over the entire duration, that number would seem more realistic for a mBlade.
Well maybe you don't see my chars because I'm not running around in the Ic even though i killed you there few times but that's been more than a year ago, haven't seen you either.
25% from flame damage
20% from incap
8% minor vulnerability
8% minor berserk
25% major beserk (not even used but possible)
Necro isn't reflected in the tooltip
That's how you get that thing to hit for 5k
I have been in Cyrodiil more often than I was in IC the past few weeks and I have not seen you or anytime before, provided your forum @ is the same as in game. And since I can not remember ever being killed by a single player alone while I was in IC unless it was an Emperor, I highly doubt in the truth of that story either. I hear these "Oh, I killed you X times ago"-stories all the time. According to these, even the Inn-Wife of Daggerfall has beaten me up before.
And there we have it, you are merely spreading theories that you haven't even tested yourself. Your Major Berserk point proves that perfectly. Just stop darling, it never happened.
Can you quote/link some lies and misinformation?
He will probably link the Nb post as he didn't understand how i can hit 9/10 incaps.
And we know how things work here:
If i can't do it no one can, if others can still do it they lie or are cheating
I hope u are talking about against openworld pugs - I doubt u hit that many on @Ragnaroek93 or any other decent stamblade.
@BohnT indigitially just outplay his opponents hard in his videos .
But you know that I'm not dueling every day so the 9/10 is 80% OW and 20% duels vs non rollerblades.
Ahhh. I get it. So now your 9/10 is 80% and 20% against anyone who is not a potato. This is the problem I have with your posts. You exaggerate and mislead to bolster your argument. You site experiences that are completely unique to you or just downright untrue.
When I fight or duel good players on my NB I do NOT land 90% of my incaps. When I fight or duel good NB’s they do NOT land 90% of their incaps on me. Ever. I get that everyone is given to exaggeration and hyperbole. I get that everyone tends to perceive their unique experiences as something that is happening across the game on every platform. But when you do it with the agenda of nerfing the NB class with such voracity as you have I start to take issue.
I have no issue with nerf NB discussions. But when people invent scenarios or grossly exaggerate to make their case I have to speak up.
P.S. To keep us on topic, nerf Sloads.
Wrong, i said that my experience of hitting an average of 9/10 incaps Comes from how i spent my playtime. 80% in OW pvp and 20% in Duels, that means i have days in OW and duels where i hit every incap and days and fights when People get hit by Maybe 6/10 incaps but in the end 9/10 incaps on target is what turned out to be a save bet.
Dude i don't know what's hard to understand About my post but let's read it again.
my experience of hitting an average of 9/10 incaps Comes from how i spent my playtime. 80% in OW pvp and 20% in Duels, that means i have days in OW and duels where i hit every incap and days and fights when People get hit by Maybe 6/10 incaps but in the end 9/10 incaps on target is what turned out to be a save bet.
So what is the information that can be found in this text?
1. I spend 80% of my playtime in OW cyro and 20% in duels
2. 9/10 incaps is the amount of hits i can count on
I hope this was easy enough for you to understandEdited by BohnT on May 18, 2018 6:22PM1 -
Koolio✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭2.6k views and 220 plus comments. No Dev Answer.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom
Is this intended or not?
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Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭In your original post you claimed to hit 9/10 Incaps as a basis for the skill being nerfed. In this post you claim to hit 8/10 Incaps in open world, 2/10 Incaps in duels, days where every Incap lands and other days where only 6/10 land. Then through some extremely complicated algorithm or just plain sorcery you arrive at 9/10 Incaps landing. Just stop.
Ehm... he said he spends 20% of his time in duels, not that 20% of his incaps in duels hit.0 -
Killset✭✭✭✭
Ok, however you arrive at the fact that you land 9/10 Incaps is an exaggeration or an experience unique to you. I don’t know of any NB’s that would boast this kind of success rate on Xbox NA. And I know some good ones.
In your original post you claimed to hit 9/10 Incaps as a basis for the skill being nerfed. In this post you claim to hit 8/10 Incaps in open world, 2/10 Incaps in duels, days where every Incap lands and other days where only 6/10 land. Then through some extremely complicated algorithm or just plain sorcery you arrive at 9/10 Incaps landing. Just stop.
I haven't dueled any decent rollerblade on my stamnb or magblade for a long time now, the OW plebs eat my incaps aswell as other duel builds in Bergama.Murador178 wrote: »
BohnT spreads more lies, misinformation, and exaggerations in these forums than almost any other poster I have come across.thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »
But you WILL experience how much it sucks to have an important aspect of your class being countered all the time with no counterplay.
