This game DESPERATELY needs an Auction House of sort!

jimbo4822 · January 2017

I would prefer an auction house type system. One can be at each bank like the guild stores are now. The problem with this system is it is hard to find something as I am limited to 5 guilds with 500 accounts selling stuff. The same goers for selling, my items to be sold have to be distributed over the 5 guilds and are limited to at most 2500 player accounts top make purchases and probably actually less when overlap of accounts is factored in.

How many total accounts are playing on just the pc server 50k? 100k? a much larger market for sales. Then there is the issue of guilds requiring minimum sales and or weekly fees to just be a member. I would rather have an auction house than bother with that as I want to play a game not work when i get off of work.

IcyDeadPeople · January 2017

If the guild trader system was replaced with a single auction house, I imagine many casual players like me would have no reason to join guilds.

In my case, I don't participate in any group dungeons, trials or group PvP, so the only direct benefit of being in any guild is the trading system.

Glurin · January 2017

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Glurin wrote: »

Anti_Virus wrote: »

Riejael wrote: »

I don't believe those asking for an auction house actually want it.

Here's why. In Everquest there was no Bazaar, nor Auction House, or any means of trading gear without physically using the trading function from player to player. The players there took up an area of a zone called East Commonlands to do their trading.

If Guild Traders are so bad, why haven't the players here done the same? Why haven't the players chosen a central location to sell their goods and bypass the traders entirely? Here, I'll take the first step:

You need a location everyone can access right off the bat by even new characters
You need a location everyone can access despite DLC/Member status.
You need a safe location without NPCs or hostile guards (for criminals) to bother you during trades.

Pick an area that meets those criteria, or pick a few areas and vote on which to use them. Then use them over guild traders. If you did this, and I mean if you all did this for real. You would see a decline in Guild Trader usage. Guilds would be wasting money, guild trader usage would go down, and ZoS would need to step in to fix the situation. The fix is to remove the guild function and link the traders.

However this will likely fail for the following reasons:

1. You all are making a mountain out of a molehill. In other words you don't care enough to make this happen. Making it a moot issue that can safely die.
2. There's not enough of you to matter. You don't make up a majority in which it makes no sense to make the change that a majority of players don't want.
3. You're making up a nontroversy to complain about.

Are those reasons wrong? Well prove it. Pick a location and trade there. Make something happen through action. Words mean little from a minority, especially in a video game. A publisher having to pick between two sides of a customer base is logically and financially always going to pick the larger group.

If you're not a majority you don't matter in this case. Lets see if you all are.

Simply because the main cities, are a very convenient place next to all the crafting stations, and major events in town. You would need to advertise for people to find your trader in remote locations.

If you owned Walmart you would open it in a shopping center and not in the middle of the woods right?

You could literally open a Walmart out in the desert 100 miles from anything even remotely resembling civilization and people would still shop there. I know that from personal experience, believe it or not.

Yeah, 1 out of 1,000,000 people that is.

More like everyone in town. If the nearest Walmart is 100 miles away, they drive 100 miles to shop at Walmart. You can be stubborn and plant your butt in the local store so you can way overpay for items from a rather limited selection that may not contain what you need anyway. But everyone else will drive that extra hundred miles and shop in bulk because it's worth it to them.

And curse you for making me sound like a friken Walmart salesman!

Riejael · January 2017

Anti_Virus wrote: »

Simply because the main cities, are a very convenient place next to all the crafting stations, and major events in town. You would need to advertise for people to find your trader in remote locations.

Then pick one:

1. Mournholde
2. Auridon
3. Daggerfall
4. I don't care enough to do this and hence do not want a AH afterall.

If you say anything else, I'm going to default you to 4.

This goes for everyone else. Pick a city to do trading in and trade there. If you don't it means you don't want a AH and you're blowing smoke.

Eleusian · January 2017

Guild traders seem to be more of a game within the game than a good way of actually trading. good luck buying motif pages on console. Eyes hurt after hitting a couple traders usually

Anti_Virus · January 2017

I can guarantee you if some kind of Grand Exchange was implemented, Tempering Alloy prices wouldn't be 16K per piece.

Poet99 · January 2017

Erasure wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

Moonfish wrote: »

Why not simply have Auction Houses where every one in Tamriel can freely exchange stuff.

