Recommended Dungeon Nerf ["Ruins of Mazzatun" - Veteran Difficulty]

F3arM0d3 · June 2017

Koensol wrote: »

Sad and yet somehow entertaining to see how OP derails and destroys his own thread by posting salty and butt hurt responses to comments he doesn't agree with. Don't be so defensive all the time. Just like you said to some other poster, its a matter of opinion. No reason to lash out with stuff like elitist and all that.

As for my opinion. No, I don't think it needs a nerf. There has to be some challenge left in the game for those skilled players for whom the other stuff has become trivial. The more casual players already have more than enough. It is a matter of give and take OP.

It's one thing when someone posts constructive criticism on the post. Another thing entirely when it's a snide remark either judging or down the post itself. Just because I'm not afraid to fight against the odds for something I believe in doesn't mean that people have to down it at every turn.

Malamar1229 · June 2017

buff the armor sets in there so they are more desirable. The problem is the only people who run it are those who are after Amberplasm.

zergbase_ESO · June 2017

Dungeon seems fine to me

, it has a challenging aspect. Only thing I dislike are one shot mechanics but eh not much can do on those ZoS loves those mechanics.

SilverWF · June 2017

ROM is fine.
Completed it many times (at HM too)

You WOULD become better or just forget about ROM - go for FG1 or CoA1, since it's your cap.

Trinity_Is_My_Name · June 2017

Sorry, but no. No more nerfs. Dungeon is not so hard if you have a group that knows the mechanics.

Parafrost · June 2017

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Sad and yet somehow entertaining to see how OP derails and destroys his own thread by posting salty and butt hurt responses to comments he doesn't agree with. Don't be so defensive all the time. Just like you said to some other poster, its a matter of opinion. No reason to lash out with stuff like elitist and all that.

As for my opinion. No, I don't think it needs a nerf. There has to be some challenge left in the game for those skilled players for whom the other stuff has become trivial. The more casual players already have more than enough. It is a matter of give and take OP.

It's one thing when someone posts constructive criticism on the post. Another thing entirely when it's a snide remark either judging or down the post itself. Just because I'm not afraid to fight against the odds for something I believe in doesn't mean that people have to down it at every turn.

I did do it. 4 manned Vrom without a tank. Shields are too strong dude.

ShedsHisTail · June 2017

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Every single boss has special circumstances and themes that must be completed and that's why I believe that it should not be on par with a regular veteran dungeon.

This is the source of your problem here... Ruins of Mazatun, Cradle of Shadows, Imperial City Prison, and White Gold Tower are all DLC dungeons and it's no mistake that they're significantly more difficult than the base-game instances. That's by design. These four (and likely the two coming up in the near future) are tuned to be more in line with end-game content, with more complex mechanics, and a certain degree of coordination required. Think of them more like miniature raids than regular Veteran Dungeons.

In short, they're not supposed to be on par with regular Veteran Dungeons.

That said, it would be nice if there were a way to take them out of the random instance selector, since they are an absolute nightmare to PuG, but otherwise they're working as intended.

Asardes · June 2017

Buff the stone shapers and the totems at the end boss by at least 50%. They die too fast

mwo1480 · June 2017

did it with a good 630+ tank a good 630+ dd, a decent 550+ heal (me now 603), and a ok 300 orso + dd and we done multiple times after morro patch, sure it was hard and stuff, but its do able

feels like u just want to complain, u not good enough so u blame the game

code65536 · June 2017

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Sigtric wrote: »

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

greylox wrote: »

We could never get past the last boss on vet, haven't tried it since the newest update. This is definitely gonna be one that once I've done it (if ever) I ain't EVER going back in. CoS is the hardest I can take on vet ( not HM)

At least someone understands. I'm guessing that all the people complaining are ones that have all the best items in game and are maxed out on CP and builds.

Supposing this is the case? How is this bad? Every level of player needs things to do. All of the vet Dungeons are facerolls except RoM, CoS and ICP. These offer some challenge. This is a good thing.

When you're maxed out in an MMORPG you do what every player of every other online game does, wait for a new addition to the game or start a movement for a new difficulty for maxed out players to get the attention of the devs.

We already have a difficulty for the endgame crowd. That you're trying to get nerfed. So when we do get another tier of difficulty, you'll be right there, calling for that to be nerfed too because you can't beat it?

