XP Exploit Poll

Sparr0w · February 2018

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

If me and my buddy have millions in our bank accounts, is it really stealing if I snatch $100 from his wallet? Or $1000? I mean he won't even notice, and I don't even need it.

Well @danno8 , personally, I don't think you should go to jail for it, as long as it happened while you were watching TV or reading a book or something.

Think it's more like you ask your millionaire buddy for $10 to pay for pizza as you don't have change & he leaves $1000 on the table.

Slick_007 · February 2018

Lucifers_Pain wrote: »

[

You yourself has no doubt broke the agreement and still played. For example when group finder was broke it was a clearly a bug but i'm guessing you still played. You gained nothing and you couldn't avoid it just like a max level toon gaining xp.

is this guy serious? im guessing they are one of the cheaters who got banned and now wants to try and get everyone on his side to go and whine to zos about how much player support they got, yet clearly doesnt know, still, what an exploit is. or a bug. or what the difference is.

VaranisArano · February 2018

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Castiel_Boomer by all means, give us a theoretical example of something you feel they would currently consider an exploit that you feel you would derive no benefit from?

Because I'm fairly sure the definition speaks for itself. 'Benefit' can come in a number of forms. I can think of no examples where your definition could possibly exist.

The usual argument I'm familiar with is that if someone was way past max CP and all skills they need maxed out, there was no benefit gained from the bugged exp.

Which I'm not sure I agree with, given that players still treat high CP as a mark of experience (rightly or wrongly), but is also besides the point with the Code of Conduct says it doesn't matter whether or not you gain an advantage.

Nihility42 · February 2018

I voted yes, because it is still technically an exploit. Still think the punishment and reaction was overdone tough.

NewBlacksmurf · February 2018

Exploit or cheating, etc. isn’t based on the amount of benefit compared to another but it’s IF YOU DID or didn’t.

Pretty simple

Subversus · February 2018

Does someone have a screenshot of how they announce you've been banned for exploiting in your mail or whatever? You can blur out the names, I'm really just curious to see how it looks like when you realize you done *** up

Ackwalan · February 2018

Another post complaining about how they only cheated a little bit.

woe · February 2018

Inarre wrote: »

Exploiting is still exploiting whether or not it benefits the one exploiting.

If I stole something from a store that I didn't need, It would still be against the law.

Running through lava in a dungeon does not explicitly further your progression, nor does it necessarily prove intention, whereas, say, repeating the same dungeon to get specific rewards that were unintended would be more apt to be called an exploit because the intention is clear through the repetition, and the motive is clear because of the reward. Running through lava has no reward and I can't see a situation where you would run through it repeatedly to achieve something.

Turelus · February 2018

Subversus wrote: »

Does someone have a screenshot of how they announce you've been banned for exploiting in your mail or whatever? You can blur out the names, I'm really just curious to see how it looks like when you realize you done *** up

@Subversus there was a link to one in a previous thread. It's basically just a long email explaining that you've been suspended due to exploiting, you can reply to it with any questions. I don't remember much of the finer details of if it said what the exploit you used was etc.

Merlin13KAGL · February 2018

VaranisArano wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

Castiel_Boomer by all means, give us a theoretical example of something you feel they would currently consider an exploit that you feel you would derive no benefit from?

Because I'm fairly sure the definition speaks for itself. 'Benefit' can come in a number of forms. I can think of no examples where your definition could possibly exist.

The usual argument I'm familiar with is that if someone was way past max CP and all skills they need maxed out, there was no benefit gained from the bugged exp.

Which I'm not sure I agree with, given that players still treat high CP as a mark of experience (rightly or wrongly), but is also besides the point with the Code of Conduct says it doesn't matter whether or not you gain an advantage.

Except that is a flawed argument unless you're sitting at 3600, which no one is.

You still gained CP. Doesn't matter that you don't get to place them until somewhere down the line. You still gained CP, therefore gain, therefore exploit.