Most other MMO's have them, but every time someone brings it up here, they get shouted down by the traders in the trade guilds who have a vested interest in keeping prices high and restricting access of others to the market. It really makes me angry that a handful of traders are the only ones who are allowed to sell anything in this game, with no way for anyone else to sell.

And before anyone pipes in with "Well, you could sell stuff in chat" that's like telling someone "Well, you can't vote, but you're free to stand outside a polling place begging for someone to vote *for* you." Standing on a street corner in Riften hawking goods in zone chat is not what I consider fair access to the market.

This game has needed an auction house for a long time. The traders claim that auction houses don't work, yet they sure seem to work just fine in every other MMO out there.

Sadly, ZOS tends to listen to a vocal minority on this and many other issues. I guarantee you that if you polled regular, average players and explained how an auction house works that most of them would be for it.

Just to define "A Handful" for people, There are over 130 traders spread throughout the game before you even get to Thieves Dens and Cyrodiil, which I don't count. That's 65,000 potential guild members selling to the public, or allowing for moderate overlap, 40,000 interested and active merchants. Is that room for every single person interested in selling to the public, while offline, that plays the game? No. Is it a small, exclusionary sect? No. Anyone interested in joining a trade guild need only pay attention to zone chat for 5 minutes to see one recruiting.

Funny how I haven't seen a single zone chat recruitment message for 2 straight days. But I play sorc, so I kinda have to... ya know, pay attention while leveling and stuff.

vyndral13preub18_ESO · January 2017

Wow im impressed this thread is still going on. People do love themselves some auction house drama i guess.

Tin foil hat time!
*tin foil hat on*

Zos will never implement a global auction house because when they start selling items in the crown store that can be traded or sold for gold in the auction house, it would make those items cheaper and easier to find. Discouraging people from buying the item from the crown store, and discouraging even those who are just buying it to sell it, since the return is so low.
*removed tin foil hat*

I am so good at this.

MLGProPlayer · January 2017

ScooberSteve wrote: »

Get awesomeguildstore addon. Your welcome. If your on console u get what u deserve.

It's sad when you need an add-on to make a feature in a game even remotely ussable.

AGS sucks too since the API doesn't let it conduct a search of the entire store, only what's on the current page.

radiostar · January 2017

Both MxO (rip) and FE (still around, but rip) were able to implement an AH megaserverwide, plus Fallen Earth has a dedicated Trade Channel. Not sure why ESO can't or won't.

Cpt_Teemo · January 2017

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

ScooberSteve wrote: »

Get awesomeguildstore addon. Your welcome. If your on console u get what u deserve.

It's sad when you need an add-on to make a feature in a game even remotely ussable.

AGS sucks too since the API doesn't let it conduct a search of the entire store, only what's on the current page.

Yeah it doesn't block out the listings per say just ignores them while its still physically on the page, it'll be like 0/100

Really wish they would have had atleast a search function to search for the exact item without having to scroll through all the pages.

Bazgrim · January 2017

So, I'm going to give a little insight here from my point of view. Towards the end of my wow career when I hopelessly looking for ways to entertain myself I got into auctioning on Illidan-US. Those unfamiliar with Illidan-US, it's one of the, if not the largest, server and highest ranking server in the us. You would think this meant that because there were so many people markets couldn't be controlled by a single person or a group of people.

Here's where things get interesting, I nailed down 3 markets. Enchanting, battlepets, and lower end tcg mounts. Enchanting was easy to manipulate, buyout the materials up to a certain price, repost the materials for a higher price than the enchant itself, effectively driving people to buy your enchants vs the materials because the mats are more expensive than the enchant. I didn't need a lot of gold to buy up to that point, once I got this rolling I moved onto battlepets.

Battlepets were almost too easy. Since the actual pet cage and item to learn said pet are different there were some huge price discrepancies. Normally I would look for pets that had a higher stddev of selling, maybe 1.5 a day. This was provided to me via an auctioning database, which if eso creates an auction house, it will have one too.

Tcg mounts were big scores because of limited quantity, there was no one flooding the market. Once I had achieved 1.2mil I started dealing with lower end tcg mounts, like the feldrake. Buy out the market, wait a day, someone would post for an atrociously large amount and my multiple mounts would look like a good buy.

4 weeks i made 3million gold and was banned for exploiting the economy.

If eso was to implement some sort of auctioning system, have it be a supply/demand system like guild wars 2 has, this is far less exploitable and creates a general accepted price for goods on the market because no one can buy out a demand price for a buyer.

