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Anyone else bummed out no dungeons came with the $40 price tag on Morrowind?
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ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭DurzoBlint13 wrote: »none of the DLCs except SoH (which was ONLY dungeons) had dungeons with them. I know this is supposed to be an "expansion" but that is just a marketing gimic. Its a DLC. My guess is the next dungeons we get will be in their own DLC like SoH
I don't remember anything about Morrowind ever saying there would be group dungeons. Not sure why this is a surprise to people
There may not have been many new dungeons added, that's true... but -all- the existing dungeons were re-worked, new loot, new vet modes added for a bunch of them, existing Vet modes made available to non-vet characters, etc. You might have started playing after the changes, but the changes they made opened up a lot of content for a lot of people. Especially since, at release, vet mode was pretty inaccessible because it was -significantly- more difficult.
I'm not saying it's the same as getting all new dungeons (of which we did get at least three between Vanilla and Morrowind; SoH dungeons and the new Crypt of Hearts Vet mode), but for the majority of casual players it about doubled the amount of group content available in the game.
EDIT: Oh, yeah, forgot about the IC dungeons, make that at least five new dungeons.Edited by ShedsHisTail on June 9, 2017 6:15PM"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
JWKe✭✭✭✭Well... of course i'm bummed. But it damn well better be free if they release it in the future or loud outcry.0 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭ShedsHisTail wrote: »ZirconJunkie wrote: »If you compare the first ESO expansion (Morrowind) to the first WoW expansion (Burning Crusade), BC was a much better value.
Sorry... How many DLC packs did WoW have prior to Burning Crusade?
Very different game, very different funding model.
You can't really compare them honestly.
Put all ESO dlc's together and Morrowind, and still WoW first expansion was a better value.
Tally it up for me:
Burning Crusade Content vs. Pre-Morrowind additions (DLC and Non). Let's see how it shakes out.
Edit: I'm not gonna argue the logistics of the funding model because neither you nor I can do much more than speculate there and there's enough threads doing to that. My only point was that they are different and so they must behave differently.
Edited by ShedsHisTail on June 9, 2017 6:18PM"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
ZirconJunkie✭✭✭✭ShedsHisTail wrote: »
Sorry... How many DLC packs did WoW have prior to Burning Crusade?
Very different game, very different funding model.
You can't really compare them honestly.
Honestly, you really can compare them.
Both games are made by multi-billion dollar companies. They both have the resources to throw at their game, but the difference in the way they do it is staggering.
No, WoW had no DLC packs prior to Burning Crusade. ESO has had Wrothgar (1 zone, $30), Imperial City (arguably 2 zones, $25), Thieves Guild (1 zone, $20), Dark Brotherhood (1 zone, $20), and Shadows of the Hist (2 dungeons, $15).
And now we have Morrowind, 1 zone for $40. If you bought all of these, you will have paid $150 for 5 DLCs and one "Chapter", and still have less content than Burning Crusade had.3 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, WoW had no DLC packs prior to Burning Crusade. ESO has had Wrothgar (1 zone, $30), Imperial City (arguably 2 zones, $25), Thieves Guild (1 zone, $20), Dark Brotherhood (1 zone, $20), and Shadows of the Hist (2 dungeons, $15).
You're really cheapening the content of all of those, and you're neglecting all of the content added that -wasn't- DLC, ie: Craglorn, Player Housing, One Tamriel, etc.Edited by ShedsHisTail on June 9, 2017 6:31PM"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
Korah_Eaglecry✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭For an expan....sorry a Chapter. And the fact they boasted about how much bigger it was than Wrothgar. I would of expected at least 2 dungeons to go along with all this 30 hours of content.
