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Sorcerer PVP
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Takes-No-Prisoner✭✭✭✭✭
✭I can´t quite put my finger on it but every time someone coming from a different class is trying to tell my sorry 105 million ap made solo/smallgrp on sorc ass that the class is fine and i`m just doing it wrong/whatever i get supertriggered.
It´s like trump talking about climate change. Just makes me want to hurt someone.
Surge a pve skill - where literally everyone uses spellpower pots
That is why I stay away from those discussions. I'd rather be knowledgeable about the classes I play, but there is clearly a big distinction between knowing what I know, and knowing what someone whose played the toon for 4 years knows, hehehe.0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Malamar1229 wrote: »I have multiple sorcs,To get rid of shield stacking, the class needs an overhaul -in a number of ways.
I mean, a competent shield user doesn't just stack and laugh... They use a combination of dodging and dmg reduction gear/abilities to protect the shield, and then a bit of survivability to take part-hits so the shield can drop enough to finish your burst.
NB does the former much better than sorc cos cloak and shade (when it works).
Templar/dk/warden does the second better with the ability to both block and heal on a sword n board bar.
If a sorc can no longer stack, they suddenly become worse, defensively than every other mag class who can use a single shield. Sorc will then need to be able to use snb to survive. But that isn't possible on the front bar because there is no spammable. Nor is it possible on the back-bar because there is no block-castable heal..
Complete overhaul...
My take on this would be sorc can no longer stack shields (at all - not even healing ward). Bad for other classes.
You can only have dmg shields with a total strength of 120% of you characters hp - this is halved by battlespirit resulting in maximum of 60% hp value in shields.
Bolt escape + morphs forcemiss attacks for the duration of the port (0.5s or sth - not a complete gcd).
Bol escape + morphs penalty reduced to 33% cost increase and 3s duration.
Streak morph suffers no cost increase if you deal dmg with it.
Powersurge now only grants major sorcery and heals for 3s but the heal becomes 15% weaker each second (effect refreshable).
0s (initial hit) 100% heal 2550
1s 85% heal 2170
2s 70% heal 1785
3s 55% heal 1400
Boundless storm removes snares + roots on activation (no immunity time).
Offensively i´d probably just restore fragments to it´s old state.
Really all they need to do it nerf the magicka refund on harness when stacked with another shield. Have you tried stacking shields with the dampen morph? It doesn’t work for long.
Completely agree on frags though. No idea what they’re thinking, but they broke the class badly.
It seems they gut something on Sorc every few patches. Meanwhile, they still haven’t touched troll king, yet pirate skeleton had to change NOW!
I think my proposed changes would lead to sorcs becoming better against multiple opponents while at the same time becoming less tanky against a single one. which would benefit the class greatly.
Stacking dampen + hardened does not even have to work for long - if you´re fighting in a situation where you know you´ll get friendly add.
It´s the same as permablocking and backpeddal. It creates asinine gameplay where you simple outtank an opponent for x amount of time without any actualy counterplay but just spamming 2 / holding 1 button.
It´s too effective and too easy.
Not really if you can’t even use healing ward with hardened ward up. It means we can’t even heal on top of everything else.
I don’t even want to talk about Sorc nerfs right now, we’re in such a bad place that it’s hard to even have a remotely respectful dialogue with you about it.
Then you see the off balance changes next patch and what it’s going to do to our already super-powered MagDK overlords, and you wonder if anyone at ZOS has half a brain or even gives a %#*^.
We need that stun and damage back on crystal frags. It won’t ‘fix’ our class, but it’ll make dealing with the garbage mechanics in this game more palatable.
We shouldnt have to farm veteran Dragonstar just to be able to play the game. I can’t even find a damn group for this dungeon, it can’t be pugged, and Im about frustrated enough to go back on hiatus for another six months.
The surge change would be a tremendous buff for selfhealing on sorc.
The change to bolt escape + boundless would once again center sorc more around survival due to superior mobility instead of tanking opponents.
I play sorc solo almost daily still - so i have to admit i fail to see where my proposed changes put you in a position where its hard to have a respectful dialogue.
I think the changes would greatly increase survivability on sorcs that play mobility oriented.
It would finally make streak a vaible combat spell again.
It would greatly reduce the viability of 2/3 button spamming wannabe sorcs that are inept to kill anything but get kicks out of trolling people with shields.
Trolling people with shields is about all we have left! Lol
I’d definitely like to see a streak buff to offset some shield change. But at this point I doubt Wrobel would give us anything remotely resembling a buff.
I can help you build around force pulse until you get a Vdsa staff. Don't forget there is a trade off running clench over pulse. The latter isn't reflected.
You don't need a masters staff to be effective. I chose that build because I enjoy the play style.
But to Lexys point, I think you just gotta build to high dmg. In around a 1v1 scenario you don't need wizards you can run shadowrend which is probably close to bis....pelican swears it is useful in open world as the tail swipe against X opponents applies the maim debuff to them all, I just never had that level of success with it.
Are you vampire? I have considered dropping it due to all the magdks I encounter especially in duels. It offers nothing but some sustain and survivability which I think we can do without in dueling.
You know I am down for some 2vX on my DC sorc. Once I get my skills to rank IV, I'm sure we can pull off some good stuff.
A pulse build with rune cage is pretty terrible TBH. If I’m going to do that I need one of the new perfected staves from the new vet trial. Same issue though with not having a group. I’d rather run a flame or lightning clench setup and a master staff.
