What is your tanking setup for vHRC Warrior?

Dubhliam · December 2016

I have tanked vHRC yesterday on my mag DK.
This was the first time I tanked vHRC since it was bumped to CP160, so I really have no idea if I was not geared accordingly or if it was something else that caused my deaths from the Warrior's "A thousand cuts" attack.

Our group composition was: 1 tank, 2 healers, 9 DDs

My gear setup was: 6H, 0M, 1L(gloves) double 1H&S
5 piece Tava
5 Piece Ebon
2 piece Bloodspawn

I am sitting at around 30k health without Warhorn, and close to 30k resistances without the Bloodspawn proc.

I do admit, a few times it was my fault for dying. I am used to weapon swap a lot to activate my buffs, and sometimes I got hit right during the weapon swap.
I will learn from my mistakes and position my skills accordingly for future runs.
I may also swap Bloodspawn for Lord Warden since it will benefit my whole group and it has a much higher proc chance than Bloodspawn, which gets me over the cap, and the only real benefit is the ult generation.

My questions are:

what is your setup for tanking the Warrior?
do you have self heals?
which heals do your healers use the most?

paulsimonps · December 2016

For Regular Veteran Warrior I use:

1p Chokethorn, 1p Shadowrend, 5p Alkosh 5p Dragon

For Hardmode Veteran Warrior I use:

1p Chokethorn, 1p Shadowrend, 5p Hist Bark 5p Dragon

I do not use any self heals for either but I do buff my Healing Received quite a lot. I go into the Hardmode Warrior fight with about 75% Extra healing Received. I remember one run my healers Healing Springs did 11k per tick on me.

And my healers used it all. A combination of Healing Springs, Mutagen/Rapid Regen and Breath of Life. During the parts where only you are being hit Breath of Life will hit you cause you are the only one Damaged, and since HS is a 3s HoT you can do all 3 of those, plus Ritual of Retribution and you will stay alive quite well.

Oh and of course one of the ways I stay alive is for someone to run Guard on you. For HM I will always want Mystic Guard but for regular Warrior I am not picky cause the extra healing isn't as necessary then. I would also recommend you to use the potions with Major Vitality on them, 30% healing received and they last for 47s and Potion cooldown is 45s so you can keep it up for the entire fight as long as you don't run out.

Dubhliam · December 2016

@paulsimonps great advice, thanks.
Although, what you say here confirms my suspicions about the qualifications of my two healers in that particular run.
I have never seen any Grand healing hit me (not sure if they both even had it slotted) plus Extended Rital wasn't up most of the time.
Resulting in an BoL spam that healed everyone but me during those critial two seconds.

paulsimonps · December 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

@paulsimonps great advice, thanks.
Although, what you say here confirms my suspicions about the qualifications of my two healers in that particular run.
I have never seen any Grand healing hit me (not sure if they both even had it slotted) plus Extended Rital wasn't up most of the time.
Resulting in an BoL spam that healed everyone but me during those critial two seconds.

When I first did vHRC after they did the update with the scaling there were some in my guild that since I died a lot questioned me and my build really badly, it got me really frustrated and I spent hours thoerycrafting around the trial and looking over my build. But one of the healers did have a niggling feeling they might be the issue and when Beyond Infinity posted their first clear of vHRC HM and I could see what Woeler was running I showed my guild and they realized I wasn't running this that much different from him and the healers instead cam forth and wondered what they could do better and that's when they started utilizing their skills more and getting a really strong rotation. In the end we all became better players through the experience. But yes a healer that does nothing but BoL will not keep you safe, and if they use their Healing Springs on the group but not having it also cover you then you will not be safe either. The tank needs 75% or more of all the healing on that fight. Sure when he does his star fall at the end everyone gets hit but he isn't doing his channeled sweeps then is he :P So that is how we did it.

Inig0 · December 2016

I use 5 ebon 5 alkosh with bloodspawn or warden. You can dragon blood spam through the channel or just call for big healz and you should be fine. The healers should bol spam for that. Or what else works is getting guarded.

