CP bigotry on this game is out of control. Something needs to be done.

Rev Rielle · December 2016

Remove visual indication of CP, I'm in support of this.
It's just a mechanism used to separate the player base. We need everything we can get to bring the playing community together, not further segregate it into 'them and us'.

dday3six · December 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

CP really should be anonymous or at the very least capped at 160 visible to others.

More CP mean NOTHING other than you've played the game for X amount of time longer than Y player.

The other day, I PUG'd vCoS with a CP150 stamblade and a CP540 stamsorc that had never done that dungeon before AND WE CLEARED IT. Why? Because we took the time to explain the mechanics of the dungeon and boss fights. It wasn't perfect ofc, we wiped twice, but considering the circumstances, I felt it was amazing and by the end of the dungeon, the CP 150 had made it to CP160 so he got a maxed out Velidreth helm for all that.

I'm not saying that there aren't bad low CP players but I've seen just as many max CP characters just spamming Dizzy Swing, Snipe, or Light attacks that I learned to not judge people by their CP but how well they play.

While you cannot judge a player on CP alone, at the same time you cannot say that CP means nothing either. There are large tangible increases from CP which skill alone cannot overcome. If that was not the case, a CP cap would not have been required in the first place.

Jeremy · December 2016

dday3six wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

CP really should be anonymous or at the very least capped at 160 visible to others.

More CP mean NOTHING other than you've played the game for X amount of time longer than Y player.

The other day, I PUG'd vCoS with a CP150 stamblade and a CP540 stamsorc that had never done that dungeon before AND WE CLEARED IT. Why? Because we took the time to explain the mechanics of the dungeon and boss fights. It wasn't perfect ofc, we wiped twice, but considering the circumstances, I felt it was amazing and by the end of the dungeon, the CP 150 had made it to CP160 so he got a maxed out Velidreth helm for all that.

I'm not saying that there aren't bad low CP players but I've seen just as many max CP characters just spamming Dizzy Swing, Snipe, or Light attacks that I learned to not judge people by their CP but how well they play.

While you cannot judge a player on CP alone, at the same time you cannot say that CP means nothing either. There are large tangible increases from CP which skill alone cannot overcome. If that was not the case, a CP cap would not have been required in the first place.

CP can make a good player better - but it can't make a bad player good or a good player bad.

Integral1900 · December 2016

Cp should be hidden, there are a lot of players that grind to max level having played almost nothing of the game and reach 561 barely knowing one end of a build from the other. Max cp means very little when, in reality it could be getting an experienced engine of destruction or just as easily a grinder that stands at the back with bow and rest staff spamming light attacks. All cp does is give the tiny elitist minority an almost inexhaustible supply of fuel.

One rare occasion I was doing vet RoM, very rare thing for me mostly as being a bit lazy I forgot to set it to normal, lol, myself as healer and two others, one was a dps and the other was a tank. A cp 120 joins, someone votes to kick but having no reason to I decline the motion, the dps leaves in a huff and in comes another, again at 561 and of we go..... holy god......

Now bear in mind that my healer was out dps ing the 561 dps and the tank combined. The cp 120 they wanted to kick cleared well over the 50000 mark and stayed there. All I did was feed this destroyer of worlds a bit of stamina and once they needed a heal. I'm a pretty average player but if I put my mind to it I can just nudge 35000 using a glass cannon, this beast had 25000 health and close to max resistance, it was awesome! I was so supprised I forgot to message them till after the dungeon and I didn't remember their name but I tell you what, you sure as hell don't need max cp to take an end boss by the nose and knock its block off!

I swear this player could solo the dam thing, as a side note I don't think any proc sets were used, I am familiar with most of them and I'm pretty sure they were not present.

dday3six · December 2016

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

CP needs to be totally rebalanced or gutted entirely. INB4 Mah progrezzunz.

It has done nothing but encourage power creep, elitism, and is the cause of SO MANY nerfs to amazing skills and gear sets in this game.