I really feel like Bethesda and the suits stepped in sometime early in 2016 when they were starting to move into actual content creation for Morrowind and was like "this is how things are going to go and this is what we expect to see". And suddenly all of the things that probably should of made its way into this DLC/Expansion/Chapter (whatever you want to call it). To me the idea of Morrowind and the money signs kachinging in the suits eyes got in the way of what this probably could of been*. We got one trial. And I hear its fun. But not all of us do trials all day and we do need new mid-tier endgame content like dungeons. Now we have to wait for what I assume the next DLC will be. A Dungeon Pack.....Will it add to Morrowind? Maybe. But since we wont know til we're well past this release and into the next Quarter...
* To be honest I am enjoying the questing in the game. But thats not to say I am a bit baffled by some of the choices or the overlooked aspects.Penniless Sellsword CompanyCaptain Paramount - Jorrhaq VhentKorith Eaglecry * Enrerion Aedihle * Laerinel Rhaev * Caius Berilius * Seylina Ithvala * H'Vak the GrimjawlTenarei Rhaev * Dazsh Ro Khar * Yynril Rothvani * Bathes-In-Coin * Anaelle Faerniil * Azjani Ma'LesAban Shahid Bakr * Kheshna gra-Gharbuk * Gallisten Bondurant * Etain Maquier * Atsu Kalame * Faulpia SeverinusWhat is better, to be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort? - Paarthurnax0 -
ZirconJunkie✭✭✭✭ShedsHisTail wrote: »You're really cheapening the content of all of those, and you're neglecting all of the content added that -wasn't- DLC, ie: Craglorn, Player Housing, One Tamriel, etc.
I didn't set those prices, and I didn't create the amount of content in them. The price of the content was set by ZoS, as was the amount of content contained within them.
Craglorn, One Tamriel, and Homestead weren't DLCs (nor "Expansions"). They were base game updates.0 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZirconJunkie wrote: »ShedsHisTail wrote: »
Sorry... How many DLC packs did WoW have prior to Burning Crusade?
Very different game, very different funding model.
You can't really compare them honestly.
Honestly, you really can compare them.
Both games are made by multi-billion dollar companies. They both have the resources to throw at their game, but the difference in the way they do it is staggering.
No, WoW had no DLC packs prior to Burning Crusade. ESO has had Wrothgar (1 zone, $30), Imperial City (arguably 2 zones, $25), Thieves Guild (1 zone, $20), Dark Brotherhood (1 zone, $20), and Shadows of the Hist (2 dungeons, $15).
And now we have Morrowind, 1 zone for $40. If you bought all of these, you will have paid $150 for 5 DLCs and one "Chapter", and still have less content than Burning Crusade had.
And if you played WoW from release to Burning Crusade you paid 26 months of subscription costs ($389.74 IIRC) before you got any of that content.
"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
Coilbox✭✭✭✭Well... I agree comparing the two games might be hard, to me the fund system is pretty similar, but thats not the subject.
Im talking from someone who got the collector's edition pre purchase from day one, I love the game, I have been subscriber since release. I have always supported the game no matter what cause, even when some changes are annoying I still enjoy the game.
I play every day and enjoy the game so much. I leveled up a warden and Vvanderfell looks nice. But all this doesnt mean the 'chapter' is a little bit overpriced (also, we were promised to have all new content included on eso+, call it dlc, call it chapter, expansion or whatever you want, ZOS never made a distinction on that matter) in terms of what includes.Comrade, a word...0 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZirconJunkie wrote: »ShedsHisTail wrote: »You're really cheapening the content of all of those, and you're neglecting all of the content added that -wasn't- DLC, ie: Craglorn, Player Housing, One Tamriel, etc.
I didn't set those prices, and I didn't create the amount of content in them. The price of the content was set by ZoS, as was the amount of content contained within them.
By "cheapening" I mean you're understating what was in those DLC packs (ie: the two Imperial City Dungeons)Craglorn, One Tamriel, and Homestead weren't DLCs (nor "Expansions"). They were base game updates.
That's exactly my point. They were content you got for free whether you subscribed or not.
I think WoW had like one raid (Nax) and maybe a pair of dungeons during that time period and required a subscription to play."As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
ZirconJunkie✭✭✭✭ShedsHisTail wrote: »And if you played WoW from release to Burning Crusade you paid 26 months of subscription costs ($389.74 IIRC) before you got any of that content.
