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Mag temps need a nerf.
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Rylana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So its only now that templars are strong?
Son I been tanking 10+ guys in Kags heavy as a healer since fricken IC dropped. Where the hell you been. (seriously, Zazeer and GoS were still playing when I made the same suit I use today, almost a year ago). I remember sitting for four hours one night back in late 2015 with Sinister from GoS (now in Invictus) theory crafting the build, the day i forsook light armor on templar forever. That same suit sat on my AD templar for nearly six months until I was finally able to buy a character slot and make an EP templar like id always wanted.
This isnt a Malubeth or Black Rose thing, this has been the templar power build since forever, its only recently become mainstream because some people made some videos of it and the metachasers saw how strong constitution is, heavy has been strong as hell for a lot longer than that. Its one of the main reasons I was against buffing it further. In fact, I remember saying that the loss of block cost in heavy NEEDED to happen without buffing anything else because it was already OP.
This is the reason a lot of you on the forums and your little fanboy cliqs bother me so much, you dont even know whats good in the game until one of them runs a video of it. You have any idea how many heavy armor templars have been running since long before any of this changed?
No, you dont, because youre ignorant of how the game works.
Lol.....Kag's, let me teach you a few things, I wrote the book from which you copied......
You of all people just tried to e-peen at me? Son, you arent even a challenge and I was running the build before i even knew you existed.@rylanadionysis == Closed Beta Tester October 2013 == Retired October 2016 == Uninstalled @ One Tamriel Release == Inactive Indefinitely
Ebonheart Pact: Lyzara Dionysis - Sorc - AR 37 (Former Empress of Blackwater Blade and Haderus) == Shondra Dionysis - Temp - AR 23 == Arrianaya Dionysis - DK - AR 17
Aldmeri Dominion: Rylana Dionysis - DK - AR 25 == Kailiana - NB - AR 21 == Minerva Dionysis - Temp - AR 21 == Victoria Dionysis - Sorc - AR 13
Daggerfall Covenant: Dannika Dionysis - DK - AR 21 == The Catman Rises - Temp - AR 15 (Former Emperor of Blackwater Blade)
Forum LOL Champion (retired) == Black Belt in Ballista-Fu == The Last Vice Member == Praise Cheesus == Electro-Goblin3 -
THEDKEXPERIENCE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭In b4 aggressive comments from Magicka Templar class players, because they like the position their class is in now and they refuse to see it from other player's perspectives. This goes out to you for making this thread, because you are about to get a lot of hate for trying to bring light on the issue of perma-block casting breath of life spams into bats, with radiants that reach 30 meters. Hey this goes out to you reactive templars with malubeth, you the real MvP's of Cyrodiil.
C'mon man. It's 41 meters!1 -
DisgracefulMind✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Magicka Templar isn't overpowered. Light Armor magicka Templar is just as hard to play and unforgiving as light armor magicka Sorc/DK/NB. The synergy between Heavy Armor and magicka Templar however is pretty strong. And that's a conversation that we can have, sure. But there's no way I'm gonna entertain it until Stamina is nerfed into the ground: damage, heals, dodge or all three. You telling me you have never seen a stamina build take multiple players on with ease? Make no mistake, that is the most pressing balance issue of the day. As it stands heavy armor Magplar is the only class spec that's even comparable to stamina builds medium or heavy. Heavy armor stam DK and stamplar are easily more powerful all around than Heavy Magplar. So until every single light armor Magicka build is brought to par with medium armor stamina builds, and magicka and stamina are balanced in general, we are not gonna nerf the one Magicka spec that can even compete.
And P.S: If the Templar was was taking on the 4 players with ease and killed any of em- I assure you they weren't any good. The only thing a Magplar can do against 4 competent players is mist form line of sight until they run out of juice. If it drops the defenses to go offensive against good players, the Templar will get obliterated due to the channel time on virtually every Templar skill. Now compare this to a stam Templar, for example, that can easily have vigor and rally hots along with shuffle up - alongside 8% damage reduction and healing on top of everything- as it bash cancels heroic slash with impunity, punctuating it with dawnbreaker bursts.....ya. Not even close.
