I am for the most part a PVE care bear, I played enough PVP on four toons o unlock vigor.

It is much better now then it used to be, Dow snit require a huge investment of time (you can casually get vigor in a week, generally being awful at PVP and less then a day if you find a rather efficient group).

PVP is general sucks not because of the game but because a rather substantial portion of PvP players exhibit competition toxic behavior.

Take you PVP beating and leave Cyrodill pick up the sky shards while you are there, farm for kutas (because they fall like candy in PVP land, and don't go back until you want a Hakiejo.

Basically deal as a fellow care bear I can't endorse this.

You want free vigor? I want free vma weapons

If you are strong enough for vmsa then youre strong enougj for pvp. Stop doubting yourself.

Ghost-Shot wrote: »

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

if it used to be more doesnt mean its ok now, this is one of the most essentail skills and shouldnt behind a huge pvp barrier

It's not a huge barrier, we have already had everything we could earn in PVP handed out to carebears, stop trying to make it worse. You have rally for healing already as well as fantastic avoidance and mitigation options. If those aren't enough for you then get good or by all means PVP for vigor.

n1 naming ppl who dont like random zerg fests and probably the most casual noobish PvP in any game to date, carebears.

I've been a competitive PvP player in all games I play, except ESO, with good reason

and yeah, I hate to play horse simulator for hours to get vigor just like OP.

I solo gank and pull 1.1-1.3k a kill gank on seige lines and you will be their in one night.

I hate how you are forced to use vigor as any stamina spec unless you gimp yourself. We only have limited space but we have to fill up that space with essential abilities like vigor and shuffle as well as a range of standard weapon abilities and a couple of class defining abilities. Even with a stamblade their class abilities are essentially like slotting the weapon lines.

Unsent.Soul wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

vyndral13preub18_ESO wrote: »

GrumpyDuckling wrote: »

I'm shocked by the amount of people giving the OP a hard time about this thread. There's no reason that Vigor shouldn't also be accessible through gaining XP in PVE.

Just because it doesn't take as long to get Vigor now compared to "back in our day," doesn't mean the OP should be getting bashed for it. It's a legitimate complaint that ZOS forces players to play a game mode they don't want to play.

I think most of it comes from the fact that pvpers need to grind out pve for things as well. So most feel if I have to do something i dont like to compete in something i do like, then so should you.

If that's their logic, then they shouldn't bash the OP, they should make a legitimate claim for PVP-centered XP and being able to unlock skills through PVP means.

Unless they think it is fair that both have to do something they dont like.

Not sure why they'd prefer to do something they don't like and insist that others drudge through a similar circumstance rather than advocate for positive changes. Maybe that's too logical for most, though. Easier to drag others down than promote positive change for everyone.

How's that "positive change" working out for you with that tank build on MA/VMA? Did ZOS write back and say how they see the flaws and will change the arena so tanks can take 8 hours to complete the arena?

Had to go there, advocating for positive change works, sometimes. Highly doubtful you'd see that being taken into consideration with ZOS.

They've already scaled the amount of AP needed, once, maybe twice, can't recall TBH. Next it'll just be handed out because people fear the dreaded pvp.

You realize that you're making my point, right?

Instead of supporting the OP and trying to help advocate for a positive change that benefits the community of players as a whole, you're attacking the OP and making a baseless claim that suggests he/she wants Vigor to "be handed out."

No one asked for Vigor to be given for free, and there's no reason for it to be locked into a PVP skill line. It could easily be unlocked by gaining PVE experience, and there simply isn't a justifiable reason for why that shouldn't be the case.

You can keep trying to drag the OP down, but the bottom line is that the OP has a sound argument and so far there hasn't been a good counter-argument against it. I'm continuously shocked by players who want to pigeon-hole both themselves and the rest of the community by defending a "one-way-to-play" style.

What would be the harm in making Vigor accessible in a PVE skill line? Please, someone, I'd like a logical argument for why Vigor shouldn't be PVE-accessible.

Here is the biggest issue with this game...PvE and PvP are not separated. This is the reason why nerfs come to PvE so often. I hate PvPing...I don't enjoy...but I had to do it to get Proximity detonation on my templar. So I went in and either healed zergs or just radiant oppressioned while other classes did the work. Don't like players like me? Then give me a way to get these skills outside of cyrodil and I will leave and never come back. Till then I'll be using the cheesiest mechanics to get the skills I need for PvE....

For stam it's even worse...while proxi det is useful, vigor is essential. Putting it behind a mandatory PvP experience imho is real crappy.

silky_soft wrote: »

You want free vigor? I want free vma weapons

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

Here is the biggest issue with this game...PvE and PvP are not separated. This is the reason why nerfs come to PvE so often. I hate PvPing...I don't enjoy...but I had to do it to get Proximity detonation on my templar. So I went in and either healed zergs or just radiant oppressioned while other classes did the work. Don't like players like me? Then give me a way to get these skills outside of cyrodil and I will leave and never come back. Till then I'll be using the cheesiest mechanics to get the skills I need for PvE....

For stam it's even worse...while proxi det is useful, vigor is essential. Putting it behind a mandatory PvP experience imho is real crappy.

Great post. I play both PVE and PVP. While I enjoy both, I wish there were more of a separation of the two (but with all skills accessible to both groups of players). I wonder if there was more separation, if we could drop classes all together and actually pick the skills we want (for PVE purposes).

Example: I don't have much use for most Ardent Flame skills on my DK tank. It would be nice to be able to further customize my build for content in which I am not competing with others.

xskinzcity wrote: »

Bigevilpeter wrote: »

wow pvp players are really too elitist and toxic, the rumors were all true

Because pve players complain about everything and want things handed to them. Pvp players dont complain about having to grind out dungeons for undaunted and vmsa just to have the gear we need for pvp. Plus more than likely its the pve players going to cyrodiil and getting wrecked then scream NERF on the forums.

i see both sides QQ and want stuff handed to them..*cough* monster helms *cough*
Many nerfs have come to PVE skills because of PVP QQ.

lets not be blind now

Kammakazi wrote: »

It's literally only 88,000 AP to get it.

Before it was 364,000 AP.

and before that it was Rank 10 Alliance.

APPRECIATE THE CHANGES MADE FOR VIGOR

Watch out, you'll be called an elitist and all kinds of other things... right @GrumpyDuckling ?