ESO+ members who have subscribed to the game have paid the same $15 a month that WoW subscribers pay. And ESO+ members are getting far less value.
Back in 2015, Matt Firor stated time and again that ZoS was committed to releasing 1 DLC per quarter (4 DLCs a year), all to be included in an ESO+ membership (now changed to 3 DLCs per year). Except there haven't been any DLCs released since August 2016, and so the value of ESO+ is diminished.Edited by ZirconJunkie on June 9, 2017 6:36PM2 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZirconJunkie wrote: »ShedsHisTail wrote: »And if you played WoW from release to Burning Crusade you paid 26 months of subscription costs ($389.74 IIRC) before you got any of that content.
ESO+ members who have subscribed to the game have paid the same $15 a month that WoW subscribers pay. And ESO+ members are getting far less value.
That's debatable as "value" is subjective. ESO+ subscribers, like myself, have paid every month we've played, true. But we also got the DLC at no additional cost (a $150 dollar value, like you said) and all of the other updates included (plus some perks). During the first 26 months of WoW, you got next to nothing for your dollar if you weren't running end-game content (an if you were, you got one Raid); so big a Xpac was a welcome an deserved addition.
I feel like I've gotten my money's worth.Back in 2015, Matt Firor stated time and again that ZoS was committed to releasing 1 DLC per quarter (4 DLCs a year), all to be included in an ESO+ membership (now changed to 3 DLCs per year). Except there haven't been any DLCs released since June 2016, and so the value of ESO+ is diminished.
Again, there are other threads for this. I'm simply discusing content vs. dollars here. I'm not going to comment on perceived promises.
Edit: Actually, doing some research, I've been a little unfair to WoW, there was quite a bit more than I alluded to, but it's still almost entirely end-game content.Edited by ShedsHisTail on June 9, 2017 6:48PM"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
ZirconJunkie✭✭✭✭ShedsHisTail wrote: »Back in 2015, Matt Firor stated time and again that ZoS was committed to releasing 1 DLC per quarter (4 DLCs a year), all to be included in an ESO+ membership (now changed to 3 DLCs per year). Except there haven't been any DLCs released since June 2016, and so the value of ESO+ is diminished.
Again, there are other threads for this. I'm simply discusing content vs. dollars here. I'm not going to comment on perceived promises.
Edit: Actually, doing some research, I've been a little unfair to WoW, there was quite a bit more than I alluded to, but it's still almost entirely end-game content.
I was also slightly in error. The last DLC for ESO wasn't in June 2016. Shadows of the Hist was released in August 2016. Nevertheless, ESO+ members are still missing at least 2 DLCs. I wasn't trying to derail the thread with ESO+ discussion, but merely trying to illustrate the lower value of ESO content overall when compared to other MMOs.
Edited by ZirconJunkie on June 9, 2017 7:03PM0 -
Silver_Strider✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ShedsHisTail wrote: »ZirconJunkie wrote: »ShedsHisTail wrote: »
Sorry... How many DLC packs did WoW have prior to Burning Crusade?
Very different game, very different funding model.
You can't really compare them honestly.
Honestly, you really can compare them.
Both games are made by multi-billion dollar companies. They both have the resources to throw at their game, but the difference in the way they do it is staggering.
No, WoW had no DLC packs prior to Burning Crusade. ESO has had Wrothgar (1 zone, $30), Imperial City (arguably 2 zones, $25), Thieves Guild (1 zone, $20), Dark Brotherhood (1 zone, $20), and Shadows of the Hist (2 dungeons, $15).
And now we have Morrowind, 1 zone for $40. If you bought all of these, you will have paid $150 for 5 DLCs and one "Chapter", and still have less content than Burning Crusade had.
And if you played WoW from release to Burning Crusade you paid 26 months of subscription costs ($389.74 IIRC) before you got any of that content.