Woeler · December 2016

5 Ebon, 5 Alkosh and BS or LW both works, but I'd never drop alkosh there. I'm always in front of the boss.

The swipes hit hard, but can be survived easily if there is a spings on the ground if you are using vitality potions and put up an igneous shield before every hit. There should simply be one healer that is always looking out for you, or if you have real troubles, ask for guard. Also of course 100 points in hardy.

Dubhliam · December 2016

Woeler wrote: »

5 Ebon, 5 Alkosh and BS or LW both works, but I'd never drop alkosh there. I'm always in front of the boss.

The swipes hit hard, but can be survived easily if there is a spings on the ground if you are using vitality potions and put up an igneous shield before every hit. There should simply be one healer that is always looking out for you, or if you have real troubles, ask for guard. Also of course 100 points in hardy.

Great advice, thanks!
I will most definitely switch to Vitality potions in the future.

I am also using Igneous very often since I am a mag tank.
I was thinking about replacing it for Coagulating Blood.
The reasoning is that Blood would give me healing received, while Shield gives me healing done (which I don't do).
Another thing is... shields don't take resistances into account. But what worries me even more is that I heard once that a hit done while you have a shield will go unmitigated even for the damage beyond the shield value.
Is there any truth to it?

Woeler · December 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

5 Ebon, 5 Alkosh and BS or LW both works, but I'd never drop alkosh there. I'm always in front of the boss.

The swipes hit hard, but can be survived easily if there is a spings on the ground if you are using vitality potions and put up an igneous shield before every hit. There should simply be one healer that is always looking out for you, or if you have real troubles, ask for guard. Also of course 100 points in hardy.

Great advice, thanks!
I will most definitely switch to Vitality potions in the future.

I am also using Igneous very often since I am a mag tank.
I was thinking about replacing it for Coagulating Blood.
The reasoning is that Blood would give me healing received, while Shield gives me healing done (which I don't do).
Another thing is... shields don't take resistances into account. But what worries me even more is that I heard once that a hit done while you have a shield will go unmitigated even for the damage beyond the shield value.
Is there any truth to it?

Nah, that's complete nonsense. Would mean that as soon as you pop a shield he would insta kill you.

Dubhliam · December 2016

Woeler wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

5 Ebon, 5 Alkosh and BS or LW both works, but I'd never drop alkosh there. I'm always in front of the boss.

The swipes hit hard, but can be survived easily if there is a spings on the ground if you are using vitality potions and put up an igneous shield before every hit. There should simply be one healer that is always looking out for you, or if you have real troubles, ask for guard. Also of course 100 points in hardy.

Great advice, thanks!
I will most definitely switch to Vitality potions in the future.

I am also using Igneous very often since I am a mag tank.
I was thinking about replacing it for Coagulating Blood.
The reasoning is that Blood would give me healing received, while Shield gives me healing done (which I don't do).
Another thing is... shields don't take resistances into account. But what worries me even more is that I heard once that a hit done while you have a shield will go unmitigated even for the damage beyond the shield value.
Is there any truth to it?

Nah, that's complete nonsense. Would mean that as soon as you pop a shield he would insta kill you.

Okay, that's great to hear.

o0Velius · December 2016

5 Ebon,
5 Alkosh
and 2 Warden.
( I stopped using BS as my group has no need for extra Ult regen and warden has a high Prox chance, However Bloodspawn is a good option)

My orginal Tanking set up was:
5 Dragon
5 tavas
2 Bloodspawn.
And I could tank the Warrior just fine. But this was back when my Group needed massive Ulti regen for those Warhorn pops.

My healers are Instructed to NOT use BoL, as every time they do it hits someone who has full health and I am stuck holding my breath hoping I don't die. They simply place their 2 healing springs on me and the whole group. If your team is potions the right way you can easy have both your healers healing you and the whole group. That is 2 healing springs on you; from 2 healers. As well as Healing orbs ( for the alkosh prox and the healing) combat Prayer( For the HOT) rapid/Mutagen ( For the HOT) However at the time of his 3 Rapid swings their main focus is double healing Springs.

