destro staff ult

Ghost-Shot · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

We desperately need it to be single target burst ult somewhere around the 125 ult cost, in its current form, you are far better off using meteor/banner/negate and even if they reduce the cost of the current ability you would be better off using bats/soul tether. There is literally no reason to use the skill right now, its low aoe damage for a ridiculous cost.

Toc de Malsvi · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

Destruent wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

lucky_Sage wrote: »

who think the destroy ult should be changes from a aoe ult
I think magicka has to many aoe ults

yes, talk to my sorcerer , we have the badest aoe of the game ... yeah ...

I main a magica sorc and i don´t see any reason to use the destro staff ulti in its curret form ever.

Negate is better for everything but strict max dps. Meteor is better for max dps. If you want an pbaoe effect batswarm is better.

What exactly do you want to use the ulti for when you have three aoe alternatives all of which are better than the destro staff one - care to explain @Apherius ?

At no point in your statement did you ask explicitly for Sorc use. I can see how on a Sorc this ult would seem less than worthwhile, that doesn't mean it is completely useless for everyone. It is not a good ultimate no doubt, but I could see it being very useful in certain very specific builds.

Which one?
DK: Banner
NB: Soultether
Templar: Nova

all classes have an AoE-ulti which does good DPS (maybe even more than this destro-ult), sometimes costs less and has powerfull secondary effects. So who is going to use this destro-ulti in your opinion?

Banner is not mobile with a self cast, at best it requires repeated casting to move to a new location, it can proc skoria but not winter born, has a smaller AOE.

Soultether is a smaller aoe that creats a tether that can be broken so it is not functionally mobile, it cannot proc winter born or any elemental secondary effect.

Nova, might approach the same size but is only ground cast so opponents can move out of it. It also does not proc Winterborn, or burning, or chilled, or concussed.

Bat's is cast on self and so is mobile but lacks the AOE size and is half the duration at 5 seconds, it also cannot proc winterborn or burning or chilled, or concussed.

Meteor is also smaller on the AOE size, but is not self cast, opponents can move away from target cast on and out of aoe.

The destro ultimate is weak but fills a unique role in its position of having both a massive AOE size, and is self castable such that it is mobile. Its duration of 10 seconds is double that of Bats and can proc elemental effects, specifically it can proc winterborn. So in a specific setup it can cover a much larger area especially if used with 1 or 2 more from other players, if using an Ice staff it can proc winterborn which does AOE damage and slows, Chilled will also slow, this slow component being mobile is key to staying on a group as other ground cast abilities can be easily dodge rolled out of. Stacked this could be very effective.

That doesn't mean it isn't an overall bad ultimate it just means it would be useful in very particular circumstances, of course only in those particular circumstances where it offers something that the others do not.

GreenSoup2HoT · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

Magicka is better at AoE and always has been. So many players here just want a Destro Ult for 1v1s. THIS GAME DOES NOT REVOLVE AROUND 1V1!

Destruent · September 2016

@Toc de Malsvi
Banner grants major defile, 20% more dmg done and 20% less damage received (depends on the morph) (and a nice synergy)+ a snare,
soultether a stun and massive heal
nova a great synergy + snare.
And you can use all those Ultis without slotting crappy destro-staff. You say, nova is weak, bc you can move out of it. The same can be said for the destro ult. But the snare caused by the nova (+ the synergy) will make your enemy stay inside for some seconds.

Xvorg · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

Destruent wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

lucky_Sage wrote: »

who think the destroy ult should be changes from a aoe ult
I think magicka has to many aoe ults

yes, talk to my sorcerer , we have the badest aoe of the game ... yeah ...

I main a magica sorc and i don´t see any reason to use the destro staff ulti in its curret form ever.

Negate is better for everything but strict max dps. Meteor is better for max dps. If you want an pbaoe effect batswarm is better.

What exactly do you want to use the ulti for when you have three aoe alternatives all of which are better than the destro staff one - care to explain @Apherius ?

At no point in your statement did you ask explicitly for Sorc use. I can see how on a Sorc this ult would seem less than worthwhile, that doesn't mean it is completely useless for everyone. It is not a good ultimate no doubt, but I could see it being very useful in certain very specific builds.

