Has this ever being different? In any pvp game I ever saw stealth based classes have been very popular and very strong. That's in my opinion inbuilt in such a kind of game design.

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Had to cut off a bit, and I'm just passing on what was told to me

Hope that crit CP won't affect healing too. Healing needs definitely more nerfs, so that we all have actually even more fun to fight the magicka duroks cancer meta

All we need is to make defile affect shields.. then see the rage on forums

Minalan wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Had to cut off a bit, and I'm just passing on what was told to me

Hope that crit CP won't affect healing too. Healing needs definitely more nerfs, so that we all have actually even more fun to fight the magicka duroks cancer meta

All we need is to make defile affect shields.. then see the rage on forums

I would be fine with that if there was a corresponding buff to counter that.

Befoul is countered by blessed CP, and the buffs major and minor mending, countered by the defile debuff.

Shattering blows is countered by bastion, but there are no buffs or debuffs for shields right now.

Having major and minor shield buffs though would just make shields more ridiculous for anyone not running defile - thus making that debuff a build requirement for basically everyone.

TL;DR add a buff and debuff class for shields to be fair. Dont try to stick it on defile.

You are the exact reason I wrote that post.

Yes, we need befoul working on shields so that people like you can stop with the ''hurr durr it counters major mending so its fine''.
Yeah I'm pretty sure my 3 seconds of major mending for 4k magicka is so super overpowered. Its also probably why magDks just use 2x dragon blood instead. cus major mending OP, should be countered, Am I rite?

Healing problem is created by healbots, how does a debuff that cuts healing in half sounds balanced to anyone, that can also be only countered by other healbots, which adds more to the insult, I just can't understand at all.

Waffennacht wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Had to cut off a bit, and I'm just passing on what was told to me

Hope that crit CP won't affect healing too. Healing needs definitely more nerfs, so that we all have actually even more fun to fight the magicka duroks cancer meta

All we need is to make defile affect shields.. then see the rage on forums

I would be fine with that if there was a corresponding buff to counter that.

Befoul is countered by blessed CP, and the buffs major and minor mending, countered by the defile debuff.

Shattering blows is countered by bastion, but there are no buffs or debuffs for shields right now.

Having major and minor shield buffs though would just make shields more ridiculous for anyone not running defile - thus making that debuff a build requirement for basically everyone.

TL;DR add a buff and debuff class for shields to be fair. Dont try to stick it on defile.

You are the exact reason I wrote that post.

Yes, we need befoul working on shields so that people like you can stop with the ''hurr durr it counters major mending so its fine''.
Yeah I'm pretty sure my 3 seconds of major mending for 4k magicka is so super overpowered. Its also probably why magDks just use 2x dragon blood instead. cus major mending OP, should be countered, Am I rite?

Healing problem is created by healbots, how does a debuff that cuts healing in half sounds balanced to anyone, that can also be only countered by other healbots, which adds more to the insult, I just can't understand at all.

The CP tree is too much for defile. 45% healing reduction - with some of the lowest cost (free from a set, a hard CC x2)

Shield strength is really strong 1v1 (mostly - have faced some damage dealers capable of dealing more damage per gcd than my shield) but really rather poor in groups.

Keep in mind all heals (practically) also heal another player, BoL as an example (or resto abilities) so in XvX you're getting way more value than a shield.

Personally, befoul needs to curve like the main damage stats

Then there's Earthgore which just laughs at my whole discussion

purge itself is a ridicilous thing. earthgore is the proof why its a ridicilous thing.
I would be fine with befoul if it actually worked on healbots and I didnt had to spam reverb like every 2-3 seconds.

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Had to cut off a bit, and I'm just passing on what was told to me

Hope that crit CP won't affect healing too. Healing needs definitely more nerfs, so that we all have actually even more fun to fight the magicka duroks cancer meta

All we need is to make defile affect shields.. then see the rage on forums

This is now a nerf sorc thread

Vanzen wrote: »

If something makes me quit this game, it will be (Stam) NBs in BGs.

It drives me mad.

The absolute unfairness of their tools in no cp BG environment is an outrageaous game breaking scandal.

This sounds eerily reminiscent of Imperial City release. For a long time it was nothing but a feeding pit for Nightblades.

jhharvest wrote: »

I play NB because everyone else plays NB. Why Piercing Mark is a NB skill I will never understand. Having to play one class to counter that same class is really, really weird game design.

