Tremorscale - Good intentions, badly implemented

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

Hai!
So, something that's been a hot topic in many guilds, both PvE & PvP guilds alike: Tremorscale.

I think ZoS intended for this to be a PvE-tanking-set, where the tank could help the group-DPS in dungeons when fighting piles of mobs, a boss etc. Or simply just to offer tanks a set to wear, which I think is great. So I do think ZoS had good intentions with the set, but it just doesn't seem to work as intended(from my PoV interpretation of it, anyway).

Now I see mostly everyone(including a few Magicka characters, lul) are running Tremorscale in PvP and taunting Players.

But I'm not a fan of direct nerfs. Even though the combination, or the set in itself, is a problem, I don't want to see it nerfed directly. However, I do think it could use a few tweaks, this is just my suggestions, though. I do not like option 1, but I'll include it anyway.
Either:
1) Proc rate goes down to 8-10% to be in-line with other proc-sets. The slow's duration gets lowered. Leave the damage as it is.
2) Make sure it doesn't proc Viper. (Which wouldn't make sense, since if you use the melee-taunt its a melee attack :>)
3) Since yes, you can use the "Taunt" on players but it doesn't work in the same way as in PvE. Update the set & tooltip so that it only procs when the target IS properly taunted.
4)As suggested in other threads on the forums & discussed in-game: Make a global cooldown of offensive(!) proc-sets. Viper, Skoria, Kena, Tremorscale, Velidreth, Selene, Malubeth etc. can only proc once every 10 seconds. Or 8 seconds, 12 seconds. The number doesn't matter that much, getting in a cooldown is what matters.

Personally I'm a fan of number 3 & 4, with 4 being the favourite, but I know it's probably a very hard thing to implement and I have a understanding of that proc-sets are a part of the game. But it would be really sweet & would stop the "I spam one skill and wait for my sets to proc and deal damage for me" - mentality that seem to have raisen in the game.

Note: I know it's a hot topic. Just a reminder, keep the discussion constructive.

incite · October 2016

Confirmend and agreed

Rune_Relic · October 2016

Not unreasonable.
I agree the proctology class needs a rework and/or moratorium.
Cant see the point of not being able to stack sets but you can stack procs (same set different disguise).
Its like a back door workaround.

Apherius · October 2016

i agree .

zuto40 · October 2016

Bring the snare down to 30% and give it a 35% proc rate

RinaldoGandolphi · October 2016

The Tooltip for Tremor Scale says:

(1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina

(2 items) When you taunt an enemy, you have a 50% chance to cause a duneripper to burst from the ground beneath them, dealing 6500 Physical Damage to all enemies within 4 meters and reducing their Movement Speed by 70% for 8 seconds. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Since you can not taunt players and force them to attack you like PVE mobs this is obviously a bug.

Make it not work on players(like it was obviously intended in the 1st place) and the problem goes away.

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

The Tooltip for Tremor Scale says:

(1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina

(2 items) When you taunt an enemy, you have a 50% chance to cause a duneripper to burst from the ground beneath them, dealing 6500 Physical Damage to all enemies within 4 meters and reducing their Movement Speed by 70% for 8 seconds. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Since you can not taunt players and force them to attack you like PVE mobs this is obviously a bug.

Make it not work on players(like it was obviously intended in the 1st place) and the problem goes away.

But you CAN taunt players, they just don't get the sudden urge to focus on you, since the players are thinking individuals and not AI. But you can taunt players, in a sense. But I do agree with you, I think it is pretty silly that it should proc on players.

Strider_Roshin · October 2016

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

The Tooltip for Tremor Scale says:

(1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina

(2 items) When you taunt an enemy, you have a 50% chance to cause a duneripper to burst from the ground beneath them, dealing 6500 Physical Damage to all enemies within 4 meters and reducing their Movement Speed by 70% for 8 seconds. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.

Since you can not taunt players and force them to attack you like PVE mobs this is obviously a bug.

