Ridiculously long queue for DPS to queue for dungeon

Yolokin_Swagonborn · May 2016

Perhaps if ZOS didn't continually nerf tanks, refuse to update tanking gear or come out with any new useful tanking sets, and plan to nerf tanks even more in the next patch, there would be more tanks in the game.

I don't know what happened to healers its not like Breath of Life got a ner....oh wait.

Most Dungeons are a DPS race, PvP has been changed into a Burst DPS race, most of the new armor sets are all about stacking DPS, Maelstrom is a nightmare without high DPS.

I wonder why there are so many DPS in this game?

SlayerTheDragon · May 2016

Most of the serious PVE Dungeon(ers) are LFG spamming chat for daily pledges. They have ZERO reason for using Dungeon Finder.

If they (ZO$) were to get a brainstorm of lets say, have the Dungeon Finder reward pledge keys, you will see a lot more players using the Dungeon Finder.

khele23eb17_ESO · May 2016

SlayerTheDragon wrote: »

Most of the serious PVE Dungeon(ers) are LFG spamming chat for daily pledges. They have ZERO reason for using Dungeon Finder.

If they (ZO$) were to get a brainstorm of lets say, have the Dungeon Finder reward pledge keys, you will see a lot more players using the Dungeon Finder.

Theyd still lfg in chat and queue after making a grp?

phaneub17_ESO · May 2016

khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »

SlayerTheDragon wrote: »

Most of the serious PVE Dungeon(ers) are LFG spamming chat for daily pledges. They have ZERO reason for using Dungeon Finder.

If they (ZO$) were to get a brainstorm of lets say, have the Dungeon Finder reward pledge keys, you will see a lot more players using the Dungeon Finder.

Theyd still lfg in chat and queue after making a grp?

They could make it like WoW, where those who queue for a random dungeon solo receive a buff that increases damage done, healing done, and reduces damage taken by like 10% rate. Among those who are tanks or healers queue solo have a chance at a bag of goodies when the number of DPS get overwhelmingly high. Those who queued in a group of 2 or more don't get either bonuses, but still get the end reward for completing the random dungeon.

Rakkul · May 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

IDK, in my experience with past MMOs, DPS always had long queue times, due to the lack of tanks/healers or because there was just too many DPS in the game.

Nature of the beast.

True
It's also affected to a degree by the nature of the classes. Going back to my earlier WoW days I recall a range of healing classes, which many people seemed to enjoy playing. Similarly for Rift, FFXIV, Aion, I enjoyed and still enjoy playing healers in a couple of those games.

The recent move in mmo's seems to have been a reduction in focus on healers, with some games removing this class entirely - Skyforge, Echo of Soul for example.

Yet a good healing class can be great to play. It doesn't get the glamour of "worlds highest dps" etc, but it can give great satisfaction of looking after team members through events.

As for Tanks - already said in another post. They nerf Tanks, people move away from the playing them, then find there is a shortage of Tanks - Development team?

And it points yet again to the Development teams' focus on pvp, whilst ignoring the effect on pve game play. Until these two environments are treated equally by the Development team you will always see one format (in this case pve) suffering - and it will continue to get worse.

The answer seems to be make dungeons/raids a dps race. This at least would remove the need for dedicated non dps classes - but how monotonous is this with players just looking at the highest dps classes.

The Development team need to broaden their thinking again with class changes. The ones in DB only make this situation worse and need to be revisited with both pve and pvp in mind.

Guppet · May 2016

Mr.Hmm wrote: »

Shadowfx1970 wrote: »

Tank and Healer always get the blame are the hardest characters to play and get the least amount of love, dps on the other hand are for people who can't play tanks or healers, take from that what you will.

To me DPS are the people who dont care about anything but High Numbers in their screens.

It's been my experience that a lot of dps can't even do that. They don't know how to do decent dps, because the solo game doesn't require or teach how to do it.

CaptainBeerDude · May 2016

Waffennacht wrote: »

You can solo as dps not tank or healer

You can vMA as dps, not tank or healer

You can small scale 1v1 as dps, not tank or healer

You can do PvE content as a dps, not so as a tank or healer (or at least far more difficult

Agreed. I have a tank/healer. I can solo things, but it takes a long time.

A really long time

anitajoneb17_ESO · May 2016

I agree that ZOS doesn't do much to attract more players towards healing and even less towards tanking.