Magıc · June 2017

Just no. ICP and WGT became jokes of a dungeon after the nerfs. It's almost impossible to NOT get speed run + no death they became that easy.

At least COS and ROM are still challenging.

VoodooWasser · June 2017

I think the problem is that this game is so easy on overland mobs that noone really learns how to improve their build. I can understand that you feel the dungeon is to hard but you have to understand that all other dungeons are far to easy for a lot of players. We dont even take healers to white gold tower or prison because there is nothing a tank couldnt heal. Cos and mazzatun are our ONLY fun dungeons. So do you really think it would be fair to take them? You can do so much other stuff and if you feel like it im sure you can find a guild with players who can teach you smt for your build and the dungeons as well. The two of them are far away from undoable. They are just way harder than all the others. If you play on eu i could take you through it and you will see its not that hard at all.
Best regards.

Autolycus · June 2017

This OP is seriously exaggerated. I've had both good and bad runs of vRoM with a variety of players, ranging from extremely well-geared and experienced guild players to totally fresh players with crafted (at best) gear. This post makes RoM sound impossible for even qualified groups, and frankly that is just not true. I have people that farm this place for motif pages with me and whenever we want to "just run something for fun," it's almost always RoM because it's fast, easy if you know what you're doing, and profitable (motif pages).

Yeah, sometimes it takes awhile. But considering the utter lack of difficult and mechanic-oriented content outside of vet trials in this game, vRoM is a welcome change of pace. Would you rather have another Spindle I, where the only thing to watch for is a guaranteed 1-shot with a 1s reaction time, and literally the entire rest of the place is no-brain easymode? That's BORING. RoM is not. If your whole group is cp630 and can't complete this place, it's on you, not the dungeon. It means you need more practice, or you're missing a mechanic or a kill priority - we really shouldn't be asking for nerfs to content that deliberately avoids dps racing (unlike 97% of the rest of this game). Some vet trials make vRoM look like a day along the shores of Auridon tbh.

P.S. You can run the entire thing without ever fighting a sludge-slinger. If you don't know how to interrupt them (or aren't quick enough) then skip them. They would have fixed it by now if they cared about people skipping tough mobs. I distinctly call some advice I saw on a loading screen about 37,000 times in the last three years.... "Fleeing is a perfectly valid tactic if you wander into a tough situation. Find or craft better gear, use skill points, or level up a bit more, then come back to fight another day." Cheers.

Doctordarkspawn · June 2017

Wasting your breath OP.

I've made thread after thread about suggestions for some difficulty tweaks with the SOTH dungeons. ZOS isn't gonna lisen, and your just gonna get called a scrub who needs to git gud. The people who typically do this are the selfish who would rather monopolize the game for their specific needs than advocate change that gives everyone what they want, like more difficulty tiers and so on.

Fanboyism never changes. Welcome to the resistance, the accomidations suck. But at least we dont have a mandatory cool-aid diet.

Doctordarkspawn · June 2017

Voxicity wrote: »

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Voxicity wrote: »

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Tyrion87 wrote: »

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Tyrion87 wrote: »

Please, no.

vRoM and vCoS are the last challenging dungeons for decent players. And by challenging I mean fun. While doing other dungeons, I'm bored to death.

That's all well and good for you, but maybe other people who are far from the grindstone cap want to be able to play this dungeon without getting ***.

Since when everything has to be done by everyone? That is why there are normal modes as well.

I understand your frustration and that it can be hard for low level (low CP) players, but please leave some content for good players as well. Because someday, when you improve your build etc., you will be pissed when there will be no challenging 4-man content left for you.

And one more thing: 3 good players are enough to get this done on vet without hard mode. If you want so much to complete it now, try to find a better group then. Maybe a group of friends.

Keep in mind that there a far more of us mid to low lvl cp players than capped players. How is it fair to 70% of the game who want to be able to complete this with moderate challenge when it's ungodly to us?

Progression

Honestly, that answer sucks.

How does it suck? The whole point of playing an MMORPG is progressing your character/group. People who are able to clear these difficult dungeons didn't just walk into it and clear it with ease. It takes time, as it should do.

If ESO was about progression, it wouldn't keep trying to slap down players geting too powerfull with progressively greater nerfs.

Progression has never been a goal in ESO.