I’ve seen shadowrend pets here and there and I have yet to see anyone actually get hit by the mob. It’s a pet. They’re slow, they bug out, get stuck, and chase the wrong players/mobs 90% of the time. I tried a pet build all week during No-CP, it was really clunky.
I did have fun this weekend, regardless of how many times we both died. We won more than we lost, and even when we did die outnumbered, we took out a couple of them first.
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Lexxypwns✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Malamar1229 wrote: »Yeah sorcerers are in a bad state currently noticeably the weakest class in the game and outclassed in most content. but still Sorcs aren't bad I mean I still tare in up in PVP we just lack the skills that every other class has. for a game that often spouted a play as you want mentality I guess sorcs were left out on that
I guess all those sorcs I see soloing content every other class dies to easily, and the endless carnage they spread in PVP was just an illusion.
Unless you are on Xbox you are full if it. Xbox has a lot more sorcs running around than PC, and it's probably because PC sorcs are fed up with Miats PvP crutches.
I know this because I play sorc on both platforms.
There are apoximately 2 scary sorcs on Xbox though. They’re just potato mashers in the current meta because of the class being gutted and it’s only defensive mechanic having terrible scaling1 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I just want bound armaments would become a whole new ability, could even give what it does now for being slotted, and do something.
I did get to have a group of 4 chase me for a while in IC. But you can't catch a sorc specced for escape (with invis pots)
Which imo is the only stand out aspect of a PvP sorc.
Or maybe give console more control over pets, that'd be cool0 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Go get triggered m8. I'm coming from another class and going "Wow, this is fun and easy to play."
I had a blast playing sorc last night, but it took me way less time to get into it, adjusted, and pull in a good chunk of AP with my own smallscale than it ever did for me to learn to play StamDK and MagDK effectively. StamBlade was similarly fairly easy to learn. Warden was intermediate, and I haven't tried running a non-healer templar yet.
Entropy is solid AF, and I found the returns on it more reliable than Surge (plus it applies a nice DoT). Surge is something I use in vMA (which this sorc is designed for farming originally) and when I don't want to blow tons of cash on doing non-vtrials. The heal is far too small to use in PvP, and frankly I was taking advice on using entropy over it from the three or so main sorcs that I grab advice from in my guilds because they all have countless hours on sorcerer.
I'm not dissing you or telling you how to play, but I am curious if you play other classes outside of sorc much? The difference between MagSorc and MagDK is especially notable (the latter is pretty damn hard to play well), and I found MagSorc way easier to pick up then most stam classes.
There's a difference between "easily picking up" a class and actually playing it at a competitive level.
Are you going to deny then, that sorcerers have the best mobility in the game (on par with, or better than NB), a unique ult that cannot be replicated (negate), excellent shields, the best kill-securing execute ability and passive (fury and implosion), and comparable burst to every other class in the game?
Outside of Earthgore-Destro chains (which are frankly, broken and suck equally to fight for everyone) sorcerers have an excellently defined role that cannot be replicated by any other class as well as being competitive in 1v1 encounters. The only situation they are outright weak in is a 1vX scenario, which is something that can be avoided with awareness, LOS, and Streak.
Sorcs are in a good place. A great place really. They are not weak, and frankly I'd always want one in my group for negate and their execute.
@Malamar1229
I never said sorcs are weak, I play one myself and I don't find them weak one bit. I simply said that there is a difference between learning to play the class easily and actually being good at it.
Sure thing it's easy to streak away or to set up a burst combo, but using them to actually maneuver zergs, get kills and survive/sustain is a different story. You rarely ever kill someone in a single combo.
I'm sure you agree, seeing how you stated you have so many sorcs.Waffennacht wrote: »@Derra has been really on in this thread.
Sorc is easy to pick up because your abilities slot themselves (I mean are you Not gonna run wrath curse frag lmao?)
It's easy to pick up, because there's only one way it can be done.
What's the difference between PvP sorc builds? At most 2 abilities (such as entropy, pet, surge and which hard CC you prefer) that's it.
I would place my money on just about any other class if it was 1v1.
Sure mobility is great on a Sorc, but is constantly running away a viable argument for balance in Combat? I don't think ao
I do agree sorc is pretty *** 1v1, you usually have to outplay your opponent in order to win. We have no sustained pressure (like magblade for example) and our sustain and survivability are based around running away and LOSing, both tactics being unavailable in a duel environment.0 -
Malamar1229✭✭✭✭✭
✭Go get triggered m8. I'm coming from another class and going "Wow, this is fun and easy to play."
I had a blast playing sorc last night, but it took me way less time to get into it, adjusted, and pull in a good chunk of AP with my own smallscale than it ever did for me to learn to play StamDK and MagDK effectively. StamBlade was similarly fairly easy to learn. Warden was intermediate, and I haven't tried running a non-healer templar yet.
Entropy is solid AF, and I found the returns on it more reliable than Surge (plus it applies a nice DoT). Surge is something I use in vMA (which this sorc is designed for farming originally) and when I don't want to blow tons of cash on doing non-vtrials. The heal is far too small to use in PvP, and frankly I was taking advice on using entropy over it from the three or so main sorcs that I grab advice from in my guilds because they all have countless hours on sorcerer.
I'm not dissing you or telling you how to play, but I am curious if you play other classes outside of sorc much? The difference between MagSorc and MagDK is especially notable (the latter is pretty damn hard to play well), and I found MagSorc way easier to pick up then most stam classes.
There's a difference between "easily picking up" a class and actually playing it at a competitive level.
Are you going to deny then, that sorcerers have the best mobility in the game (on par with, or better than NB), a unique ult that cannot be replicated (negate), excellent shields, the best kill-securing execute ability and passive (fury and implosion), and comparable burst to every other class in the game?