I not only Tank the Warrior, but I also Tank the Destroyers that come out as well.

what it really comes down to is having your buffs up at the time of his swings as well.

I also use lingering Health potions, that increase my healing received.
I run vigor on my back bar however it is on my back bar so it is pointless, but having that HOT activated right before he does it will help as well.

Dubhliam · December 2016

MrsVelius wrote: »

5 Ebon,
5 Alkosh
and 2 Warden.
( I stopped using BS as my group has no need for extra Ult regen and warden has a high Prox chance, However Bloodspawn is a good option)

My orginal Tanking set up was:
5 Dragon
5 tavas
2 Bloodspawn.
And I could tank the Warrior just fine. But this was back when my Group needed massive Ulti regen for those Warhorn pops.

My healers are Instructed to NOT use BoL, as every time they do it hits someone who has full health and I am stuck holding my breath hoping I don't die. They simply place their 2 healing springs on me and the whole group. If your team is potions the right way you can easy have both your healers healing you and the whole group. That is 2 healing springs on you; from 2 healers. As well as Healing orbs ( for the alkosh prox and the healing) combat Prayer( For the HOT) rapid/Mutagen ( For the HOT) However at the time of his 3 Rapid swings their main focus is double healing Springs.

I not only Tank the Warrior, but I also Tank the Destroyers that come out as well.

what it really comes down to is having your buffs up at the time of his swings as well.

I also use lingering Health potions, that increase my healing received.
I run vigor on my back bar however it is on my back bar so it is pointless, but having that HOT activated right before he does it will help as well.

Great, thanks.

This, unfortunately, means that I was right about my healers improperly using BoL in trials.

I guess 4 man dungeons won't adequately prepare healers for trials, no matter how difficult they are.

o0Velius · December 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

MrsVelius wrote: »

5 Ebon,
5 Alkosh
and 2 Warden.
( I stopped using BS as my group has no need for extra Ult regen and warden has a high Prox chance, However Bloodspawn is a good option)

My orginal Tanking set up was:
5 Dragon
5 tavas
2 Bloodspawn.
And I could tank the Warrior just fine. But this was back when my Group needed massive Ulti regen for those Warhorn pops.

My healers are Instructed to NOT use BoL, as every time they do it hits someone who has full health and I am stuck holding my breath hoping I don't die. They simply place their 2 healing springs on me and the whole group. If your team is potions the right way you can easy have both your healers healing you and the whole group. That is 2 healing springs on you; from 2 healers. As well as Healing orbs ( for the alkosh prox and the healing) combat Prayer( For the HOT) rapid/Mutagen ( For the HOT) However at the time of his 3 Rapid swings their main focus is double healing Springs.

I not only Tank the Warrior, but I also Tank the Destroyers that come out as well.

what it really comes down to is having your buffs up at the time of his swings as well.

I also use lingering Health potions, that increase my healing received.
I run vigor on my back bar however it is on my back bar so it is pointless, but having that HOT activated right before he does it will help as well.

Great, thanks.

This, unfortunately, means that I was right about my healers improperly using BoL in trials.

I guess 4 man dungeons won't adequately prepare healers for trials, no matter how difficult they are.

no way, the only way for a healer to get better at 12 man content ( same with tanks) is to actually play the content and learn from what they could do better. things like that take time and also take people who want to learn to better themselves of course lol.

BoL is a useful skill however I noticed personally that it was not healing me during his hits, and that is why I have both my healers stack double healing springs on myself & the group; for safe keeping. along with all their HOTs.

What system do you play on?

prettynink · December 2016

I run atm 5 Tava 5 Footman 2 Bloodspawn until I am get my 5 ebon 5 alkosh, or Sunderflame and Powerful assault. (for either main or off tanking). My tank is an imperial and her health sits at 45k max mag 10-12k max stam generally 15k. My cp distribution for the warrior is 100 into hardy 30 into quik recov and 57 into ele defender. 57 blessed 100 into piercing and 30 into shattering blows (i like to take her into pvp sometimes). 100 warlord and 87 into magician.