Anyhow, my two bits.

Cpt_Teemo · January 2017

Bazgrim wrote: »

So, I'm going to give a little insight here from my point of view. Towards the end of my wow career when I hopelessly looking for ways to entertain myself I got into auctioning on Illidan-US. Those unfamiliar with Illidan-US, it's one of the, if not the largest, server and highest ranking server in the us. You would think this meant that because there were so many people markets couldn't be controlled by a single person or a group of people.

Here's where things get interesting, I nailed down 3 markets. Enchanting, battlepets, and lower end tcg mounts. Enchanting was easy to manipulate, buyout the materials up to a certain price, repost the materials for a higher price than the enchant itself, effectively driving people to buy your enchants vs the materials because the mats are more expensive than the enchant. I didn't need a lot of gold to buy up to that point, once I got this rolling I moved onto battlepets.

Battlepets were almost too easy. Since the actual pet cage and item to learn said pet are different there were some huge price discrepancies. Normally I would look for pets that had a higher stddev of selling, maybe 1.5 a day. This was provided to me via an auctioning database, which if eso creates an auction house, it will have one too.

Tcg mounts were big scores because of limited quantity, there was no one flooding the market. Once I had achieved 1.2mil I started dealing with lower end tcg mounts, like the feldrake. Buy out the market, wait a day, someone would post for an atrociously large amount and my multiple mounts would look like a good buy.

4 weeks i made 3million gold and was banned for exploiting the economy.

If eso was to implement some sort of auctioning system, have it be a supply/demand system like guild wars 2 has, this is far less exploitable and creates a general accepted price for goods on the market because no one can buy out a demand price for a buyer.

Anyhow, my two bits.

That right there is not the reason why you got banned sorry, reselling is not against Blizzards ToS, you must have done something else wrong. I've had friends that make 10m a month in WoW and they're still around, they're resellers.

Gandrhulf_Harbard · January 2017

Glurin wrote: »

More like everyone in town. If the nearest Walmart is 100 miles away, they drive 100 miles to shop at Walmart.

Except the real history of commerce and trade shows the exact opposite.

Trade invariably moves to where the customers are, and only very rarely do customers significantly move to where the trade is.

People may well travel some reasonable distance to a "trade hub" (distances for that will vary based on the settlement distribution of the country in question - in the US people may travel 100 miles to a favourite trade hub, here in the UK most people wouldn't regularly travel more than 20 or so miles) if that Trade Hub is a) well established, b) known to stock the specific items they want, c) has a reputation for value for money.

None of those apply to the Kiosk system because the incumbent in any given Kiosk can change every week, and because of that there's no guarantee they have the item you want, and there's no guarantee of a VFM price.

It is somewhat disingenuous to compare ESO Trading to non-comparable real world trade systems (as you attempted with the Walmart example); especially when there are more than sufficient comparable historical systems that could be used. Problem is those more comparable socio-economic system demonstrate that the current Kiosk system gets almost everything wrong. The ONLY thing it gets right is that there is no centralised listing feature where ALL traders can be compared at once.

All The Best

Fallen_Ray · January 2017

Moonfish wrote: »

To put it bluntly: Guild Vendor suck and they dont work. Not only because its hard to find a guild with the items you want - forcing to go all around Tamriel looking for that extra Jazbay Grape. It sucks if you are part of a guild with no Guild Merchant. I have several legendary and useful items in my bank. No way to share with the world. Plus all those crazy taxes and guilding asking money. Like many console players I can spend a lot of time without playing the game, wich means guilds will kick me off.

Why not simply have Auction Houses where every one in Tamriel can freely exchange stuff. If one is too much, you can have one for each faction.
Right now if I cant find what I need from the GV near Elder Wood, [snip] it. I wont go around like an old lady in a giant shopping mall.

[Edit for censor bypassing]

I agree with you. This "Guild Trader bidding" is a corrupt economy system. And is the reason why I stopped playing this game. You gather a lot of gear that you can sell. But you can't sell it unless you belong in a guild that hires traders. That guild will charge you on a weekly basis just so you can be in there. If you miss a deposit you'll get fired without notice.

The amounts of weekly fees a guild can charge can range from "ok" to stupidly moronic. Not to mention They will increase their minimum weekly fee (LOL guess they like playing corporate now).