This whole post completely. We should always discuss balance before we discuss nerfs.Unfortunate magicka warden main.
PC/NA Server
Fairweather Friends
Retired to baby bgs forever. Leave me alone.4 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »Problem is champion system as it always is. Take away 25% extra healing 20% extra healing taken, and infinite regen, and templars, (and pretty much everything else in the game) is balanced again.
Makes sense, I play on Azura's and I really don't see these unkillable Templar tanks. Maybe it's just a bias or maybe its just the poorly conceived CP system that needs to be reworked or removed from the game but never will be.
And this is why Azuras is getting so popular lately.
No serious. Healing takes what, a 15% battle spirit reduction?
Then you have +25/20 healing done and taken in CP.
Then you have major mending.
Then you get four second procs of 30% healing I ncrease from Malubeth.
Then you get heavy armor bonuses.
Then you take the five piece reactive helping 35% less damage on every stun.
Then you take vampire for another 30% damage reduction with undead passive under half health.
Then you get a designer, @Wrobel - who needs to be fired and shown the door. Seriously. Send security now and drag him out of the door before it's too late.
Note that none of the above means that a Templar is any less dangerous. They still can put out impressive damage with a two hander. I don't know where this 'no damage tank' myth comes from...
Edit: sorry if I ruined anyone's super secret cancer build, but IDGAF. It's cancer.
A wall of text... the first thing you said is wrong.
The fact you think healing is only 15% reduced shows your opinions should be ignored.
It's 50%..
One of the guys in the Malubeth thread swore up and down that it's 15. I looked up the rest of the stats. This is what I get for listening to people on the internets.
I don't heal though, outside of healing ward I don't slot anything.
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God_flakes✭✭✭✭✭
✭genjutsu_kami wrote: »
Not sure if you are being serious I highly doubt you are but I and many other players playing any other classes mag or stam could've done the exact same thing to bad players. That's like playing magicka dk killing 5 bads and then running to the forums to say magicka dk is fine.
Big Earnie?
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zuto40✭✭✭✭✭The way healing works is whats broken not any class itself, healing is based on your max/dmg meaning high damage builds also have high healing, tank builds can get high damage which in turn equals high healing, there is no trade off, how strong a heal is needs to be based on some other stat to make anything actually balanced, and heals themselves are way too strong with cp, without cp as a tank wearing purple crafted weapons with roughly 2700 wpn dmg and 34k max stam my rally heals me for 6k, healing is very clearly broken, but knowing zenimax if they do change anything theyll just break the game even furtherStamblade- Legate
Tank/Heals Templar- Sergeant
Magic DK- Corporal
Stam DK- Sergeant
Stamplar- Corporal
YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCy8uqORxhlrMh8oz2230s9g4 -
arkansas_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Look around you in Cyrodiil. 90% or more of Magicka classes are Templar now. Even the alts being grinded in the Sewers are always Templars. This is the situation on PS4 NA and I doubt it is different elsewhere.
You could argue that this is the result of stamina being so much more powerful in comparison to magicka, with magic Templar being the only magic class that's on par with stamina. IMO Templars need a redesign (the healer class shouldn't have access to a better execute than the assassin/long-range nuker classes), but stamina seriously needs a nerf.ＦＯＲＵＭＰＬＡＲ
Grand Overlord 25/8/172 -
Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Nerf the only magicka class worth logging into Cyrodiil atm. What a joke. There are so many of them because it's the only mage spec that can compete. Because it's the only one that can do what stam does: heal and kill stuff without having to slot sucky weapons or slot mediocre skills.
