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A Conversation with ZOS on Balance
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MirkoZ✭✭✭✭Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »
You unlocked Regeneration after using a resto staff for 20 seconds.
Unless you are a really good player, you unlock Vigor after doing PVP for 10 hours.
You also forgot to draw a box around the Mutagen effect. "If you or your allies are low on health, the heal over time is consumed to heal immediately and remove harmful effect". Which is an instant 5k heal.
Yes but the heal over time is consumed so it heals for only 5 k. Yes yes we can spam it but hey, if there are 2 friends near me the mutagen healing them instead me, instead vigor healing the caster and nearby allies.Edited by MirkoZ on August 19, 2016 6:40AM0 -
Carbonised✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Thread after thread on the issue, and even polls too. Still no word from Wrobel or any hint that things will change in the future.
I don't know if it's so sad it's almost funny, or if it's so funny it's almost sad.0 -
Pandorii✭✭✭✭✭
✭Where is Wrobel, anyway? I can't recall the last time we heard from him on an eso live or a forum thread.
I'm really curious to know if they plan on making class balance changes in the next DLC/patch. There's a lot of hype for one tamriel followed by player housing. I feel like it might be ignored or pushed off for the future. That would really suck. I'd be ok with small changes over nothing (like the nothing we got for class balance on SotH).Edited by Pandorii on August 19, 2016 7:18AM0 -
MirkoZ✭✭✭✭I see my mag sorc that can kill a group of 99 stamina players
Ah no it is a dream
Edited by MirkoZ on August 19, 2016 7:57AM0 -
Johngo0036✭✭✭✭✭PC EU Megaserver
@Johngo0036
CP900+
Altmer Magicka Sorcerer |The-Irritable-Witch(DC)
Orc Stamina Dragonknight | Gru-Bolar(DC)
Dunmer Magicka Nightblade | Chewbucca(DC)
Khajit Stamina Nightblade | Gleaming Daggers(DC)
Altmer Magicka Nightblade | Miss Chewbucca(EP)
Argonian Magicka Templar | Walks-With-Friends(EP)
Argonian Templar Healer | Dr Toxic(EP)
Orc Stamina Sorc | Lady Streaks-Alot(DC)
Dunmer Magicka DK | Whips-n-Chains(DC)
Nord Warden | Demi Tank(DC)
Dunmer Magicka Warden | Crafter-O-Crafts(DC)
Bosmer Stamplar | Forest-Plump(DC)
Argonian Hybrid Nb | Men-O-Paws(DC)
Bosmer Stamblade | 'Maui(AD)
Altmer Magicka Sorcerer | Mid-Life-Crisis(AD)6 -
GrigorijMalahevich✭✭✭✭✭Brutusmax1mus wrote: »Your comparison are idiotic at best.
Craftable set vs end game set only a few will achieve. Common. They also serve different purposes. Seducers is a healing set, not a dps set. I will agree vicious serpent does A LOT, as it should for what it takes to get it.
I'll take meteor over dbos any day as magicka. Circular aoe vs cone. Better dot and a snare.
Forgetting the best part of mutagen, the burst heal that needs no magicka out attention, in 2 seconds you can do more healing immediately with it then vigor can. It is much cheaper. And does more healing to your teammates than vigor.
Wow is a different game.
Passives, OK there is one.
I'm glad you don't balance. I have no issues with any of my magicka characters.
Since when Seducer is a healing set? Seducer in current meta is must have for any magicka sorc in PvP...
Regarding endgame vs crafted set - give me hard mode trial Seducer set with same bonuses for magicka and we are even-steven.
Your meteor statement - when was the last time you actually hit anyone with meteor? People just block it and move on. Shooting a meteor is just telling your opponent that you are going to burst him... Argument about meteor ticks - you do realise that to get that your opponent needs to stay on the same place and dawnbreaker does not require that. Any magicka sorc would take dawnbreaker any day of the week and twice on Sundays over meteor.
Your argument about vigos vs mutagen - when your magicka characters get to low health, do you use mutagen? Because any stam character will use vigor.
P.S. I play stam and magicka.PC/EU 800 CP.
PvP MagSorc.Pedro Gonzales - Mag Sorc EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/CB6j6
Valera Progib - Stam Sorc DC vMA Flawless Conqueror clear https://i.imgur.com/eYgpXG2.png
Valera Pozhar - Mag DK EP vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/jrsuK
Valera Podlechi - Mag Templar AD vMA Flawless Conqueror clear http://imgur.com/a/N0BYq4 -
CapuchinSeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭The original mechanics of the game were based on the idea that everyone would use magicka based class skills and supplement it with few weapon based stamina skills.
I said this way back in the day when it was kinda clear how the game had been build and got shot down a LOT by people who just simply wanted to keep playing Skyrim totally ignoring this was its own game in its own right.Slayer9292_ESO wrote: »
You unlocked Regeneration after using a resto staff for 20 seconds.
Unless you are a really good player, you unlock Vigor after doing PVP for 10 hours.
You also forgot to draw a box around the Mutagen effect. "If you or your allies are low on health, the heal over time is consumed to heal immediately and remove harmful effect". Which is an instant 5k heal.
You can unlock Vigor by walking around empty keeps repairing walls and gates.2 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Can happen once every 6 seconds...
Can happen once every 45 seconds...
