https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NNIpwhR66o
Like this, could open up many RP opportunities and socializing.
i don't think interacting with an npc really counts as socializing
If there would be stalls like these,i'd prefer them to only be allowed in certain areas like the market place.
For socializing purposes,it might be better to extend the idea.
so that players can offer themselves as mercenary in the tavern for dungeons,..
the ablities for players to offer certain expertis to others ,linked to a specific area that hasthe right context for it.
I'm all in favour of restricting NPC traders or stalls to just the three starting cities, that way they would enable new players to use the trading system straightaway and they could get a quest that introduced them to the guild trader system, for example by requiring them to interact with a guild trader in a couple of different locations. Meanwhile they'd be able to sell just a few items at a high commission rate that would still constitute a gold sink and with the commission shared between the trading guilds in those cities. They wouldn't be required to move on to guild traders if they didn't want or need to, but the concept would be explained to them and the choice would be theirs to make. Members of unsuccessful guilds would also be able to continue using the feature. However, with the high commission rate and severe restrictions on the number of items that could be listed, the trading guilds would continue to offer great advantages over the feature.
The introduction of such a system would benefit those who don't want to join a trading guild for whatever reason, those who belong to a trading guild that has been unsuccessful in getting a trader slot, and those who haven't yet decided what they want to do about trading guilds and don't fully understand the system. It would strengthen the trading guilds by giving them a share of the additional commission and by introducing new players to the whole concept of trading guilds. Put simply, everyone would gain and nobody would lose.
I've yet to see a proper objection to such a system. Criticism of it is limited to things like "It's an MMO, join a guild" or "we don't need an AH", both of which are completely irrelevant to the issue.
But the thing is, if its less profitable than regular guild store, then where's the incentive to use it?
there are already four methods of selling stuff
1. via zone chat
2. to an npc
3. in a non trade guild via guild store
4. in a trade guild via a guild trader
why is a fifth method necessary?
Daemons_Bane wrote: »there are already four methods of selling stuff
1. via zone chat
2. to an npc
3. in a non trade guild via guild store
4. in a trade guild via a guild trader
why is a fifth method necessary?
Becase to non-guild people, there are only 2 of those methods available and tbh method 2 is irrelevant
Daemons_Bane wrote: »But the thing is, if its less profitable than regular guild store, then where's the incentive to use it?
The incentive is that you can now have your stuff at a trader, instead of using the WTS shout
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »there are already four methods of selling stuff
1. via zone chat
2. to an npc
3. in a non trade guild via guild store
4. in a trade guild via a guild trader
why is a fifth method necessary?
Becase to non-guild people, there are only 2 of those methods available and tbh method 2 is irrelevant
i'm still trying to figure out what 'non-guild people' is supposed to mean
and how is selling to an npc irrelevant - that's how i get rid of trash items. all that stuff that you get as drops - and so does everybody else.
you are ducking the point. those four methods are available to everyone. pretending they aren't is just fudging the issue.
Daemons_Bane wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »there are already four methods of selling stuff
1. via zone chat
2. to an npc
3. in a non trade guild via guild store
4. in a trade guild via a guild trader
why is a fifth method necessary?
Becase to non-guild people, there are only 2 of those methods available and tbh method 2 is irrelevant
i'm still trying to figure out what 'non-guild people' is supposed to mean
and how is selling to an npc irrelevant - that's how i get rid of trash items. all that stuff that you get as drops - and so does everybody else.
you are ducking the point. those four methods are available to everyone. pretending they aren't is just fudging the issue.
Okaaaay... a non-guildie is, surprise, a person not in a guild therefore, a guild trader is not available.. secondly, if you'd looted your 3rd ring of agility, would you sell it to the weaponsmith.?
so nope, I'm not really ducking anything
There is control of supply, and then there is control of location.KoshkaMurka wrote: »It would make rich richer and poor poorer if said rich people could actually control all supplies. But that's not the case. Even if someone buys every item of specific kind, they're still unable to do anything with people farming those items or getting gold through different game activities.
On the other hand, sometimes guild traders offer items at very low price. Undercutting is a thing as well... Its not a real market, but the basic supply/demand concept applies to it as well.
Daemons_Bane wrote: »We seem to do that a lot in this thread though I am not really seeing any arguments against the suggestion.. a lot of useless "get in a guild" posts, but not really any arguments
Shadesofkin wrote: »I have never met anyone who's had a good reason to avoid being in at least one trading guild.
Your points...KoshkaMurka wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »We seem to do that a lot in this thread though I am not really seeing any arguments against the suggestion.. a lot of useless "get in a guild" posts, but not really any arguments
Ok, here's my arguments:
1)If it will be less profitable, like fence assistant, then where's an incentive to use this feature? Even the assistant has its advantage - she follows you around, but even then its not terribly popular. Just because you lose 35% of the profits.
