Confessions of a zerg surfer

tinythinker · August 2016

Hello. My name is tinythinker, and I'm a zerg surfer.

I can also be rightly called a "bad", "scrub", and "potato", so feel free to use any and all of those terms. Everyone has different reasons for adopting a particular play style in Cyrodiil. Some are based on preference, some on necessity. So long as people are not violating the TOS by cheating or exploiting, there is no illegitimate way to play, yet there are ways that some people dislike and complain about. I feel no need to defend myself, but I figured it might be worthwhile giving the perspective on how and why some people play like I do because the general assumption seems to be that if people don't play in a way someone else finds acceptable, they are morally deficient: lazy, selfish, leechers, etc.

Do I always zerf ("zerg-surf")?

No. Sometimes I try to get into a small to medium group. If it's a well-formed group of decent players who regularly play together, I can contribute fairly well and have fun doing smaller objectives. I was in a guild for a while that did group PvE and small-group PvP, but I was rightly booted as per policy for a really extended absence. And even then that group wasn't always up. Job changes and other life events can make my play time irregular, not to mention sometimes needing extended vacations from a particular activity or game just to get away and do something else for a while. So, it can be hard when you just pop on whenever you can to find a decent small/medium group you gel with and who will take you/be available when you happen to be on.

As for soloing, well, I am very, very bad at that. If I can be focused by one or more players, I'm toast. L2P is irrelevant--I've been in ESO since Beta. Actually, I was never great soloing, but prior to 1.6 it was something I could practice and have at least a shot at doing OK. Got a few "GFs" even though I lost. Once even killed two gankers in 5 seconds. Since 1.6 and beyond? Nooooooo. Solo bad. Solo hurt. Stay away from solo. I get what gear I can as I am able and patch it together will skills slots choices to be as effective as possible, but my level of play doesn't work in the current era for going out alone.

Why zerf? Why not join a large group or raid?

Sometimes I do, but I generally do better for myself and whatever battle I'm at if I don't. It's hard for people to run large pug raids well, and the crown sometimes takes too long to make adjustments or the pugs take too long to course correct. As someone who does a lot of healing, debuffing, or executing, I am more efficient and get more accomplished as a floater, anticipating needs and adjustments and moving to where I will need to be to scout or set up siege or whatever else ought to be done. Sometimes I stack with their crown, sometimes I go off of their script.

In fact, then, I am neither lazy, selfish, nor leeching in my game play (well, maybe sometimes if I'm tired, but not just because I zerf) . If you hesitate or get cc's on the breach and survive due to some furious healing, you're welcome. If you are about to get killed in 1v1 or 1v2 ambush and one assailant at low health gets executed and the other cc'd, you're welcome. If a breach opens up and some fool has a meatbag set up right inside it firing onto enemy players trying to swarm in, say "Hi" and toss a heal my way. I may not be in your group, but I help you. And of course, your group helps me. You keep me from being focused so I can engage and withdraw at will. You supply the numbers needed to capture or defend an objective. You set the direction and pace of combat. So thanks.

I can't speak for all zerfers. But some of us know PvP/AvA: we know how to attack and defend breaches, we set up FCs, we rez as often as we can, we don't steal siege, and we don't just run behind your group spamming rapid regen. We want to play and we try to have fun while helping as our schedules, gear, and skill level allow. Thanks to those excellent solo players and well run groups for making our fun possible. See you in the trenches!

Edited to 1v1 some typos. I actually won.

Altercator · August 2016

zerglyfe

E-Zekiel · August 2016

Meh, people who don't like mass PVP shouldn't play games that cater so much to mass PVP, IMO.

With that said, I enjoy zerging but I don't do it all the time. And it frustrates me when I try to do something helpful that isn't zerging (like solo flagging) and the zerg is too dumb to capitalize.

But what it comes down to is I just like mass PVP. It's fun and I feel immersed in the battle and I just like it. I particularly like playing keep defense.

BRogueNZ · August 2016

Some groups get right salty if you dip into their groups collective AP pool while playing your game how you want to play it.

oh well..

Airyus · August 2016

This was a pleasant read. Your heroics are noticed, though not often enough given appropriate accolades. This soldier thanks you.

tinythinker · August 2016

E-Zekiel wrote: »

Meh, people who don't like mass PVP shouldn't play games that cater so much to mass PVP, IMO.

With that said, I enjoy zerging but I don't do it all the time. And it frustrates me when I try to do something helpful that isn't zerging (like solo flagging) and the zerg is too dumb to capitalize.

But what it comes down to is I just like mass PVP. It's fun and I feel immersed in the battle and I just like it. I particularly like playing keep defense.