Outside of Earthgore-Destro chains (which are frankly, broken and suck equally to fight for everyone) sorcerers have an excellently defined role that cannot be replicated by any other class as well as being competitive in 1v1 encounters. The only situation they are outright weak in is a 1vX scenario, which is something that can be avoided with awareness, LOS, and Streak.
Sorcs are in a good place. A great place really. They are not weak, and frankly I'd always want one in my group for negate and their execute.
@Malamar1229
I never said sorcs are weak, I play one myself and I don't find them weak one bit. I simply said that there is a difference between learning to play the class easily and actually being good at it.
Sure thing it's easy to streak away or to set up a burst combo, but using them to actually maneuver zergs, get kills and survive/sustain is a different story. You rarely ever kill someone in a single combo.
I'm sure you agree, seeing how you stated you have so many sorcs.Waffennacht wrote: »@Derra has been really on in this thread.
Sorc is easy to pick up because your abilities slot themselves (I mean are you Not gonna run wrath curse frag lmao?)
It's easy to pick up, because there's only one way it can be done.
What's the difference between PvP sorc builds? At most 2 abilities (such as entropy, pet, surge and which hard CC you prefer) that's it.
I would place my money on just about any other class if it was 1v1.
Sure mobility is great on a Sorc, but is constantly running away a viable argument for balance in Combat? I don't think ao
I do agree sorc is pretty *** 1v1, you usually have to outplay your opponent in order to win. We have no sustained pressure (like magblade for example) and our sustain and survivability are based around running away and LOSing, both tactics being unavailable in a duel environment.
@Subversus , you tagged me but I don't see where you are quoting me...? Misquote?Edited by Malamar1229 on January 15, 2018 11:36PM0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »I can´t quite put my finger on it but every time someone coming from a different class is trying to tell my sorry 105 million ap made solo/smallgrp on sorc ass that the class is fine and i`m just doing it wrong/whatever i get supertriggered.
It´s like trump talking about climate change. Just makes me want to hurt someone.
Surge a pve skill - where literally everyone uses spellpower pots
That is why I stay away from those discussions. I'd rather be knowledgeable about the classes I play, but there is clearly a big distinction between knowing what I know, and knowing what someone whose played the toon for 4 years knows, hehehe.
Generally my approach when discussing classes i´m not knowledgeable about is:
Try to point out things that are problematic - but point out subjective pov (cloak for nb being a prime example - it´s really good against projectile builds but otherwise meh at best - though i´m playing NB aswell).
Try to offer ideas for improvement in areas i feel the class is lacking (and example here being DK wings - a useless skill when fighting multiple opponents but arguably too good against a single projectile build - i´d have wings on a 3s duration with unlimited reflects - which would result in better defense if needed but also less uptime when trying to kill someone).
I don´t think comparing classes and their abilities to perform task x or y is productive by any means.
Very seldomly i think a skill is flatout overpowered and the only thing i can think of at the moment is wardens shimmering shield.Edited by Derra on January 16, 2018 7:29AM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »Go get triggered m8. I'm coming from another class and going "Wow, this is fun and easy to play."
I had a blast playing sorc last night, but it took me way less time to get into it, adjusted, and pull in a good chunk of AP with my own smallscale than it ever did for me to learn to play StamDK and MagDK effectively. StamBlade was similarly fairly easy to learn. Warden was intermediate, and I haven't tried running a non-healer templar yet.
Entropy is solid AF, and I found the returns on it more reliable than Surge (plus it applies a nice DoT). Surge is something I use in vMA (which this sorc is designed for farming originally) and when I don't want to blow tons of cash on doing non-vtrials. The heal is far too small to use in PvP, and frankly I was taking advice on using entropy over it from the three or so main sorcs that I grab advice from in my guilds because they all have countless hours on sorcerer.
I'm not dissing you or telling you how to play, but I am curious if you play other classes outside of sorc much? The difference between MagSorc and MagDK is especially notable (the latter is pretty damn hard to play well), and I found MagSorc way easier to pick up then most stam classes.
There's a difference between "easily picking up" a class and actually playing it at a competitive level.
Are you going to deny then, that sorcerers have the best mobility in the game (on par with, or better than NB), a unique ult that cannot be replicated (negate), excellent shields, the best kill-securing execute ability and passive (fury and implosion), and comparable burst to every other class in the game?
Outside of Earthgore-Destro chains (which are frankly, broken and suck equally to fight for everyone) sorcerers have an excellently defined role that cannot be replicated by any other class as well as being competitive in 1v1 encounters. The only situation they are outright weak in is a 1vX scenario, which is something that can be avoided with awareness, LOS, and Streak.
Sorcs are in a good place. A great place really. They are not weak, and frankly I'd always want one in my group for negate and their execute.
@Malamar1229
I never said sorcs are weak, I play one myself and I don't find them weak one bit. I simply said that there is a difference between learning to play the class easily and actually being good at it.
Sure thing it's easy to streak away or to set up a burst combo, but using them to actually maneuver zergs, get kills and survive/sustain is a different story. You rarely ever kill someone in a single combo.
I'm sure you agree, seeing how you stated you have so many sorcs.Waffennacht wrote: »@Derra has been really on in this thread.
Sorc is easy to pick up because your abilities slot themselves (I mean are you Not gonna run wrath curse frag lmao?)
It's easy to pick up, because there's only one way it can be done.
What's the difference between PvP sorc builds? At most 2 abilities (such as entropy, pet, surge and which hard CC you prefer) that's it.
