"It will always be items worse than what you can craft" topic

Milvan · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

and the other 70% naive simpletons, they didnt understanding the real threat in this grand scrolls

Dude, seriously...

ThePaleItalian · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

and the other 70% naive simpletons, they didnt understanding the real threat in this grand scrolls

I almost blacked out reading that.... can't form.....sentences.... ahhh.

Anywho, just because people disagree with you doesn't make them a naive simpleton. Who knows, years down the road you can stand up and say you were right, or you can sit there with your foot in your mouth and be wrong.

XP scroll is XP scroll. Doesn't make me a blind fanboy or simpleton, it makes me see it for what it is. A way to earn XP.

Go check out WoW with their heirlooms, you can do random dungeons and lvl from 1 to 60 in like half a day. So is WoW play to win? I mean you can spend 60 bucks and get an instant max character. So once again is WoW play to win?

FLuFFyxMuFFiN · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

and the other 70% naive simpletons, they didnt understanding the real threat in this grand scrolls

I'm not threatened by someone gaining more xp than me. Not getting one of these scrolls is not going to prevent me from progressing forward in the game. The only thing that is gonna show me the game is P2W is when they put weapons and armor in the crown store.

Acid_Glow · September 2016

That pretty crazy but whats new ?

Lumbermill_Emperor · September 2016

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Wow!!!

This is huge and it is complete and total BS. Is this for real?

@ZOS_GinaBruno is this an accident or has ZOS officially gone P2W.

@Oreyn_Bearclaw ,

I really wasn't joking all of the times that I told you and others that we were on our way to P2W. I don't even care about P2W, but the signs were clear that P2W was going to happen.

P2W wasn't so obvious in the past, but did exist in spirit. Using EXP scrolls instead of potions saved gold, Crown repair kits are fast to use and best for high level speed runs, horse training that saves a 180 day grind, the Crafting Bag gives players a tremendous advantage.

I have a question for everyone now.

Did anyone honestly not think that we would go down the slippery slope of P2W? Did you really think that those who monetize the game wouldn't take advantage of our bloated Crown amounts?

They wan't us to feel like we have tons of Crowns and they want us to use them all and then bloat our Crown numbers back up with flash sales and the, basically, mandatory sub fee. The best way for them to make us use Crowns is by offering an advantage for us to use them.

Again, I don't care about P2W, but everyone who does has to get really smart really quick and see exactly what is going on. Stop being blinded by your love of the game and support of the devs. Start to see when people are trying to empty your pockets by putting crowns in them.

Think of it this way. Small instances of P2W may not seem that bad, but wouldn't you rather strike a weed at it's root rather than let it bloom and spread? This specific experience scroll is small potatoes in my opinion, but don't you wish that you had been a voice against, lets say, the P2W crafting bag as a way of preventing future P2W from being implemented?

i quoted this post for people who noticing only my posts here
read it
its very good point

Unsent.Soul · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

and the other 70% naive simpletons, they didnt understanding the real threat in this grand scrolls

I'm amazed yoy haven't been reported for trolling and baiting.

70%, the people who don't agree wit you, are now simpletons?

Jesus christ @ZOS please close this thread. OPs soapbox is becoming rather weak.

EZgoin76 · September 2016

The day they put weapons or armor that is better than I can craft or farm is the day I'll admit it's p2w.

Lumbermill_Emperor · September 2016

EZgoin76 wrote: »

The day they put weapons or armor that is better than I can craft or farm is the day I'll admit it's p2w.

agreed

waterfairy · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

and the other 70% naive simpletons, they didnt understanding the real threat in this grand scrolls

Enlighten us oh wise one, what "threat" does someone leveling faster pose to anyone? All of the top players are already top level so this would only be useful for leveling alts or for lower leveled people with money to burn on things like this.

Think of it as the free anniversary cake but now they're selling slices...I don't agree with it nor will I buy a taste but more power to those who want it.

Lumbermill_Emperor · September 2016

10 agree 27 insightful first post have

im glad still here alot people who supporting my position

Unsent.Soul · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

10 agree 27 insightful first post have

im glad still here alot people who supporting my position

10 people agree with your OP? Was that the original OP or after you changed the title. First p2w now p2progress..... 5.3k views and you're bragging about 10 agrees and 27 insightfuls...

ThePaleItalian · September 2016

Unsent.Soul wrote: »

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

10 agree 27 insightful first post have

im glad still here alot people who supporting my position

10 people agree with your OP? Was that the original OP or after you changed the title. First p2w now p2progress..... 5.3k views and you're bragging about 10 agrees and 27 insightfuls...

Do not even try. He has to be trolling, or hanging onto the fact that 10 people might have agree with something in his post.