@Wrobel and his "stamina patches" were a bigger joke. As if dodge, better and more accessible HoTs than anything magicka can get, mobility, and damage weren't enough he's got to thrown in armor sets that are actually good, hand out major mending/vitality like candy, and turn stam DKs into 50K+ DPS monsters. I'm pretty sure a single vigor HoT can outheal Dragon's Blood. The magicka meta was busted only because of the dumb vicious death set and the dumber Prox Det skill (since nerfed).Edited by Joy_Division on August 16, 2016 6:13AMMake Rush of Agony "Monsters only." People should not be consecutively crowd controlled in a PvP setting. Period.10 -
BRogueNZ✭✭✭✭✭Potent healers
You need good friends. Close by.
If you do a good enough job ensuring a successful wipe by your team or even just denying them pug AP you can bet the enemy NB's are after you. Stamblades / Dizzying DK's..the burst is just plain insane against LA even with magelight and some points in the right places.
Not sure folk are surprised many become HA heal bots (more Paladin than Priest) and then wreck face with 10-15 min-max'd dps'ing and off healing companions
Edited by BRogueNZ on August 16, 2016 6:49AM2 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭arkansas_ESO wrote: »Look around you in Cyrodiil. 90% or more of Magicka classes are Templar now. Even the alts being grinded in the Sewers are always Templars. This is the situation on PS4 NA and I doubt it is different elsewhere.
You could argue that this is the result of stamina being so much more powerful in comparison to magicka, with magic Templar being the only magic class that's on par with stamina. IMO Templars need a redesign (the healer class shouldn't have access to a better execute than the assassin/long-range nuker classes), but stamina seriously needs a nerf.
Imo light armor needs a buff. I just have no idea in what way it could be buffed bc what it´s lacking is survivability.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 502 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Since other magic specs suck so bad in pvp and I refuse to roll Stam all my pve and VMA grinding has paid off.
I now run my Templar as a tanky healer that never runs out of magic and is tanky AF
2 piece Malabeth
5 piece Black Rose
3 piece Willpower
Maelstrom Sword and Shield
Maelstrom Resto Staff
Keep rapid regen up for free magic return
Lots of block cost and magic cost reduction
Can heal for days and tanky AF
Myself dropping a nova right outside of EP negate at ales farm last night was a game changer. 6 Stam turds pounding against my shield couldn't make a dent and when I'm not healing I'll Jesus beam low health people.
ZOS nerfed the tar out of my Sorc making it unplayable in pvp outside of 1 build.
So they want to bring down the thunder by god they got it! Cancer 101. I'm sick of magic being unplayable this patch for any other class so I'll just be a tanky healer for a group until thenRinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak1 -
KenaPKK✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Wow this thread turned into AIDS pretty quickly.
Anyone who disagrees that magicka Templar is op is either misinformed or in denial. Same with each stamina class in their own ways. Too much damage for how tanky they can all get, and no one is limited by sustain anymore. This game is a joke.9 -
RinaldoGandolphi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Magic Templar is not OP though,it's the only magic class that is balanced.
Templars lack mobility unless they become vamps which gives them a huge fire weakness and crap health recovery. Mist form halts magic regen to get out of snares and roots and also makes Dawnbreaker hit 20% harder
Stam builds get all of with no penalty(shuffle and forward momentum)
Radiant can be blocked and purged. It's no more OP then any other execute. You can stand back and spam Mages Fury on low health targets just like beam, but mages fury sticks on you 4 secs and if your drop low boom it's every bit as good as beam.
The only folks who complain about Templars are mostly nightblades as Templars are better equipped to handle their initial burst and purge their defiles then they are forced into a long drawn out fight that most gank builds are ill equipped to handle.
You Kena are the upper echelon of nightblade, but we both know you don't run builds with terrible sustain. Your able to gank while still having good sustain because your good with the class, but most nightblades go all out on damage and when they gank a tanky toon who can handle their intial burst they often die to these tanky toons then complain about it.
My Templar is very tanky, but he is also a healer. He will not kill anyone with half a brain because damage is terrible. I can however weather a good bit of damage and heal pretty well and squishy healers are dead ones healers who stay alive keep their groups up. Most of these tanky healers are the type I speak of.