You WILL experience? Like, are you serious? Unlike shield users, NB's have been experiencing it every day since the game has been released. There are so many things that can take a NB out of cloak compared to the one(!) set that goes through shields the comparison is not even this >< little accurate.
*shakes head*
And sload is fine. For all practical purposes, It will increase the cases where my NB's cloak failed to hide me maybe by 0.5%, if that.
Yeah I agree with this in substance and in spirit.
The truth is: No one plays a nightblade because it is easy. No one stuck it out through OT and Homestead because the class was dream to play. The mentality just isn't the same. It's a risk-junkie's class, not a rofl-stomper's class.
Nightblades had it so complicated for so long that they're not going to flail about when things get harder because of one set. I'd wager we'll see more people from the other classes complain about Sloads.
Some recent converts to nightblades may *** and moan, *** and groan about life getting more difficult for nightblades. They may even hold funerals for their nightblades, and then declare the class dead while moving onto some other FOTM. Good riddance.
In their premature schadenfreude regarding cloak being countered by Sloads, the anti-nightblade faction reveals their own lack of fortitude in assuming that others will flail about as they did. The mentality just isn't the same. The class doesn't attract people who struggle with adaptability.
PS: Considering that Shieldbreaker was used for the longest time in pro-sorc arguments against nerfing shields ("They have a hard-counter."), the anti-nightblades may wish to avoid casting Sloads as a cloak-countering set. After all, who needs to adjust cloak when you can just put on Sloads?
I agree. The good stamina nightblades are going to do fine. There might be fewer out there for those that can’t deal with the reduced healing.
A few bad NB will no doubt rage-reroll to Sorc, since the damage combos on it this patch are insane.
I think we’ll see more magblades this patch. Minus the strife thing, I really think the class is about to be insanely good. Kind of a secret OP meta that I know a few of you have already figured out. I’ll shut up about it now.
I don't think it will every be a magblade meta because of how the class plays. most players even really good players can't get the playstyle down. As well as magblade being slow and squishy open world which is a horrible combination. Along wit Cloak being pure garbage if you are snared. Magblade will be strong 1v1 next update like it always is but it will still struggle open world and this will never change until the class gets some snare immunity. There is just something about being slow and squishy, with delayed burst that just doesn't go well with open world pvp. The class is also caught in between two very popular builds. If you like to play a ranged character mag sorc is generally better for open world PvP as well as stamblade being the most popular nightblade build. Magblade is kind of like mag dk you can buff both the classes and a lot of people still won't play them or complain about them. They will keep getting better 1v1 but most people don't care about dueling builds. It would be nice to see some other magblades in cyrodiil instead of all hanging outside of wayrest
***?
Magblade is one of the best OW specs in the game and it's the easiest to never ever die once if you are tryharding.
And it only got buffed, the meditate and undo abilities are so much better on a magnb than on other classes because you can kite so good now and even better with the new shade.
Magnb isn't squishy or anything because you don't take damage for 90% of an OW fight as you can kite and cloak around all the time.
If you can't keep up with Will just use infused torugs with fire enchants or Prismatic damage enchants that'll give you 5k burst every 1.4 seconds or up to 9k with the prismatic enchant.
Or you just slot Caluurion although i think torugs is much better as you get 630 spelldamage with the beserk enchant and you just have more pressure and not just a single burst peak every 10 seconds.
You can't live in cloak as a magblade your bow up time will be horrible as well as you will slow down the tempo of the fight, but if you do choose to live in cloak which I don't recommend you are probably playing a melee build with snare immunity. you need about 2500 mag regen to sustain a Cloak spamming build. Meaning you will have to make huge sacrifices to your damage. You really need to run double utility sets to even make magblade function for solo play. With your only damage set being a monster set.
You can Cloak and survive any 1v1 or 1v2 by running away I agree but that's not in combat survivability. And that's not winning the fight running away is basically dying your just don't have To actually win a fight with a magblade you are going to need spend majority of the fight out of cloak. Low regen high damage magblades are only viable for Zerg surfing.
Nope I'm running a potion cooldown build with necro+alchemist so no "utility" here and i still have 100% cloak uptime easily.
There isn't much you have to sacrifice as a magnb especially not next patch.