It is pretty much the root of all issues in this game. I realize that some people NEED, on a deep psychological level to feel like their character is getting more powerful by means of arbitrary inflated numbers on their stat sheet even though the monsters they fight are also getting increased HP and resistances so its all a meaningless tredmill but for the love of talos can we get a progression system that offers some imcomparable benefits instead of just raw damage and stat increases? Its killing the game and has already destroyed PvP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

I'm just going to lay it out there. Name me one game that has ever taken the advice of EC and saw commercial success. Name one game of modern relevance that any of the EC people have contributed to that affords them even a modicum of credibility within the industry. Here is the thing, they are not game developers or designers. They are pretentious whiners hiding behind squeak boxes vocial processing while pretending their inane dribble is actually of any importance.

Oh, and while we're at it, why don't you at least briefly detail what the system should look like rather than just ambiguously mentioning it.

dday3six · December 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

dday3six wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

CP really should be anonymous or at the very least capped at 160 visible to others.

More CP mean NOTHING other than you've played the game for X amount of time longer than Y player.

The other day, I PUG'd vCoS with a CP150 stamblade and a CP540 stamsorc that had never done that dungeon before AND WE CLEARED IT. Why? Because we took the time to explain the mechanics of the dungeon and boss fights. It wasn't perfect ofc, we wiped twice, but considering the circumstances, I felt it was amazing and by the end of the dungeon, the CP 150 had made it to CP160 so he got a maxed out Velidreth helm for all that.

I'm not saying that there aren't bad low CP players but I've seen just as many max CP characters just spamming Dizzy Swing, Snipe, or Light attacks that I learned to not judge people by their CP but how well they play.

While you cannot judge a player on CP alone, at the same time you cannot say that CP means nothing either. There are large tangible increases from CP which skill alone cannot overcome. If that was not the case, a CP cap would not have been required in the first place.

CP can make a good player better - but it can't make a bad player good or a good player bad.

That is going to depend on the more than just the general vagueness of "good or bad", as those descriptions are largely subject to personal interpretation. CP can provide cushion which allows the 'bad' player more room for error. Generally though it's been my experience that it's not good vs bad, but rather knowledgeable and practiced vs not.

Try a no-CP Vet dungeon run some time. It'll give you more prospective on just how impactful CP can be.

livingdeaddoll_zx · December 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

Joined a Selene's Web today. Had a low CP player one of the other players kept trying to vote kick them. I lost count how many times - but it was literally spammed the entire dungeon.

We were making fine progress. No deaths - was killing every boss easily. There was absolutely no legitimate reason to kick anyone. Then we get to the last boss - and the other DPS (the maxed CP one and I'm assuming the one who kept initiating the vote kick) refused to participate in the fight. He just stood there - in the corner - doing nothing. I guess because he was pissed I would not vote along with him - and instead of winning the fight (which we could have easily done if he had simply fought) he stood there in the corner doing nothing. Then he conspired with the tank to keep resetting the boss. Eventually the low CP guy got fed up and just left on his own accord. This nonsense needs to end. And it needs to end now.

Either CP needs to be made anonymous on this game - meaning other players cannot see it - or they need to just add a CP requirement to do vet dungeons. Because I am getting very fed up with dealing with all of this nonsense over players who have low amounts of CP - and then the players who are using it as an excuse to go all elitist on them. This crap has reached the breaking point and some action needs to be taken.

I had a similar thing happen on seline's web yesterday too , the cp bias is getting stupid. I moved from PS4 with several maxed out characters to pc where I had to start again, but despite being CP300 i also have to put up with bias when it comes to trials which I've run a lot and back before they were nurfed. A lot of content is easier then it use to be and some players with low CP still manage to make better healers and tanks in dungeons. I do believe below cp160 some things can be a bit rough but that has to be judged player to player. Patience seems to be the biggest problem. I ran selines 3 times yesterday and the first 2 we breezed through but the third group struggled and of course the cp561 tank wanted to play the blame game. After finally leaving our tanky 'leader' to form our own group we struggled quite a bit but found a way to work as a group and completed the dungeon with 4 'low' cp players. All it took was a little patience and communication.

Dymence · December 2016

The problem is not the fact that you can see CP.

The problem is that some people are ***. And they are going to be ***, no matter what. If you would have CP being invisible to others, people like this will just find another reason to kick you over.

exeeter702 · December 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

CP shouldn't matter for something like Selene's Web, but I don't agree with anonymous CP. The general population is already being punished enough with the 15 minute timer and being unable to manage groups. A few bad Apples don't warrant punishing the entire community.