It is also true that the few that are left have plenty to do with their guilds and friends and don't need to use group finder much.

That being said...
Reading just a few pages of this forum would discourage some of the toughest to even try tanking or healing. Just because they are supposed to "support the group", damage dealers seem to feel entitled to drown them in demands, requirements, and judgements.

Being friendly and respectful could help. It would not solve all problems, but it would definitely help.

Keryss · May 2016

Hi,

I have 2 characters. 1 tank and 1 DPS. (both vet16).

With my tank, it take less than 1 minute to find a group (the evening, from 19h to 22h)... And it's the same every day !
I use the tool group 2x a day... (Random dungeon and specific dungeon)... Sometimes i haven't time to repair between 2 dungeons... lol

With my DPS, on the same timeslot, it could take 1 or 2 hours... :-/
Most of time, i give up with my DPS...

Avenias · May 2016

Keryss wrote: »

Hi,

I have 2 characters. 1 tank and 1 DPS. (both vet16).

With my tank, it take less than 1 minute to find a group (the evening, from 19h to 22h)... And it's the same every day !
I use the tool group 2x a day... (Random dungeon and specific dungeon)... Sometimes i haven't time to repair between 2 dungeons... lol

With my DPS, on the same timeslot, it could take 1 or 2 hours... :-/
Most of time, i give up with my DPS...

I feel ur pain brother, i have a few tanks, one healer and a bunch of dps. I got the exact same problem as u!

Rune_Relic · May 2016

disintegr8 wrote: »

The final nail in the coffin for tanks would be for the game to provide an NPC to "fill the gap". Making it so that tanks are no longer required in dungeons would be the end of the game for me.

I enjoy tanking, but due to PVP not being a good place to take a tank built for dungeons, the only alternative I have (as a vr16 tank) is to do dungeons. The inability to quickly (and cheaply) switch between play styles makes it extremely hard to have a tank doing both.

Some sort of method where you can save more than one set of CP and Skill bar settings for use in different content (dungeons/PVE/PVP) would be really helpful here. I am not suggesting free skill point respecs at the push of a button, the points would still have to be earned. allocations thought out and planned, but once you have allocated the skill points, ability to save preset bars for roles or content would not be that hard to do.

CP's are a bit different as a lot of the trees are very specific in what type of role (magicka/dps, healing/damage, etc.) they are designed for. The ability to save 2 or 3 different previously set patterns so you can quickly change would be nice. You could even have it cost something, 500g or 1000g rather than 3000g every time, to reduce it's abuse, or prevent the ability to switch at certain points in a dungeon run or quest line.

A lot of other suggestions in this thread show that we all see things differently. I think they could make changes to ensure that more of the group content actually require tanks and healers. How to do that when CP and PVP rewards provide experienced players with way over the top abilities and super gear that make most dungeons too easy for them is a challenge.

Maybe non vet dungeons should ignore CP and/or vet gear and bringing everyone to level 50 (rather than V16) might make them better. Running these with level 18, 23, or even 30 something characters when you are a V16 tank can seem like hard work but it is not their fault we have outgrown the content. They are entitled to be there otherwise they would not be grouped there.

Telling people to learn to play other roles is only partly right. At base level, a tank should be able to do damage or maybe do some group healing if things are tight, a DD should have some way to at least restore their own health, and a healer being able to do some damage can all help. How far you take all of these is going to be a matter of opinion, we all see things from our characters perspective.

I have seen 'healers' continue to attack bosses, even when the DD's are dead, seen DD's run ahead to the next mob/boss before the last mob are all dead and seen 'tanks' (after 3 wipes) hiding in bushes using a bow to attack a boss. Maybe they have all followed that suggestion and are simply choosing to 'play the other roles'.

Spot on from my view.
With the added complexity of allowing people to 'play how they want'.
Where do you draw the line between nerfing content to suit underpowered hyrbid or upping the content to suit OP pure builds.
I dont think you can have your cake and eat it in this way.
Especially when you throw new players in the mix too.

CaptainBeerDude wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

You can solo as dps not tank or healer

You can vMA as dps, not tank or healer

You can small scale 1v1 as dps, not tank or healer

You can do PvE content as a dps, not so as a tank or healer (or at least far more difficult

Agreed. I have a tank/healer. I can solo things, but it takes a long time.
A really long time

Exactly. Time being the operative factor in regard a DPS race.
Tanks and healers do low damage.
Expected them to do high damage just turns them into a DPS.