I still can't believe its going to hit 10 pages.. /facepalm

BigBressler · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno
forgive me but im mad now
when i saw you adding this scrolls to update12...
https://help.elderscrollsonline.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/26604

dam ZOS...

EXAMPLE
right now im getting 993 exp with eso+ and ambrosia
by cp300 template for cp160 zombie
from cp300 to cp400 i need 30 566 777 exp
so i need to kill 30 782 zombies
for example i can kill 1000 zombies per hour
its ~30.7 hours
if you grinding 3 hours per day its 11 days

with eso+ and grand scroll
im getting 1614 per mob
its 18 938 zombies from cp300 to 400
18.9 hours
7 days

7 days < 11 days
PAY TO PROGRESS CONFIRMED

I was here when they assured us that they would NEVER put any consumables in the crown store that are better than what you can craft. I heard it with my own ears. That is a promise, or giving a community your word. Same thing. They made that promise because the community was up in arms over the crown store potions. They assured us a million times that they would not do what they are doing right now.
I think Horse training is BS too. We all had to "do the content" to level our horses. I'm surprised they don't sell crafting levels or Trait knowledge so you can avoid that pesky research and decon BS that so many of us endured. They'll sell motifs you don't need to collect. They might as well sell gold, right?
The point is when ZOS starts selling level 50 characters and then CP packs people will say "so what you can grind out CP with XP pots, scrolls, ..."

You make a fair point. Keep in mind, however, that this is a crown CRATE item. (RNG box) The gold text signifies that it's a legendary item, and is most likely really really hard to get. You'd be able to buy more crown scrolls and save money in the long run than grinding crates to get the 150% experience buff. If they made it a stand-alone crown store item, then yes, that'd be a problem. Seeing as how rare the item is, I don't see it as an issue. I've played with the crown crates on PTS and never saw any of these.

Lumbermill_Emperor · September 2016

still waiting for official answer
@ZOS_GinaBruno

esoF2PSOON · September 2016

its just... dishearting!
agreed with op

ThePaleItalian · September 2016

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

still waiting for official answer
@ZOS_GinaBruno

esoF2PSOON wrote: »

its just... dishearting!
agreed with op

LOL, please tell me you made another account so someone can agree with you?

Lumbermill_Emperor · September 2016

^paranoid?

EnviousStruggle · September 2016

bad news... i feel you, OP
its the beginning of the end

Cazzy · September 2016

I guess one question that has no real answer is what "winning" is in an MMO.

Most people may say top quality gear, but without the skills to match it matters very little what you wear. So maybe skill points are winning. Or having the best potion/food.

It's not black and white, unfortunately

ThePaleItalian · September 2016

Cazzy wrote: »

I guess one question that has no real answer is what "winning" is in an MMO.

Most people may say top quality gear, but without the skills to match it matters very little what you wear. So maybe skill points are winning. Or having the best potion/food.

It's not black and white, unfortunately

I wish the story lined flowed a bit more. Like Molag Bal got wreaked, then it was off to Craglorn, now back to IC. I don't know. I wish there was a main protagonist or something so we can follow this story. Even if its another Daedric Lord.

I think other MMO's give you a goal. I think this one just hasn't show it yet.

Cazzy · September 2016

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Cazzy wrote: »

I guess one question that has no real answer is what "winning" is in an MMO.

Most people may say top quality gear, but without the skills to match it matters very little what you wear. So maybe skill points are winning. Or having the best potion/food.

It's not black and white, unfortunately

I wish the story lined flowed a bit more. Like Molag Bal got wreaked, then it was off to Craglorn, now back to IC. I don't know. I wish there was a main protagonist or something so we can follow this story. Even if its another Daedric Lord.

I think other MMO's give you a goal. I think this one just hasn't show it yet.

Yeah, exactly.

Not sure if you played Orsinium but the very end of the quest gave me high hopes we'd have a main focus on the way. So far it hasn't happened

ThePaleItalian · September 2016

Cazzy wrote: »

ThePaleItalian wrote: »

Cazzy wrote: »

I guess one question that has no real answer is what "winning" is in an MMO.

Most people may say top quality gear, but without the skills to match it matters very little what you wear. So maybe skill points are winning. Or having the best potion/food.

It's not black and white, unfortunately

I wish the story lined flowed a bit more. Like Molag Bal got wreaked, then it was off to Craglorn, now back to IC. I don't know. I wish there was a main protagonist or something so we can follow this story. Even if its another Daedric Lord.

I think other MMO's give you a goal. I think this one just hasn't show it yet.

Yeah, exactly.

Not sure if you played Orsinium but the very end of the quest gave me high hopes we'd have a main focus on the way. So far it hasn't happened

Yea I played it. I was excited for like another Daedric Prince or even Mannimarco to pop his head up. I do not mind adventuring all over the place, but it feels like a bunch of story quests instead of a single large branching one. Which if that is how they wanna tell the story, we travel the world saving it from everything, I am ok with that. I just need direction ZOS!!!!!!