Well then they need to put a 160 cap or something on Veteran Dungeons - because there is just no excuse for the kind of crap low CP players have to go through on this game when they sign up to do vet dungeons.

And it's not just a few bad apples. It's a widespread practice that happens almost every time I see a low CP player inside a dungeon. And I run a lot of dungeons.

Doesn't matter to me. I have never vote kicked anyone from a group that wasn't afk. I shouldn't have to deal with 15 minute timer or the removal of cp visibility. I'd be fine with them only allowing inactive players to be vote kicked or some other approach that doesn't inconvenience everyone.

How about this then - we make it optional? You can choose whether or not to have your CP visible to other players. That way you aren't forced into anything - but other players who don't want to be pre-judged due to their CP levels can avoid being done so.

you can possibly be that naive man.....

I would prefer just to make it invisible all-together. I was just trying to compromise with that poster.

i undestand.. but to even think for a second that a compromise like that would function in an online mmo environment is absurd.

Also.. the issue is not in simply masking CP, that solves very little and only fosters an environment where underperforming players (low cp or otherwise) have one more thing they can hide behind to avoid accountability. Listen.. if you have 4 players in a group, all are strangers and for the exception 1 player who is cp30, they are all cp cap. They are matched with the group finder for a specific dungeon in an effort to get their keys. Upon reaching the last boss, they activate hardmode and proceed to fail due to a lack of dps. Outside of incredible scrutiny, the max cp players would have no idea where the issue lies.

I would not automatically kick someone just because they were masking their CP. I would mask my own CP as well if it was an option - and I am well over 160 CP. So no - I don't believe it's absurd - though as I admitted in the subsequent post there probably would be many players who would instant kick people who did hide it just because they are ______.

Which is why I would just prefer to make it anonymous period.

CP is not an adequate way to judge other players anyway. Many people believe it is - which is false - which is why it needs to be taken out of the equation so people can actually get a fair shake in dungeons.

Also : this is not about keeping people from getting their feelings hurt. This is about combating the stupidity of bigotry where people assume other players suck based on nothing but their CP number. I have been in many groups where the Achilles Heel of the group was someone with max CP. So being able to see or not see CP isn't going to make a difference in that regard.

Then you understand how on the other end of the spectrum it doesnt work either. The actual issue is bigger then you are making it out to be. There is nothing bigoted about kicking a cp30 when you are constantly failing a dungeon due to said player. Granted in the OP the scenario was indeed a bit *** up since there are plenty of idiots that play this game. But if you were to call me a bigot for voting a cp30 out at the very start of vet CoS where the remaining players are 400+ and intend on doing HM velidreth, then i would in turn call you a naive fool. And if we couldnt see the cp values? then what? pull some trash mobs notice the snails pace that is occurring, or the tank is taking massive amounts of damage despite avoiding the red and blocking the big hits? Does the group then stop and ask everyone what their CP is?

Masking CP will solve the attitude and prejudgemental mindset problems only with said players that are easily vote kicked as of now anyways. And it would make genuine issues like a lack of player power that much more hard to diagnose.

The issue is with ZOS, content difficulty variables, a lack of in game role education, and the natural issue of power creep. Not internet bigotry.

exeeter702 · December 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

dday3six wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

CP really should be anonymous or at the very least capped at 160 visible to others.

More CP mean NOTHING other than you've played the game for X amount of time longer than Y player.

The other day, I PUG'd vCoS with a CP150 stamblade and a CP540 stamsorc that had never done that dungeon before AND WE CLEARED IT. Why? Because we took the time to explain the mechanics of the dungeon and boss fights. It wasn't perfect ofc, we wiped twice, but considering the circumstances, I felt it was amazing and by the end of the dungeon, the CP 150 had made it to CP160 so he got a maxed out Velidreth helm for all that.

I'm not saying that there aren't bad low CP players but I've seen just as many max CP characters just spamming Dizzy Swing, Snipe, or Light attacks that I learned to not judge people by their CP but how well they play.

While you cannot judge a player on CP alone, at the same time you cannot say that CP means nothing either. There are large tangible increases from CP which skill alone cannot overcome. If that was not the case, a CP cap would not have been required in the first place.

