Tremorscale - Good intentions, badly implemented

EsoRecon · October 2016

proc sets are out of control. something needs to be done asap.

DHale · October 2016

Dear ZOS I was killed by people running tremor scale please nerf them. Thank you!

Jaronking · October 2016

DHale wrote: »

Dear ZOS I was killed by people running tremor scale please nerf them. Thank you!

Actually haven't been killed by the set yet but still see how broken it is.

br0steen · October 2016

This needs some attention, @ZOS_GinaBruno can we get a word on if tremorscale was intended to work this way or if you guys are happy with the outcome of all these proc set builds?

Cherryblossom · October 2016

So by using an attack that does very little damage it has a 50% chance to do a similar amount of damage as Surprise attack in total.

Why are you not comparing this with other skills for the damage output?

Yes if it's paired with other sets that proc, it can do increased damage, but the same can be said for other Monster Helm Sets. Why is this one so special to you!

Ankael07 · October 2016

Cherryblossom wrote: »

So by using an attack that does very little damage it has a 50% chance to do a similar amount of damage as Surprise attack in total.

Why are you not comparing this with other skills for the damage output?

Yes if it's paired with other sets that proc, it can do increased damage, but the same can be said for other Monster Helm Sets. Why is this one so special to you!

Be cause; Ransack+bash+light attack+viper+tremor all in less than 2 seconds while using a tank build.

jakeedmundson · October 2016

TequilaFire wrote: »

In regards to tremorscale just make players not tauntable so we don't affect PvE where we take enough flak already for affecting them.

Yeah some PvP players will whine, but there are enough other proc sets to fill the gap.

agreed here... don't take away (literally) the only fun monster set for tanks in pve. it adds nice dps to a well equipped tank and has a great cc for big add pulls.

every other monster helm for tanks just adds some resist and health which we do not need in dungeons to be successful. we need fun and unique things to help cure the boredom of tanking dungeons.

Ashamray · October 2016

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

The Tooltip for Tremor Scale says:

(1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina

(2 items) When you taunt an enemy, you have a 50% chance to cause a duneripper to burst from the ground beneath them, dealing 6500 Physical Damage to all enemies within 4 meters and reducing their Movement Speed by 70% for 8 seconds. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Since you can not taunt players and force them to attack you like PVE mobs this is obviously a bug.

Make it not work on players(like it was obviously intended in the 1st place) and the problem goes away.

But you CAN taunt players, they just don't get the sudden urge to focus on you, since the players are thinking individuals and not AI. But you can taunt players, in a sense. But I do agree with you, I think it is pretty silly that it should proc on players.

But you can't

Actually tooltip should be like: "when you deal damage with taunt ability..." In this case it should work on players.

Jsmalls · October 2016

When I use a taunting emote in PvP this skill should proc on all viewers as it does not say the use of a Taunting SKILL, please fix your broken set Zos.

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

Ashamray wrote: »

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

The Tooltip for Tremor Scale says:

(1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina

(2 items) When you taunt an enemy, you have a 50% chance to cause a duneripper to burst from the ground beneath them, dealing 6500 Physical Damage to all enemies within 4 meters and reducing their Movement Speed by 70% for 8 seconds. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Since you can not taunt players and force them to attack you like PVE mobs this is obviously a bug.

Make it not work on players(like it was obviously intended in the 1st place) and the problem goes away.

But you CAN taunt players, they just don't get the sudden urge to focus on you, since the players are thinking individuals and not AI. But you can taunt players, in a sense. But I do agree with you, I think it is pretty silly that it should proc on players.

But you can't
Actually tooltip should be like: "when you deal damage with taunt ability..." In this case it should work on players.

"In a sense". Because you can, it just got no effect. Yes, I agree that the tooltip should be updated to better reflect the actual intention of the set.

Cheese · October 2016

Agreed

Infrapuna · October 2016

Yes i think Tumourscale does not do enough damage, maybe Wrobel should add 5000 proc damage to it.

Oh and of course make it proc viper.

For balance reasons.

Ajaxduo · October 2016

tbh I feel like it should proc on when you take damage, to avoid the mess that it causes in pvp in general.

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

Ajaxduo wrote: »

tbh I feel like it should proc on when you take damage, to avoid the mess that it causes in pvp in general.

Then the tooltip need a serious update. But another proc-set in PvP. As if it wasn't enough proctatoes already.

Rebornlogic · November 2016

well since this thread is here. firstly tremorscale sucks on damage. before making a forum test it out. the reason tremor hits so high is because players puncture which -5k presist which in turn makes it very op. i've tested it out and when you use a the undaunted taunt it does very little damage. ive also tested selenes with sword and board.,and veilidrith. and veilidrith is worse.
what people are not understanding is that tremor/viper/black rose. its the meta. its not tremorscale thats making it op its the sword and board taunt

Blackfyre20 · November 2016

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

Hai!
So, something that's been a hot topic in many guilds, both PvE & PvP guilds alike: Tremorscale.