My bar setup, which I will only let you know what i use on my main bar because its the only bar the really matters when you are maining the warrior. Pierce armor, evasion, igneous shields, spell symmatry, hardened armor, ult warhorn.

I built my tank around my maining a healer for vet trials, normally I don't trust healers( well random ones anyway). so with this tank setup its foolproof or well incapable healer proof and guard proof. Resource management A plus plus. spell symm to get all your magika back to be able to spam igneous to you and your group during his swipes plus get stam back to be able to consistently block.. with this tank I 've been getting called in more than I would like for vhrc vaa vso, and vdsa. Hope this helps..

side note you said you were a mag dk?? dunmer perhaps? If so you may want to rethink putting your points into health as they get a max mag max stam boost

paulsimonps · December 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

5 Ebon, 5 Alkosh and BS or LW both works, but I'd never drop alkosh there. I'm always in front of the boss.

The swipes hit hard, but can be survived easily if there is a spings on the ground if you are using vitality potions and put up an igneous shield before every hit. There should simply be one healer that is always looking out for you, or if you have real troubles, ask for guard. Also of course 100 points in hardy.

Great advice, thanks!
I will most definitely switch to Vitality potions in the future.

I am also using Igneous very often since I am a mag tank.
I was thinking about replacing it for Coagulating Blood.
The reasoning is that Blood would give me healing received, while Shield gives me healing done (which I don't do).
Another thing is... shields don't take resistances into account. But what worries me even more is that I heard once that a hit done while you have a shield will go unmitigated even for the damage beyond the shield value.
Is there any truth to it?

Nah, that's complete nonsense. Would mean that as soon as you pop a shield he would insta kill you.

Okay, that's great to hear.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279426/damage-mitigation-explanation-and-list-of-options/p1

Have a look at this, will help you a bit in that regard I think. It contains a explanation for how mitigation works in great detail and which mitigations gets applied before a damage shield is factored in and which goes after, this has a great significance for how much damage you will take after the damage shield is depleted. But like was stated earlier and as my text just now said too there is mitigation before AND after a damage shield, key is to know which goes where.

Dubhliam · December 2016

Dunmer.

o0Velius · December 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

Dunmer.

I do know ATM its a bit harder for Magicka Tanks to tank the harder content.. However being a DK you shouldn't have any issues at all; since Dk can get stam back from spaming igneous shields.. I Run a tank for every Class; and Have tanked all the content in the game on all of them ( actually all my characters are tanks ranging from Magic to Stam to health builds)

You shouldn't have any issues, except the normal. "I bar swaped at the wrong time." and Healers falling asleep.
I've ranked the bottom boss of vHRC with my healer snoring in my hear.. Needless to say being a Magicka Dk you can sit there and spam dragon Blood; and Viggor at the same time for extra health. However on this boss itself bar swapping can be dangerous if not done correctly. It all comes down to knowing exactly when to bar swap and having healers that are not always spaming BoL during his 3 swings.

Dubhliam · December 2016

MrsVelius wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Dunmer.

I do know ATM its a bit harder for Magicka Tanks to tank the harder content.. However being a DK you shouldn't have any issues at all; since Dk can get stam back from spaming igneous shields.. I Run a tank for every Class; and Have tanked all the content in the game on all of them ( actually all my characters are tanks ranging from Magic to Stam to health builds)

You shouldn't have any issues, except the normal. "I bar swaped at the wrong time." and Healers falling asleep.
I've ranked the bottom boss of vHRC with my healer snoring in my hear.. Needless to say being a Magicka Dk you can sit there and spam dragon Blood; and Viggor at the same time for extra health. However on this boss itself bar swapping can be dangerous if not done correctly. It all comes down to knowing exactly when to bar swap and having healers that are not always spaming BoL during his 3 swings.

Permablocking was never an issue for me.
Stamina was never the problem during the Warrior.
Not getting healed was the problem.

As I said... bar swapping is one of the things I need to improve on my part, since my current skill allocation requires constant swapping.
Also, I will start using Vitality potions in trials.