Which one?
DK: Banner
NB: Soultether
Templar: Nova

all classes have an AoE-ulti which does good DPS (maybe even more than this destro-ult), sometimes costs less and has powerfull secondary effects. So who is going to use this destro-ulti in your opinion?

VoB is even better than this destro ulti.

Saturn · September 2016

In terms of damage it needs an overhaul as it is being outperformed by current ultimates and the whole point is to add more to the mix. It is a similar issue some of the new upcoming monster sets has as well, where they are supposed to compared to current helmets but most (not all) simply don't and aren't even filling a gap where something is missing, but rather adding onto the pile of useless sets.

lucky_Sage · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

lucky_Sage wrote: »

who think the destroy ult should be changes from a aoe ult
I think magicka has to many aoe ults

yes, talk to my sorcerer , we have the badest aoe of the game ... yeah ...

I main a magica sorc and i don´t see any reason to use the destro staff ulti in its curret form ever.

Negate is better for everything but strict max dps. Meteor is better for max dps. If you want an pbaoe effect batswarm is better.

What exactly do you want to use the ulti for when you have three aoe alternatives all of which are better than the destro staff one - care to explain @Apherius ?

At no point in your statement did you ask explicitly for Sorc use. I can see how on a Sorc this ult would seem less than worthwhile, that doesn't mean it is completely useless for everyone. It is not a good ultimate no doubt, but I could see it being very useful in certain very specific builds.

Which one?
DK: Banner
NB: Soultether
Templar: Nova

all classes have an AoE-ulti which does good DPS (maybe even more than this destro-ult), sometimes costs less and has powerfull secondary effects. So who is going to use this destro-ulti in your opinion?

Banner is not mobile with a self cast, at best it requires repeated casting to move to a new location, it can proc skoria but not winter born, has a smaller AOE.

Soultether is a smaller aoe that creats a tether that can be broken so it is not functionally mobile, it cannot proc winter born or any elemental secondary effect.

Nova, might approach the same size but is only ground cast so opponents can move out of it. It also does not proc Winterborn, or burning, or chilled, or concussed.

Bat's is cast on self and so is mobile but lacks the AOE size and is half the duration at 5 seconds, it also cannot proc winterborn or burning or chilled, or concussed.

Meteor is also smaller on the AOE size, but is not self cast, opponents can move away from target cast on and out of aoe.

The destro ultimate is weak but fills a unique role in its position of having both a massive AOE size, and is self castable such that it is mobile. Its duration of 10 seconds is double that of Bats and can proc elemental effects, specifically it can proc winterborn. So in a specific setup it can cover a much larger area especially if used with 1 or 2 more from other players, if using an Ice staff it can proc winterborn which does AOE damage and slows, Chilled will also slow, this slow component being mobile is key to staying on a group as other ground cast abilities can be easily dodge rolled out of. Stacked this could be very effective.

That doesn't mean it isn't an overall bad ultimate it just means it would be useful in very particular circumstances, of course only in those particular circumstances where it offers something that the others do not.

on magdk it is crap but with standard even though they can run out but when placed at right spots and times combined with talons and fossilize its it really strong in pvp I have been liking it more than meteor and using instead it give me a decent aoe burst with deep breathe helps with Templars I had a lot more trouble with them when using meteor but standard helps out a lot
and on a sorc for pvp are signle target not aoe and would benefit a lot more from a single target ult
Templars never run destro in pvp and would loose to much if the did so doest matter but if did metoer still better and batsawrm aswell
a magblade is either a bomber build and soul tether is needed for the stun and a dot destro build is a single target build so a they would be more useful for a single target ult that's not a channel like soul assault
the ult is crap same with 95% of the destro staff is anyways they need to rework both destro and resto they don't match the aoe of duel wield or single target of it either or two handed in single target

Apherius · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Magicka is better at AoE and always has been. So many players here just want a Destro Ult for 1v1s. THIS GAME DOES NOT REVOLVE AROUND 1V1!

please . stop . Take a stam sorc , you see ? now you have the Best aoe character of the game .

susmitds · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

lucky_Sage wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Incapacitating Strike is a Nightblade only ultimate, and don't expect imitation of a class specific skill for every body. That's as bad as asking for a open for all negate or overload.

As for Dawnbreaker, it is a stamina only ultimate and should remain so.