Yeah, I don't really seek out zergs but most battles I come across now have at least one side with 40-50+ people swarming around and reacting as a whole, which is my definition of a zerg, as opposed to a well-run raid (24) or half-raid (12). So technically then since I am on the periphery of such zerg v zergs and not out doing a lot of small-group stuff my playstyle can be considered zerg-surfing.

I agree about the fun of keep defense. I love my nami-wagon ("Namira* wagon", a.k.a. meatbag catapult). I also agree that prepping a target and having it be ignored is frustrating, which is why I hardly ever do it anymore. I know exactly where the zergs in each Alliance are going based on the situation on the map, so why bother? Just go where the players will be and set up shop.

I don't think people who prefer small-groups don't belong but they do need more objective/rewards. I think town capture is a good start, and adding mobile flags would be a great next step.

[*Yes, techincally Peryite is the God of Pestilence, but pery-pult isn't as catchy, and disease is technically a gift Namira sometimes bestows, plus she is the God of Repulsion, and hurling rotten meat at people is damn gross.]

tinythinker · August 2016

BRogueNZ wrote: »

Some groups get right salty if you dip into their groups collective AP pool while playing your game how you want to play it.

oh well..

If a group is stacking with 30-50 other players, they can get as salty as they want

I am not talking about trailing a 12-24 player group to leach AP by spamming rapid regen and then grabbing a tick after making no significant contribution.

And in any case, no one owns the map. I've been in a group now and then that decided to farm AP for a while, and I can't say I feel bad at all if a few pugs show up and grab a little of their spoils. The raid can share the wealth a bit and move on. It's a cost one has to factor in and any raid leader who regularly does such farming is aware of it.

I go where I think I will have fun or be useful. If possible, both. Sometimes people are asking in zone, "Come help siege here," "Come help us defend we're about to flag," and so on so at some fun places (Brindle!!!!!). But mostly it's just the same few locations over and over again where 90% of the action is every single day (bridge between Alessia and Sejanus, gate between Chalman Farm and Bleaks, gate between Ash and Nikel) unless one Alliance is pushing Emp or scrolls, so who knows how much of "my" AP someone else is taking or how much of "theirs' " I am getting when everyone is running around. It doesn't matter to me.

tinythinker · August 2016

Airyus wrote: »

This was a pleasant read. Your heroics are noticed, though not often enough given appropriate accolades. This soldier thanks you.

Heroics? Naw. We all contribute something worthwhile to each battle, and anyone could turn the tide by the most mundane sounding activity. Well, I usually contribute something worthile unless I just feel like prancing around on my mount along the front lines of skirmishes, or in and out of active breaches, etc. Then I'm more like a diversion or perhaps a bit of entertainment. Mostly I am ignored unless I linger too long, occasionally I am attacked, and sometimes I actually scare some people away, presumably thinking that I must be a super-badass who is taunting them or that my presence is some kind of Valkyrie-like pronouncement of impending doom

Olyboi · August 2016

Zerg surf + full health radiant = profit

Airyus · August 2016

Olyboi wrote: »

Zerg surf + full health radiant = profit

You just described my favorite enemy templar. Rhymes with Mace Fartwind

tinythinker · August 2016

Olyboi wrote: »

Zerg surf + full health radiant = profit

I know, I know, but then I got hooked again on Endless Fury.

Not to mention I swapped a while back to Radiant Glory on my Temp...

Reverb · August 2016

Are you me? I feel like you might be me.

GreenSoup2HoT · August 2016

Love love to read posts like these. As a casual pvp zerf/ganker myself its really nice to see others with the same way of thinking.

I couldnt have said it better myself. Everything you said represents how i also play the game aswell.

Master_Kas · August 2016

Upularity · August 2016

Master_Kas wrote: »

You are the definition of a zerger

KenaPKK · August 2016

Zerf!

I love that word.

My phone autocorrect just got so confused. Lol

E-Zekiel · August 2016

tinythinker wrote: »

E-Zekiel wrote: »

Meh, people who don't like mass PVP shouldn't play games that cater so much to mass PVP, IMO.

With that said, I enjoy zerging but I don't do it all the time. And it frustrates me when I try to do something helpful that isn't zerging (like solo flagging) and the zerg is too dumb to capitalize.

But what it comes down to is I just like mass PVP. It's fun and I feel immersed in the battle and I just like it. I particularly like playing keep defense.

Yeah, I don't really seek out zergs but most battles I come across now have at least one side with 40-50+ people swarming around and reacting as a whole, which is my definition of a zerg, as opposed to a well-run raid (24) or half-raid (12). So technically then since I am on the periphery of such zerg v zergs and not out doing a lot of small-group stuff my playstyle can be considered zerg-surfing.