I don't know which build you are running but i guarantee there are better builds out there if you have issues with magnb and OW fights
I run riposte lich skoria it allows me to run all damage glyphs. If i switch to a damaged set I'll have to run a couple regen glyphs. Alchamist/necro is a bad outdated build. I ran that build for a little while before 1T it was a decent dueling build back then with alot of 1 *** potential but it can't sustain 1vX any more with the siphoning attacks change. Your build also lacks regen a experienced player can put you on your back foot and you'd be done your build doesn't have enough sustain unless you are using all 3 glyphs as regen glyphs. The fact that you are living in cloak tells me you are not very experienced with magblade and not familiar with the class in general. And your build tells me that you are probably Zerg surfing or grouping and not really 1vXing. I play solo so my builds will be a little different. If you are playing magblade solo first and foremost you want to make sure you get at least 24k health so you want be one shot. Next you need to build enough to sustain to survive being defensive because solo play it's impossible to control a fight 100% of the time like you can in a 1v1 it's too many variables. Lastly you focus on damage because you get damage from your combos. Anyone building high damage magblades are behind almost a year worth of updates. Unless you are playing a game build
Oh here comes the self proclaimed NB overlord.
Riposte is a crappy set on magnb you have 100% uptime on minor maim on any enemy that can attack you if you don't you don't understand how to kite and move during combat.
In any 1vX where you face too many players to apply minor maim with fear and shade on them you will either run away or they are so bad that you don't need it at first.
Sherlock if you play argonian with alchemist you are sitting at 25k health all the time.
I'm not living in cloak i don't get where you got that idea from i'm just able to keep cloak spam up if i need to.
I have fights against top good players with their duel builds that lasted longer than 15min but yeah you definitly know how bad sustain is also potion cooldown build and 3 regen glyphs? Do you even play the game
You can control any 1vX fight against 1vX background artist and you should know that unless you are one aswell.
Which platform are you on just so i know if i should even waste my time any further?
I play Xbox NA many people consider me an elite level magblade, most people believe me to be in the top 5 of all magblade mains on my platform. I've never really liked or embraced claims like this but I have helped many new magblades who are actually pretty good now by giving them tactics and build advice.
You can't control all 1vX fights it's impossible. If you are using 3 regen glyphs what's the point of using alchamist. You can run a utility set that allows you the utility of the set as well as the regen to run less regen glyphs meaning you can get an additional 522 spell damage as well as more regen and utility. That's why your build is outdated like I said I ran that build in 2016 back when you could run all damage glyphs and it was pretty strong not so much anymore.
That's also a common misconception riposte is a great set on magblade for solo play. I agree it is wasted in a 1v1 but 1vX you are going to be in 1v5, 1v6 situations at this point this set starts to become really good there is no way to keep up maim enough with just shade in this situation now if you run away from these fights that's a different story, but I'm trying to win these type of fights which I win a good deal of fights like this.
You said you were living in cloak when you said you don't take damage for 90% of a open world fight which means you are spamming Cloak. It's impossible other wise because there are too many variables in open world from gankers to snare spam and everything in between. If you are controlling every 1vX it's time for you to fight better players.
I'm using 3 potion cooldown glyphs no regen glyphs as they are much better and will be even better next patch, they free up any need for stamina sustain and magicka sustain can be done with ele drain and siphoning strikes if you really need it.
I don't take damage because i use shade, cloak and crippling grasp to avoid damage aswell as Maw of the infernal the true God of taunting 1vX material.
Maybe 90% was an exaggeration but overall i take way less damage than other builds.
Are you really using maw of the infernal ? Why would you do that ?
as @Derra already mentioned it works as a huge Walking Pleb annoyance mix that with the ability of NBs to be invisible and many Players are lured into attacking your pets rather than you.
Also the Damage and pressure is Pretty good i get average hits of About 3-5k and the flame breath deals upto 9k on Vamps.
it's not a set that Shows you it's effectiveness on any statsheet but once you use it for some time on magnb you'll see how often it takes hits for you or helps you to put pressure on enemies you try to kill.
But as always, you are naming pve numbers. The daedroth hits for around 2 k in pvp vs badly armored players, everything else is mathematically impossible for a nightblade and the Daedroths slow speed combined with the tiny cone of his breath (which is sadly a third of what the animation implies) makes it very unlikely that a player will get hit by this, Auri-El forbid the entire breath.
As someone who has tested this set alot in hope for it to show effectiveness, I must say your post sounds very theoretical. I get the thing about the meatshield though and I shall further test this to see if this really helps. It seems that I never have the luck to encounter players who hit my pet. I would be interested to hear more though Maybe more experiences you have made, in a private message if you have the time.
it's not theoretical that's what i got from using the set for 6 months now.