Merlin13KAGL · February 2018

Sparr0w wrote: »

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

If me and my buddy have millions in our bank accounts, is it really stealing if I snatch $100 from his wallet? Or $1000? I mean he won't even notice, and I don't even need it.

Well @danno8 , personally, I don't think you should go to jail for it, as long as it happened while you were watching TV or reading a book or something.

Think it's more like you ask your millionaire buddy for $10 to pay for pizza as you don't have change & he leaves $1000 on the table.

I was mocking the fact that some people try to use the "I didn't notice" excuse because they weren't fully tuned into the game, as if that's somehow the game's fault.

DoctorESO · February 2018

An exploit is an exploit is an exploit.

Emma_Overload · February 2018

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

It's an exploit solely because ZOS said it is. And I'd wager that they decided upon that based on the overall deviance from the norm. Skipping 30 or so mobs at the cost of potential gear to get guaranteed gear only marginally faster is not adding more to the player too quickly. Getting 1000x the exp from a single mob is.

ZOS said they were going through this on a case by case basis. Which means the reason for the bans are based on the players intent. If they were unknowingly gathering xp, then they would be exempt. If the player was intentionally trying to see how much xp they could accrue from these mobs at that time, they would get punished.

The problem with this is that ZOS has no friggin clue what the players' intent was if they don't ask any of us. ZOS only sends form letters in response to players' questions.

Emma_Overload · February 2018

bethsheba wrote: »

It's a couple week suspension. Why is it still being discussed? Zos made it extremely clear anyone punished could submit an appeal if they wanted, with an explanation such as you posed (full cp full levels) and they would review it to see if it had merit to be reversed. Otherwise, if guilty, they have a couple weeks to do something else, watch the rest of the Olympics, plot their revenge, whatever. I know I personally neglect ALL my other games for my true love, ESO, and for that I am ashamed.

Submitting an appeal didn't do anything except generate an automated response that reiterated the same information that was in the original suspension letter. ZOS has yet to show any sign that they are looking at individual accounts in response to player appeals.

Ackwalan · February 2018

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

It's an exploit solely because ZOS said it is. And I'd wager that they decided upon that based on the overall deviance from the norm. Skipping 30 or so mobs at the cost of potential gear to get guaranteed gear only marginally faster is not adding more to the player too quickly. Getting 1000x the exp from a single mob is.

ZOS said they were going through this on a case by case basis. Which means the reason for the bans are based on the players intent. If they were unknowingly gathering xp, then they would be exempt. If the player was intentionally trying to see how much xp they could accrue from these mobs at that time, they would get punished.

The problem with this is that ZOS has no friggin clue what the players' intent was if they don't ask any of us. ZOS only sends form letters in response to players' questions.

You spent hours in a zone earning many CP. I didn't know is not a valid excuse. With the logs at hand, intent is clear.

WuffyCerulei · February 2018

The IC thing was an accident, which does indeed happen. It was a huge accident, though, and people went ahead and got huge amounts of XP when they knew they shouldn't have.
The only thing with the bans that I have an issue with is that some innocent people who happened upon the XP incident were banned. Like they were grinding tel var for the new boxes, and just because they happened to be in that area, they got banned.

Ydrisselle · February 2018

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

It's an exploit solely because ZOS said it is. And I'd wager that they decided upon that based on the overall deviance from the norm. Skipping 30 or so mobs at the cost of potential gear to get guaranteed gear only marginally faster is not adding more to the player too quickly. Getting 1000x the exp from a single mob is.

ZOS said they were going through this on a case by case basis. Which means the reason for the bans are based on the players intent. If they were unknowingly gathering xp, then they would be exempt. If the player was intentionally trying to see how much xp they could accrue from these mobs at that time, they would get punished.

The problem with this is that ZOS has no friggin clue what the players' intent was if they don't ask any of us. ZOS only sends form letters in response to players' questions.