I would say, something similar to the unnerfed Magicka Detonation as an ultimate.

how is it better than soul tether
that ult cost less has a good cc and deal a lot of dmg
when destroy ult has no cc and cost a lot more

Well you can't expect something that steps on another class's ultimates. Which is what I wanted to say.

Say, talk about the 2H ultimate. While, currently a bit OP due to the morph effects, I am pretty sure it will be nerfed before release. But even currently, what it is, is a beefed up Incapacitating Strike. But, while it deals more damage than Incapacitating Strike, hardly any NB would use it over Incapacitating Strike, as it costs thrice more, has no CC, no debuff, etc and can still be dodged, blocked, etc. And other classes have Dawnbreaker, which even with the nerf costs less than the 2H ultimate and overall damage with the DoT is more and is AoE, undodgeable and has a strong CC.

The point I am trying to make is that, ZOS won't make something similar to another class's ultimate for everyone to use without making it cost way more and have additional weaknesses.

Ghost-Shot · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

susmitds wrote: »

Incapacitating Strike is a Nightblade only ultimate, and don't expect imitation of a class specific skill for every body. That's as bad as asking for a open for all negate or overload.

As for Dawnbreaker, it is a stamina only ultimate and should remain so.

I would say, something similar to the unnerfed Magicka Detonation as an ultimate.

They added a set that gives every stam user access to battle roar, the last unique mechanic DK's had, why should anyone give a *** about class specific skills?

susmitds · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

Ghost-Shot wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

Incapacitating Strike is a Nightblade only ultimate, and don't expect imitation of a class specific skill for every body. That's as bad as asking for a open for all negate or overload.

As for Dawnbreaker, it is a stamina only ultimate and should remain so.

I would say, something similar to the unnerfed Magicka Detonation as an ultimate.

They added a set that gives every stam user access to battle roar, the last unique mechanic DK's had, why should anyone give a *** about class specific skills?

It works twice as good with the actual Battle Roar. Expect to see tons of StamDKs using this. That be said, they made sets copying nearly classes individual skills. There is a Minor Berserk monster set, as well as a Minor Expedition set, ripping off NBs and Sorcs. Then there is that chain monster set, which actually works better than the real chain skill. Vicious Ophidian rips off Repentance of templars.

Toc de Malsvi · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

Destruent wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi
Banner grants major defile, 20% more dmg done and 20% less damage received (depends on the morph) (and a nice synergy)+ a snare,
soultether a stun and massive heal
nova a great synergy + snare.
And you can use all those Ultis without slotting crappy destro-staff. You say, nova is weak, bc you can move out of it. The same can be said for the destro ult. But the snare caused by the nova (+ the synergy) will make your enemy stay inside for some seconds.

You cant move out of gap closing, the destro ult can be applied to self and you can stay on top of people, the only other aoe dot like that is bats but it has half the duration and almost half the radius.

Destruent · September 2016

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi
Banner grants major defile, 20% more dmg done and 20% less damage received (depends on the morph) (and a nice synergy)+ a snare,
soultether a stun and massive heal
nova a great synergy + snare.
And you can use all those Ultis without slotting crappy destro-staff. You say, nova is weak, bc you can move out of it. The same can be said for the destro ult. But the snare caused by the nova (+ the synergy) will make your enemy stay inside for some seconds.

You cant move out of gap closing, the destro ult can be applied to self and you can stay on top of people, the only other aoe dot like that is bats but it has half the duration and almost half the radius.

radius doesn't matter if you gaclose....bats also have like 60% the cost and a decent selfheal and you don't have to slot a destro.

Kiiiddd · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

Magicka is definitely missing some sort of burst damage like dawnbreaker. When dawnbreaker was magicka based it was probably the most popular PvP ult for Magicka classes. Now that it moved to physical damage(which it should be) magicka is left with a bit of a hole in their toolkits

Toc de Malsvi · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

Destruent wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi
Banner grants major defile, 20% more dmg done and 20% less damage received (depends on the morph) (and a nice synergy)+ a snare,
soultether a stun and massive heal
nova a great synergy + snare.
And you can use all those Ultis without slotting crappy destro-staff. You say, nova is weak, bc you can move out of it. The same can be said for the destro ult. But the snare caused by the nova (+ the synergy) will make your enemy stay inside for some seconds.