It's a broken system. One that's being abused by a group controlling all of in game economy (much like governments in real life) and ZOS is doing shít about it.

Of course you can go and chat spam in capital cities to sell the stuff avoiding all of the mentioned pain and dilemma. But it's no fun to spend precious play-time shouting the same thing endlessly. Only those who actually control this poor excuse for a player market will defend it to the very end with statements that only proves that it's all about one thing: "control". Control the guild trading system and you'll get over 100 sales weekly and enough profits to keep you in control so long the guild trader system lasts, which will be until this game dies.

Victoria_Marquis · January 2017

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Victoria_Marquis wrote: »

On top of that you do not get all your gold back if you loose the bid, so it's extremely frustrating for the guild leaders, and the guild members.

I'm sorry, but this is wrong. If you lose a bid, the gold that was bid is returned to said guild in full.

@wenchmore420b14_ESO So wait, you do get 100% of the gold back if you loose the bid?
So going to kill the GM of some guilds then.... And maybe find a new guild if they are pocketing the gold....

So this proves the point that guild stores can be corrupted.... The developers should change the Guild bank with a separate donation for gold that can only be used for bidding, not even the GM can withdraw from it... And that is the only thing it will be used for.

This is why we have been leaving our mega guilds with mandatory 5-20k fees, and starting to get into fee free guilds, sure they may not get a good trade spot, or even any trade vender some weeks, but at least they are honest.

Again we would like to stress to the developers to make an island, or designate a new trade City with a Bazaar where every guild that makes the minimum requirements of members gets a trade vender, no more bouncing around the world looking for the poor SOB that is out in Timbuktu, a one stop shopping center.

This will help take some of the corruption out of the guilds, and being in a fair trade system, making it equal for all Guilds no matter if your just starting out, or a long time mega guilds, everyone will have a trade vender.
Thank you for your time and consideration..

wenchmore420b14_ESO · January 2017

Victoria_Marquis wrote: »

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Victoria_Marquis wrote: »

On top of that you do not get all your gold back if you loose the bid, so it's extremely frustrating for the guild leaders, and the guild members.

I'm sorry, but this is wrong. If you lose a bid, the gold that was bid is returned to said guild in full.

@wenchmore420b14_ESO So wait, you do get 100% of the gold back if you loose the bid?
So going to kill the GM of some guilds then.... And maybe find a new guild if they are pocketing the gold....

So this proves the point that guild stores can be corrupted.... The developers should change the Guild bank with a separate donation for gold that can only be used for bidding, not even the GM can withdraw from it... And that is the only thing it will be used for.

This is why we have been leaving our mega guilds with mandatory 5-20k fees, and starting to get into fee free guilds, sure they may not get a good trade spot, or even any trade vender some weeks, but at least they are honest.

Again we would like to stress to the developers to make an island, or designate a new trade City with a Bazaar where every guild that makes the minimum requirements of members gets a trade vender, no more bouncing around the world looking for the poor SOB that is out in Timbuktu, a one stop shopping center.

This will help take some of the corruption out of the guilds, and being in a fair trade system, making it equal for all Guilds no matter if your just starting out, or a long time mega guilds, everyone will have a trade vender.
Thank you for your time and consideration..

I'm sorry, but yes thats true. I take care of Kiosk bidding in 3 guilds, so I know.
As far as your other GM's, If I was on Xbox, I would help you kill em!!! Lol. Thats just sad if they do that and you need to call them out!
If you were on NA/PC, I would happily invite you to one of mine.
Huzzah!!

Stopnaggin · January 2017

Victoria_Marquis wrote: »

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Victoria_Marquis wrote: »

On top of that you do not get all your gold back if you loose the bid, so it's extremely frustrating for the guild leaders, and the guild members.

I'm sorry, but this is wrong. If you lose a bid, the gold that was bid is returned to said guild in full.

@wenchmore420b14_ESO So wait, you do get 100% of the gold back if you loose the bid?
So going to kill the GM of some guilds then.... And maybe find a new guild if they are pocketing the gold....

So this proves the point that guild stores can be corrupted.... The developers should change the Guild bank with a separate donation for gold that can only be used for bidding, not even the GM can withdraw from it... And that is the only thing it will be used for.

This is why we have been leaving our mega guilds with mandatory 5-20k fees, and starting to get into fee free guilds, sure they may not get a good trade spot, or even any trade vender some weeks, but at least they are honest.