I would place my money on just about any other class if it was 1v1.
Sure mobility is great on a Sorc, but is constantly running away a viable argument for balance in Combat? I don't think ao
I do agree sorc is pretty *** 1v1, you usually have to outplay your opponent in order to win. We have no sustained pressure (like magblade for example) and our sustain and survivability are based around running away and LOSing, both tactics being unavailable in a duel environment.
@Subversus , you tagged me but I don't see where you are quoting me...? Misquote?
Tagged the wrong guy lmao0 -
Malamar1229✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »Go get triggered m8. I'm coming from another class and going "Wow, this is fun and easy to play."
I had a blast playing sorc last night, but it took me way less time to get into it, adjusted, and pull in a good chunk of AP with my own smallscale than it ever did for me to learn to play StamDK and MagDK effectively. StamBlade was similarly fairly easy to learn. Warden was intermediate, and I haven't tried running a non-healer templar yet.
Entropy is solid AF, and I found the returns on it more reliable than Surge (plus it applies a nice DoT). Surge is something I use in vMA (which this sorc is designed for farming originally) and when I don't want to blow tons of cash on doing non-vtrials. The heal is far too small to use in PvP, and frankly I was taking advice on using entropy over it from the three or so main sorcs that I grab advice from in my guilds because they all have countless hours on sorcerer.
I'm not dissing you or telling you how to play, but I am curious if you play other classes outside of sorc much? The difference between MagSorc and MagDK is especially notable (the latter is pretty damn hard to play well), and I found MagSorc way easier to pick up then most stam classes.
There's a difference between "easily picking up" a class and actually playing it at a competitive level.
Are you going to deny then, that sorcerers have the best mobility in the game (on par with, or better than NB), a unique ult that cannot be replicated (negate), excellent shields, the best kill-securing execute ability and passive (fury and implosion), and comparable burst to every other class in the game?
Outside of Earthgore-Destro chains (which are frankly, broken and suck equally to fight for everyone) sorcerers have an excellently defined role that cannot be replicated by any other class as well as being competitive in 1v1 encounters. The only situation they are outright weak in is a 1vX scenario, which is something that can be avoided with awareness, LOS, and Streak.
Sorcs are in a good place. A great place really. They are not weak, and frankly I'd always want one in my group for negate and their execute.
@Malamar1229
I never said sorcs are weak, I play one myself and I don't find them weak one bit. I simply said that there is a difference between learning to play the class easily and actually being good at it.
Sure thing it's easy to streak away or to set up a burst combo, but using them to actually maneuver zergs, get kills and survive/sustain is a different story. You rarely ever kill someone in a single combo.
I'm sure you agree, seeing how you stated you have so many sorcs.Waffennacht wrote: »@Derra has been really on in this thread.
Sorc is easy to pick up because your abilities slot themselves (I mean are you Not gonna run wrath curse frag lmao?)
It's easy to pick up, because there's only one way it can be done.
What's the difference between PvP sorc builds? At most 2 abilities (such as entropy, pet, surge and which hard CC you prefer) that's it.
I would place my money on just about any other class if it was 1v1.
Sure mobility is great on a Sorc, but is constantly running away a viable argument for balance in Combat? I don't think ao
I do agree sorc is pretty *** 1v1, you usually have to outplay your opponent in order to win. We have no sustained pressure (like magblade for example) and our sustain and survivability are based around running away and LOSing, both tactics being unavailable in a duel environment.
@Subversus , you tagged me but I don't see where you are quoting me...? Misquote?
Tagged the wrong guy lmao
Thats what she said! That's what she said!!!!3 -
Takes-No-Prisoner✭✭✭✭✭
✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »I can´t quite put my finger on it but every time someone coming from a different class is trying to tell my sorry 105 million ap made solo/smallgrp on sorc ass that the class is fine and i`m just doing it wrong/whatever i get supertriggered.
It´s like trump talking about climate change. Just makes me want to hurt someone.
Surge a pve skill - where literally everyone uses spellpower pots
That is why I stay away from those discussions. I'd rather be knowledgeable about the classes I play, but there is clearly a big distinction between knowing what I know, and knowing what someone whose played the toon for 4 years knows, hehehe.
Generally my approach when discussing classes i´m not knowledgeable about is:
Try to point out things that are problematic - but point out subjective pov (cloak for nb being a prime example - it´s really good against projectile builds but otherwise meh at best - though i´m playing NB aswell).
Try to offer ideas for improvement in areas i feel the class is lacking (and example here being DK wings - a useless skill when fighting multiple opponents but arguably too good against a single projectile build - i´d have wings on a 3s duration with unlimited reflects - which would result in better defense if needed but also less uptime when trying to kill someone).
I don´t think comparing classes and their abilities to perform task x or y is productive by any means.
Very seldomly i think a skill is flatout overpowered and the only thing i can think of at the moment is wardens shimmering shield.
Interesting you should bring up NBs Cloak. As, many would believe, it's inherently broken. I'm sure you've seen multiple complaints over the years. Though when I go to use it, I barely have any instance where I can sit back and knowingly see what pulled me out of it. So any time I see complaints, I'm instantly hesitant to believe it's a 'real' thing and it's more so placebo effect or more importantly L2P.
It's hard to find actual good class improvement ideas, with well thought out responses in certain threads where ideas can become so subjectively one sided without considering ANY counter play. Which, coming full circle, why I vaguely read Sorc threads any more. The blatant drive by posting, without any sort of good reading material is utterly staggering sometimes. The Nerf Sorc meme is the most over played one, it's so tiresome to read.0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭On the matter of Cloak, magblades just pop it again. Zero issues.