You cant move out of gap closing, the destro ult can be applied to self and you can stay on top of people, the only other aoe dot like that is bats but it has half the duration and almost half the radius.

radius doesn't matter if you gaclose....bats also have like 60% the cost and a decent selfheal and you don't have to slot a destro.

Radius does matter because were talking, zerg busting, gap closing to the center of a 8 man group that is right on top of each other is fine, but they will immediately scatter. The larger Radius of the Destro ult will mean they will have to move more than just side stepping to get out. 3 of the destro ults can cover a huge area making it almost impossible to avoid the damage.

More like 70-80% of the cost.

Jar_Ek · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

Low cost, yes plz.
Single target or cone.
Debuffing or buffing secondary, yes plz.

Destruent · September 2016

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Destruent wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi
Banner grants major defile, 20% more dmg done and 20% less damage received (depends on the morph) (and a nice synergy)+ a snare,
soultether a stun and massive heal
nova a great synergy + snare.
And you can use all those Ultis without slotting crappy destro-staff. You say, nova is weak, bc you can move out of it. The same can be said for the destro ult. But the snare caused by the nova (+ the synergy) will make your enemy stay inside for some seconds.

You cant move out of gap closing, the destro ult can be applied to self and you can stay on top of people, the only other aoe dot like that is bats but it has half the duration and almost half the radius.

radius doesn't matter if you gaclose....bats also have like 60% the cost and a decent selfheal and you don't have to slot a destro.

Radius does matter because were talking, zerg busting, gap closing to the center of a 8 man group that is right on top of each other is fine, but they will immediately scatter. The larger Radius of the Destro ult will mean they will have to move more than just side stepping to get out. 3 of the destro ults can cover a huge area making it almost impossible to avoid the damage.

More like 70-80% of the cost.

Use proxy --> soul tether --> better result...and enemys are stunned...get damage etc...
Oh...and they are not countered by one negate

notimetocare · September 2016

simthing in between

Dawn breaker replacement. Its what we all want

Minno · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

The ultimate is mostly plagued by bad staff design. I would rather they provide viable dps abilities in that skill line than change the ultimate to match dawnbreaker.

The only useful morph is the lighting due to it lasting longer and always giving the concussed status effect. Throwing down a WoE seems to also give off balance status effects just as much. So mostly useful for a zerg diver, or for keep defenses.

The other two morphs are easily replaced by meteor due to its cheaper cost and single target with an AOE.

The cold morph should give friendlies a shield

The fire should do increased chance to knock down enemies (similar to the mage guild rune).

This skill should cost 200 to use.

Lava_Croft · September 2016

And there I was thinking the Weapon Ultimates would be a great way to give Magicka some better single target DPS and Stamina some more AoE options.

Silly me, trying to think for @Wrobel.

juhasman · September 2016

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

lucky_Sage wrote: »

who think the destroy ult should be changes from a aoe ult
I think magicka has to many aoe ults

yes, talk to my sorcerer , we have the badest aoe of the game ... yeah ...

I main a magica sorc and i don´t see any reason to use the destro staff ulti in its curret form ever.

Negate is better for everything but strict max dps. Meteor is better for max dps. If you want an pbaoe effect batswarm is better.

What exactly do you want to use the ulti for when you have three aoe alternatives all of which are better than the destro staff one - care to explain @Apherius ?

In theory zerg busting, I don't know how effective it would really be, but Destro ult has much larger radius than Ice Comet and bats while being able to cast on self. So my thought is 2-3 NB's with Ice Staff's, Wearing something like(winterborn+skoria), Proxy Det>Destro Ult>Immovable pot>gap close>Unstable Wall>Mist.

I honestly think that as bad as the destro ultimate is overall, that it could be quite useful in a setup like that. Basically trying to take advantage of a self cast ult that can proc winterborn and skoria and has a very large radius.

Zerg busting needs burst not DoT if You want to kill the zerg with Dot's You'll fail because healers will outheal it with BoL and if atleast 1 person drop negate You'll fail even more. Nb already have zergbusting ulti which is soul tether. It hits hard at the opening stuns enemies deal DoT dmg later and heal caster. Also cost 150 ulti. Who would change it to 10 sec DoT cost 250 ulti and requiring destro staff to wear which will lower dmg comparing to other ultimates that can be used with dual wield?