They won't ask "why did you do it", they never will. You can write down you reasons in your answer, and it's possible that you remain tempbanned. But I think many people tried to tell you that already...

joaaocaampos · February 2018

There are two different situations here. XP and Dungeon. In some cases, skipping mobs is not exploit.

There's Fungal Grotto, and you can use water to skip two bosses. If this was an exploit, why is there a chest under the bridge? I think the same goes for City of Ash II.

I don't know about other dungeons and trials.

Emma_Overload · February 2018

Ackwalan wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

It's an exploit solely because ZOS said it is. And I'd wager that they decided upon that based on the overall deviance from the norm. Skipping 30 or so mobs at the cost of potential gear to get guaranteed gear only marginally faster is not adding more to the player too quickly. Getting 1000x the exp from a single mob is.

ZOS said they were going through this on a case by case basis. Which means the reason for the bans are based on the players intent. If they were unknowingly gathering xp, then they would be exempt. If the player was intentionally trying to see how much xp they could accrue from these mobs at that time, they would get punished.

The problem with this is that ZOS has no friggin clue what the players' intent was if they don't ask any of us. ZOS only sends form letters in response to players' questions.

You spent hours in a zone earning many CP. I didn't know is not a valid excuse. With the logs at hand, intent is clear.

"I didn't know" isn't just an excuse, it's the truth. I stopped paying attention to XP and CP gains a long time ago when I passed the CP cap. Even if I had noticed how much XP mobs were dropping, it wouldn't have meant anything to me because I have no idea how much they're supposed to drop in the first place!

If you want to talk about "logs", then let them look at the logs before and after patch day that show that I play almost every day for MONTHS in the Imperial City. I didn't go down to IC on patch to exploit, I went down there because that's where I always play.

VaranisArano · February 2018

WuffyCerulei wrote: »

The IC thing was an accident, which does indeed happen. It was a huge accident, though, and people went ahead and got huge amounts of XP when they knew they shouldn't have.
The only thing with the bans that I have an issue with is that some innocent people who happened upon the XP incident were banned. Like they were grinding tel var for the new boxes, and just because they happened to be in that area, they got banned.

They weren't banned because "they happened to be in the same area." They were banned because they were gaining sufficient amounts of bugged exp for ZOS to take note, for whatever reason that person claims they gained that exp (didn't care, didn't notice, thought ZOS wouldn't care, whatever.)

vyndral13preub18_ESO · February 2018

Yes. Although I’m baffled why anyone would care how fast some one levels.

VaranisArano · February 2018

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

Yes. Although I’m baffled why anyone would care how fast some one levels.

Yet I'm not baffled that ZOS would care that people took advantage of bugged exp in the Imperial City to gain levels faster than intended...or that some people simply played around in the Imperial City gaining bugged exp and never reported the bugged exp for whatever reason.

Its more about breaking the Terms of Service and Code of Conduct we all agreed to than it is just about the exp.

red_emu · February 2018

Exploit is an exploit. If you discover something that gives you an unfair advantage over other players and you gain a lot of something for nothing - it's a bug and should be reported not used to get unfair gains which is against T's and C's which we have all agreed to. I get that some players were possibly suspended unfairly (many reasons have been brought up why someone could maybe not notice the XP gains), but considering the fact that that those accounts weren't banned I think ZOS found a good balance between punishing exploiters and teaching others a lesson that no matter how many forum threads and hate you pour onto here, you break the rules, you will be punished.

JJBoomer · February 2018

All of this.

Is at ZOS's discretion. they get to decide what counts as an exploit, they get to decide how that is handled. they get to decide how to punish people that break/violate their TOS.

this is what every single one of us AGREE to, when we electronically sign the digital contract presented to us before we begin using the product. If you (general you) didn't read any of that and this is all coming as a surprise to you, then yes, that is 100% on you.

Period. End of story. There is no debate here. You agreed to these terms the moment you booted up this game for the first time and clicked "Accept" or "Agree" to all those contracts. We all did.

