Dual Wield has some healing capabilities Bloodcraze and Bloodthirst.

Tiitus wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Vigor scales off of stamina. healing ritual and rushed ceremony scale off of Magicka. Soo if your a stamplar than they are a wasted skill spot bcz they will only heal for 1000ish.

ah gotcha.

There is a huge difference between CP 400 and CP 501. Just wait till you get to CP 501. If your still struggling then check your armor. This game is less about skill and technique and more about min/maxing

You can get vigor in one day of pvp. Im a pve player but went in with my healer for warhorn with my new tank for warhorn caltrops and vigor and then got vigor for a new stamblade too all in few days because the skill is that good. Its worth the pvp time. And as i am not much in pvp i ignore things i dont like in chat thats rather easy if youre only there occasionally

psychotic13 wrote: »

Tiitus wrote: »

Is there a pve version of this "a must have for stambuilds" skill if not can we get one, hate pvp one cuz I suck at it and two cuz its usually follows with toxic ppl not my cup of tea.

I'm afraid you're going to have to PvP, it's the same on the flip side though, those of use who only PvP and don't PvE don't really want to go and grind for some maelstrom weapons

Except you don't require vMSA weapons to kill people but you do need vigor to survive in PVP its a PITA when you don't have it.

Nevertheless on my 3rd character vigor grind now -__-

Lets be honest guys if you're a new player just starting out on pvp and don't really know the best way to get AP in pvp then it's going to take you 10+ hours and probably few days of running from keep to keep to keep to keep, sometimes getting very little AP for the huge amount of time spent.

It's kind of fun but if you're new and your mount speed is bad, then much of your time is going to be traveling from fort to fort, sometimes for very little exp, and vigor is necessary for most stamina builds and the most reliable heal overall so if you want to be decent and not have to depend on a healer in dungeons, you're forced to grind PVP for it.

Just learn how to play PvP once you get good you want even be able to play PvE any more because you will be bored of how easy it is. That's just how the game is everyone has to do something they don't want to. I want max rank undaunted to improve my PvP build but I don't want to grind dungeons. To get my lich armor I did about 600 dolmens. For you though to get a lot of ap just set up oil on the inner keep wall when a enemy is running through the breach. You'll get 3k ticks you'll have vigor in a couple hours

Jinxycat wrote: »

Sorry OP I don't feel bad for you at all. I need to do tedious and boring pve content to level up mages guild, fighters guild and undaunted so....

I don't think this should be a zero sum game. I don't think PvE players should be forced to do PvP to get a critical skill, nor should PvP players have to do the reverse. There are a few ways this could be solved.

1: The PvP skill lines and the PvE guild skill lines (mage's, fighter's, undaunted) could have their skills mirrored (and not stack with each other). This would let people from both sides get the skills they need by doing the content they prefer. The downside to this solution is that homogenizing the skill lines is a bit boring.

2: The skill lines could have alternative methods of leveling them up. You could get Mage Guild ranks by helping to capture/defend Elder Scrolls. You could get Fighter Guild ranks from doing bounties in Cyrodiil (make them always available instead of requiring a passive from the skill line). Undaunted could gain ranks from capturing large scale objectives (like keeps or the town capture mechanic that's being introduced soon), or they could introduce world bosses to Cyrodiil in the form of alliance generals. For the PvP skill lines, they could add repeatable quests (like the Thieves' Guild or Dark Brotherhood quests) to help secure supply lines from bandits or something similar (logistics is a very important part of any real military endeavor). The downside here is that it's probably more complex to implement.

Bromburak wrote: »

A good class architecture will consider trade offs but they don't really exist in ESO. From design perspective you cannot just give up "old" trinity concepts for hybrid flexibility when it gets out of control like in ESO.

You are able to play very tanky canon with heals, mobility and CC at the same time and this is the best confirmation you can get that a game has severe balancing issues. The reason why ESO balancing will always stay questionable is that ZOS never really made a difference between PvP and PvE. Any change has impact without recognizing PvE or PvP.

This makes class balance very challenging because it's only dealt with symptoms instead with cause.

I disagree. @KenaPKK hit the nail on the head when he stated that if you balance the game around pvp, then pve will be balanced as well. He's absolutely right on this. Games that design around PVE first then PVP always have balance problems. Games that build around PVP FIRST seem to gain balance stability early on and have less headaches for the designers. In my view there's a lesson for Devs there of any MMO, and I highly recommend they consider doing this instead of this odious battle spirit nonsense.

KenaPKK wrote: »

/ignore toxic people.

You should give it a shot!

This exactly. I avoided PvP for a long time in game. I had no fun due to looking at a mostly toxic zone chat and not understanding the tactics others used. Then just stopped caring about if I die or not, it's a game. Sometimes you win, sometimes you don't. Turn off most of your Add-ons, maybe adjust your video settings down a notch and just follow a group around. If you pick up a group, don't be afraid to say you're new and learning and ask if they are a guild that is accepting new players. Just learn from your experience, and go with it. Eventually you'll be able to anticipate the moves of others, then it's just tons of fun from there.