Ain’t that the truth

Aedaryl wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Befoul should scale to 25%.

Healing is getting removed from class crit damage passives and it should be detached from precise strikes and elfborn.

Then we’ll have a good start to balancing healing and defiles.

Shields scale really poorly so they should stay defile free. However I think we should change the scaling on shields so that they’re about 75% of present strength overall and get a major/minor system so that class shields don’t stack with annulment.

Then you’d need to buff native sorc healing somehow, probably by adding the increased healing to both morphs of Surge and give stam and magika each a unique effect beyond that.

So you want to nerf shield stacking and shield strengh ?

Pretty bad idea.

We need a major/minor shield system so Annulment can't stack with hardened ward.

Then we need shattering blows being removed, because it's too strong, block and dodge doesn't have counter, no reason shield should have one.

We also need a harness magicka nerf, it give far too much (free defense spammable) magicka back.

Finally we need a major shield system to make major shields (class shields + annulment) scale with the number of ennemies.

Then, it's balanced.

block and dodge have counters, if we start listing the skills which go through dodge:
Dots, Magbased AoEs, AoE Ultimates,PotL, Zaan, channeled Beams, Jabs, Shalks, curse, endless fury execute applies through dodge, Ground AoEs in lag almost any ability can hit you mid dodgeroll.
Dodge only shines when you are on a Nightblade. You don't see dodging DKs anymore, medium armor stamsorcs with crazy speed which dodge for days or stamplars in medium armor which charge into an enemy kill them and then escape with dodgeroll. Those things are dead in Cyro and so are they in duels

Block gets countered by Dots, Ground AoEs, curse, PotL , fozilize, fear, mage rune, shalks, destro ult.
Also blocking is extremely expensive, with full block cost reduction you are looking at 1.6k stamina drain per second while not gaining stam through regen, all sources which made it possible to sustain while blocking got nerfed into oblivion. Blocking reduces your mobility a lot and in a game where the mobile classes die only a small portion of the time the tanky classes die mobility is king and you don't have it on block builds.


Shattering blows is the counerpart of bastion, it's even worse than all other counters in the CP system as things like heavy attack damage, direct damage, Dot damage or physical / magic damage increase help you against all enemies you encounter while Shattering blow works only against a small portion of the community.


With harness you are completely right however, this was mentioned when Morrowind sustain nerfs came and they didn't bother to change it

Aedaryl wrote: »

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Befoul should scale to 25%.

Healing is getting removed from class crit damage passives and it should be detached from precise strikes and elfborn.

Then we’ll have a good start to balancing healing and defiles.

Shields scale really poorly so they should stay defile free. However I think we should change the scaling on shields so that they’re about 75% of present strength overall and get a major/minor system so that class shields don’t stack with annulment.

Then you’d need to buff native sorc healing somehow, probably by adding the increased healing to both morphs of Surge and give stam and magika each a unique effect beyond that.

So you want to nerf shield stacking and shield strengh ?

Pretty bad idea.

We need a major/minor shield system so Annulment can't stack with hardened ward.

Then we need shattering blows being removed, because it's too strong, block and dodge doesn't have counter, no reason shield should have one.

We also need a harness magicka nerf, it give far too much (free defense spammable) magicka back.

Finally we need a major shield system to make major shields (class shields + annulment) scale with the number of ennemies.

Then, it's balanced.

Shattering blows isn't even comparable to defile, let alone defile+befoul. Defile+befoul take away about half your healing, post all buffs.

Shattering gives 25% extra damage, which even when full, doesn't guarantee an exact 25% reduction to the users shield uptime. Because it doesn't just take away an amount, like siphoned, it's based off the users damage.

Shield doesn't have any other debuffs because instead of health damage scaling of resistances, shields don't, and instead scale size wise of mag, which isnt debuffed.

They don't even have type counters, only oblivion and cheesebreaker.

Everything else I generally agree with, not sure about pure size increase per person, since you could end up with dynamic ultimate level issues. Per person would be weird with shields too.

Buff streak, mines, lightning form and some other things and then it's fine.

Aedaryl wrote: »

Finally we need a major shield system to make major shields (class shields + annulment) scale with the number of ennemies.

Then, it's balanced.

lol, someone tell this dude what happened to mDk after dynamic ult regen.