CP can make a good player better - but it can't make a bad player good or a good player bad.

you totally sidestepped the validity of his statement.

exeeter702 · December 2016

dday3six wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

CP needs to be totally rebalanced or gutted entirely. INB4 Mah progrezzunz.

It has done nothing but encourage power creep, elitism, and is the cause of SO MANY nerfs to amazing skills and gear sets in this game.

It is pretty much the root of all issues in this game. I realize that some people NEED, on a deep psychological level to feel like their character is getting more powerful by means of arbitrary inflated numbers on their stat sheet even though the monsters they fight are also getting increased HP and resistances so its all a meaningless tredmill but for the love of talos can we get a progression system that offers some imcomparable benefits instead of just raw damage and stat increases? Its killing the game and has already destroyed PvP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

I'm just going to lay it out there. Name me one game that has ever taken the advice of EC and saw commercial success. Name one game of modern relevance that any of the EC people have contributed to that affords them even a modicum of credibility within the industry. Here is the thing, they are not game developers or designers. They are pretentious whiners hiding behind squeak boxes vocial processing while pretending their inane dribble is actually of any importance.

Oh, and while we're at it, why don't you at least briefly detail what the system should look like rather than just ambiguously mentioning it.

I understand where you are coming from, but its not really an opinion that video, at least not the main message isnt. Explaining the drawbacks of powercreep is an objective observation. Power creep is an actual thing and it was explained clearly in that video.

starkerealm · December 2016

So... Wouldn't constantly spamming the kick, and then sabotaging the run constitute reportable harassment?

starkerealm · December 2016

dday3six wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

CP needs to be totally rebalanced or gutted entirely. INB4 Mah progrezzunz.

It has done nothing but encourage power creep, elitism, and is the cause of SO MANY nerfs to amazing skills and gear sets in this game.

It is pretty much the root of all issues in this game. I realize that some people NEED, on a deep psychological level to feel like their character is getting more powerful by means of arbitrary inflated numbers on their stat sheet even though the monsters they fight are also getting increased HP and resistances so its all a meaningless tredmill but for the love of talos can we get a progression system that offers some imcomparable benefits instead of just raw damage and stat increases? Its killing the game and has already destroyed PvP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

I'm just going to lay it out there. Name me one game that has ever taken the advice of EC and saw commercial success. Name one game of modern relevance that any of the EC people have contributed to that affords them even a modicum of credibility within the industry. Here is the thing, they are not game developers or designers. They are pretentious whiners hiding behind squeak boxes vocial processing while pretending their inane dribble is actually of any importance.

Oh, and while we're at it, why don't you at least briefly detail what the system should look like rather than just ambiguously mentioning it.

I was going to say something far less comprehensive on them.

Well said.

Vereaux078 · December 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

Iselin wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Iselin wrote: »

Whether we like it or not there ARE a few problems with those under CP160 doing vet dungeons--especially the 2's and DLC ones as DPS.

1. Most players, if they have any sense, save all their keys until they are CP160 so as not to waste them on shoulders that will just need to be replaced in a few days. This means that generally they are not benefiting from the added monster mask/shoulder DPS.
2. Just like above, unless they are very gold rich, they won't be bothering to upgrade their weapons and armor to legendary gold for the same reason. DPS missing there as well.
3. Chances also are that due to the trait RNG they're not using all or mostly Divines and Sharpened, much less vMA or trial weapons. DPS missing there as well.

With the addition of keys to completion of pledges in normal mode with 1T, there really is very little reason for sub-CP160s to queue for vet dungeons and IMO, CP160 should become the new entry level for veteran pledges, not level 50.

Why would you even queue for veteran when you're under CP160 when the key and even XP reward for randoms is the same in normal and vet. You don't even get an extra key for vet unless you do the last boss in HM and that's really pushing it for a low CP group. Are you doing it for possible purple jewelry drops that you're going to replace anyway once you're CP160? That seems like a really silly and wasteful reason.

CP by itself is not really the issue. But it is an indication that the sub-CP160 player is not going to be putting out good DPS due to lack of optimal gear. Do yourselves a favor and stick to normal dungeon runs until you have the gear for veteran runs.

There can be problems in those dungeons even if the DPS are over CP 160.