Make it not work on players(like it was obviously intended in the 1st place) and the problem goes away.

This 100% also rather than Viper being a guaranteed hit every 4 seconds, it should be a proc chance with a 4 second cool down.

If they did this while removing the weapon and spell damage received from black rose, I think it'll go a long way in terms of balance.

As it stands currently heavy armor is just too good in PvP.

RAGUNAnoOne · October 2016

So... is it that bad I mean most things in the game snare you that much anyways and the damage doesn't seem too bad. besides with pure tanks being...less than viable in polite terms especially with penetration buffs they need SOMETHING to offset the insane DPS. plus it gives taunting a use in PvP

Mayrael · October 2016

I knew that this.set will be a mess in pvp as soon as Ive read its description. Combined with viper its very very nasty. Add blackrose to this setup and there you go. Tanky heavy armored titan with good sustain and burst dmg. Perfectly fine.

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

Mayrael wrote: »

I knew that this.set will be a mess in pvp as soon as Ive read its description. Combined with viper its very very nasty. Add blackrose to this setup and there you go. Tanky heavy armored titan with good sustain and burst dmg. Perfectly fine.

Unfortunately that seems to be the case.

RobTheAxe · October 2016

I agree. As someone who PVE and PVPs, I see how it could be useful. Run up to a pack and use ransack, then I need to quickly tag all the mobs that beeline straight toward my team. Tremorscale would help slow them down and put damage on them to aggro me. In pvp, it seems a bit cheesy, as the damage is decent and the activation chance is very high. Lowering the chance would reduce its PVE effectiveness. Possible changes - halve the damage, remove all damage and replace with an aoe taunt plus the slow, or, I would be in favor ov a wide-ranging proc nerf, some sort ov global cooldown so widowmaker and viper weren't assured to simultaneously fire together every time. Players can wear one proc set then wear other sets ov their choice. Right now proc sets give too much power.

Dracane · October 2016

Agreed on everything

Waffennacht · October 2016

Couple of months late

Wollust · October 2016

A global cooldown would be the best solution imo.
And creating consistent proc sets without incredibly high or guaranteed proc chances.

xRIVALENx · October 2016

Make players immune to taunt, should solve the problem I would think.

AhPook_Is_Here · October 2016

If they nerf one they should just nerf all of them. Vipers, velidriths, and all the rest. It's as simple as making a rule that if you have the PVP heriosm buff, no armor procs activate. That way they can balance the game for PVP and PVE.

idk · October 2016

@Lieblingsjunge

So you don't want the set nerfed directly but you recommend nerfs to be applied directly to the set.

mr_wazzabi · October 2016

Wollust wrote: »

A global cooldown would be the best solution imo.
And creating consistent proc sets without incredibly high or guaranteed proc chances.

It does have a global cooldown of 4 seconds lol.

I think the best solution is to make it only work if an enemy is truly "taunted", as in pve.

In pvp, taunts have no effect, so it should not proc.

DeadlyRecluse · October 2016

If you want to make it PvE relevant, make it a bigger AOE with much less damage. Keep the high proc rate, increase the cooldown. Then you can use it to snare a large pull on the first couple taunts and get some of that first-hit aggro.

As it currently is, there are much better sets for a PvE tank and the radius isn't enough to make it a useful tool for managing a pull.

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

@Lieblingsjunge

So you don't want the set nerfed directly but you recommend nerfs to be applied directly to the set.

Except point 1) I wouldn't consider any of the other a nerf. I also mentioned I don't even like option 1. I'm more interested in tweaks that can be done.AsI said, I've made a few suggestions, but you're free to give others.

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

A global cooldown would be the best solution imo.
And creating consistent proc sets without incredibly high or guaranteed proc chances.

It does have a global cooldown of 4 seconds lol.

I think the best solution is to make it only work if an enemy is truly "taunted", as in pve.

In pvp, taunts have no effect, so it should not proc.