2)If it will give the same (or comparable) profit as normal guild traders, then where's an incentive to be in guild, and support it?
3)Number of trades is limited - 30 trades in every guild. If you will be able to list 30 items at every trader, there wont be any need to prioritize sales and think about reasonable prices - you could just put over 9000 items to different traders and forget about them.
Also a guild cant have more than 500 members, and even than big guildstores are often cluttered and difficult to navigate without addons. What will happen if there will be listings from 5000 people at once? And how to manage your own items, scattered in different guildstores?
4)I honestly dont see how this feature would improve average player's experience. It will require a lot of changes to make it more or less fair and balanced, but will it be worth it? For people who dont wanna join any guilds, there is (or will be if were speaking about consoles) an option - /z chat. Yes, it requires some time, but you get 100% of profits this way, without guild fees.
Is it wrong that I want to sell items at far below the prices that others are asking for them?
Example: Guild store (one of the ones I dropped) the other day selling Blessed Thistle @ 1500 each. I had about 50 of them in my inventory (I find them all over the place in Morrowind) so I considered putting out 40 of them at 50 each.
I suppose that would make the other folks mad, but, honestly, I have 29 regen rings or 240 + health items or paldrouns or weapons and staves that low level players could get some use out of rather than going and searching for them that I'm just going to break down for parts anyhow.
Maybe I'm just evil, or maybe I just want to annoy greedy people. Not sure which, but either will work for me.
Anybody need a green Night Mother's Pauldron that I haven't bothered to upgrade? I'll just give it to you. I have no use for it and I don't feel like searching for the whole set.
Your points...KoshkaMurka wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »We seem to do that a lot in this thread though I am not really seeing any arguments against the suggestion.. a lot of useless "get in a guild" posts, but not really any arguments
Ok, here's my arguments:
1)If it will be less profitable, like fence assistant, then where's an incentive to use this feature? Even the assistant has its advantage - she follows you around, but even then its not terribly popular. Just because you lose 35% of the profits.
2)If it will give the same (or comparable) profit as normal guild traders, then where's an incentive to be in guild, and support it?
3)Number of trades is limited - 30 trades in every guild. If you will be able to list 30 items at every trader, there wont be any need to prioritize sales and think about reasonable prices - you could just put over 9000 items to different traders and forget about them.
Also a guild cant have more than 500 members, and even than big guildstores are often cluttered and difficult to navigate without addons. What will happen if there will be listings from 5000 people at once? And how to manage your own items, scattered in different guildstores?
4)I honestly dont see how this feature would improve average player's experience. It will require a lot of changes to make it more or less fair and balanced, but will it be worth it? For people who dont wanna join any guilds, there is (or will be if were speaking about consoles) an option - /z chat. Yes, it requires some time, but you get 100% of profits this way, without guild fees.
1 - Merely having access to a wide customer base makes it profitable above the existing merchant rock bottom prices, even if it had a 35% tax taken. If I recall correctly, I could sell a purple C160 ring of willpower (healthy) to the npc for like 46 gold. If that sells for 100 - 35% tax it is still more than what the npc offers, AND someone gets to finish off their set with something, even if only as a placeholder until something better comes along.
2 - Guilds are also social groups. There's your incentive.
3a - We're talking about ONE public trader. So no 9000 listings stretching from the maormer infestation of auridon all the way to the giant infestation of eastmarch.
3b - To keep the merchandise in stock able to be managed well, perhaps instead of one universally accessible trader, make it multiples with specialties. Public trader A does alchemy and provisioning. B does clothing and 'other'. C does blacksmithing and woodworking. Etc.
4 - As mentioned earlier, the guild trader requirement is the bottleneck that cripples people's ability to sell beyond the reach of their area voice / text chat. Exclusion of people from being able to participate is what reduces normal free market competition. Reduction in competition allows the participants to gouge, because who is going to be able to have a real impact when they can't reach 95% of the possible customers?
Your points are thusly ALL refuted.
Ok, here's my arguments:
1)If it will be less profitable, like fence assistant, then where's an incentive to use this feature? Even the assistant has its advantage - she follows you around, but even then its not terribly popular. Just because you lose 35% of the profits.
2)If it will give the same (or comparable) profit as normal guild traders, then where's an incentive to be in guild, and support it?
3)Number of trades is limited - 30 trades in every guild. If you will be able to list 30 items at every trader, there wont be any need to prioritize sales and think about reasonable prices - you could just put over 9000 items to different traders and forget about them.