Asardes · June 2017

Buff the stone shapers and the totems at the end boss by at least 50%. They die too fast

Kagetenchu · June 2017

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Parafrost wrote: »

Vrom and vcos can be pug'd. Every dungeon can be pug'd nowadays .-.

Try it lol.

I did and it was my first vRoM clear.
I'm working on achievements now.

Btw, my first clear was with a 15k DPS sorc that I was working on.

WalksonGraves · June 2017

Seriously? You can skip most of it. Mazz is easy compared to veli.

josiahva · June 2017

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Parafrost wrote: »

Vrom and vcos can be pug'd. Every dungeon can be pug'd nowadays .-.

Try it lol.

I pug them almost every day...there is no problem most of the time. The exception being when the DPS is too low to kill the totem in vRoM or to keep the ads under control in vCoS.

Drummerx04 · June 2017

This dungeon is fine, but the final boss HM is super unforgiving if your group is not communicating.

Here (vRoM Guide by Emphatic Static), I'm actually rather liking this guy's dungeon videos. I kind of wish they were around when I was a wee noob. They aren't perfect in the sense that there are a surprising amount of nuances that most people don't notice/strategies can vary quite a bit, but they are still excellent, AND they demonstrate dungeon completions with mid dps stamina builds... often with deaths showing that more average groups can in fact complete them.

bloodthirstyvampire · June 2017

i'm trash at this game I, can do VROM in trash gear no problem, its not that hard. Once you know the mechanics its just like every dungeon, Vet or normal PREDICTABLE!!!

F3arM0d3 · June 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Wasting your breath OP.

I've made thread after thread about suggestions for some difficulty tweaks with the SOTH dungeons. ZOS isn't gonna lisen, and your just gonna get called a scrub who needs to git gud. The people who typically do this are the selfish who would rather monopolize the game for their specific needs than advocate change that gives everyone what they want, like more difficulty tiers and so on.

Fanboyism never changes. Welcome to the resistance, the accomidations suck. But at least we dont have a mandatory cool-aid diet.

I love this lol.

DemonDruaga · June 2017

Besides the hardmode I think it is already in a good place. I helped many guildies under 300, some even under 200 to complete it. It went always smooth. Sure, with one dps that doesn't contribute much(everybody needs to learn and train first, right?) it will take longer. One could say it will force the group to use their brains. If people focus down the high priority adds, and dodge the 'onehits' every trash pull will be easy.
It is natural that not every group will just clean the trash within a few seconds, some are in the learning process. But that doesn't give those that aren't ready the right to call the nerf hammer everytime. At one point those people will be able to just rush trough there brain afk. Imagine it will get nerfed, it will make for even more boring dungeon expiriences.

In fact we sometimes do this dungeon on vet. with just 3 people( tank, dps, offheal )
Get yourself in a guild, use a comunication tool and stop screaming for nerfs.

Merlin13KAGL · June 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Wasting your breath OP.

I've made thread after thread about suggestions for some difficulty tweaks with the SOTH dungeons. ZOS isn't gonna lisen, and your just gonna get called a scrub who needs to git gud. The people who typically do this are the selfish who would rather monopolize the game for their specific needs than advocate change that gives everyone what they want, like more difficulty tiers and so on.

Fanboyism never changes. Welcome to the resistance, the accomidations suck. But at least we dont have a mandatory cool-aid diet.

@Doctordarkspawn you seem to be confused as to what fanboi-ism is. You have normal mode for this dungeon - there is your difficulty tier.

You are guaranteed access to all content. You do not need to be guaranteed a clear.

And regarding the 'selfish' comment? Let me translate the following for you:

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

When you're maxed out in an MMORPG you do what every player of every other online game does, wait for a new addition to the game or start a movement for a new difficulty for maxed out players to get the attention of the devs.

"If you're max level, you can wait for the next content for something to do while current content is nerfed down to "guaranteed clear" level for the majority."

That doesn't sound selfish at all, does it?

90% (generously low estimate) of this game can be completed with relative ease. Leave the other 10% the way it is.

Improve your skills.
Improve your communication.
Improve your coordination with your group members.
Finish the content the way it was intended, at the difficulty level it was intended.

laksikus · June 2017

VROm and vCos are the last 2 challanging dungeons, and even those can be completed by randoms when they arent on ultra noob level.

If you want easy mode in the last few harder dungeons, then do normal mode.
You are not entitled to be able to do it vet or HM if you are an ultra casual.