That's because you just Play magsorc and are Always visible for your enemy magblade can evade and 99% of the Players in cyro have to attack something all the time
Dear, that's math. The daedroth has 5,9k tooltip damage roughly. That gets reduced to 2,9k in pvp and then we always have CP, resistances. You won't even get a 3k hit from this. It can't crit, which you are surely aware of after 6 months.
And you are hopefully aware that testing by tooltip is ***?
Also the Deadroth deals 25% more damage against vamps as it deals flame damage.
Whatever it is, you are not dealing 5k hits as you claim, never. Not without daedric prey.
I noticed in many of your posts, that you tend to tell pve numbers and not pvp numbers. Which is very misleading and not happening in pvp. In this thread alone it happened 2 times.
Dude go to OW pvp use the set and see how you can reach 5k hits with that pet.
Better go back to your Sorc posts and cry that sorcs are useless
What Sorc posts and where am I crying ? Seems like someone is a bit displeased that his theoretical numbers are not waterproof.
I am dealing between 4-5k against pve mobs, so in what world will you deal the same amount to players ? It's simply impossible and that's what I wanted to make clear. Your theory in all honor, but don't make up numbers yes ?
You are crying in every post how bad sorcs are in every single post.
Well i guess my pvp experience is just theory while your theoretical testing in PvE is actual testing?
Create a magnb with the same build (because you don't have one to begin with) then go to pvp and test it.
Oh wow. How can there be so many mistakes and lies in a single post. Gladly will I add a screenshot of my maxed out and geared up Nightblade. You haven't even met me in game, so you know nothing. At least I have never seen any of your chars before, raising the question if you're even playing.
So and what build exactly ? There is little what can affect a proc set tooltip other than CP. Or are you telling me, that 8% from merciless resolve will add 3k damage to that thing ? Right now, I'm beginning to wonder if we are having a big misunderstanding here, because you can't possibly be that confused. Are you proposing that Maw deals 3-5k damage with a single blow or over its entire duration ? I was assuming we are speaking about a single hit. Spread over the entire duration, that number would seem more realistic for a mBlade.
Well maybe you don't see my chars because I'm not running around in the Ic even though i killed you there few times but that's been more than a year ago, haven't seen you either.
25% from flame damage
20% from incap
8% minor vulnerability
8% minor berserk
25% major beserk (not even used but possible)
Necro isn't reflected in the tooltip
That's how you get that thing to hit for 5k
I have been in Cyrodiil more often than I was in IC the past few weeks and I have not seen you or anytime before, provided your forum @ is the same as in game. And since I can not remember ever being killed by a single player alone while I was in IC unless it was an Emperor, I highly doubt in the truth of that story either. I hear these "Oh, I killed you X times ago"-stories all the time. According to these, even the Inn-Wife of Daggerfall has beaten me up before.
And there we have it, you are merely spreading theories that you haven't even tested yourself. Your Major Berserk point proves that perfectly. Just stop darling, it never happened.
Can you quote/link some lies and misinformation?
He will probably link the Nb post as he didn't understand how i can hit 9/10 incaps.
And we know how things work here:
If i can't do it no one can, if others can still do it they lie or are cheating
I hope u are talking about against openworld pugs - I doubt u hit that many on @Ragnaroek93 or any other decent stamblade.
@BohnT indigitially just outplay his opponents hard in his videos .
But you know that I'm not dueling every day so the 9/10 is 80% OW and 20% duels vs non rollerblades.
Ahhh. I get it. So now your 9/10 is 80% and 20% against anyone who is not a potato. This is the problem I have with your posts. You exaggerate and mislead to bolster your argument. You site experiences that are completely unique to you or just downright untrue.
When I fight or duel good players on my NB I do NOT land 90% of my incaps. When I fight or duel good NB’s they do NOT land 90% of their incaps on me. Ever. I get that everyone is given to exaggeration and hyperbole. I get that everyone tends to perceive their unique experiences as something that is happening across the game on every platform. But when you do it with the agenda of nerfing the NB class with such voracity as you have I start to take issue.
I have no issue with nerf NB discussions. But when people invent scenarios or grossly exaggerate to make their case I have to speak up.
P.S. To keep us on topic, nerf Sloads.