Wow · September 2016

Whatever you all say, they need to do one of this. If not they are just contradicting themselves, if they leave it like that and this item make its way to the live server.

- Reduce the Grand EXP Scroll to be 50% bonus EXP instead of 150% which is 3x more powerful than we have available for crafting.
- Buff Psijic Ambrossia or give us recipe for a new craftable consumable as powerful as the Grand EXP Scroll
- Or if they are too lazy, they can just edit this part on the http://i68.tinypic.com/20gyzkp.png and put new line: "Yes Crown Store will have the most powerful consumable items than you can ever craft"

There problem solved.

Lumbermill_Emperor · September 2016

than it will be a disaster

exeeter702 · September 2016

Valen_Byte wrote: »

All of you that are saying "its not p2w" are missing the true point here.

The issue here is integrity. They said they would NEVER put ANY consumibles in the crown store that are better than crafted consumables. They said it on there FAQ, they said it in a live stream, and they have said it here on the forums.

Looks like they lied. Integrity, is on its way out. One person in this thread even said "that was 2 years ago, things change" Had to just smh at that one. On that logic, I married my wife 20 years ago so the promises I made are no longer valid. Im sure that would go over well with the wife.

Like I said this is not a p2w issue...its about integrity. Something that is beginning to seem very rare in game and in the real world.

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

@Cherryblossom
i know i can craft training gear and i use id for grinding ofc

still its not linked with the matter of my topic
and math from first post will remain the same with training gear on me or not

Your whole argument is crafters get shafted. He showed you craters don't, I showed you they don't, and then you call "pay to progress"

Bro, stop trolling. Please.

Not that I agree with him. But for his point, it's not a troll. Training gear is separate to his issue since it's not a perk that would counter the scrolls, but is simply an addition to it. He is saying everyone has access to it, and stacks with other exp bonuses so referencing training gear is pointless.

DocFrost72 · September 2016

exeeter702 wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

All of you that are saying "its not p2w" are missing the true point here.

The issue here is integrity. They said they would NEVER put ANY consumibles in the crown store that are better than crafted consumables. They said it on there FAQ, they said it in a live stream, and they have said it here on the forums.

Looks like they lied. Integrity, is on its way out. One person in this thread even said "that was 2 years ago, things change" Had to just smh at that one. On that logic, I married my wife 20 years ago so the promises I made are no longer valid. Im sure that would go over well with the wife.

Like I said this is not a p2w issue...its about integrity. Something that is beginning to seem very rare in game and in the real world.

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

@Cherryblossom
i know i can craft training gear and i use id for grinding ofc

still its not linked with the matter of my topic
and math from first post will remain the same with training gear on me or not

Your whole argument is crafters get shafted. He showed you craters don't, I showed you they don't, and then you call "pay to progress"

Bro, stop trolling. Please.

Not that I agree with him. But for his point, it's not a troll. Training gear is separate to his issue since it's not a perk that would counter the scrolls, but is simply an addition to it. He is saying everyone has access to it, and stacks with other exp bonuses so referencing training gear is pointless.

Don't feed him. This conversation started as "p2w" then "p2progress" whatever the *** that is, to they broke some statement, not promise, a year + ago.

And training is relevant, heavily. Crafters get a more reliable, effective, and easier xP boost option over someone buying even these scrolls.

Wow · September 2016

DocFrost72 wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

All of you that are saying "its not p2w" are missing the true point here.

The issue here is integrity. They said they would NEVER put ANY consumibles in the crown store that are better than crafted consumables. They said it on there FAQ, they said it in a live stream, and they have said it here on the forums.

Looks like they lied. Integrity, is on its way out. One person in this thread even said "that was 2 years ago, things change" Had to just smh at that one. On that logic, I married my wife 20 years ago so the promises I made are no longer valid. Im sure that would go over well with the wife.

Like I said this is not a p2w issue...its about integrity. Something that is beginning to seem very rare in game and in the real world.

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

@Cherryblossom
i know i can craft training gear and i use id for grinding ofc

still its not linked with the matter of my topic
and math from first post will remain the same with training gear on me or not

Your whole argument is crafters get shafted. He showed you craters don't, I showed you they don't, and then you call "pay to progress"

Bro, stop trolling. Please.

Not that I agree with him. But for his point, it's not a troll. Training gear is separate to his issue since it's not a perk that would counter the scrolls, but is simply an addition to it. He is saying everyone has access to it, and stacks with other exp bonuses so referencing training gear is pointless.

Don't feed him. This conversation started as "p2w" then "p2progress" whatever the *** that is, to they broke some statement, not promise, a year + ago.

And training is relevant, heavily. Crafters get a more reliable, effective, and easier xP boost option over someone buying even these scrolls.

