Warlord and Magician CP being removed in Morrowind
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Ashtaris✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Here is the thing. It's obvious that Rich listens too much to Brian Wheeler, with Brian being the PVP lead. So my question is, who is the PVE lead? Somebody that represents PVE players at heart that can go up to Brian and say: "WTF are you doing?"16 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yay!
Finally we'll be shoehorned again into obligatory Altmer + must have templar healer and everything else = garbage.
And once again we'll have to re-re-re-re-re-re-re-grind another set, materials and so on.
Like the good old times!
The times when I quit.Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO6 -
Lylith✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ep1kMalware wrote: »So Mr. /lurk (Rich Lambert) says there is no counter to cost reduction (another PVP thing?) and that we have unlimited resources. Sheesh, I wish my CP600 Stamblade knew that because during long fights, I'm constantly running out of resources. Nevermind I have no self heals besides Vigor to depend on. And will this change pigeonhole us more into absolutely demanding a Templar Healer to help with resource management (shards, repentence)? And yes, before you ask, I try to weave in heavy's to keep my stam up, but then we are loosing DPS to do so. I'm probably going to retire my stamblade after this next patch if things stay the same with this stupid cost reduction nerf. Sometimes I wonder if the devs play the same game I do, and if any of them have a stamblade?
Was that on the eso live today? So it's official then? First they force us to put pnts into reduction by increasing skill costs and then thy just remove it?
Well it was official as of the ESO Live, but that doesn't mean it has to be official as of the release of Morrowind. We still have time to voice our displeasure of the changes and have them revert it.
how's the rng been on that? (not picking on you, just saying)
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FloppyTouch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ep1kMalware wrote: »So Mr. /lurk (Rich Lambert) says there is no counter to cost reduction (another PVP thing?) and that we have unlimited resources. Sheesh, I wish my CP600 Stamblade knew that because during long fights, I'm constantly running out of resources. Nevermind I have no self heals besides Vigor to depend on. And will this change pigeonhole us more into absolutely demanding a Templar Healer to help with resource management (shards, repentence)? And yes, before you ask, I try to weave in heavy's to keep my stam up, but then we are loosing DPS to do so. I'm probably going to retire my stamblade after this next patch if things stay the same with this stupid cost reduction nerf. Sometimes I wonder if the devs play the same game I do, and if any of them have a stamblade?
Was that on the eso live today? So it's official then? First they force us to put pnts into reduction by increasing skill costs and then thy just remove it?
Well it was official as of the ESO Live, but that doesn't mean it has to be official as of the release of Morrowind. We still have time to voice our displeasure of the changes and have them revert it.
how's the rng been on that? (not picking on you, just saying)
Well the reverted the racial passives of the khajiit bc the out cry of the community on it being to op before it went live so there is a chance0 -
Personofsecrets✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I'm all for this tremendous nerf.
The game has gotten so boring and the nerf will spice things up.
The nerf will allow us to have more skilled gameplay.
The nerf will be fun.
All hail the nerf.Rest in Peace:
The Dragonknight
2014-2025
This commemoration is for the class that has constantly been plundered and dismantled by designers for no obvious reason while other classes continue to have coherent skill lines and feel both powerful and cool.2 -
Nifty2g✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
@Personofsecrets we all know its just a nerf to tanksPersonofsecrets wrote: »I'm all for this tremendous nerf.
The game has gotten so boring and the nerf will spice things up.
The nerf will allow us to have more skilled gameplay.
The nerf will be fun.
All hail the nerf.#MOREORBS1 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I love how many posts this has over one change. One change that isn't official, has anyone thought maybe it just moved? Has anyone looked in the medium armor/light armor passives? You know the ones everyone had asking to buff, because heavy armor was just too good.
Should we be patient and wait for the rest of the changes to be posted to make rational judgements on gameplay changes? Or should we go back to shouting that the sky is falling and kicking ourselves in the skull with these knee-jerk reactions?
Have you watched ESO Live from yesterday in which they discussed this? Because if you have you'd see that while they did add a disclaimer that nothing is final, they seemed pretty confident that Cost Reduction would be removed because not only is sustain too powerful right now but also that CR has no 'counter' in the CP tree. They said they want to have 'counters' to all things in the CP tree.
Just because ZoS is confident doesn't mean this approach will work or it's even a good idea.
Slapping what they think are counters is not a self correcting system. If I am a sorcerer, I load up on Bastion because my shields are great against every single opponent I play. If I am not a sorcerer, am I supposed to load up on the Shield breaker CP star as a counter? Well, if I do, that means I am screwed and wasted a whole bunch of CPs against every single stamina opponent I face, every magplar, most mDKs, some mageblades, and even those pesky sorcs when I am actually hitting their health bar.