Seriously WTF is going on with the blatant stamina favoritism.Edited by Xeven on August 19, 2016 1:59PM14 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭Every major magic race (nobody's looking at you Argonians) gets 9-10% Max magic AND increased sustainability (regen or cost reduction) and only Redguards get max Stamina and resource management in that neighborhood.
For an endgame magic build, that's like 4500 Magic or the equivalent of 425 weapon damage. EVERY MAJOR MAGIC RACE.
There aren't any Stamina based Weapon damage racial bonuses and even our highest max stamina bonus doesn't come close
to what Altmer, Bretons, and Dunmer get, since Stam builds don't scale to Stamina predominately, but rather weapon damage.
But they don't have any passives to further boost damage besides that, right?
Two out of three also get MASSIVE ELEMENTAL BOOSTS!!!
And Mages guild passives, THEY ALL GIVE YOU EMPOWER and EASY ACCESS TO MAJOR SORCERY and even MORE
Max Magic.
Fighter's guild though, right? Well when Camo Hunter starts giving us insta-Standard of Might, then we'll talk.
Mag DKs definitely need a buff. the rest of you... SMH
Edited by Amdar_Godkiller on August 19, 2016 2:34PM2 -
DocFrost72✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭SleepyTroll wrote: »I'm sure it's really hard to balance a game where everyone can do everything at the same time, with no soft caps.
^1 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lets compare the main offensive stamina weapon passives to the ONLY offensive magicka weapon passives shall we?
10 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭You highlighted the one passive that benefits magic builds as well. And it arguably is a benefit solely to magic
users because stam builds use axes, daggers, and maces almost exclusively, because magic builds already have
way more penetration than us from light armor passives. AND you all have access to Major Breach through destruction
staff skills. Not to mention more AOE than any stam build is capable of slotting.0 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭Also we can't even use Two-handed in PVE because of how weak it is compared to DW. These are all PVP boosts,
so when was the last time you let yourself get whacked by a slow-mo heavy attack?0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »so when was the last time you let yourself get whacked by a slow-mo heavy attack?
These PvE guys are clueless.
Edited by Xeven on August 19, 2016 3:03PM6 -
DocFrost72✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »so when was the last time you let yourself get whacked by a slow-mo heavy attack?
These PvE guys are clueless.
It would go a long way not to be rude to others when making your point, regardless of how frustrated you are.4 -
CapuchinSeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »Also we can't even use Two-handed in PVE because of how weak it is compared to DW. These are all PVP boosts,
so when was the last time you let yourself get whacked by a slow-mo heavy attack?
er... pretty much all the time because of animation cancelling and pre-building the heavy attack while the "charge towards target" animation plays out.3 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »so when was the last time you let yourself get whacked by a slow-mo heavy attack?
These PvE guys are clueless.
Maybe, but I'm less clueless about healing than anybody who thinks Vigor is OP. LOL
This is how much my stam Healer could get out of Regeneration with 18K magic.
Of course that doesn't matter because Healing Springs/Illustrious Healing is the actual skill that compares to vigor.
And it heals for WAY more than vigor per tick and in total.
1 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭As you can see, the GROUND BASED MORE EXPENSIVE magicka heal does 13050 compared to 15200 vigor.
GTFO man there is no question that vigor is the best heal in the game barring BoL.
Edited by Xeven on August 19, 2016 3:53PM3 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭For reference, same stats, rally does 22162 total, is 20% weapon damage, and is an optional burst heal on your OFFENSIVE WEAPON mind you.
Edited by Xeven on August 19, 2016 4:06PM2 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭Less than 18K Magic vs 33K Stam with equal weapon and spell damage and Illustrious still heals for more
And for what it's worth 2610 x 5 =13050
13050/4 seconds = 3262.5 heals per second
15200/5 seconds = 3040 heals per second with that morph, so less healing per tick than Illustrious
Echoing Vigor heals for 14600 on this build at 32K Stamina
0 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭Rally is definitely OP. I laugh every time I use it.
But so is breath of life.
Vigor isn't. It's a decent heal, but it's outclassed by restro skills and many class heals0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »And for what it's worth 2610 x 5 =13050
13050/4 seconds = 3262.5 heals per second
15200/5 seconds = 3040 heals per second with that morph, so less healing per tick than Illustrious
Irrelevant. 4 seconds vs 5 and you have to use a *** weapon. Combine this with shuffle, rally, dodge roll, block and 20k resists, and you can face tank a magicka build because they cant out DPS your HoTs.
Edited by Xeven on August 22, 2016 1:25PM3 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭You can cast illustrious healing in front of you and fall into it if you want. You can dodge roll AC combat prayer
all day. I know because I do it. Combat Prayer grants one of the strongest and rarest buffs in the game
Put some damn Stam recovery glyphs on your build then! You get to use two pools. Only an idiot would solely focus on one! Stam and Magic are balanced. Magic builds just aren't willing to sacrifice anything to adapt to the level playing field.
Roll dodge costs a like 5K, so unless you are risking insta-death in all well-fitted, it's not that much help. You do realize that
you are not prevented from using shuffle.0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'd like to point something else out to @Wrobel and everyone else. These passives DO NOT APPLY after swapping back to your DPS weapon which means... Your HoTs do not benefit from these passives, and your healing ward does not benefit from these passives! Theyre ALMOST USELESS!
Edited by Xeven on August 19, 2016 4:29PM2