Stamblades might have a valid concern, if at all.
Wanna know what sucks? Being pulled out of invisibility potion that I had to wait for, just to wait another 45 seconds. While snared and being gapclosed to death.
Please, Nightblades can spare me their tears.
Just sayin'.0 -
Irylia✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »The current meta seems to be an unkillable “cockroach” Sorc build that also can’t get reliable kills without burning an ultimate.
While it’s hilarious to tank and outmaneuver huge ball groups without dying, I’m pretty sure this is badly broken. (Shield stack plus riposte plus lights champion plus immovable pots plus 14K Stamina plus clever use of LOS = Lulz)
These specs are totally unthreatening to well built players though. Shackle+Riposte is simply such inadequate damage that it’s not even funny. Kinda sad that’s considered the meta, speaks to how bad the class has fallen
I've been running that setup since MW dropped. My flame reach tool tip is 10k for 2k magicka cost. My frags is about a 15-16k tooltip. While neither set is a "dmg set," I can tell you I have done quite well 1vX with it and in duels.
I’m not sure that tooltip is accurate. Considering I’m stackig damage and scraping past that barely.MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Holy ****.. anyone else notice how dense this dude is.
Best mobility my ass.
My god sorc is in such a terrible place and then you have some dude who spams fury in a zerg surf saying it’s easy.
I want to headbutt a knife at this autistic comment.
I play magplar. Stamdk stamblade stamden and magsorc
But magsorc is the hardest out of them to make successful in open world. Get snared once and I’m done.
Bad sorc you might say.
That would be a lie.Edited by Irylia on January 16, 2018 4:00PM7 -
lao✭✭✭✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »I can´t quite put my finger on it but every time someone coming from a different class is trying to tell my sorry 105 million ap made solo/smallgrp on sorc ass that the class is fine and i`m just doing it wrong/whatever i get supertriggered.
It´s like trump talking about climate change. Just makes me want to hurt someone.
Surge a pve skill - where literally everyone uses spellpower pots
That is why I stay away from those discussions. I'd rather be knowledgeable about the classes I play, but there is clearly a big distinction between knowing what I know, and knowing what someone whose played the toon for 4 years knows, hehehe.
Generally my approach when discussing classes i´m not knowledgeable about is:
Try to point out things that are problematic - but point out subjective pov (cloak for nb being a prime example - it´s really good against projectile builds but otherwise meh at best - though i´m playing NB aswell).
Try to offer ideas for improvement in areas i feel the class is lacking (and example here being DK wings - a useless skill when fighting multiple opponents but arguably too good against a single projectile build - i´d have wings on a 3s duration with unlimited reflects - which would result in better defense if needed but also less uptime when trying to kill someone).
I don´t think comparing classes and their abilities to perform task x or y is productive by any means.
Very seldomly i think a skill is flatout overpowered and the only thing i can think of at the moment is wardens shimmering shield.
i can see why you consider shimmering shield OP as a sorc and you may be right but tbh the way pvp in cyrodiil has evolved there is very little room for a true solo playstyle these days. so a class that is abit better at mitigating dmg from multiple opponents is needed or that playstyle will simply die off completely. right now the only classes that can still effectively play solo are NB and warden. and NB has like extremely little error margin and relies alot on working cloak which is always a gamble. DK and temp lack the mobility and sorc isnt what it used to be + all mag classes get kinda wrecked by snares which are everywhere nowadays. not to forget that every potato NB is a snipe spammer these days.
so while i agree that it is maybe abit too good it is absolutely required to support a dying playstyle and therefor should never be nerfed until ZOS decided to fix the god damn game and shows the zerglings the finger.0 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@Derra
The class has issues. But it is far from bad.
They still have decent burst and mobility for 1vX, with great group support. And shields are strong af.
Issues being: Very pigeonholed/1d, everyone runs same abilities and are forced into the light/masters build. The burst, whilst OK, is quite telegraphed vs good players, and the mobility is pretty much a run away button since its too dangerous to use in combat.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.0 -
lao✭✭✭✭Malamar1229 wrote: »The current meta seems to be an unkillable “cockroach” Sorc build that also can’t get reliable kills without burning an ultimate.
While it’s hilarious to tank and outmaneuver huge ball groups without dying, I’m pretty sure this is badly broken. (Shield stack plus riposte plus lights champion plus immovable pots plus 14K Stamina plus clever use of LOS = Lulz)
These specs are totally unthreatening to well built players though. Shackle+Riposte is simply such inadequate damage that it’s not even funny. Kinda sad that’s considered the meta, speaks to how bad the class has fallen
I've been running that setup since MW dropped. My flame reach tool tip is 10k for 2k magicka cost. My frags is about a 15-16k tooltip. While neither set is a "dmg set," I can tell you I have done quite well 1vX with it and in duels.
I’m not sure that tooltip is accurate. Considering I’m stackig damage and scraping past that barely.MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Holy ****.. anyone else notice how dense this dude is.
Best mobility my ass.
My god sorc is in such a terrible place and then you have some dude who spams fury in a zerg surf saying it’s easy.
I want to headbutt a knife at this autistic comment.
I play magplar. Stamdk stamblade stamden and magsorc
But magsorc is the hardest out of them to make successful in open world. Get snared once and I’m done.
Bad sorc you might say.
That would be a lie.
have to agree on this. non 1vX players should really have their posting priviledges revoked in this sub section of the forum.
not even trying to troll here but zerg surfers really really shouldnt be able to comment on class balance as class balance doesnt matter in a zerg situation anyways and 20 years of MMO experience have shown me that developers are often incompetent enough to listen to those zero value comments.5 -
Takes-No-Prisoner✭✭✭✭✭
✭On the matter of Cloak, magblades just pop it again. Zero issues.