If we're going to be technical about everything, then we have to consider that ESO started as a sub based game and Craglorn was released within that 1st year under that model so you're gonna have to take off about 12 months from WoW and $180 dollars from your total.
Argonian forever1 -
I've seen a lot of threads about disappointment in morrowind but I feel like we all got shafted on the dungeons. Base game has 15+ dungeons to run through and that was $60. Morrowind does not offer any group dungeons. Just disappointed is all and was curious how the rest of the community felt.
A little.0 -
ShedsHisTail✭✭✭✭✭
✭Silver_Strider wrote: »ShedsHisTail wrote: »ZirconJunkie wrote: »ShedsHisTail wrote: »
Sorry... How many DLC packs did WoW have prior to Burning Crusade?
Very different game, very different funding model.
You can't really compare them honestly.
Honestly, you really can compare them.
Both games are made by multi-billion dollar companies. They both have the resources to throw at their game, but the difference in the way they do it is staggering.
No, WoW had no DLC packs prior to Burning Crusade. ESO has had Wrothgar (1 zone, $30), Imperial City (arguably 2 zones, $25), Thieves Guild (1 zone, $20), Dark Brotherhood (1 zone, $20), and Shadows of the Hist (2 dungeons, $15).
And now we have Morrowind, 1 zone for $40. If you bought all of these, you will have paid $150 for 5 DLCs and one "Chapter", and still have less content than Burning Crusade had.
And if you played WoW from release to Burning Crusade you paid 26 months of subscription costs ($389.74 IIRC) before you got any of that content.
If we're going to be technical about everything, then we have to consider that ESO started as a sub based game and Craglorn was released within that 1st year under that model so you're gonna have to take off about 12 months from WoW and $180 dollars from your total.
I went ahead and crunched the numbers in a different thread:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/351596/crunching-the-numbers-eso-vs-wow"As an online discussion of Tamrielic Lore grows longer, the probability of someone blaming a Dragon Break approaches 1." -- Sheds' Law
Have you seen the Twin Lamps?0 -
Wifeaggro13✭✭✭✭✭
✭I've seen a lot of threads about disappointment in morrowind but I feel like we all got shafted on the dungeons. Base game has 15+ dungeons to run through and that was $60. Morrowind does not offer any group dungeons. Just disappointed is all and was curious how the rest of the community felt.
Tje price point was to steep for this pack. It was 25$ worth of content . Thos dungeons they drop next quarter will be 15 bucks0 -
Orjix✭✭✭✭not really, i never do dungeons, i bought the shadows of the hist DLC the day it came out and i have yet to even set foot inside one of those dungeons, so...0 -
GDOFWR420✭✭✭✭I just wanted the statue, which arrived in one piece. Some paint came off the tip of the nose and chin but other than that I'm very pleased. Just waiting for my update to finish so I can venture to morrowind
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Megabear✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think the devs pulled a heist on us.Guide to making $$$ in Tamriel: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/370618/guide-to-making-gold-in-eso/p1?new=1
Cost analysis for potential ESO players: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/367919/cost-analysis-for-brand-new-potential-pc-eso-players#latest
Warden Bow Healer/DPS Hybrid Build: http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/warden-bow-healerdps-hybrid/
Warden "The Warladin" Healer/Tank Hybrid Build: http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/warden-the-warladin-healertank-hybrid-build/
Warden Stamina DPS Build: http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/warden-dps-build/Server - PC/NA
Vhevet - (S) Night Blade/Female/Orsimer
Ecaer - (M) Templar/Female/Breton
Captain Beaster Bunny - (S) Warden/Male/Red Guard
Ezaera - (M) Sorcerer/Female/Altmer
Ecaeri - (M) Warden/Female/Argonian
Dun-and-Dunmer - (M) Dragon Knight/Male/Dunmer
What Can Go Wong - (S) Night Blade/Male/Bosmer
Izaer - (M) Templar/Male/Breton2 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »Wait, there's a trial dungeon, 2 public dungeons, and a half a dozen regular delves. Many of them are some of the most complex underground areas in the game right now. And Clockwork City DLC will be added soon, if not the next DLC. (Yes it kind of sucks that it wasn't included in Morrowind, but oh well.) So I'm not getting the part where you say there are no dungeons in Morrowind.