Again we would like to stress to the developers to make an island, or designate a new trade City with a Bazaar where every guild that makes the minimum requirements of members gets a trade vender, no more bouncing around the world looking for the poor SOB that is out in Timbuktu, a one stop shopping center.

This will help take some of the corruption out of the guilds, and being in a fair trade system, making it equal for all Guilds no matter if your just starting out, or a long time mega guilds, everyone will have a trade vender.
Thank you for your time and consideration..

Ok auction house in the middle of cyrodill. That way everyone who wants an open market can have one. It is the most centralized locaton in the map. Seriously though, the guild traders need an overhaul and better ui, search function, but there really aren't that many dishonest guilds as everyone is making it out to be. I'm not saying they aren't there, but not in the majority. I have proposed before making some of the wandering merchants into pawn brokers, limited slots but would allow non guild players to sell. And they are plentiful enought to accommodate a much larger portion of the player base that dont have a guild. But still no on a central AH.

idk · January 2017

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Fortunately for us Zso went a different direction and decentralized the market in ESO. We can all be grateful.

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

And as I have stated numerous times I like that decentralised market, it fits beautifully within the socio-economic setting of the game.

But look at historically comparable markets in the real world and you'll see vast differences to how Zeni have done things.

Most Trade Kiosks would be in major urban areas - because that is where most customer are either based, or pass through. Trade Kiosks on the lonely crossroads in the middle of nowhere would fail, and no one would ever bid on them again. The owner of said Trade Kiosk would be forced to move it to a more favourable trade location. Failing that traders who had failed to secure an existing Kiosk would either pay someone to build them a better situated one, or would build one themselves.

I have no problem with a decentralised market model that is appropriate to the socio-economic setting that the game exists within. Problem is that the current Kiosk system is no more that than a centralised AH is.

I don't want an end to the Kiosk system, I just want a much improved version of it.

One where a player does not have to be in a Trade Guild just to be able to sell. Add in, in each Zone Capital a "Free Trader" where anyone not already in a Trade Guild can list 10 Items per week for Trade and pay a little higher rate of Sales Tax.

More traders selling equals lower prices. Lower prices will, eventually drive down Kiosk prices, leading to more competition as more, smaller Trade Guilds are able to get a foot hold.

Heck, that would be just about enough to have me praising the system to the heavens. I like the concept of the current system, I just think it is abysmally implemented.

All The Best

@GandalfTheGrey

Your first sentence is fabulous. I stopped at your second sentence comparing a game to the real world.

It's really a small part of the gaming community that's stuck in the means of the game they no longer want to play which is why Zos doesn't want to change from the guild trader.

Zos received feedback via forums, metrics from the game and from regular groups they talk with. From this they see the guild trader system works. It's why it's not changing.

Uriel_Nocturne · January 2017

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Fortunately for us Zso went a different direction and decentralized the market in ESO. We can all be grateful.

@Giles.floydub17_ESO

And as I have stated numerous times I like that decentralised market, it fits beautifully within the socio-economic setting of the game.

But look at historically comparable markets in the real world and you'll see vast differences to how Zeni have done things.

Most Trade Kiosks would be in major urban areas - because that is where most customer are either based, or pass through. Trade Kiosks on the lonely crossroads in the middle of nowhere would fail, and no one would ever bid on them again. The owner of said Trade Kiosk would be forced to move it to a more favourable trade location. Failing that traders who had failed to secure an existing Kiosk would either pay someone to build them a better situated one, or would build one themselves.

I have no problem with a decentralised market model that is appropriate to the socio-economic setting that the game exists within. Problem is that the current Kiosk system is no more that than a centralised AH is.

I don't want an end to the Kiosk system, I just want a much improved version of it.

One where a player does not have to be in a Trade Guild just to be able to sell. Add in, in each Zone Capital a "Free Trader" where anyone not already in a Trade Guild can list 10 Items per week for Trade and pay a little higher rate of Sales Tax.

More traders selling equals lower prices. Lower prices will, eventually drive down Kiosk prices, leading to more competition as more, smaller Trade Guilds are able to get a foot hold.

Heck, that would be just about enough to have me praising the system to the heavens. I like the concept of the current system, I just think it is abysmally implemented.

All The Best

@GandalfTheGrey

Your first sentence is fabulous. I stopped at your second sentence comparing a game to the real world.