I agree about the fun of keep defense. I love my nami-wagon ("Namira* wagon", a.k.a. meatbag catapult). I also agree that prepping a target and having it be ignored is frustrating, which is why I hardly ever do it anymore. I know exactly where the zergs in each Alliance are going based on the situation on the map, so why bother? Just go where the players will be and set up shop.

I don't think people who prefer small-groups don't belong but they do need more objective/rewards. I think town capture is a good start, and adding mobile flags would be a great next step.

[*Yes, techincally Peryite is the God of Pestilence, but pery-pult isn't as catchy, and disease is technically a gift Namira sometimes bestows, plus she is the God of Repulsion, and hurling rotten meat at people is damn gross.]

Oh I'm not saying the small group stuff doesn't belong, just that it's silly (IMO) to play this game while being anti-zerg. I'd definitely be cool with more small-group objective oriented stuff. That's somewhat hard to accomplish without some type of 'battleground' enforcing a small team limit. Which I'd also be ok with, but I know a lot of people wouldn't be.

tinythinker · August 2016

E-Zekiel wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

E-Zekiel wrote: »

Meh, people who don't like mass PVP shouldn't play games that cater so much to mass PVP, IMO.

With that said, I enjoy zerging but I don't do it all the time. And it frustrates me when I try to do something helpful that isn't zerging (like solo flagging) and the zerg is too dumb to capitalize.

But what it comes down to is I just like mass PVP. It's fun and I feel immersed in the battle and I just like it. I particularly like playing keep defense.

Yeah, I don't really seek out zergs but most battles I come across now have at least one side with 40-50+ people swarming around and reacting as a whole, which is my definition of a zerg, as opposed to a well-run raid (24) or half-raid (12). So technically then since I am on the periphery of such zerg v zergs and not out doing a lot of small-group stuff my playstyle can be considered zerg-surfing.

I agree about the fun of keep defense. I love my nami-wagon ("Namira* wagon", a.k.a. meatbag catapult). I also agree that prepping a target and having it be ignored is frustrating, which is why I hardly ever do it anymore. I know exactly where the zergs in each Alliance are going based on the situation on the map, so why bother? Just go where the players will be and set up shop.

I don't think people who prefer small-groups don't belong but they do need more objective/rewards. I think town capture is a good start, and adding mobile flags would be a great next step.

[*Yes, techincally Peryite is the God of Pestilence, but pery-pult isn't as catchy, and disease is technically a gift Namira sometimes bestows, plus she is the God of Repulsion, and hurling rotten meat at people is damn gross.]

Oh I'm not saying the small group stuff doesn't belong, just that it's silly (IMO) to play this game while being anti-zerg. I'd definitely be cool with more small-group objective oriented stuff. That's somewhat hard to accomplish without some type of 'battleground' enforcing a small team limit. Which I'd also be ok with, but I know a lot of people wouldn't be.

Did someone say PvP Battleground?

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/277732/cloud-ruler-temple-as-a-pvp-trial-or-as-a-pvp-battleground

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/279545/make-ic-the-home-of-arenas-bgs

frozywozy · August 2016

I think what you described is very reasonable. What usually gets on people's nerves about zergers is when you get chased 24v1 from one keep to another persistently with the only goal to p1ss you off. I won't say that I have never killed a player outnumbering him, but I never chase one player for 30seconds - 1 minute with a full zerg next to me.

That is just toxic and bad manners.

Rohamad_Ali · August 2016

frozywozy wrote: »

I think what you described is very reasonable. What usually gets on people's nerves about zergers is when you get chased 24v1 from one keep to another persistently with the only goal to p1ss you off. I won't say that I have never killed a player outnumbering him, but I never chase one player for 30seconds - 1 minute with a full zerg next to me.

That is just toxic and bad manners.

56714-Sponge-Bob-gif-gif-Animation-Animated-Pictures-explosion.gif

ToRelax · August 2016

I like playing with or against this playstyle a lot more than large, organized groups, ganksquads or the typical zerg players who spam lfg in zone and chase single players and small groups over the whole map. People complaining about "zerg surfing" as you call it either don't realize how toxic their own playstyle is, or are just too arrogant to accept that not everyone might be able to practice it.

Derra · August 2016

If none of my grpmates is only i exclusively zergsurf on my sorc now.

I don´t see the point of soloing deep into enemy territory just to be stealthganked by atleast 3ppl or fight tankbuilds that end in a stalemate 100% of the time.

kevlarto_ESO · August 2016

This whole thing about zerg surfing is just stupid, I play in a small group sometimes we are the first on the scene, and start to siege once those x's show up on the map people show up sometimes in large numbers, we have no control of that, we all go where the action is when there is nothing else going on, on the map, I don't follow the zerg around like some lost puppy, but I do show up at keep takes and defends, what else is there to do, this is a group based pvp game, you might get 10 people showing up you might 50 plus showing up that's just the way things are, if your not into large scale pvp this is not the game for you, there are plenty of games on the market that offer up mini games and small scale, this is not one of them, yet at least.