Delves and public dungeons aren't challenging in the slightest bit (you can run through them naked and not die). And they are solo content.
Vvardenfell also does not have any more public dungeons (2) and delves (6) than Orsinium did. Orsinium's public dungeons/delves were also huge.
You'd expect to get a little bit more with an expansion.Edited by MLGProPlayer on June 9, 2017 11:56PM3 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Biggest map, new trial, new pvp mode, new class... can't say I'm too bothered about not having new dungeons. They'll come in the form of a DLC pack in 3 months and will be Nord themed
If you leave the volcano zone out, the map is not the biggest, i would even say Wrothgar is even bigger, the pvp mode, appart that it should've been there from the beggining as a feature, doesnt work propperly when trying to queue in.
New class and trial... well, thats good, Vvanderfell area and quests not bad. But having almost the same price as the base game... and as the OP says, not even having other dungeons... feels a bit overpriced and dissapointing.
It absolutely is the biggest map. With the inacessible areas removed, it's still 50% bigger than Wrothgar.Edited by MLGProPlayer on June 10, 2017 8:13AM0 -
MLGProPlayer✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Biggest map, new trial, new pvp mode, new class... can't say I'm too bothered about not having new dungeons. They'll come in the form of a DLC pack in 3 months and will be Nord themed
Or maybe I got that wrong and it'll be the one after, I don't remember
A DLC pack just means more money we have to spend. Most MMO devs continue to add dungeons and raids for free to their expansions after they are released.Edited by MLGProPlayer on June 9, 2017 11:50PM1 -
Dragonnord✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Of course dungeons will come as a separate DLC so they can charge us $$$ again. Of course.
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MattT1988✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Looks like dungeons are going to be their own thing as seperate DLC's from now on. If the price is pretty low I'm ok with that. Looking forward to the Nord ones coming up. Hopefully they keep with the racial theme and give all the races a go.0 -
Caligamy_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's definitely needed, I am so bored with the current ones and I would love to see something introduced with some nice ice based monster set actually designed to compliment Warden.
Currently all of the monster sets do not mesh well with the class at all for example Iceheart being the only ice damage set but it forces you to stand close up to an enemy to do damage with it, which contradicts the magicka based morph of cliff racers which do up to 15% more damage but only from long distances. Same goes for Grothdarr, ..and Ilambris requires you to spam crushing shock or at the very least use elemental blockade and 2 staff types for it to actually be effective.. which at this point you might as well just be a Sorcerer and do it better.
Give us a Direfrost Keep II at the very least, something would be better than the current stagnation of just farming keys and spamming rng for slightly better traits.love is love0 -
Coilbox✭✭✭✭MLGProPlayer wrote: »Biggest map, new trial, new pvp mode, new class... can't say I'm too bothered about not having new dungeons. They'll come in the form of a DLC pack in 3 months and will be Nord themed
If you leave the volcano zone out, the map is not the biggest, i would even say Wrothgar is even bigger, the pvp mode, appart that it should've been there from the beggining as a feature, doesnt work propperly when trying to queue in.
New class and trial... well, thats good, Vvanderfell area and quests not bad. But having almost the same price as the base game... and as the OP says, not even having other dungeons... feels a bit overpriced and dissapointing.
It absolutely is the biggest map. With the vinacessible areas removed, it's still 50% bigger than Wrothgar.
Well... whatever, still just one single area with quests. 'Expansion' they call it... lol xDComrade, a word...1 -
Axoinus✭✭✭✭✭This is par for the course in game industry. That is not intended to be an insult. Just a fact. Reading between the lines, the game must be doing well for them to be so bold.
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