Worst thing that could happen is someone kicks you from group and is a general troll in zone. Meh, that is what ignore is for.

@dodgehopper_ESO thank you. Funny how common sense goes right past some developers.

Two other points.

One, to the OP, Vigor is only necessary in PvP and Maelstrom Arena anyway. You'll have pocket healers in your groups with your roles, and you have access to other self heals available for easier solo content. Maelstrom plays like PvP anyway -- it's basically a big, choreographed 1vX -- so if you want to do Maelstrom, I suggest you pony up. You'll gain skills necessary to do it faster in PvP than in PvE.

Two, PvPers have to grind MORE PvE stuff than PvEers have to grind PvP stuff. You want two skill lines which both level with AP gains and cap at a low amount of AP. One weekend of play tops, and that's with low AP per hour gains. We have to grind undead for FG, hunting four thousand lorebooks for MG, repeating dungeons for Undaunted passives and set pieces, blah blah blah.

Sorry, but I'm pretty done with PvEers complaining about having to PvP to get our rewards for playing our content right after the requirements to acquire them were just lowered immensely.

You should be saying thank you, not whining. Be glad the shoe isn't on the other foot.

Oh, surprise third point -- a question. What is fundamentally wrong with different areas of content having separate rewards anyway? If you want to go all completionist on your character, then go complete stuff. You might find yourself surprised. PvP has a steep and intimidating learning curve, but it's challenging and a ton of fun once you get the hang of it. And aside from a few jerks, most of whom are widely known at this point, the community is really cool.

.

code65536 wrote: »

Aemon_Isklexi wrote: »

I don't think PvE players should be forced to do PvP to get a critical skill, nor should PvP players have to do the reverse.

You're not being "forced" to do anything, and there is no problem here.

You can get along just fine without Vigor, Dawnbreaker, or Meteor. Yes, they are nice to have, and yes, they are essential and required for high-level gameplay. But a lot of other things are also required for high-level gameplay--gear, consumables, gold, git gud, etc. Do you propose we eliminate that, too?

If you want to just get by in Tamriel, you don't need to do anything that you don't want to. And for people who aspire to be more, the game encourages them to branch out and be more well-rounded. I think that's a good thing, and this whining about "Oh, I don't want to PvP to PvE" or "I don't want to PvE to PvP" is, frankly, childish. You want something? Earn it. All the better if it also takes you out of your comfort zone.

I was not whining, i asked a question then i made a suggestion on how to approach it.. not asking for the skill to be handed to me, im willing earn it through challenging PVE, when you take someone out of their comfort zone and they do not like it but have to do it (becuz you said so yurself) it is required for high level gameplay, then they may stop playing.. that is not childish it is a compliant with the current system of eso, do not label me becuz it does not effect you.

childish would be "nerf it so i can just ignore it".

KenaPKK wrote: »

@dodgehopper_ESO thank you. Funny how common sense goes right past some developers.

Two other points.

One, to the OP, Vigor is only necessary in PvP and Maelstrom Arena anyway. You'll have pocket healers in your groups with your roles, and you have access to other self heals available for easier solo content. Maelstrom plays like PvP anyway -- it's basically a big, choreographed 1vX -- so if you want to do Maelstrom, I suggest you pony up. You'll gain skills necessary to do it faster in PvP than in PvE.

Two, PvPers have to grind MORE PvE stuff than PvEers have to grind PvP stuff. You want two skill lines which both level with AP gains and cap at a low amount of AP. One weekend of play tops, and that's with low AP per hour gains. We have to grind undead for FG, hunting four thousand lorebooks for MG, repeating dungeons for Undaunted passives and set pieces, blah blah blah.

Sorry, but I'm pretty done with PvEers complaining about having to PvP to get our rewards for playing our content right after the requirements to acquire them were just lowered immensely.

You should be saying thank you, not whining. Be glad the shoe isn't on the other foot.

Oh, surprise third point -- a question. What is fundamentally wrong with different areas of content having separate rewards anyway? If you want to go all completionist on your character, then go complete stuff. You might find yourself surprised. PvP has a steep and intimidating learning curve, but it's challenging and a ton of fun once you get the hang of it. And aside from a few jerks, most of whom are widely known at this point, the community is really cool.

I agree.

I think a lot of people who are afraid of the PvP realm take the occasional ribbing as serious. In some cases sure it gets out of control, but most pvp'ers are pretty chill folks. I know I'm not the best in the world, and I certainly don't get to play as much as I'd like to, but I get along well enough with new and experienced players in the pvp realm and I think I do well enough. When I'm out there I give it my all and I've had plenty fun killing and getting killed in 1vX, 1v1, 4v4, 12v12 and bigger groups. I like hunting players in IC/cyro story content, I like group vs. group, map conquering you name it. You'll still run into jerks, but I've run into that with the raid/trial crowd too - that's called life. I have plenty of fun and my gear quality is abysmal. I've never been nuts about gear, and I know it hurts me. When I do get the time to focus on it I'll eventually top end my equipment all gold and streamlined, but you don't need it. You don't have to be the best and wear the best to do well. I think when you realize that it'll be a big confidence booster.