ShedsHisTail · June 2017

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Wasting your breath OP.

I've made thread after thread about suggestions for some difficulty tweaks with the SOTH dungeons. ZOS isn't gonna lisen, and your just gonna get called a scrub who needs to git gud. The people who typically do this are the selfish who would rather monopolize the game for their specific needs than advocate change that gives everyone what they want, like more difficulty tiers and so on.

Fanboyism never changes. Welcome to the resistance, the accomidations suck. But at least we dont have a mandatory cool-aid diet.

You can't say people who are okay with content as it is are being selfish when they're not the ones calling for change. People who want to nerf content so that "everyone" (excluding, presumably, the people who like it as it is) is happy are the ones trying to "monopolize" (that word makes no sense here) the game.

When -you- say, "Make it easier for me." and others say, "It's fine." Who, in that situation, is being selfish?
The people who've put in the time and effort to learn how to accomplish it the way it was intended?
Or the people who' rather not put in the time and effort to learn to accomplish it the way it was intended and would rather it just be made easier?

You can't just arbitrarily invoke the voice of "everyone" and say that your cause is altruistic. Especially in a thread where you're super out-numbered.

exeeter702 · June 2017

F3arM0d3 wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Sad and yet somehow entertaining to see how OP derails and destroys his own thread by posting salty and butt hurt responses to comments he doesn't agree with. Don't be so defensive all the time. Just like you said to some other poster, its a matter of opinion. No reason to lash out with stuff like elitist and all that.

As for my opinion. No, I don't think it needs a nerf. There has to be some challenge left in the game for those skilled players for whom the other stuff has become trivial. The more casual players already have more than enough. It is a matter of give and take OP.

It's one thing when someone posts constructive criticism on the post. Another thing entirely when it's a snide remark either judging or down the post itself. Just because I'm not afraid to fight against the odds for something I believe in doesn't mean that people have to down it at every turn.

It has nothing to do with fighting against the odds for something. You took a particularly hard stance on something very unpopular to be sure, yet your responses here suggest more than anything that you are fishing for a confirmation bias and lashing out at anyone who believes your opinion on the subject means you have a lot to learn.

Having read through this thread and seeing your replies, i would say that the issue is your stubbornness and lack of willingness to look at what you can do to improve your odds of clearing vrom. And also your lack of ability to siff through the snarky and leveled replies in this thread and actually understand what you are being told.

Difficult 4 man content is often welcomed in this game and imo still not prominent enough. Where is the breaking point from something being to hard for a percentage of players vs realistically expecting those same players to rise to the occasion?

These are the objective facts of the matter.

Vrom can be cleared with a 250cp group
Vrom is mechanic heavy before its a stat check
Vrom requires some communication between players

And chudan set is a hot pile of ***.

Sigtric · June 2017

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Wasting your breath OP.

I've made thread after thread about suggestions for some difficulty tweaks with the SOTH dungeons. ZOS isn't gonna lisen, and your just gonna get called a scrub who needs to git gud. The people who typically do this are the selfish who would rather monopolize the game for their specific needs than advocate change that gives everyone what they want, like more difficulty tiers and so on.

Fanboyism never changes. Welcome to the resistance, the accomidations suck. But at least we dont have a mandatory cool-aid diet.

You can't say people who are okay with content as it is are being selfish when they're not the ones calling for change. People who want to nerf content so that "everyone" (excluding, presumably, the people who like it as it is) is happy are the ones trying to "monopolize" (that word makes no sense here) the game.

When -you- say, "Make it easier for me." and others say, "It's fine." Who, in that situation, is being selfish?
The people who've put in the time and effort to learn how to accomplish it the way it was intended?
Or the people who' rather not put in the time and effort to learn to accomplish it the way it was intended and would rather it just be made easier?

You can't just arbitrarily invoke the voice of "everyone" and say that your cause is altruistic. Especially in a thread where you're super out-numbered.

ShedsHisTail · June 2017

Oh, also, just so you know where I stand...

I've never cleared it on Veteran, and I still think it's fine.

F3arM0d3 · June 2017

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

Oh, also, just so you know where I stand...

I've never cleared it on Veteran, and I still think it's fine.

That makes absolutely no sense. Why would you think something is fine if you've never been able to clear it? That is completely circular logic.