Stamblades might have a valid concern, if at all.
Wanna know what sucks? Being pulled out of invisibility potion that I had to wait for, just to wait another 45 seconds. While snared and being gapclosed to death.
Please, Nightblades can spare me their tears.
Just sayin'.
That is what I tell everyone else.
I do this...
but mainly when I'm in the danger zone(about to bomb)3 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »On the matter of Cloak, magblades just pop it again. Zero issues.
Stamblades might have a valid concern, if at all.
Wanna know what sucks? Being pulled out of invisibility potion that I had to wait for, just to wait another 45 seconds. While snared and being gapclosed to death.
Please, Nightblades can spare me their tears.
Just sayin'.
That is what I tell everyone else.
I do this...
but mainly when I'm in the danger zone(about to bomb)
LMAO!
x'DDD0 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »On the matter of Cloak, magblades just pop it again. Zero issues.
Stamblades might have a valid concern, if at all.
Wanna know what sucks? Being pulled out of invisibility potion that I had to wait for, just to wait another 45 seconds. While snared and being gapclosed to death.
Please, Nightblades can spare me their tears.
Just sayin'.
That is what I tell everyone else.
I do this...
but mainly when I'm in the danger zone(about to bomb)
Good meme, made me LOL
0 -
Takes-No-Prisoner✭✭✭✭✭
✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »On the matter of Cloak, magblades just pop it again. Zero issues.
Stamblades might have a valid concern, if at all.
Wanna know what sucks? Being pulled out of invisibility potion that I had to wait for, just to wait another 45 seconds. While snared and being gapclosed to death.
Please, Nightblades can spare me their tears.
Just sayin'.
That is what I tell everyone else.
I do this...
but mainly when I'm in the danger zone(about to bomb)
LMAO!
x'DDD
But...it works! Like you in that fight, and you have bombs flying left and right. You got your 250 ult bomb on stand by, crown gives you the nod and you zoom in. And everything around you is an Aoe, the FPS is 5, of course I'm gonna mash cloak once the dirty deed is done!0 -
Beardimus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭To be fair this thread has helped my sanity, been struggling with a few things since the nerfs and glad I ain't alone
Stun back on Frags is top of my wish list nowXbox One | EU | EP
Beardimus : VR16 Dunmer MagSorc [RIP MagDW 2015-2018]
Emperor of Sotha Sil 02-2018 & Sheogorath 05-2019
1st Emperor of RavenwatchAlts - - for the Lolz
Archimus : Bosmer Thief / Archer / Werewolf
Orcimus : Fat drunk Orc battlefield 1st aider
Scalimus - Argonian Sorc Healer / Pet master
Fighting small scale with : The SAXON Guild
Fighting with [PvP] : The Undaunted Wolves
Trading Guilds : TradersOfNirn | FourSquareTraders
Xbox One | NA | EP
Bëardimus : L43 Dunmer Magsorc / BG
Heals-With-Pets : VR16 Argonian Sorc PvP / BG Healer
Nordimus : VR16 Stamsorc
Beardimus le 13iem : L30 Dunmer Magsorc Icereach1 -
grannas211✭✭✭✭✭
✭MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Youre trolling right?
Most of your post shows you definitely play in zergs (fury spam, negates, earthgore) mo offense. Sorcs are great at zerg surfing; however, as soon as you find yourself outnumbered and snared all those "op shields and mobility" really show their ugly head.
Also no no no on lightning staves. Youre not doing aoe abilities unless again youre just heavy attacking in a ball group.3 -
Malamar1229✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »The current meta seems to be an unkillable “cockroach” Sorc build that also can’t get reliable kills without burning an ultimate.
While it’s hilarious to tank and outmaneuver huge ball groups without dying, I’m pretty sure this is badly broken. (Shield stack plus riposte plus lights champion plus immovable pots plus 14K Stamina plus clever use of LOS = Lulz)
These specs are totally unthreatening to well built players though. Shackle+Riposte is simply such inadequate damage that it’s not even funny. Kinda sad that’s considered the meta, speaks to how bad the class has fallen
I've been running that setup since MW dropped. My flame reach tool tip is 10k for 2k magicka cost. My frags is about a 15-16k tooltip. While neither set is a "dmg set," I can tell you I have done quite well 1vX with it and in duels.
I’m not sure that tooltip is accurate. Considering I’m stackig damage and scraping past that barely.MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Holy ****.. anyone else notice how dense this dude is.
Best mobility my ass.
My god sorc is in such a terrible place and then you have some dude who spams fury in a zerg surf saying it’s easy.
I want to headbutt a knife at this autistic comment.
I play magplar. Stamdk stamblade stamden and magsorc
But magsorc is the hardest out of them to make successful in open world. Get snared once and I’m done.
Bad sorc you might say.
That would be a lie.
@Irylia which tooltip? Flame reach? I took a screenshot and ill show you later. I dont think its a ui bug because it does hit hard, and it def changes when i swap gear around. I do a couple neat tricks to up my damage since I'm running no real dps set.0 -
Malamar1229✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »The current meta seems to be an unkillable “cockroach” Sorc build that also can’t get reliable kills without burning an ultimate.