Now they want to put in a PvP only star, which screws people like me who play both PvP and PvE, which will adversely effect some classes more than others. Builds that do not rely on base recovery regen, i.e. most of the good "cancer" tanks that people are complaining about in the first place, will not be adversely effected by this. Meanwhile, the poor average player trying to get her first complete on Maelstrom arena will be.
The CP system is in needs of major reform. A little tweak here or there is not going to suffice.
Edited by Joy_Division on March 19, 2017 1:46PMMake Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.5 -
Personofsecrets✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭This constant re-balancing was always the end game of accepting the CP system.
The mistake of the CP system was having it to begin with.
The second mistake was taking seriously the idea that players may actually be allowed to become more powerful.
Really, we don't need to become more powerful, but because the developers are expected to raise the CP cap, they have to then nerf players in a way that makes up for extra power granted by that newly earned CP. This ***-for-tat model is reused every balance update and it surprises me to see so many people being duped by the CP system as well as the work around to the CP system that the balance team uses.Edited by Personofsecrets on March 19, 2017 2:23PMRest in Peace:
The Dragonknight
2014-2025
This commemoration is for the class that has constantly been plundered and dismantled by designers for no obvious reason while other classes continue to have coherent skill lines and feel both powerful and cool.2 -
EldritchPenguin✭✭✭✭✭
It will probably accomplish three things:Personofsecrets wrote: »I'm all for this tremendous nerf.
The game has gotten so boring and the nerf will spice things up.
The nerf will allow us to have more skilled gameplay.
The nerf will be fun.
All hail the nerf.
1) Players will run cost reduction glyphs instead of damage glyphs.
2) Players will use some more heavy attacks.
3) Healers will have to spam more orbs/other abilities with synergies to sustain the tank and DPS.
Now which one of those sounds more fun or more skillful?Lilelle Adlis - Dark Elf Dragonknight
Vaynothah Sailenar - Dark Elf Templar
Sherivah Telvanni - Dark Elf Sorcerer
Nephiah Telvanni - Dark Elf Nightblade8 -
Korah_Eaglecry✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I feel like this company truely doesnt know what it wants with its gameplay. There is this constant shifting of priorities and concepts from update to update. And that when they come across a problem that baffles them, or challenges what they think they want. They immediately go with the most nuclear option they can find. In this case removing things from the Constellation that is considered a staple in many builds (because of the immense importance of resource management).
And guaranteed if not the next update or the one following that theyll knee jerk to whatever problem this one causes by breaking something else.Penniless Sellsword CompanyCaptain Paramount - Jorrhaq VhentKorith Eaglecry * Enrerion Aedihle * Laerinel Rhaev * Caius Berilius * Seylina Ithvala * H'Vak the GrimjawlTenarei Rhaev * Dazsh Ro Khar * Yynril Rothvani * Bathes-In-Coin * Anaelle Faerniil * Azjani Ma'LesAban Shahid Bakr * Kheshna gra-Gharbuk * Gallisten Bondurant * Etain Maquier * Atsu Kalame * Faulpia SeverinusWhat is better, to be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort? - Paarthurnax7 -
DPShiro✭✭✭✭✭
✭EldritchPenguin wrote: »
It will probably accomplish three things:Personofsecrets wrote: »I'm all for this tremendous nerf.
The game has gotten so boring and the nerf will spice things up.
The nerf will allow us to have more skilled gameplay.
The nerf will be fun.
All hail the nerf.
1) Players will run cost reduction glyphs instead of damage glyphs.
2) Players will use some more heavy attacks.
3) Healers will have to spam more orbs/other abilities with synergies to sustain the tank and DPS.
Now which one of those sounds more fun or more skillful?
This exactly^
And the skill gap between casuals and top players will increase drastically.
We end game players will adapt, no problem, but casual players will really struggle in most content.~ Gryphon Heart ~
~ Immortal Redeemer ~
~ Grand Master Crafter ~
~ Master Angler ~
~ Former Emperor ~13 -
bowmanz607✭✭✭✭✭
✭Personofsecrets wrote: »This constant re-balancing was always the end game of accepting the CP system.
The mistake of the CP system was having it to begin with.
The second mistake was taking seriously the idea that players may actually be allowed to become more powerful.
Really, we don't need to become more powerful, but because the developers are expected to raise the CP cap, they have to then nerf players in a way that makes up for extra power granted by that newly earned CP. This ***-for-tat model is reused every balance update and it surprises me to see so many people being duped by the CP system as well as the work around to the CP system that the balance team uses.
I said this the second it was introduced.