So what Templar has a beam it's NOT just an execute its intended to do decent damage above 50% read the tooltip. Healers in pve have to contribute damage too and that's what beam is for. It's not meant to be solely an execute its a mediocre DPS skill with a execute mechanic folks really just need to get over it. The cases you would die to beam something else would have killed ya anywaysRinaldo Gandolphi-Breton Sorcerer Daggerfall Covenant
Juste Gandolphi Dark Elf Templar Daggerfall Covenant
Richter Gandolphi - Dark Elf Dragonknight Daggerfall Covenant
Mathias Gandolphi - Breton Nightblade Daggerfall Covenant
RinaldoGandolphi - High Elf Sorcerer Aldmeri Dominion
Officer Fire and Ice
Co-GM - MVP
Sorcerer's - The ONLY class in the game that is punished for using its class defining skill (Bolt Escape)
"Here in his shrine, that they have forgotten. Here do we toil, that we might remember. By night we reclaim, what by day was stolen. Far from ourselves, he grows ever near to us. Our eyes once were blinded, now through him do we see. Our hands once were idle, now through them does he speak. And when the world shall listen, and when the world shall see, and when the world remembers, that world will cease to be. - Miraak12 -
KenaPKK✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@RinaldoGandolphi depends on your definition of balanced. Magplars hardly feel the weaknesses you listed for them, and stamina certainly doesn't have clear weaknesses anymore with proper builds. I expect clear weaknesses and limitations in my idea of balance, and heavy armor snb magplar currently does not have those. Same with stamina.1 -
Ron_Burgundy_79✭✭✭✭✭@RinaldoGandolphi depends on your definition of balanced. Magplars hardly feel the weaknesses you listed for them, and stamina certainly doesn't have clear weaknesses anymore with proper builds. I expect clear weaknesses and limitations in my idea of balance, and heavy armor snb magplar currently does not have those. Same with stamina.
Except a heavy armor sword and board magplar will have a hard time killing anyone. That's a weakness.4 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Ron_Burgundy_79 wrote: »@RinaldoGandolphi depends on your definition of balanced. Magplars hardly feel the weaknesses you listed for them, and stamina certainly doesn't have clear weaknesses anymore with proper builds. I expect clear weaknesses and limitations in my idea of balance, and heavy armor snb magplar currently does not have those. Same with stamina.
Except a heavy armor sword and board magplar will have a hard time killing anyone. That's a weakness.
Nah they won't.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...1 -
Ron_Burgundy_79✭✭✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »Ron_Burgundy_79 wrote: »@RinaldoGandolphi depends on your definition of balanced. Magplars hardly feel the weaknesses you listed for them, and stamina certainly doesn't have clear weaknesses anymore with proper builds. I expect clear weaknesses and limitations in my idea of balance, and heavy armor snb magplar currently does not have those. Same with stamina.
Except a heavy armor sword and board magplar will have a hard time killing anyone. That's a weakness.
Nah they won't.
Care to elaborate?2 -
Sheuib✭✭✭✭I think a tank character should be able to last a long time. 2 minutes isn't that bad. He wasn't unkillable. It would be different if they couldn't kill him and he managed to kill all of them.1
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Cinbri✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Nope.
Just reading pathcnotes of every major update and first thing you will see - number of nerfs for this particular class.
P.S.: or maybe you won't see that coz huge amount of nerfs for templars are ninja-nerfs that already caused some rage in the past.
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Kilandros✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Wow this thread turned into AIDS pretty quickly.
Anyone who disagrees that magicka Templar is op is either misinformed or in denial. Same with each stamina class in their own ways. Too much damage for how tanky they can all get, and no one is limited by sustain anymore. This game is a joke.
Says the guy who won't be happy until Magblade completely eclipses every other class. Magblade is still good, you should calm down. Btw speaking of denial, have you wiped any Adamant groups with your 4 man lately?Invictus
Kilandros - Dragonknight / Grand Overlord
Deimos - Templar / Grand Warlord
Sias - Sorcerer / PrefectZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Short answer is DKs likely won't be seeing a ton of changes before we go live; this class is still quite powerful (as it should be being a tank), even after some of the adjustments we've made to other classes and abilities.