While it’s hilarious to tank and outmaneuver huge ball groups without dying, I’m pretty sure this is badly broken. (Shield stack plus riposte plus lights champion plus immovable pots plus 14K Stamina plus clever use of LOS = Lulz)
These specs are totally unthreatening to well built players though. Shackle+Riposte is simply such inadequate damage that it’s not even funny. Kinda sad that’s considered the meta, speaks to how bad the class has fallen
I've been running that setup since MW dropped. My flame reach tool tip is 10k for 2k magicka cost. My frags is about a 15-16k tooltip. While neither set is a "dmg set," I can tell you I have done quite well 1vX with it and in duels.
I’m not sure that tooltip is accurate. Considering I’m stackig damage and scraping past that barely.MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Holy ****.. anyone else notice how dense this dude is.
Best mobility my ass.
My god sorc is in such a terrible place and then you have some dude who spams fury in a zerg surf saying it’s easy.
I want to headbutt a knife at this autistic comment.
I play magplar. Stamdk stamblade stamden and magsorc
But magsorc is the hardest out of them to make successful in open world. Get snared once and I’m done.
Bad sorc you might say.
That would be a lie.
have to agree on this. non 1vX players should really have their posting priviledges revoked in this sub section of the forum.
not even trying to troll here but zerg surfers really really shouldnt be able to comment on class balance as class balance doesnt matter in a zerg situation anyways and 20 years of MMO experience have shown me that developers are often incompetent enough to listen to those zero value comments.
Well technically since this game is supposed to be balanced around zergs and not 1vX, then they should be allowed to comment on balance...right? Especially the zerg surfers.
I am 100% 1vX but my play style isn't blinded by the goal of the developer team. This game was never meant to be balanced around solo pvp.0 -
Malamar1229✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Derra
The class has issues. But it is far from bad.
They still have decent burst and mobility for 1vX, with great group support. And shields are strong af.
Issues being: Very pigeonholed/1d, everyone runs same abilities and are forced into the light/masters build. The burst, whilst OK, is quite telegraphed vs good players, and the mobility is pretty much a run away button since its too dangerous to use in combat.
Let's not kid ourselves. Shields are only strong in a 1v1 scenario.1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »On the matter of Cloak, magblades just pop it again. Zero issues.
Stamblades might have a valid concern, if at all.
Wanna know what sucks? Being pulled out of invisibility potion that I had to wait for, just to wait another 45 seconds. While snared and being gapclosed to death.
Please, Nightblades can spare me their tears.
Just sayin'.
That is what I tell everyone else.
I do this...
but mainly when I'm in the danger zone(about to bomb)
LMAO!
x'DDD
But...it works! Like you in that fight, and you have bombs flying left and right. You got your 250 ult bomb on stand by, crown gives you the nod and you zoom in. And everything around you is an Aoe, the FPS is 5, of course I'm gonna mash cloak once the dirty deed is done!
I was laughing about your awesome meme!
(^_-)
Agree with Cloak mashing, it's sometimes the way to go.
Shade and Mist helps, too. If you can afford all three, you should rarely find yourself being unable to escape. And you DEFINITELY have better chances at survival than a sorc, because Streak and shields are poop against big groups.1 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »@Derra
The class has issues. But it is far from bad.
They still have decent burst and mobility for 1vX, with great group support. And shields are strong af.
Issues being: Very pigeonholed/1d, everyone runs same abilities and are forced into the light/masters build. The burst, whilst OK, is quite telegraphed vs good players, and the mobility is pretty much a run away button since its too dangerous to use in combat.
Let's not kid ourselves. Shields are only strong in a 1v1 scenario.
And even then...2 -
Irylia✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »The current meta seems to be an unkillable “cockroach” Sorc build that also can’t get reliable kills without burning an ultimate.
While it’s hilarious to tank and outmaneuver huge ball groups without dying, I’m pretty sure this is badly broken. (Shield stack plus riposte plus lights champion plus immovable pots plus 14K Stamina plus clever use of LOS = Lulz)
These specs are totally unthreatening to well built players though. Shackle+Riposte is simply such inadequate damage that it’s not even funny. Kinda sad that’s considered the meta, speaks to how bad the class has fallen
I've been running that setup since MW dropped. My flame reach tool tip is 10k for 2k magicka cost. My frags is about a 15-16k tooltip. While neither set is a "dmg set," I can tell you I have done quite well 1vX with it and in duels.
I’m not sure that tooltip is accurate. Considering I’m stackig damage and scraping past that barely.MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Holy ****.. anyone else notice how dense this dude is.
Best mobility my ass.
My god sorc is in such a terrible place and then you have some dude who spams fury in a zerg surf saying it’s easy.
I want to headbutt a knife at this autistic comment.
I play magplar. Stamdk stamblade stamden and magsorc
But magsorc is the hardest out of them to make successful in open world. Get snared once and I’m done.
Bad sorc you might say.
That would be a lie.
@Irylia which tooltip? Flame reach? I took a screenshot and ill show you later. I dont think its a ui bug because it does hit hard, and it def changes when i swap gear around. I do a couple neat tricks to up my damage since I'm running no real dps set.
It’s the master buff to flame clench prob why0 -
grannas211✭✭✭✭✭
✭Malamar1229 wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »The current meta seems to be an unkillable “cockroach” Sorc build that also can’t get reliable kills without burning an ultimate.
While it’s hilarious to tank and outmaneuver huge ball groups without dying, I’m pretty sure this is badly broken. (Shield stack plus riposte plus lights champion plus immovable pots plus 14K Stamina plus clever use of LOS = Lulz)
These specs are totally unthreatening to well built players though. Shackle+Riposte is simply such inadequate damage that it’s not even funny. Kinda sad that’s considered the meta, speaks to how bad the class has fallen
I've been running that setup since MW dropped. My flame reach tool tip is 10k for 2k magicka cost. My frags is about a 15-16k tooltip. While neither set is a "dmg set," I can tell you I have done quite well 1vX with it and in duels.