It's really a small part of the gaming community that's stuck in the means of the game they no longer want to play which is why Zos doesn't want to change from the guild trader.

Zos received feedback via forums, metrics from the game and from regular groups they talk with. From this they see the guild trader system works. It's why it's not changing.

Bold sentence: And that, in a nutshell, is all that needs to be said.

Despite what a vocal minority says on the Forums (on both sides of the argument), ZOS has access to tools and metrics that none of us can utilize or see. They see what is going on behind the scenes, what does work and what doesn't work; and if ZOS is as adamant as they currently are that the current Guild Trader system is not only working, but working well in the best interests of their game, then that's the system that they're going to keep with.

I applaud them for "sticking to their guns" on this particular subject.

While there might need to be some small tweaks made to make the UI more user friendly, the overall Guild trader system works well, is fair, and allows the market to regulate itself. It's designed in a way that makes it nigh impossible for a single super-wealthy Guild to corner the market on anything, and it also makes it nigh impossible for even a conglomeration of Guilds to control the game economy (despite what unfounded claims the Pro-AH crowd may say, there is ZERO evidence of any type of wide-spread market collusion). Collusion, wealth, and market-control tactics that are constantly dangers in centralized AH markets in other MMO's, are simply not viable worries with the way ESO has their Guild Trader Markets set up.

But those dangers would very much exist if ESO switched to a Global Auction house set-up, and with the determination that ZOS has tapped into in resisting moving to an AH set-up, I think they see that danger as well, and thus they're sticking with what works for THIS game.

Castagere · January 2017

Pallmor wrote: »

Moonfish wrote: »

Why not simply have Auction Houses where every one in Tamriel can freely exchange stuff.

Most other MMO's have them, but every time someone brings it up here, they get shouted down by the traders in the trade guilds who have a vested interest in keeping prices high and restricting access of others to the market. It really makes me angry that a handful of traders are the only ones who are allowed to sell anything in this game, with no way for anyone else to sell.

And before anyone pipes in with "Well, you could sell stuff in chat" that's like telling someone "Well, you can't vote, but you're free to stand outside a polling place begging for someone to vote *for* you." Standing on a street corner in Riften hawking goods in zone chat is not what I consider fair access to the market.

This game has needed an auction house for a long time. The traders claim that auction houses don't work, yet they sure seem to work just fine in every other MMO out there.

Sadly, ZOS tends to listen to a vocal minority on this and many other issues. I guarantee you that if you polled regular, average players and explained how an auction house works that most of them would be for it.

This is so true. The logic behind this reason for not having them makes no sense. The way it is now caters to the few and not everyone.

Uriel_Nocturne · January 2017

Castagere wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

Moonfish wrote: »

Why not simply have Auction Houses where every one in Tamriel can freely exchange stuff.

Most other MMO's have them, but every time someone brings it up here, they get shouted down by the traders in the trade guilds who have a vested interest in keeping prices high and restricting access of others to the market. It really makes me angry that a handful of traders are the only ones who are allowed to sell anything in this game, with no way for anyone else to sell.

And before anyone pipes in with "Well, you could sell stuff in chat" that's like telling someone "Well, you can't vote, but you're free to stand outside a polling place begging for someone to vote *for* you." Standing on a street corner in Riften hawking goods in zone chat is not what I consider fair access to the market.

This game has needed an auction house for a long time. The traders claim that auction houses don't work, yet they sure seem to work just fine in every other MMO out there.

Sadly, ZOS tends to listen to a vocal minority on this and many other issues. I guarantee you that if you polled regular, average players and explained how an auction house works that most of them would be for it.

This is so true. The logic behind this reason for not having them makes no sense. The way it is now caters to the few and not everyone.

Actually neither you nor he are correct in any way.

Both statements are abjectly false.

Patouf · January 2017

Burn all trading guilds and all the job they did.

Sarcasm... or not ?

Gandrhulf_Harbard · January 2017

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Zos received feedback via forums, metrics from the game and from regular groups they talk with. From this they see the guild trader system works. It's why it's not changing.

The problem with internal metrics is that they tend to be self reinforcing unless subject to extreme scrutiny.

The metrics you allude to would, I assume, include the fact that most kiosks are bid on. And that many players are in one or more trade guilds. This in and of itself does NOT show people are satisfied with those systems. It shows the are using them because there is no alternative.