But mostly I guess I will simply tell my healers to drop BoL as it isn't doing anyone any good during those critical seconds.

paulsimonps · December 2016

Dubhliam wrote: »

MrsVelius wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Dunmer.

I do know ATM its a bit harder for Magicka Tanks to tank the harder content.. However being a DK you shouldn't have any issues at all; since Dk can get stam back from spaming igneous shields.. I Run a tank for every Class; and Have tanked all the content in the game on all of them ( actually all my characters are tanks ranging from Magic to Stam to health builds)

You shouldn't have any issues, except the normal. "I bar swaped at the wrong time." and Healers falling asleep.
I've ranked the bottom boss of vHRC with my healer snoring in my hear.. Needless to say being a Magicka Dk you can sit there and spam dragon Blood; and Viggor at the same time for extra health. However on this boss itself bar swapping can be dangerous if not done correctly. It all comes down to knowing exactly when to bar swap and having healers that are not always spaming BoL during his 3 swings.

Permablocking was never an issue for me.
Stamina was never the problem during the Warrior.
Not getting healed was the problem.

As I said... bar swapping is one of the things I need to improve on my part, since my current skill allocation requires constant swapping.
Also, I will start using Vitality potions in trials.

But mostly I guess I will simply tell my healers to drop BoL as it isn't doing anyone any good during those critical seconds.

Don't tell them to drop it. Using it in combination with their HoTs is the key. Healing Springs is a 3s HoT, if they take those 3s between each HS to do Mutagen/Rapid Regen and a BoL then they will be able to give you extremely strong heals and put out more HoTs for you and everyone else. This combo is great for any scenario where the majority of the group is not taking damage or not taking a lot at least but the main tank is tanking a lot. The first boss of Hel Ra is another good example of that. Cause when he does is spins after 30% HP then everyone else is still taking damage from the whirlwinds but the tank is taking great amounts of damage from the Spin. So unless you want the tank to be running from the spin the healers need to be focused on the tank, if he dies its either a wipe or a ton of group members just died.

Dubhliam · December 2016

paulsimonps wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

MrsVelius wrote: »

Dubhliam wrote: »

Dunmer.

I do know ATM its a bit harder for Magicka Tanks to tank the harder content.. However being a DK you shouldn't have any issues at all; since Dk can get stam back from spaming igneous shields.. I Run a tank for every Class; and Have tanked all the content in the game on all of them ( actually all my characters are tanks ranging from Magic to Stam to health builds)

You shouldn't have any issues, except the normal. "I bar swaped at the wrong time." and Healers falling asleep.
I've ranked the bottom boss of vHRC with my healer snoring in my hear.. Needless to say being a Magicka Dk you can sit there and spam dragon Blood; and Viggor at the same time for extra health. However on this boss itself bar swapping can be dangerous if not done correctly. It all comes down to knowing exactly when to bar swap and having healers that are not always spaming BoL during his 3 swings.

Permablocking was never an issue for me.
Stamina was never the problem during the Warrior.
Not getting healed was the problem.

As I said... bar swapping is one of the things I need to improve on my part, since my current skill allocation requires constant swapping.
Also, I will start using Vitality potions in trials.

But mostly I guess I will simply tell my healers to drop BoL as it isn't doing anyone any good during those critical seconds.

Don't tell them to drop it. Using it in combination with their HoTs is the key. Healing Springs is a 3s HoT, if they take those 3s between each HS to do Mutagen/Rapid Regen and a BoL then they will be able to give you extremely strong heals and put out more HoTs for you and everyone else. This combo is great for any scenario where the majority of the group is not taking damage or not taking a lot at least but the main tank is tanking a lot. The first boss of Hel Ra is another good example of that. Cause when he does is spins after 30% HP then everyone else is still taking damage from the whirlwinds but the tank is taking great amounts of damage from the Spin. So unless you want the tank to be running from the spin the healers need to be focused on the tank, if he dies its either a wipe or a ton of group members just died.

The first boss is a great example where I never expected to die.
And that is exactly what happened.
The misuse of BoL is the thing that leads to deaths during spins. Or, to be more precise, the lack of Extended Ritual and Grand Healing.