DK IS NOT JUST A TANK CLASS. #PLAYTHEWAYYOUWANT4 -
Jules✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's moreso a heavy armor and permablock issue than it is a class issue I think. Those two things just synergize well with the healing of magplar and so people misunderstand what the true underlying issue is.
The fact that everyone's in heavy armor and many are permablocking makes for a very boring, tanky meta. Perhaps revisiting the buffs to heavy armor or reconsidering the resistances of light and medium might be in order. And as far as permablocking, it is entirely possible again due to the strength of sturdy. If Zeni wanted this out of the game, why has it been reintroduced?3 -
Lyrander✭✭✭BruhItsOver9000 wrote: »
so he did die?
well that was ONE of them.
I fought against a stam DK with 5 other players.
He did not die.
not in the 30mins we tried. you see me asking for a nref?
No? maybe its because that one player made his build and knows how to play it well.
And 2 minutes isnt even a long fight.2 -
Lyrander✭✭✭genjutsu_kami wrote: »ill just leave this here for you delusional mag templars
[SNIP]
a NB could have executed them as well.....no point.Edited by ZOS_PeterT on August 16, 2016 7:13PM0 -
Lyrander✭✭✭Sugaroverdose wrote: »
What does it proves? He catch a bunch of people who cannot even kill guards.genjutsu_kami wrote: »
try to count beams in this vid, spoiler - i didn't kill anyone there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuU2kLruvoU
nice one
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Lyrander✭✭✭Magicka Templar isn't overpowered. Light Armor magicka Templar is just as hard to play and unforgiving as light armor magicka Sorc/DK/NB. The synergy between Heavy Armor and magicka Templar however is pretty strong. And that's a conversation that we can have, sure. But there's no way I'm gonna entertain it until Stamina is nerfed into the ground: damage, heals, dodge or all three. You telling me you have never seen a stamina build take multiple players on with ease? Make no mistake, that is the most pressing balance issue of the day. As it stands heavy armor Magplar is the only class spec that's even comparable to stamina builds medium or heavy. Heavy armor stam DK and stamplar are easily more powerful all around than Heavy Magplar. So until every single light armor Magicka build is brought to par with medium armor stamina builds, and magicka and stamina are balanced in general, we are not gonna nerf the one Magicka spec that can even compete.
And P.S: If the Templar was was taking on the 4 players with ease and killed any of em- I assure you they weren't any good. The only thing a Magplar can do against 4 competent players is mist form line of sight until they run out of juice. If it drops the defenses to go offensive against good players, the Templar will get obliterated due to the channel time on virtually every Templar skill. Now compare this to a stam Templar, for example, that can easily have vigor and rally hots along with shuffle up - alongside 8% damage reduction and healing on top of everything- as it bash cancels heroic slash with impunity, punctuating it with dawnbreaker bursts.....ya. Not even close.
here we have it again.
and as someone who played a templar in almost every way there is, i have to agree on one thing specially here.
its heavy armor that makes a huge difference. and thats not only for magicka templars but for all classes.
i am sad to say that its almost useless nowadays to choose light armor over heavy armor.2 -
Lyrander✭✭✭arkansas_ESO wrote: »Look around you in Cyrodiil. 90% or more of Magicka classes are Templar now. Even the alts being grinded in the Sewers are always Templars. This is the situation on PS4 NA and I doubt it is different elsewhere.
You could argue that this is the result of stamina being so much more powerful in comparison to magicka, with magic Templar being the only magic class that's on par with stamina. IMO Templars need a redesign (the healer class shouldn't have access to a better execute than the assassin/long-range nuker classes), but stamina seriously needs a nerf.
Imo light armor needs a buff. I just have no idea in what way it could be buffed bc what it´s lacking is survivability.
THIS!!!0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8P-08bsNFs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_zM19tgfa0