It's less about CP and more about the player and his or her own abilities.

Anyway, this was not even an issue in the example I gave. I am confident we could have won that fight if only the other DPS had helped instead of pout in the corner because I would not follow his lead and kick the low CP player for no good reason. In any case - he should have at least given it a try.

Just give the player a chance. If it turns out they don't have enough damage most of the time they will leave on their own accord anyway. This thread is more about combating CP bigotry. If there is a legitimate issue with not enough damage being done - then that is another matter.

I wasn't even thinking about your example. You had an obstinate *** in your group that pouted and went on strike when he couldn't get his way. Those people exist and will always exist no matter what mechanics change or stay the same.

I was just thinking out loud in general terms about what might possess someone under CP160 to even queue for vet and suggesting that they shouldn't

Well I would imagine those monster sets would be good at any level, not just post CP 160. So I can see why they queue up.

You're right that some dungeons are more demanding on DPS than others - and once a player comes to realize they don't have enough damage to complete them then they should refrain from doing them until they are better equipped. But it's going to be difficult for these players to learn which dungeons they can handle and which ones they can't if they are always kicked at the start.

You are right about this, so like in most mmo, there should be a higher cp requirement for more difficult dungeons. For example the dlc ones. Or not a requirement, but a fair warning for lower cp players when they press queue.

Example : this dungeon is difficult to player under... cp, beware of the difficulty of this content.

Or something like that.

To stay on topic, it was clearly a guy that didn't want to take too long to find a group and clear the dungeon. Sometimes you're lucky with the dungeon finder and sometimes you're not. Anyway if I am not in the mood to do the dungeon, I don't use the group finder, but ask in the guild for people. If I want a challenge I do. I can imagine people on max cp don't want to be in a veteran dungeon for over an hour. I rather do them in 15 to 20 minutes as well. But I take the effort to make a group myself. If people don't want to do any effort to make one.
You use the dungeon finder on your own risk.

I think it is a good idea to let people get options in searching groups in dungeon finder.
I do love to do random dungeons, but I always leave if I end up with a dlc dungeon. So an option to exclude those would be nice for random ones.

To make a long story short, they still need some adjustments for the dungeon finder. And not the dungeon finder only. The game is still young, eventually we will get there.

SquareSausage · December 2016

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Some people have stated they don't run dungeons for fun, just for the rewards/xp and some of those people are probably the same people who find grinding for gear a necessity and a ballache too. I'm wondering what do they find fun? It sometimes comes across as a number of players just continuously do things they find monotonous and not very fun. If it's not doing dungeons just for the sake of it, they're farming vMA for hours on end or boss runs for gear. Do some people genuinely do hours upon hours of *** they find dull just so they can have 5mins of actual fun? I mean, what fun things do you actually do with that gear if you're mainly just a PvE player? I really wonder why some people play this game. It's been a real eye opener.

With any MMO, to be able to compete successfully in end game you need to grind, grind, grind through lower level group content or solo play to adequately equip you for the harder material.

With this MMO we are all lumped together no matter of CP in group finder and obviously people who are 'grinding' compared to casually doing a dungeon want to minimize the time in said dungeon.

I'm not for kicking anyone, if I'm doing a vet dungeon I know to be one of the harder ones and the the majority of the group is below 160 i'll prob leave myself rather than instigate any kicking.

Draxys · December 2016

CP level isn't the issue, you had an @sshole in group. It might suck sometimes, but put em on ignore and do it again with a reasonable human being. Problem solved.

Yolokin_Swagonborn · December 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

CP needs to be totally rebalanced or gutted entirely. INB4 Mah progrezzunz.

It has done nothing but encourage power creep, elitism, and is the cause of SO MANY nerfs to amazing skills and gear sets in this game.

It is pretty much the root of all issues in this game. I realize that some people NEED, on a deep psychological level to feel like their character is getting more powerful by means of arbitrary inflated numbers on their stat sheet even though the monsters they fight are also getting increased HP and resistances so its all a meaningless tredmill but for the love of talos can we get a progression system that offers some imcomparable benefits instead of just raw damage and stat increases? Its killing the game and has already destroyed PvP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

I understand what you are saying - but this is a vital element of RPG games. It's all about character progression and becoming more powerful. When you lose that incentive - the game becomes stale and many players will go find something else to play.