Draxys · August 2016

tinythinker wrote: »

E-Zekiel wrote: »

Meh, people who don't like mass PVP shouldn't play games that cater so much to mass PVP, IMO.

With that said, I enjoy zerging but I don't do it all the time. And it frustrates me when I try to do something helpful that isn't zerging (like solo flagging) and the zerg is too dumb to capitalize.

But what it comes down to is I just like mass PVP. It's fun and I feel immersed in the battle and I just like it. I particularly like playing keep defense.

Yeah, I don't really seek out zergs but most battles I come across now have at least one side with 40-50+ people swarming around and reacting as a whole, which is my definition of a zerg, as opposed to a well-run raid (24) or half-raid (12). So technically then since I am on the periphery of such zerg v zergs and not out doing a lot of small-group stuff my playstyle can be considered zerg-surfing.

I agree about the fun of keep defense. I love my nami-wagon ("Namira* wagon", a.k.a. meatbag catapult). I also agree that prepping a target and having it be ignored is frustrating, which is why I hardly ever do it anymore. I know exactly where the zergs in each Alliance are going based on the situation on the map, so why bother? Just go where the players will be and set up shop.

I don't think people who prefer small-groups don't belong but they do need more objective/rewards. I think town capture is a good start, and adding mobile flags would be a great next step.

[*Yes, techincally Peryite is the God of Pestilence, but pery-pult isn't as catchy, and disease is technically a gift Namira sometimes bestows, plus she is the God of Repulsion, and hurling rotten meat at people is damn gross.]

I giggled at nami-wagon =P

Stikato · August 2016

Kudos to OP, my sentiments exactly. To me its just more fun trying to help turn the tide of a massive battle.

skillastat · August 2016

+1 Awesome

Even if myself I'm getting the urge to get away from my own faction when I see it. But as you said to everyone their playstyle and I respect that.

BTW if you wanna try solo one day.... go for EVASION classes.

one of these:

Stamina Sorcerer
Magicka Nightblade
Stamina Nightblade
Magicka Sorcerer

tinythinker · August 2016

skillastat wrote: »

+1 Awesome

Even if myself I'm getting the urge to get away from my own faction when I see it. But as you said to everyone their playstyle and I respect that.

BTW if you wanna try solo one day.... go for EVASION classes.

one of these:

Stamina Sorcerer
Magicka Nightblade
Stamina Nightblade
Magicka Sorcerer

My DC Breton is a magicka sorc, but he was mostly fun in 1.5 on BwB. His gear needs an upgrade, but I don't see myself evading much with a magicka Sorc. My EP Argonian sorc is currently magicka. I did have him has stamina very briefly several months ago with some hand-me-down gear from my DK who switched back to magicka but when I started playing that sorc again recently, the stam gear was really old. It takes me a while to even get basic crafted gear so I don't like to switch a lot. I generally do noticeably worse with stamina builds than their magicka counterparts so everyone in my stable is magicka atm.

I do have an EP Argonian NB who is a magicka build (basically I have an Argonian for each class), but, it's absolutely, no doubt my worst class to try to play in PvP. By a light year. I hate it. I can survive longer, do more damage, and evade better with Elusive Mist on my Argonian magicka Templar than on my NB even if they run the same gear. I do squat damage on my NB and anyone can either one shot me or use magelight/detect pots/practically any ability to pull me out of stealth if one shot wasn't enough.

zyk · August 2016

frozywozy wrote: »

I think what you described is very reasonable. What usually gets on people's nerves about zergers is when you get chased 24v1 from one keep to another persistently with the only goal to p1ss you off. I won't say that I have never killed a player outnumbering him, but I never chase one player for 30seconds - 1 minute with a full zerg next to me.

That is just toxic and bad manners.

Riiight, so everyone with an escape element to their build should just be given unlimited get out of jail free cards because they're outnumbered? Did you not recently post about situational awareness and playing in hard mode?

If you do not wish to die in that scenario, do not enter that scenario. There is nothing toxic about killing an opponent.

The play style you have recently adopted is what I've mainly played from the start. Not once have I complained about being chased down. If you're a known player, it's going to happen no matter where you are or who you're with. And if you're not a known player, it's probably still going to happen.

This is what I love about AvA. The dynamism. You never know what is coming around the corner or over the hill. That 2v2 can turn into a 2v26 at anytime. Being ready for and dealing with it is part of the fun.