That as people got more cp they would balance it again and so that you are really just grinding out the same thing over and over again with this illusion of progression.in fact, I know many people who left because they saw the writing on the wall.3 -
EldritchPenguin✭✭✭✭✭
Here's what really has me scratching my head: Why do the devs want us to use Cost Reduction instead of Damage on our jewelry? I mean, I can understand wanting to raise the floor and lower the ceiling, and I'm fine with that, but they could do that by reallocating the power in the CP system back to players in other ways that are more easily accessible; buffing cost reduction and recovery on light/medium armor while nerfing the respective CP stars, boosting the base attributes of players and removing the attribute points from CP stars, stuff like that. But a giant blanket nerf like this will break the game for some people and change nothing for others. I imagine it will be broken for mid-CP players who like to run 4-man dungeons, and change nothing for the high-end trial players, and make the gap between them even wider than it already is.EldritchPenguin wrote: »
It will probably accomplish three things:Personofsecrets wrote: »I'm all for this tremendous nerf.
The game has gotten so boring and the nerf will spice things up.
The nerf will allow us to have more skilled gameplay.
The nerf will be fun.
All hail the nerf.
1) Players will run cost reduction glyphs instead of damage glyphs.
2) Players will use some more heavy attacks.
3) Healers will have to spam more orbs/other abilities with synergies to sustain the tank and DPS.
Now which one of those sounds more fun or more skillful?
This exactly^
And the skill gap between casuals and top players will increase drastically.
We end game players will adapt, no problem, but casual players will really struggle in most content.Lilelle Adlis - Dark Elf Dragonknight
Vaynothah Sailenar - Dark Elf Templar
Sherivah Telvanni - Dark Elf Sorcerer
Nephiah Telvanni - Dark Elf Nightblade3 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Personofsecrets wrote: »I'm all for this tremendous nerf.
The game has gotten so boring and the nerf will spice things up.
The nerf will allow us to have more skilled gameplay.
The nerf will be fun.
All hail the nerf.
WE'VE LOST HIM!
Srsly tho, as one tank to another, do you even play anymore? I know I dont.0 -
majulook✭✭✭✭✭
✭IMHO for PVP players this will not have as big of an impact as it will on PVE players.
All PVP players will be nerfed the same, so while it will cause a change in tactic's and possibly gear. the affect will be minimal as for the most part players fight other players with the same nerfs. Yes, we will need to do things a bit differently but it should all work out.
PVE players will feel the nerf more, as the WB, Dolmens, Delve, Undaunted, and Trials bosses will all be more difficult due to the CP point changes in these areas.
PUG's will suffer as not all players will be knowledgeable, ready for, or even able to adjust to the changes.
This change like others in the past are designed to reduce PVE to group play to get more things done, and reduce the amount of solo play.Si vis pacem, para bellum6 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Personofsecrets wrote: »The second mistake was taking seriously the idea that players may actually be allowed to become more powerful.
Really, we don't need to become more powerful
Isn't it the core of RPG and TES games to become more powerfull while leveling up? If your char after x amount of level ups is just as powerfull as a newly created, only being seperated by grinded gear, what's the point of leveling up? I strongly begin to believe this will become more of an action game than a RPG.Edited by Chilly-McFreeze on March 19, 2017 4:28PM0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Here's your obvious reply from ZOS:
Solo players shut up and get in your damn 50 man super Zerg and spam light attacks and Destro ults like everyone else.Doctordarkspawn wrote: »Here is the thing. It's obvious that Rich listens too much to Brian Wheeler, with Brian being the PVP lead. So my question is, who is the PVE lead? Somebody that represents PVE players at heart that can go up to Brian and say: "WTF are you doing?"
There isn't anyone.
The closest is likely the dungeon design lead as Wrobel likely gives Wheeler whatever the hell he wants as he PVP's too. Given how big Wrobel's ego is, all Wheeler has to do, is stroke said ego.
Meanwhile, the dungeon design dude does what he can with the scraps he's given.
My guess is Wrobel and Wheeler are PVP potatoes who got 1vX'ed too many times by really good solo players.
We can't have that, so this kind of gameplay is going away. Kiss it goodbye everyone.Edited by Minalan on March 19, 2017 4:38PM5 -
Kay1✭✭✭✭✭
✭Doctordarkspawn wrote: »If everyone spams the @zos mentions well get areplynafter 100 of us do it XD. I will not be i dont have patience or care, and i accept that changes happen. Im not worried about the changes. I have recently taken all CPs out of sustain. Threw on a resto staff and i am doing ok in my same heavy templar build. Now i cant really solo 1vX...but im still able to rek dudes who stray from their zerg. Im still having fun. As for pve, figure with light armor and my destro staff offbar, ill just drop some heavies once in awhile and manage fine.