SWTOR suffered from the same myopic use of metrics when they showed that most players were playing the KotFE and KotET chapters, so that must mean players want solo content. Well those chapters were the only new content for 2 years, and they HAD to be played solo. D'uh!

From the very beginning there have been constant calls for either significant improvements to the Guild Trade system (my preferred option) or the introduction of an AH (not my preferred option).

Way back then there were several polls that had huge numbers of players involved. I know @Tandor will remember them because he and I were both very vocal about our opinions in those threads.

The upshot of those polls was this: if given the option to have a much reformed Guild Trade Kiosk system including a method for non guild players to list items for sale the majority of players chose that option. However, if the option was a simple choice of what we have now, or an Auction House the majority of players opted for an Auction House.

Across all of the many threads that discussed this issue 18 months and more ago the ONLY group that favoured the "do nothing, its working fine" option were members of established and wealthy trading guilds.

The Guild Trader System makes it harder for buyers to buy (though some of that has been mitigated by one tamriel) and it make it cumbersome and costly for sellers to sell.

That is almost a perfect description for a trade system the doesn't work.

All The Best

Soella · January 2017

You could literally open a Walmart out in the desert 100 miles from anything even remotely resembling civilization and people would still shop there. I know that from personal experience, believe it or not.

2 of my trade guilds have kiosks in the same capital - but one is next to wayshrine, another one is far away.

My selling through first one are 4 times (literally!) more. Not to mention I am selling roughly 10% cheaper in second one because otherwise difference would be much more.

Kiosk in Craglorn (not the worst city for kiosk) is even less, I participate in that guild only because there are some goods which are selling better their.

Pretty much from what I see there are literally only 6-8 kiosks which can be called "prime spot" (and not all of them are taken by top guilds, which is even more interesting). About 20 more are "OK spot". Everything else is garbage, you are not able to sell effectively there.

Sure, if you want to sell only yokudan motifs, and you need to sell only couple a week you can trade almost anywhere. But if you want to sell most of what you getting while you are playing - normal strategy in most MMO - it's next to impossible in ESO.

Simple example - there is demand on intricate items. I daily got 20+ of them while I am questing/doing writs. In any other MMO it would be no brainer income for a new player, and way to powerlevel crafting for others. What is going on in ESO? I can use my very limited slots on 200-300g item only if I am sure I'll sell it within 1 day, preferably less. No way kiosk in the middle of nowhere can be used for it - and as results market of intricates is slow and expensive. With global AH they would cost about 100g each, easily available and easy to sell.

CromulentForumID · January 2017

alexkdd99 wrote: »

Someone should just list out the numerous arguments for and against auction house/ guild traders. That way when someone wheels this horse out for another beating, all the arguments for and against the system can be easily posted.

Or atleast the people for auction house could maybe come up with some different conspiracy theory to post. That way it is atleast an interesting read and not the same as is in the countless other auction house threads.

Imo this is not the worst system, I believe it is the best. And is not in need of am auction house.

In all of my trade guilds we have open slots nearly every day. 2 of them ALWAYS have a trader in a capital city.

If you can't make enough to pay dues for a prime location trader, then you should probably find a guild that has one in a slower location.

And those who are complaining about getting kicked for not paying, well you get what you deserve. Stop trying to free load and not pay your fines. Also I find it hard to believe you get immediate boot for missing dues 1 time. Most demote you and if you still don't pay then you get the boot, and rightfully so.

And I don't care what happens to the money in the guild bank providing they keep a trader every week. It is not easy to run a trade guild and they should get some benefit for doing so. 2 of my main trade guilds have roughly 50 mil in the bank. So I am not concerned in the least that I am being cheated.

If we must continue beating the horse can you please atleast come up with some new conspiracies?

You post in just about every one of these threads, and I assume you read them. You have boiled all of the arguments against Guild Traders / For AH down to conspiracy theories? Wow.

Agree or disagree with the need for an AH, or like or dislike the current system, but you cannot disagree that decent arguments have been presented on both sides, can you? Mind you, not every post has one, but in total?

Doctordarkspawn · January 2017

Simply put.

I've got better deals with this system.

I've sold reasonibly fast with this system.

ZOS has said you will not get a auction house.

GG. No RE.

CromulentForumID · January 2017

Avidspark wrote: »

Not necessary at all. Every MMO I've ever played that had an auction house, eventually saw every item dropping to just over vendor price, so no, don't want it at all.