That's only for that set. Wollust (&me) refers to a global cooldown for all proc-sets, including their internal ones. As 4 seconds doesn't matter if you have something else proc in between.

Minalan · October 2016

Make it so you can't taunt players. We're not mobs, that's silly.

That fixes one [SNIP] proc set, only about half a dozen [SNIP] sets to go.

WillhelmBlack · October 2016

I'm alright with nerfs.

themdogesbite · October 2016

Lower the procc chance, increase the cooldown.

Wollust · October 2016

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

A global cooldown would be the best solution imo.
And creating consistent proc sets without incredibly high or guaranteed proc chances.

It does have a global cooldown of 4 seconds lol.

I think the best solution is to make it only work if an enemy is truly "taunted", as in pve.

In pvp, taunts have no effect, so it should not proc.

As Lieb said, global cooldown refers to an overall cooldown on offensive procs, not an individual set cool down. A global cooldown would prevent stacking up proc sets because it would simply not make sense.
I am completely fine with the way Tremorscale works (maybe except the massive snare which could need a bit of tweaking imo), the bigger issue is that builds can be created using multiple procs to deal instantly anything between 15-25k dmg with one or two clicks. That is the big issue atm. And that is where a global cooldown would help.

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

Wollust wrote: »

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

A global cooldown would be the best solution imo.
And creating consistent proc sets without incredibly high or guaranteed proc chances.

It does have a global cooldown of 4 seconds lol.

I think the best solution is to make it only work if an enemy is truly "taunted", as in pve.

In pvp, taunts have no effect, so it should not proc.

As Lieb said, global cooldown refers to an overall cooldown on offensive procs, not an individual set cool down. A global cooldown would prevent stacking up proc sets because it would simply not make sense.
I am completely fine with the way Tremorscale works (maybe except the massive snare which could need a bit of tweaking imo), the bigger issue is that builds can be created using multiple procs to deal instantly anything between 15-25k dmg with one or two clicks. That is the big issue atm. And that is where a global cooldown would help.

I second that. Too much dmg for RNG procs.

G0ku · October 2016

Works fine on my stam sorc DD-tank in pve. Just adjust the annoying stuff using the battle spirit debuff or what it is called in pvp. Leave pve alone please.

Lieblingsjunge · October 2016

G0ku wrote: »

Works fine on my stam sorc DD-tank in pve. Just adjust the annoying stuff using the battle spirit debuff or what it is called in pvp. Leave pve alone please.

Hence why one of the suggestions is that the set needs a tweak so it only works on properly taunted mobs(not players).

Enslaved · October 2016

What would be a good solution is to add another chance % if target is not taunted. Could be maybe half of what you get when you apply taunt to the target. That way, this set will not be nerfed for PvE, and those who end snared and dead in PvP from tremorscale users would benefit a bit, too.

TequilaFire · October 2016

In regards to tremorscale just make players not tauntable so we don't affect PvE where we take enough flak already for affecting them.

Yeah some PvP players will whine, but there are enough other proc sets to fill the gap.

Jaronking · October 2016

Wollust wrote: »

mr_wazzabi wrote: »

Wollust wrote: »

A global cooldown would be the best solution imo.
And creating consistent proc sets without incredibly high or guaranteed proc chances.

It does have a global cooldown of 4 seconds lol.

I think the best solution is to make it only work if an enemy is truly "taunted", as in pve.

In pvp, taunts have no effect, so it should not proc.

As Lieb said, global cooldown refers to an overall cooldown on offensive procs, not an individual set cool down. A global cooldown would prevent stacking up proc sets because it would simply not make sense.
I am completely fine with the way Tremorscale works (maybe except the massive snare which could need a bit of tweaking imo), the bigger issue is that builds can be created using multiple procs to deal instantly anything between 15-25k dmg with one or two clicks. That is the big issue atm. And that is where a global cooldown would help.

This would be the best solution to fixing the proc set problem.