Really? I've been playing this game for almost three years now and the only times I have been at the verge of quitting is when ZOS increases the level cap and forces me to regrind all of my gear and stats again in order to be competitive in PvP. There are so many builds to create, so many races with unique passives to pair with classes things that I have more than enough to do at endgame provided I don't have to continuously grind to stay at endgame.

dday3six · December 2016

exeeter702 wrote: »

dday3six wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

CP needs to be totally rebalanced or gutted entirely. INB4 Mah progrezzunz.

It has done nothing but encourage power creep, elitism, and is the cause of SO MANY nerfs to amazing skills and gear sets in this game.

It is pretty much the root of all issues in this game. I realize that some people NEED, on a deep psychological level to feel like their character is getting more powerful by means of arbitrary inflated numbers on their stat sheet even though the monsters they fight are also getting increased HP and resistances so its all a meaningless tredmill but for the love of talos can we get a progression system that offers some imcomparable benefits instead of just raw damage and stat increases? Its killing the game and has already destroyed PvP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

I'm just going to lay it out there. Name me one game that has ever taken the advice of EC and saw commercial success. Name one game of modern relevance that any of the EC people have contributed to that affords them even a modicum of credibility within the industry. Here is the thing, they are not game developers or designers. They are pretentious whiners hiding behind squeak boxes vocial processing while pretending their inane dribble is actually of any importance.

Oh, and while we're at it, why don't you at least briefly detail what the system should look like rather than just ambiguously mentioning it.

I understand where you are coming from, but its not really an opinion that video, at least not the main message isnt. Explaining the drawbacks of powercreep is an objective observation. Power creep is an actual thing and it was explained clearly in that video.

I felt they spent more time on extraneous details and imagery depicting power creep as menacing opposed to actually explaining it. Not to mention making terrible Magic the Gathering tie-ins, and conflating MMO gameplay with that of a MOBA.

Doctordarkspawn · December 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

I'll put this simply.

Low CP people have no buisness queuing vet. Hell, I didn't queue for things back in the day until I completed both Cadwells silver and gold. And that's how it needs to be.

CP is a barrier to entry. They need to impliment requirements.

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Salene last boss is tough and with scroll almost impossible for low level CP,

I would never waste time, i did many times but low cp player end up with time waste..

Pugged Selene with a couple of 200ish CP DPSers today. I kinda expected we'd skip hard mode, but they were doing well, so we read the scroll. It was a little rough and took a few tries, but they did just fine and we're being carried either.

Just chill and give players a chance to prove themselves before making assumptions.

Better upload video, 200 CP dps doing salene vet hard?

You don't have to do hard mode though.

That's there as option for groups who are capable of doing it. It's not a requirement - and people shouldn't always assume their group is going to be able to do hard mode

alexkdd99 wrote: »

No to making it anonymous. But honestly if someone is going to go through all that to be a ***, they would more than likely find any number of other reasons to be a *** of cp was anonymous.

There will always be aholes like that.

I think hiding cp would actually cause even more behavior like you mentioned.

I wish we had even more information about our potential group members, such as how many dungeons they have run and other stats.

Making CP invisible would stop people from pre-judging others based on CP at the start of a dungeon.

So I'm not buying this argument that it wouldn't help. Because I believe it would.

In any case - it couldn't hurt to try it and see.

@Jeremy

If I queue. Or if I form a group that's on Vet I'm doing the hardmode, and anyone who isn't capable or willing is tossed overboard. Why would I queue vet, for only one key?

And when the other three are capable it ain' that hard a call.

dday3six · December 2016

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

CP needs to be totally rebalanced or gutted entirely. INB4 Mah progrezzunz.

It has done nothing but encourage power creep, elitism, and is the cause of SO MANY nerfs to amazing skills and gear sets in this game.

It is pretty much the root of all issues in this game. I realize that some people NEED, on a deep psychological level to feel like their character is getting more powerful by means of arbitrary inflated numbers on their stat sheet even though the monsters they fight are also getting increased HP and resistances so its all a meaningless tredmill but for the love of talos can we get a progression system that offers some imcomparable benefits instead of just raw damage and stat increases? Its killing the game and has already destroyed PvP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bxszx60ZwGw

I understand what you are saying - but this is a vital element of RPG games. It's all about character progression and becoming more powerful. When you lose that incentive - the game becomes stale and many players will go find something else to play.