I’m not sure that tooltip is accurate. Considering I’m stackig damage and scraping past that barely.MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Holy ****.. anyone else notice how dense this dude is.
Best mobility my ass.
My god sorc is in such a terrible place and then you have some dude who spams fury in a zerg surf saying it’s easy.
I want to headbutt a knife at this autistic comment.
I play magplar. Stamdk stamblade stamden and magsorc
But magsorc is the hardest out of them to make successful in open world. Get snared once and I’m done.
Bad sorc you might say.
That would be a lie.
@Irylia which tooltip? Flame reach? I took a screenshot and ill show you later. I dont think its a ui bug because it does hit hard, and it def changes when i swap gear around. I do a couple neat tricks to up my damage since I'm running no real dps set.
It’s the master buff to flame clench prob why
master staff makes it hit pretty hard, I use it like everyone else. But it blows thats it both dodgeable and reflectable.0 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭grannas211 wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »The current meta seems to be an unkillable “cockroach” Sorc build that also can’t get reliable kills without burning an ultimate.
While it’s hilarious to tank and outmaneuver huge ball groups without dying, I’m pretty sure this is badly broken. (Shield stack plus riposte plus lights champion plus immovable pots plus 14K Stamina plus clever use of LOS = Lulz)
These specs are totally unthreatening to well built players though. Shackle+Riposte is simply such inadequate damage that it’s not even funny. Kinda sad that’s considered the meta, speaks to how bad the class has fallen
I've been running that setup since MW dropped. My flame reach tool tip is 10k for 2k magicka cost. My frags is about a 15-16k tooltip. While neither set is a "dmg set," I can tell you I have done quite well 1vX with it and in duels.
I’m not sure that tooltip is accurate. Considering I’m stackig damage and scraping past that barely.MagSorc is in an absolutely fine place right now.
1. MagSorc has unmatched mobility. Streak is hilariously powerful, and it's possible to streak 3-4 times before running out of mag with a standard build (twice more with Dark Conversion) as well as having expedition up with Lightning form. It is very easy to get the hell out of dodge in bad situations that other classes would just outright die or be forced to 1vX in. (barring NBs, who can cloak out) It also makes sorcs exceptional at securing kills on running enemies, since you can "gapclose" on someone that is using terrain as cover. (something that no other class can do). Because of this mobility, sorcs are one of the safest classes to run damage sets on (light armor)
2. Endless fury and implosion are the best executes in the game. Hands-down. Not only do they automatically hit once the target gets under the threshold, but anyone you tag with the ability who uses stealth will get knocked out when the second hit of endless goes off. This ability is excellent in BGs, and functions very well in any open-world content as long as you have a solid team at your back.
3. Negate. Is. Amazing. Excepting earthgore, nothing stops it and nothing in the game *** up ENTIRE TEAMS of players more than an AoE silence. Negate is by far the easiest, safest, and most effective AoE ulti in the game. The only ults that really compare to it are Permafrost and Soul Tether (which are centered on caster, and thus far more high-risk high-reward).
4. Sorcs Synergize very, very well with lightning staves, and destructive reach/clench is a high-damage spamable that comes with a stun attached. Master staves, if you are able to get them, make the skill even better. (The ability has more damage than frags with a master lit staff!)
5. Frags is still a huge burst ability even without the stun. Once it procs you have in your pocket an excellent burst on an instant cast.
6. Sorc shields are pretty damn strong, and make the sorc themselves uncrittable while up. Unless you burn all your stam for a break free, get zerged (in which case, you will die), or unwittingly burn all of your mag so you can't streak out of a bad spot a sorc should never go down. All of these ways to die are mistakes on the sorcerer's part and can be remedied by experience, practice, and situational awareness.
7. Matriarch, if you are willing to use pets, is a fairly reliable non-directional heal that is equivalent to BoL. Very good in group play if you lack a warden or templar healer for your group.
8. Mines. Combine with streak for making people chasing your streaking ass absolutely hate you.
Mobility is key in PvP. Sorcs are the kings of mobility. While magsorcs are most certainly not the best class for 1vX (Stamsorcs do decently at it), their mobility means they really should never need to 1vX in an unfavorable situation. In a group fight they make excellent skirmishers and backline burst units, have strong support skills, and they have the most uniquely powerful ult in the game.
Frankly, I wish my DKs were nearly as easy and fun to play as my Sorc. Comparing a single night of PvP on sorc to almost a year on two flavors of DK, I can honestly say the Sorc was absolutely fun, and overall more useful.
Holy ****.. anyone else notice how dense this dude is.
Best mobility my ass.
My god sorc is in such a terrible place and then you have some dude who spams fury in a zerg surf saying it’s easy.
I want to headbutt a knife at this autistic comment.
I play magplar. Stamdk stamblade stamden and magsorc
But magsorc is the hardest out of them to make successful in open world. Get snared once and I’m done.
Bad sorc you might say.
That would be a lie.
@Irylia which tooltip? Flame reach? I took a screenshot and ill show you later. I dont think its a ui bug because it does hit hard, and it def changes when i swap gear around. I do a couple neat tricks to up my damage since I'm running no real dps set.
It’s the master buff to flame clench prob why
master staff makes it hit pretty hard, I use it like everyone else. But it blows thats it both dodgeable and reflectable.
Pulse used to be like that as well... some people forget way too easily when they start living the good life...0