Now if you're going to shirk these rules and say screw it and try to take advantage, then yes. Consequences abound. 276 people. That is the number. That is an exact number. I expected it to be higher. Which tells me that ZOS definitely took a look around to pinpoint which players were in fact, taking advantage. And how they get to decide that, is at their discretion.

You don't have to like it. Whether or not you do is completely irrelevant and I highly suggest people practice some radical acceptance. Because these contract and TOS's exist within EVERY online product, service, or game you will ever use.

I hate saying this, but at this point, it's the only relevant thing to be said. If you don't like the rules, if you disagree with what you already agreed to, then don't play the game. Go make your own game with no rules and no TOS. I guarantee you, you will find yourself in ZOS's position very quickly.

Accept that you broke the rules. Take responsibility. Wait out your (tbh, generous) 2-3 week suspension and be adults please jfc.

jssriot · February 2018

1) people still look at over-the-soft-cap CP level of other players to gauge how long they've been playing, and thus make assumptions of their skill and experience. Whether they admit it or not, they do, in both pve and pvp.

2) I literally saw some of these players advertising and inviting other players to group with them or otherwise get in on the exploit which is also explicitly against the TOS, so if they were doing that, the ban was justified, regardless of their own CP level

Ackwalan · February 2018

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Avran_Sylt wrote: »

It's an exploit solely because ZOS said it is. And I'd wager that they decided upon that based on the overall deviance from the norm. Skipping 30 or so mobs at the cost of potential gear to get guaranteed gear only marginally faster is not adding more to the player too quickly. Getting 1000x the exp from a single mob is.

ZOS said they were going through this on a case by case basis. Which means the reason for the bans are based on the players intent. If they were unknowingly gathering xp, then they would be exempt. If the player was intentionally trying to see how much xp they could accrue from these mobs at that time, they would get punished.

The problem with this is that ZOS has no friggin clue what the players' intent was if they don't ask any of us. ZOS only sends form letters in response to players' questions.

You spent hours in a zone earning many CP. I didn't know is not a valid excuse. With the logs at hand, intent is clear.

"I didn't know" isn't just an excuse, it's the truth. I stopped paying attention to XP and CP gains a long time ago when I passed the CP cap. Even if I had noticed how much XP mobs were dropping, it wouldn't have meant anything to me because I have no idea how much they're supposed to drop in the first place!

If you want to talk about "logs", then let them look at the logs before and after patch day that show that I play almost every day for MONTHS in the Imperial City. I didn't go down to IC on patch to exploit, I went down there because that's where I always play.

You think you are the only person to reach the CP cap? Lots of people (including me) have stop looking at XP gain, and we still notice that big banner that goes across the screen every time. There is no add-on to turn that off. You said you spent 2+hours in IC and earned around 30 CP. There is no way you couldn't figure out something was wrong.

Cpt_Teemo · February 2018

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

Yes. Although I’m baffled why anyone would care how fast some one levels.

I'm baffled that everyone thinks they should get away with exploiting no matter if it benefits them or not. The goal it to teach cheaters a lesson, single player games are meant for cheating not MMO's, Moba's, etc while online playing with others.

Abysswarrior45 · February 2018

They should've rerolled the patch. Some players don't read the forums and/or play IC and kill mobs without noticing the xp gains while looking for players/telvar farming mobs. If they had rerolled, then players who spent time grinding would have just wasted their own time. The bug was the developers fault.

Abysswarrior45 · February 2018

And I'm on console so no, I haven't exploited.

Cpt_Teemo · February 2018

Abysswarrior45 wrote: »

They should've rerolled the patch as some players don't read the forums and/or play IC and kill mobs without noticing the xp gains while looking for players or teller farming mobs. If they had rerolled then players who spent time grinding would have just wasted their own time. The bug was the developers fault.

Also then the rest of the 99.8% of the entire game will be pissed off even if it was just a few hours