Try a PVE dungeon run. See how you fair.
Or better yet, VMA, or Vmol.
You snowflake, you don't realize everyone here is in the top 10 Leaderboard of vMol? Lol I know people in this thread that do vMsa with their eyes blind, this is the elite of ESO bro what do you expect, we don't need +15% reduce cost some of the people in this thread already 4 man Rakkhat, we are beyond the casuals here, keep it elite.
Try a PvE dungeon run he said lol, someone post a video doing Kena naked and without CP to show this guy who are the elite./sK1 The Big Monkey1 -
redspecter23✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭EldritchPenguin wrote: »
It will probably accomplish three things:Personofsecrets wrote: »I'm all for this tremendous nerf.
The game has gotten so boring and the nerf will spice things up.
The nerf will allow us to have more skilled gameplay.
The nerf will be fun.
All hail the nerf.
1) Players will run cost reduction glyphs instead of damage glyphs.
2) Players will use some more heavy attacks.
3) Healers will have to spam more orbs/other abilities with synergies to sustain the tank and DPS.
Now which one of those sounds more fun or more skillful?
You forgot number 4
4) Players leave, because they just get tired of ZOS beating them around every 3 months with whatever new nerf is on their balance agenda then grinding away for the next 3 months to get a fraction of that lost character progression back.8 -
Personofsecrets✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »Personofsecrets wrote: »The second mistake was taking seriously the idea that players may actually be allowed to become more powerful.
Really, we don't need to become more powerful
Isn't it the core of RPG and TES games to become more powerfull while leveling up? If your char after x amount of level ups is just as powerfull as a newly created, only being seperated by grinded gear, what's the point of leveling up? I strongly begin to believe this will become more of an action game than a RPG.
@Chilly-McFreeze ,
Good questions. Although the point of TES and RPG games in general may be to become more powerful, there are different ways that such power can be gained.
There is the obvious way where a players actually does become more powerful, but there is also the way that is practiced while playing TES. Instead of becoming more powerful players gain the feeling of becoming more powerful through an illusion. From the perspective of how players feel, either method of power increase doesn't matter, but there are practical effects.
For example, throughout the games history there have been a number of fights or mechanics that are literally broken by high DPS. Some boss enemies literally had the chance of becoming frozen in place because of high DPS. Of course the development team doesn't want numerous instances of such game breaking DPS to become common and that is why we get the CP system where an illusion of power increase suffices for the real deal.Rest in Peace:
The Dragonknight
2014-2025
This commemoration is for the class that has constantly been plundered and dismantled by designers for no obvious reason while other classes continue to have coherent skill lines and feel both powerful and cool.0 -
Marabornwingrion✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭This thread has 28k views, still no word from devs. Gj ZOS, you beat the record in ignoring player base.7 -
Nelson_Rebel✭✭✭✭✭
✭This thread has 28k views, still no word from devs. Gj ZOS, you beat the record in ignoring player base.
Apparently they mentioned it on eso live but did not go into detail explaining the real reasoning. We'll have to wait for an official announcement but they are certainly aware of this thread at this point
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Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This thread has 28k views, still no word from devs. Gj ZOS, you beat the record in ignoring player base.
They stopped caring after Imperial city, when Wrobels first great act and subsequent justification with "Tanks are not fun" made it very clear that the playerbase is Wrobel's enemy.5 -
JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Oh well, if they do nerf cp without giving anything in return, we will just have to voice our displeasure, and from what iv'e seen here it will be very bad for zenimax.
This thread is a warning zenimax...1 -
Personofsecrets✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@everyone Voicing displeasure doesn't matter so long as you still have the crafting bag.Rest in Peace:
The Dragonknight
2014-2025
This commemoration is for the class that has constantly been plundered and dismantled by designers for no obvious reason while other classes continue to have coherent skill lines and feel both powerful and cool.0 -
JinMori✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭joaaocaampos wrote: »I'll just say one thing:
STOP WHINING!
This is not whining, this is complaining, keep in mind that only the people who complain change things, sometimes for the worst sometimes for the best.
People seem to forget that the word whining isn't a synonym of complaining, whining is high pitched moaning, the ones that babies do, it doesn't have anything to do with criticism, especially if the concerns are real and the argument is well put.
People have voiced they're opinion on this and it's mostly negative.
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Nelson_Rebel✭✭✭✭✭
✭joaaocaampos wrote: »I'll just say one thing:
STOP WHINING!
Why are you whining about people voicing their opinions? This has been an unpopular decision in the works and people have a right if they're displeased with what the developers have planed for us.
If you don't like the conversation then LEAVE
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