Wrong, i said that my experience of hitting an average of 9/10 incaps Comes from how i spent my playtime. 80% in OW pvp and 20% in Duels, that means i have days in OW and duels where i hit every incap and days and fights when People get hit by Maybe 6/10 incaps but in the end 9/10 incaps on target is what turned out to be a save bet.
Dude i don't know what's hard to understand About my post but let's read it again.
my experience of hitting an average of 9/10 incaps Comes from how i spent my playtime. 80% in OW pvp and 20% in Duels, that means i have days in OW and duels where i hit every incap and days and fights when People get hit by Maybe 6/10 incaps but in the end 9/10 incaps on target is what turned out to be a save bet.
So what is the information that can be found in this text?
1. I spend 80% of my playtime in OW cyro and 20% in duels
2. 9/10 incaps is the amount of hits i can count on
I hope this was easy enough for you to understand
As for Sloads, my hope is that if the set stays in the game as is, they revisit the DOT pulling NB out of stealth. Given the strength of this set, it’s almost a sure thing that it will become main stream. If this happens the main NB defense skill and a class defining ability will be crippled.
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MalakithAlamahdi✭✭✭✭✭brandonv516 wrote: »Truth of the matter is, Cloak counters are insufficient, or NBs wouldn't be rocking Cyro.
Very naive. Players not choosing to slot counters to Cloak is the reason they appear to be lacking. Many don't want to make the sacrifice so they just lay down to NBs and then whine about it.
But you go ahead and use a 5 piece set to counter NBs when you could have used 1 skill slot!
Strawman argument.
Cloak counters are indeed lacking because they´re single purpose. No other ability requires you to use specific counters that only counter said ability and are useless against anything else.
Comes by, medium armor passives also work or skills like magelight. Making the range in which it detects you about 1m only, which is less then light attack range on mele weapons.0 -
MalakithAlamahdi✭✭✭✭✭arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
I disagree. The only reason cloak supresses DoT's in the first place is because ZoS couldn't make it so that it damages you without pulling you from cloak. It's a bandaid fix that made cloak overpreform. So I doubt they can even program it to deal damage without pulling you from cloak if they wanted. Currently it does what it does to anyone, which is giving unavoidable damage. Getting damage pulls you from cloak so it's being consistent according to the games rules. I get that it can be annoying, but It won't break cloak, I'm pretty sure about that.3 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MalakithAlamahdi wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
I disagree. The only reason cloak supresses DoT's in the first place is because ZoS couldn't make it so that it damages you without pulling you from cloak. It's a bandaid fix that made cloak overpreform. So I doubt they can even program it to deal damage without pulling you from cloak if they wanted. Currently it does what it does to anyone, which is giving unavoidable damage. Getting damage pulls you from cloak so it's being consistent according to the games rules. I get that it can be annoying, but It won't break cloak, I'm pretty sure about that.
Yep.
Complaining that something that breaks every suppression (Even the blatently OP cloak dots) isn't being suppressed, and an ability that breaks on damage is being broken on damage is real funny.
I'd rather NBs take damage from dots and abilities en route, (still untargettable) and mark/detect would allow you to see and hit them, but not break unless AoE'd/reveal skilled.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.2 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭MalakithAlamahdi wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
I disagree. The only reason cloak supresses DoT's in the first place is because ZoS couldn't make it so that it damages you without pulling you from cloak. It's a bandaid fix that made cloak overpreform. So I doubt they can even program it to deal damage without pulling you from cloak if they wanted. Currently it does what it does to anyone, which is giving unavoidable damage. Getting damage pulls you from cloak so it's being consistent according to the games rules. I get that it can be annoying, but It won't break cloak, I'm pretty sure about that.
That's not why Cloak supresses dots. It supresses dots because the purge was nerfed. So instead of cloak purging negative effects the base morph now supresses dots. Which was a pretty big Nerf actually for magblade at least. It changed the way I played the game completely.1 -
MalakithAlamahdi✭✭✭✭✭thankyourat wrote: »MalakithAlamahdi wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
I disagree. The only reason cloak supresses DoT's in the first place is because ZoS couldn't make it so that it damages you without pulling you from cloak. It's a bandaid fix that made cloak overpreform. So I doubt they can even program it to deal damage without pulling you from cloak if they wanted. Currently it does what it does to anyone, which is giving unavoidable damage. Getting damage pulls you from cloak so it's being consistent according to the games rules. I get that it can be annoying, but It won't break cloak, I'm pretty sure about that.