Why is this bad? I don't see that explained too often. Are traders/AH just there to make players maximum profit? Is it bad if a lot of goods are a lot more available and fairly cheap to buy?

Doctordarkspawn · January 2017

CromulentForumID wrote: »

Avidspark wrote: »

Not necessary at all. Every MMO I've ever played that had an auction house, eventually saw every item dropping to just over vendor price, so no, don't want it at all.

Why is this bad? I don't see that explained too often. Are traders/AH just there to make players maximum profit? Is it bad if a lot of good are a lot more available and fairly cheap to buy?

This economy is harder to manipulate.

Undercutting and such can happen but it's more organic with better prices the more your willing to go looking.

CromulentForumID · January 2017

Molydeus wrote: »

Uriel_Nocturne wrote: »

I've played WoW. I've played SWtOR, LotRO, Eberon, etc. All of those MMO's have Auction Houses, and in every single one of them, the market is either controlled by a single massive Trade Guild, or a conglomeration of Trade Guilds working together to make sure the entire game economy works to their favor.

The in-game economy on those games sucks, newer Trade Guilds cannot break into the market in any way worth noting, and those Guild Conglomerations use their massive wealth, plus agreements between the Guilds, to fix the Auction house market directly in their favor.

If you think finding an item for a good price (albeit with a bit of hunting for a good deal) is difficult with the Trader System in place now, you have no idea of the frustration and heartbreak you're going to face with an Auction House.

The "Elite Trader Guilds" that you and your ilk keep referencing now, would simply pool their efforts and use their already significant wealth to buy up say... all the Kuta runes or Tempering Alloy's, then would gouge the prices. But then players would HAVE TO pay their exorbitant prices, because those Guild Conglomerations are the only places that have them, even if offered in a centrally located Auction House.

They'd be able to (once again) set extremely high prices, because they've bought up all the available stock, and resell it at a price that gets them the highest "bids".

"But Uriel; I could simply put a Kuta or Tempering Alloy up for sale, and I'd just undercut them! That would fix the market!"

How naive.

They'd simply buy your low-price Kuta or Tempering Alloy (and they'd have the wealth already to make sure that they are the highest "bid"), add it to their own stock, and resell it at a highly marked-up price.

You and your ilk whine and complain about pricing and finding items now. An Auction House would make it much easier to find items, sure; but they'd be controlled by those aforementioned conglomerations of Trading Guilds, and the initial asking prices would be far, far out of your ability to pay for. But, you'd still need those items, so you'd have to find a way to get the money, because there is nowhere else to buy them from.

As I said at the top of this post; I've seen this very thing happen (and it's still going on) in WoW, SWtOR, LotRO, Eberon, and any host of other MMO's with an Auction House.

Frankly, I'd LOVE to keep that sort of price-fixing/gouging out of the ESO game economy.

And an Auction House would do just that, kill the in-game economy.

I played on multiple servers in WoW and never experienced anything like what you're describing. There was never "a trade guild" that controlled everything, and there was always an easy method for an individual, casual player to sell his goods. I never had a problem selling my unique items no matter how large/small the server was. Some servers had lower prices and some had higher prices, but since anyone could access the system no one was ever shut out of it. Did you actually play some of these games you said you did?

I think their argument isn't really wrong, but incomplete. I am sure with a global AH there would be certain items that are controlled. Kutas and Tempering Alloys are good examples. So, if your buying interest is only on those kinds of items, you are going to be looking at a "controlled market" because you are targeting those high-level materials and items that have a small enough supply and large enough demand to make it worth the effort to corner that item.

If you aren't focusing on those items, you would not see a controlled market. You'd probably just see all of the additional supply and cheaper prices for the items you're buying.

I think the "AH would be controlled by Guilds" crowd uses way too broad of languages/arguments. The whole market wouldn't be controlled, but certain things would be. Sometimes it seems like the end-game people forget what the game looks like for the many players who are not at that end game or play competitively. There are, I am sure, large numbers of players who don't give a **** if their items are never gold, let alone even purple.

Likewise, the "It could never be controlled" people need to realize that it would happen for some items.

What players would need to decide is if they think the increased access for sellers and increased supply, with mostly lower prices, is worth the higher prices for high-demand items. And also making less money from selling your stuff because of the increased competition.