Don't sweep it under the rug either about the fact that there are going to be powerful consumables coming in Crown shop, 3 times more powerful than Psijic Ambrossia

AzraelKrieg · September 2016

Wow wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

All of you that are saying "its not p2w" are missing the true point here.

The issue here is integrity. They said they would NEVER put ANY consumibles in the crown store that are better than crafted consumables. They said it on there FAQ, they said it in a live stream, and they have said it here on the forums.

Looks like they lied. Integrity, is on its way out. One person in this thread even said "that was 2 years ago, things change" Had to just smh at that one. On that logic, I married my wife 20 years ago so the promises I made are no longer valid. Im sure that would go over well with the wife.

Like I said this is not a p2w issue...its about integrity. Something that is beginning to seem very rare in game and in the real world.

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

@Cherryblossom
i know i can craft training gear and i use id for grinding ofc

still its not linked with the matter of my topic
and math from first post will remain the same with training gear on me or not

Your whole argument is crafters get shafted. He showed you craters don't, I showed you they don't, and then you call "pay to progress"

Bro, stop trolling. Please.

Not that I agree with him. But for his point, it's not a troll. Training gear is separate to his issue since it's not a perk that would counter the scrolls, but is simply an addition to it. He is saying everyone has access to it, and stacks with other exp bonuses so referencing training gear is pointless.

Don't feed him. This conversation started as "p2w" then "p2progress" whatever the *** that is, to they broke some statement, not promise, a year + ago.

And training is relevant, heavily. Crafters get a more reliable, effective, and easier xP boost option over someone buying even these scrolls.

Don't sweep it under the rug either about the fact that there are going to be powerful consumables coming in Crown shop, 3 times more powerful than Psijic Ambrossia

More powerful yes but rare as hen's teeth. You could spend an entire 6 month's allotment of crowns and not get it. Or you could get it in one crate. The RNG on these powerful XP boosts is going to make it hard to get them and anyone that gets them should consider themselves lucky.

disintegr8 · September 2016

The only players who gain a lot from XP pots/scrolls are those who are leveling up a 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc., characters who have already earned a pile of CP and have skills, knowledge and experience in the game. It simply makes it easier to get your new characters to level 50 so you can use them for end game content.

I would suggest that new players are actually disadvantaged by using XP pots/scrolls because while they are leveling up faster, they are playing less of the game and not gaining as much knowledge about how best to play. When I quit groups in non vet dungeons with my tank or healer because people with 160+ CP do not know how to beat a boss and have not joined group chat, it tells me that they do not know how best to play the game or their role, especially in groups.

The only reason a group full of CP160+ players is not capable of completing Blackheart Haven or Crypt of Hearts is that some or all of them have raced through leveling and not bothered to learn how to best use their skills and what skills work best in different situations.

These are non vet dungeons that simply require some skill and a bit of practice. Anyone at CP160+ who has trouble in these dungeons is not really going to be much of a threat to other players in PVP.

exeeter702 · September 2016

DocFrost72 wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

All of you that are saying "its not p2w" are missing the true point here.

The issue here is integrity. They said they would NEVER put ANY consumibles in the crown store that are better than crafted consumables. They said it on there FAQ, they said it in a live stream, and they have said it here on the forums.

Looks like they lied. Integrity, is on its way out. One person in this thread even said "that was 2 years ago, things change" Had to just smh at that one. On that logic, I married my wife 20 years ago so the promises I made are no longer valid. Im sure that would go over well with the wife.

Like I said this is not a p2w issue...its about integrity. Something that is beginning to seem very rare in game and in the real world.

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Lumbermill_Emperor wrote: »

@Cherryblossom
i know i can craft training gear and i use id for grinding ofc

still its not linked with the matter of my topic
and math from first post will remain the same with training gear on me or not

Your whole argument is crafters get shafted. He showed you craters don't, I showed you they don't, and then you call "pay to progress"

Bro, stop trolling. Please.

Not that I agree with him. But for his point, it's not a troll. Training gear is separate to his issue since it's not a perk that would counter the scrolls, but is simply an addition to it. He is saying everyone has access to it, and stacks with other exp bonuses so referencing training gear is pointless.

Don't feed him. This conversation started as "p2w" then "p2progress" whatever the *** that is, to they broke some statement, not promise, a year + ago.

And training is relevant, heavily. Crafters get a more reliable, effective, and easier xP boost option over someone buying even these scrolls.

The point is, training gear is entirely separate and crafters are not prohibited from using scrolls or ambrosias either. Any argument that could be made can ignore training exp boost as it is accessible in game to everyone and it simply adds to any exp boost a player obtains, crown crate or otherwise. They are not mutually exclusive.

Feel free to expose the OP for the fool that he is showing himself to be, but make sure your points are concise.