I think ZoS intended for this to be a PvE-tanking-set, where the tank could help the group-DPS in dungeons when fighting piles of mobs, a boss etc. Or simply just to offer tanks a set to wear, which I think is great. So I do think ZoS had good intentions with the set, but it just doesn't seem to work as intended(from my PoV interpretation of it, anyway).

Now I see mostly everyone(including a few Magicka characters, lul) are running Tremorscale in PvP and taunting Players.

But I'm not a fan of direct nerfs. Even though the combination, or the set in itself, is a problem, I don't want to see it nerfed directly. However, I do think it could use a few tweaks, this is just my suggestions, though. I do not like option 1, but I'll include it anyway.
Either:
1) Proc rate goes down to 8-10% to be in-line with other proc-sets. The slow's duration gets lowered. Leave the damage as it is.
2) Make sure it doesn't proc Viper. (Which wouldn't make sense, since if you use the melee-taunt its a melee attack :>)
3) Since yes, you can use the "Taunt" on players but it doesn't work in the same way as in PvE. Update the set & tooltip so that it only procs when the target IS properly taunted.
4)As suggested in other threads on the forums & discussed in-game: Make a global cooldown of offensive(!) proc-sets. Viper, Skoria, Kena, Tremorscale, Velidreth, Selene, Malubeth etc. can only proc once every 10 seconds. Or 8 seconds, 12 seconds. The number doesn't matter that much, getting in a cooldown is what matters.

Personally I'm a fan of number 3 & 4, with 4 being the favourite, but I know it's probably a very hard thing to implement and I have a understanding of that proc-sets are a part of the game. But it would be really sweet & would stop the "I spam one skill and wait for my sets to proc and deal damage for me" - mentality that seem to have raisen in the game.

Note: I know it's a hot topic. Just a reminder, keep the discussion constructive.

I agree, just want to point out that Kena should not be thrown in there with the other proc sets because it has a different function as it doesn't do direct damage. If you can keep it up at all times and deal with the more expensive costs then good for you.

WhiteMage · November 2016

I really like what people have been saying about global cool-downs on proc sets. It's a small change has a wide impact. If one proc goes off, none would proc till it's cooldown expired... that would have the effect of making no proc set usable in conjunction with viper because of its 100% chance. Unfortunately, it wouldn't solve all the problems we have with them. Some proc sets have no cooldowns, just chances, and it does little to combat the synergy of a super tank with procs for damage.

Ariades_swe · November 2016

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

@Lieblingsjunge

So you don't want the set nerfed directly but you recommend nerfs to be applied directly to the set.

Except point 1) I wouldn't consider any of the other a nerf. I also mentioned I don't even like option 1. I'm more interested in tweaks that can be done.AsI said, I've made a few suggestions, but you're free to give others.

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

A global cooldown would be the best solution imo.
And creating consistent proc sets without incredibly high or guaranteed proc chances.

It does have a global cooldown of 4 seconds lol.

I think the best solution is to make it only work if an enemy is truly "taunted", as in pve.

In pvp, taunts have no effect, so it should not proc.

That's only for that set. Wollust (&me) refers to a global cooldown for all proc-sets, including their internal ones. As 4 seconds doesn't matter if you have something else proc in between.

Best solution I think.

Lava_Croft · November 2016

Signed with banana mush.

cpuScientist · November 2016

Meh to be honest the easiest people this patch to kill are the tremor proc set users. But that's for me and my build. I can't speak for everyone else. But just reduce the chance and that is all that's needed.

Lieblingsjunge · November 2016

Blackfyre20 wrote: »

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

Hai!
So, something that's been a hot topic in many guilds, both PvE & PvP guilds alike: Tremorscale.

I think ZoS intended for this to be a PvE-tanking-set, where the tank could help the group-DPS in dungeons when fighting piles of mobs, a boss etc. Or simply just to offer tanks a set to wear, which I think is great. So I do think ZoS had good intentions with the set, but it just doesn't seem to work as intended(from my PoV interpretation of it, anyway).

Now I see mostly everyone(including a few Magicka characters, lul) are running Tremorscale in PvP and taunting Players.

But I'm not a fan of direct nerfs. Even though the combination, or the set in itself, is a problem, I don't want to see it nerfed directly. However, I do think it could use a few tweaks, this is just my suggestions, though. I do not like option 1, but I'll include it anyway.
Either:
1) Proc rate goes down to 8-10% to be in-line with other proc-sets. The slow's duration gets lowered. Leave the damage as it is.
2) Make sure it doesn't proc Viper. (Which wouldn't make sense, since if you use the melee-taunt its a melee attack :>)
3) Since yes, you can use the "Taunt" on players but it doesn't work in the same way as in PvE. Update the set & tooltip so that it only procs when the target IS properly taunted.
4)As suggested in other threads on the forums & discussed in-game: Make a global cooldown of offensive(!) proc-sets. Viper, Skoria, Kena, Tremorscale, Velidreth, Selene, Malubeth etc. can only proc once every 10 seconds. Or 8 seconds, 12 seconds. The number doesn't matter that much, getting in a cooldown is what matters.