Also a guild cant have more than 500 members, and even than big guildstores are often cluttered and difficult to navigate without addons. What will happen if there will be listings from 5000 people at once? And how to manage your own items, scattered in different guildstores?
4)I honestly dont see how this feature would improve average player's experience. It will require a lot of changes to make it more or less fair and balanced, but will it be worth it? For people who dont wanna join any guilds, there is (or will be if were speaking about consoles) an option - /z chat. Yes, it requires some time, but you get 100% of profits this way, without guild fees.
jedtb16_ESO wrote: »Your points...KoshkaMurka wrote: »Daemons_Bane wrote: »We seem to do that a lot in this thread though I am not really seeing any arguments against the suggestion.. a lot of useless "get in a guild" posts, but not really any arguments
Ok, here's my arguments:
1)If it will be less profitable, like fence assistant, then where's an incentive to use this feature? Even the assistant has its advantage - she follows you around, but even then its not terribly popular. Just because you lose 35% of the profits.
2)If it will give the same (or comparable) profit as normal guild traders, then where's an incentive to be in guild, and support it?
3)Number of trades is limited - 30 trades in every guild. If you will be able to list 30 items at every trader, there wont be any need to prioritize sales and think about reasonable prices - you could just put over 9000 items to different traders and forget about them.
Also a guild cant have more than 500 members, and even than big guildstores are often cluttered and difficult to navigate without addons. What will happen if there will be listings from 5000 people at once? And how to manage your own items, scattered in different guildstores?
4)I honestly dont see how this feature would improve average player's experience. It will require a lot of changes to make it more or less fair and balanced, but will it be worth it? For people who dont wanna join any guilds, there is (or will be if were speaking about consoles) an option - /z chat. Yes, it requires some time, but you get 100% of profits this way, without guild fees.
1 - Merely having access to a wide customer base makes it profitable above the existing merchant rock bottom prices, even if it had a 35% tax taken. If I recall correctly, I could sell a purple C160 ring of willpower (healthy) to the npc for like 46 gold. If that sells for 100 - 35% tax it is still more than what the npc offers, AND someone gets to finish off their set with something, even if only as a placeholder until something better comes along.
2 - Guilds are also social groups. There's your incentive.
3a - We're talking about ONE public trader. So no 9000 listings stretching from the maormer infestation of auridon all the way to the giant infestation of eastmarch.
3b - To keep the merchandise in stock able to be managed well, perhaps instead of one universally accessible trader, make it multiples with specialties. Public trader A does alchemy and provisioning. B does clothing and 'other'. C does blacksmithing and woodworking. Etc.
4 - As mentioned earlier, the guild trader requirement is the bottleneck that cripples people's ability to sell beyond the reach of their area voice / text chat. Exclusion of people from being able to participate is what reduces normal free market competition. Reduction in competition allows the participants to gouge, because who is going to be able to have a real impact when they can't reach 95% of the possible customers?
Your points are thusly ALL refuted.
1. sell it via /z...... all profit
2. non-sequitur
3a. the op was about an npc in every trade area. not one trader - that is a different argument.
3b.another non-sequitur
4. cripples? using pejorative language does nothing to persuade me to your point of view. i have made a lot of gold from /z and, a year or so back, made plenty from being in a trade guild (not the case currently) it's hardly crippling. no one is excluded from trading by any of the four methods i listed above (ok, consoles for the time being). gouge? again pejorative language to hide a flaccid argument...its simple if you don't like the price don't buy it.
the points still stand.
add to that the fact that trading in the game is built on the idea of guilds - remember the loading screens that say 'if you want to trade with other players join a guild'???
so that has to be dismantled to suit a few malcontents rather than the devs spend time on some of the real issues that (i'm told) affect other players enjoyment of the game and on introducing more great content.
No one talked about dismantling anything we're talking about adding stuff.. That's quite the oppositeso that has to be dismantled to suit a few malcontents
why do people play MMOs if they just want to play alone and all that?
I'll never get behind that logic.
why do people play MMOs if they just want to play alone and all that?
I'll never get behind that logic.
Daemons_Bane wrote: »why do people play MMOs if they just want to play alone and all that?
I'll never get behind that logic.
A few reasons could be that as a TES fan they love the game, or maybe that just because it's an mmo it's not a law to socialize people could simply be seeing other players as another kind of npcs..
Rayya_Blackheart wrote: »Ok. But why would I, as a player, want to continue to be in my trade guilds if I have a guaranteed spot any time I want to sell something? What limitations are you posing for people who opt out of a trader? How would this effect the current trade market?
Rayya_Blackheart wrote: »Ok. But why would I, as a player, want to continue to be in my trade guilds if I have a guaranteed spot any time I want to sell something? What limitations are you posing for people who opt out of a trader? How would this effect the current trade market?