That's not why Cloak supresses dots. It supresses dots because the purge was nerfed. So instead of cloak purging negative effects the base morph now supresses dots. Which was a pretty big Nerf actually for magblade at least. It changed the way I played the game completely.
The issue was that you could still be pulled out by the dot's that remained after the ones that were purged got removed. It was their way of fixing that issue while still keeping the effect a bit similar. If you got a big amount of dot's on you it's a buff over the purge it used to have. It's overtuned either way.1 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭MalakithAlamahdi wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »MalakithAlamahdi wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
I disagree. The only reason cloak supresses DoT's in the first place is because ZoS couldn't make it so that it damages you without pulling you from cloak. It's a bandaid fix that made cloak overpreform. So I doubt they can even program it to deal damage without pulling you from cloak if they wanted. Currently it does what it does to anyone, which is giving unavoidable damage. Getting damage pulls you from cloak so it's being consistent according to the games rules. I get that it can be annoying, but It won't break cloak, I'm pretty sure about that.
That's not why Cloak supresses dots. It supresses dots because the purge was nerfed. So instead of cloak purging negative effects the base morph now supresses dots. Which was a pretty big Nerf actually for magblade at least. It changed the way I played the game completely.
The issue was that you could still be pulled out by the dot's that remained after the ones that were purged got removed. It was their way of fixing that issue while still keeping the effect a bit similar. If you got a big amount of dot's on you it's a buff over the purge it used to have. It's overtuned either way.
I agree it's over tuned but so is ever thing else in the game because skills in this game don't have cool downs Which is the way most of us like. Yesterday I fought a mag dk who did nothing but hold block and try to crowd control, between block and wings I could do no damage. I know magsorcs who I'll never break through their shield stack. Templars keeping everyone alive with BoL. Cloak isn't any better or worse than these skills it's just different. I could make a case for all these being over tunedEdited by thankyourat on May 19, 2018 11:45AM4 -
Koensol✭✭✭✭✭
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You have a valid point. The truth is this combat system is inherently unbalanced and every strong non ult ability will be spammed or abused. The devs way of balancing this through resources is not really as effective as having a skill put on cd. I mean I like the fast paced combat without cd, but it definately has its trade-offs.thankyourat wrote: »MalakithAlamahdi wrote: »thankyourat wrote: »MalakithAlamahdi wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »At the very least, if the DOT should do damage through Cloak, it shouldn't pull you out of it. Getting hit with a Shield Breaker proc doesn't remove your shield, it just goes through the shield, but with Sload's on you using Cloak is a literal waste of magicka, it won't protect you against anything.
This is the key issue.
The DOT doing irresistible damage while cloaked is nasty enough but pulling you out of cloak to expose you to all other damage including other DOTs that are supposed to be suppressible defeats the entire skills purpose completely.
I disagree. The only reason cloak supresses DoT's in the first place is because ZoS couldn't make it so that it damages you without pulling you from cloak. It's a bandaid fix that made cloak overpreform. So I doubt they can even program it to deal damage without pulling you from cloak if they wanted. Currently it does what it does to anyone, which is giving unavoidable damage. Getting damage pulls you from cloak so it's being consistent according to the games rules. I get that it can be annoying, but It won't break cloak, I'm pretty sure about that.
That's not why Cloak supresses dots. It supresses dots because the purge was nerfed. So instead of cloak purging negative effects the base morph now supresses dots. Which was a pretty big Nerf actually for magblade at least. It changed the way I played the game completely.
The issue was that you could still be pulled out by the dot's that remained after the ones that were purged got removed. It was their way of fixing that issue while still keeping the effect a bit similar. If you got a big amount of dot's on you it's a buff over the purge it used to have. It's overtuned either way.
I agree it's over tuned but do is ever thing else in the game because skills in this game don't have cool down. Which is the way most of us like. Yesterday I fought a mag dk who did nothing but hold block and try to crowd control, between block and wings I could do know damage. I know magsorcs who I'll never break through their shield stack. Templars keeping everyone alive with BoL. Cloak isn't any better or worse than these skills it's just different. I could make a case for all these being over tuned0 -
WeylandLabs✭✭✭✭✭I can't wait for rerelease of proc sets instant damage being able to crit again. Lol
On the other hand if we still had that Cyrodiil wouldn't be out of control, unless your a zergling.
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KingJ✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm ok with it going through cloak and damaging the Nb but it shouldn't break cloak.I'm just saying if it kept a sorc from using shields or templar from purging we would see more out cry but people can't stand NB.3
This discussion has been closed.