Darlon · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

Despite making the single target low cost choice:

I am fine with it being an AoE skill (I don't see them changing it anyways, the graphics would have to be redone etc), but there's a few things very wrong with it.

1. The cost. It is way way to expensive right now. It hits for way less than meteor, so it should not be 25% more expensive, otherwise nobody will ever use it. A cost of 125-150 ultimate (if there's no changes to the damage output) is more reasonable.

2. Make it so that the static morph doesn't have the 2 seconds start up.

This thing doesn't have to be more powerful or better than other ultimates, but it must be useful in certain situations. It would be awesome if in certain situations it would be a better choice than for instance meteor, while in other situations meteor would be the better choice. That way you would have to make a choice based on the situation you're in.

The way it is now just isn't any of that.

itscompton · September 2016

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Bat's is cast on self and so is mobile but lacks the AOE size and is half the duration at 5 seconds, it also cannot proc winterborn or burning or chilled, or concussed.

Bats and the new Desto Ult are both a 10M radius so that part of your argument is a non starter.
As for the length of the effect: Devouring Swarm lets me wade right into the middle of 6-8 people keeping myself alive over the whole course of the Ult even if they all focus damage on me because with that many people in it's radius I'm getting 9-16k per second in healing and if they actually are able do so much damage I see my bar start going down a dodge roll buys enough time to be back to full health. You try to put that Destro Ult storm up and wade into a group of 6-8 people and I don't care if you're in heavy armor with reactive, Malabeth, and transmutation on, have 20K shields stacked or you do nothing but spam breath of life, if they all focus on you you're going to die before the fourth tick so it doesn't matter it's supposed to last twice as long. And with the way the animations look for each ability it's 10x harder to tell who's using bats that it will be to spot the person in the middle of the destro ult lightshow so expect to get zerged hard when you use it..
Devouring swarm might not proc the status effects you mention but it certainly procs Skoria which is getting a nice buff of it's own. And I'd rather get 1.5 to 3k in health back per second from each and every person affected than apply pretty much any of the status effects anyway.
The whole proccing winterborn deal is a bad reason why anyone would want to run the Destro Ult. If you're carrying an Ice staff you could still proc winterborn at an excellent rate by constantly keeping barricade of elements down while you're fighting AND while using a cheaper Ult with better secondary effects that could be fired off way more often..

ad4mss · September 2016

yes - for low cost single target ult

Well, first of all it should be lowered at cost, why magicka ultimate has to be 250 compared to the 2h ultimate which is 150 and also will be spamable all the time if properly used. Sorcerers lacks of single target ultimate, overload is the only way to target single one or use mages guild ultimate. Please consider to not put another one aoe.

Code2501 · September 2016

Even as an AOE with the current cost a few creative tweaks could make it useful in my view.

All morphs: Give it a Drain Magicka ability for duration like the poison effect, but AOE.

Elemental Rage: Remove the 2 sec build and make it tick twice as fast (0.5 sec), the burst would make a world of difference. If your going to name it 'Elemental Rage' make it a rage rather than just brooding anger. This would also make it time better with inevitable detonation.

Elemental Rage would provide a ranged burst of damage and magicka and not be so easy to dodge in pvp.
While Eye of the Storm would be a useful PBAOE bombing tool providing passive damage + magicka to follow through with Proxy Det and spam of instant PBAOE skills like Impulse, Solar Barrage, Sap Essence,etc.

This would give the Ultimate additional sustain utility for pve and make it a good anti-zerg tool in pvp.

Alternatively they could go down the path of giving each element additional distinctive flavor to the Ultimate... something like Drain Stamina on Ice, Drain Magicka on Lightning and Sorcery-Draining on Fire. This could be a harder change to apply depending on how they have the elemental effects coded but it would be true to the design intent of Destro being 3 different weapons, with 3 distinct Ultimates bound into one.

Burning_Talons · September 2016

I wish it was a Stabdard morph

leepalmer95 · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

I'm gonna say keep it the huge ass aoe on the grounds the animation looks cool.

You've got to admit that at least, too bad the actual ult is terrible.

Apherius · September 2016

no- keep aoe ult

Delete this ultimate , i push the wrong button ! where is the " Delete ultimate staff " button please guys ?