Personally I'm a fan of number 3 & 4, with 4 being the favourite, but I know it's probably a very hard thing to implement and I have a understanding of that proc-sets are a part of the game. But it would be really sweet & would stop the "I spam one skill and wait for my sets to proc and deal damage for me" - mentality that seem to have raisen in the game.

Note: I know it's a hot topic. Just a reminder, keep the discussion constructive.

I agree, just want to point out that Kena should not be thrown in there with the other proc sets because it has a different function as it doesn't do direct damage. If you can keep it up at all times and deal with the more expensive costs then good for you.

Hm, yeah. I actually agree with you there. And aswell for Bloodspawn I guess. It's not an offensive proc-set so it doesn't make sense adding it. It just adds to your own stats :P

kessik221 · November 2016

The problem is that pvp and pve are not seperately balanced. Theres no reason to as the only pvp options currently are dueling and avava. Start making PvP only gear and PvE only gear and this solves the issue.

kessik221 · November 2016

With pvp gear being based off your alliance rank.

dem0n1k · November 2016

I agree with the sentiment that Tremorscale should not proc in PVP ....... but please don't nerf it! It is super awesome for my PVE tank to almost double his abysmal DPS.

Tannus15 · November 2016

Rebornlogic wrote: »

well since this thread is here. firstly tremorscale sucks on damage. before making a forum test it out. the reason tremor hits so high is because players puncture which -5k presist which in turn makes it very op. i've tested it out and when you use a the undaunted taunt it does very little damage. ive also tested selenes with sword and board.,and veilidrith. and veilidrith is worse.
what people are not understanding is that tremor/viper/black rose. its the meta. its not tremorscale thats making it op its the sword and board taunt

I wrote a "screw you PvP land!" rant and then I read this and went "huh. yeah, this is also the same problem as the sharpened trait".

Basically armour penetration is OP right now. That's the root of the problem. It's the same problem that is causing people to start "nerf sharpened" threads or "buff other traits" or even more to the point "vMA RNG is *** because I still don't have a sharpened dagger!"
This is why stamina builds are swiftly shifting towards "use spriggan plus literally any damage set"

Stop bashing on Tremorscale. Start bashing on armour pen. Damage mitigation matters, stop making it so easy to ignore it.

SnubbS · November 2016

Tremor might be the most overrated set in the game. I spent 10-12 hours with it, decided to switch back to Veli.

PS4_ZeColmeia · November 2016

If we had a lock on system on console then taunt might actually serve a purpose but no tab targeting makes taunt useless.

I actually wish they would make taunt useful in PvP

Lieblingsjunge · November 2016

Mhhm. Taunt is useless in PvP, since you can't properly taunt a player, but spamming it still works, which I don't get to make sense, anyway.

It's not the tremourscale-damage that's the problem. It's 1) The slow 2) It's spammable to a point where you can slot Ransack/Pierce armour on all 10 slots on your skillbar and spam it. 3) It's also illogical, but then again, a lot of the things are.

As a templar, I don't find the pierce armour to be an issue. My issue is more with the slow it applies to e.g. Mistform & that it procs through dodge roll as well. You can't escape it!

DerpyShadowz · November 2016

The slow is the most soul destroying thing ever :c

mr_wazzabi · November 2016

Tannus15 wrote: »

Rebornlogic wrote: »

well since this thread is here. firstly tremorscale sucks on damage. before making a forum test it out. the reason tremor hits so high is because players puncture which -5k presist which in turn makes it very op. i've tested it out and when you use a the undaunted taunt it does very little damage. ive also tested selenes with sword and board.,and veilidrith. and veilidrith is worse.
what people are not understanding is that tremor/viper/black rose. its the meta. its not tremorscale thats making it op its the sword and board taunt

I wrote a "screw you PvP land!" rant and then I read this and went "huh. yeah, this is also the same problem as the sharpened trait".

Basically armour penetration is OP right now. That's the root of the problem. It's the same problem that is causing people to start "nerf sharpened" threads or "buff other traits" or even more to the point "vMA RNG is *** because I still don't have a sharpened dagger!"
This is why stamina builds are swiftly shifting towards "use spriggan plus literally any damage set"

Stop bashing on Tremorscale. Start bashing on armour pen. Damage mitigation matters, stop making it so easy to ignore it.

People are doing armor pen because of op heavy armor builds. If everybody stuck to medium and light, demand for pen wouldn't be so high. Do you run heavy in pvp?