Really? I've been playing this game for almost three years now and the only times I have been at the verge of quitting is when ZOS increases the level cap and forces me to regrind all of my gear and stats again in order to be competitive in PvP. There are so many builds to create, so many races with unique passives to pair with classes things that I have more than enough to do at endgame provided I don't have to continuously grind to stay at endgame.

That's why PVE and PVP need to be separated. PVP focused players want to PVP without having to extensively grind to do it competitively. However on the other hand incomparables such as teleports and stuns do not reward PVE focused players in a manner that keeps them playing like stat increases do.

Sheezabeast · December 2016

If its hidden people will just demand to know your CP and ditch those who won't reveal it. Or you'll have people lying. Not sure this bandaid fix would be a good solution but it might be better than the current set up.

TheRealPotoroo · December 2016

Fudly_budly wrote: »

CP's are such an invalid measure! So were VR's. I'm CP 430 and have never run a dungeon. The never-ending forum posts like this one have convinced me to never try a dungeon. Petulant brats like that might consider finding an end content guild and avoid pugs / group-finder altogether.

CP320-ish here and I'm in the same position.

The whole thing is bizarre. As best I can make out the situation is:

1. CP < 561: useless noobs don't know what they're doing, kick them
2. CP = 561: see point 1.

Twizelbang · December 2016

I get vote kicked every time i enter a Vet dungeon. So i gave up doing them. I'm only CP 80 something.. but thats to low.
Getting the 15minute timer 3 times in a row... because of Elite wankers... pure joke.

FloppyTouch · December 2016

Back in my day u needed max lvl to do anything even pvp and max lvl is NOT cp160 it's cp561

bottleofsyrup · December 2016

Twizelbang wrote: »

I get vote kicked every time i enter a Vet dungeon. So i gave up doing them. I'm only CP 80 something.. but thats to low.
Getting the 15minute timer 3 times in a row... because of Elite wankers... pure joke.

There are guilds you could join who are accommodating to new players. Friendly Dungeon Runners and Red Crusade come to mind. Though it may be easier for you to grind to 160 first. You could do it pretty fast with the rest of the New Life Festival.

Shadow-Fighter · December 2016

What about a cooldown of 15 mins for no-vote kick again? I mean if vote kick fails there should be 15mins cooldown. Should be better option to avoid spamming vote kicks...

nimander99 · December 2016

CP should be anon, been saying this since before CP's were implemented.

Now someone give me a cookie please... I deserve something for being right all the time.

IronCrystal · December 2016

Personally, I healed my way through my first 200 cp and didn't experience any kicking of any kind.

Low cp will do much lower dps even if they are skilled. Is it enough for the dungeon? For the most part, yes. Are people always going to be patient enough? No.

While my cp isn't maxed (low 500s), I am proud of my cp and want it shown off. While there are always exceptions to the high cp being good, it is a good generalization that high cp players are more experienced so people will more often than not listen to me if I have to explain a mechanic or the best way to beat something. Also, low cp players feel like they will have an easier time if there is a high cp player helping them.

If cp is removed from view, then everyone becomes equalized and people will start demanding other things like achievements to prove themselves.

Removing cp won't solve anything, and I think being able to view one's cp is a good thing.

Sheezabeast · December 2016

Just a tip for anyone who hates grinding CP: do it on a crafter. Harvest nodes, slay mobs, pop an xp pot and slot rapids and watch the CP rack up.

SquareSausage · December 2016

Twizelbang wrote: »

I get vote kicked every time i enter a Vet dungeon. So i gave up doing them. I'm only CP 80 something.. but thats to low.
Getting the 15minute timer 3 times in a row... because of Elite wankers... pure joke.

Hardly a pure joke, you're more than likely being carried in vet dungeons if you are continually entering them at that level.

Why not wait until CP160 when atleast the gear you get you will keep for the rest of the game, you are more than likely undergeared in random crap or crafted sets too many levels low for you equaling a combined total of *** performance if you happen to be a DD character.