Perhaps that the direction they are now going.
No tank
No healer
Just tank-dps hyrbid, heal-dps hybrid + dps.

Look at all the skills that increase mitigation and healing when you deal damage or heal/mitigation/dd skills that scale off one resource.
Everything is stacked in favour of being a DD

NBrookus · May 2016

Elvent wrote: »

Guppet wrote: »

Just learn to heal, it doesn't require much different gear compared to DPS, you even get to spend a fair bit of time DPSing. I never have to wait more than 2 minutes for a group. It's also quite fun in ESO, you just have to accept that now and then you'll get fake tanks. So long as your not fake, that's not a problem though, so long as the dps can actually kill stuff.

I learned how to heal, did my first normal dungeon as a vet 7 healer just a few minutes ago and left after first boss because of how hard it was to keep everybody alive. I don't even see how it would be possible to heal a vet dungeon if a normal dungeon was that hard? But then again the tank said he was level 15 lowbie so I'm not sure how that scaling works and why vets would be in a dungeon with lowbies but I don't think I'll ever heal again after that experience.

I guess healing isn't for me and I'm just bad at it.

One failed try doesn't make you a bad healer. A level 15 tank probably is running around in trash looted gear and barely has any skills unlocked. Scaling him up isn't going to help much.

sirrmattus · May 2016

everybody wants to be a damage dealer. not everyone can deal damage.

Keryss · May 2016

sirrmattus wrote: »

everybody wants to be a damage dealer. not everyone can deal damage.

yeahh... DD is a full time job ^^

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Because there are just as many bad players out there.

Jesus, you pretentious prick.
Let people decide what they want to play for themselves, not what YOU want them to play for YOU.
This is elitism in it's purest form.

Dexter411 · May 2016

Waffennacht wrote: »

phaneub17_ESO wrote: »

I don't know what you're talking about, I have 2 tanks and 2 healer characters; they all get a dungeon within 5 minutes.

Yes... OP said he Wasn't those... he said dps takes forever...

You can solo as dps not tank or healer

You can vMA as dps, not tank or healer

You can small scale 1v1 as dps, not tank or healer

You can do PvE content as a dps, not so as a tank or healer (or at least far more difficult)

Why, when making a character, especially the first time, would you make the single player so difficult on yourself?

This game incentives DPS, especially with end game being all dps checks

So true.
Edit: You can even solo some of the group content as dps but not as tank or healer.

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

There should be major bonuses for Tanks or Healers (I am neither, so no, it's not for me that I say this, but for those that do play it).
Each heal for instance, should give Exp (IF the target is wounded, healthy characters being healed, should not give additional exp, self explanatory, I think), tanks should have a continuous additional exp gain.
Just because it is that much harder on them to level and progress through the stages.

svartorn · May 2016

Supply and demand.

Everyone in this game wants to dps.

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

svartorn wrote: »

Everyone in this game wants to dps.

Yes, mainly because you can't always find someone to level with you in PvE.
And this makes that gaining levels becomes a drag.
It's not fun building a healer or a tank, compared to a DPS which can take 80% and more of all content by itself.

cosmic_niklas_93b16_ESO · May 2016

svartorn wrote: »

Supply and demand.

Everyone in this game wants to dps.

Also, if you get your dps high enough and get other people with similar dps, you don't need a healer or tank anymore, you can just burn everything down before you even need heals or tanking.

Roymachine · May 2016

There is a very simple fix for this. As in any situation in any game, players adapt. I do not want to wait in long queues as a DPS, so I put in the time to get the skill points and gear to have an alternate setup for DPS/Healer or DPS/Tank. Heck, on my Templar I can queue up as all 3 without a problem. You do not need champion points respecced in order to cater to the min/max of a role you get if it's not your 'main'. People complain that the game is too easy anyway so I don't see them as really necessary anyway.

Guppet · May 2016

They need to add actual threat mechanics. Heavy armour adds a multiplier to threat and so does one hand and shield. Could tank with one or the other, but will be best with both.

This would make tanking more fun.

BucFanJKE · May 2016

I'm a healer and I can't get groups for dailies in the group finder. I give up on the queue after about 15 mins and just go to the undaunted enclave and try to find people in area chat.

Lightninvash · May 2016

Taisynn wrote: »

There is no incentive to play as a tank or healer. It's an unforgiving and cruel thing, especially with heavy armor being useless in PVP - nobody wants to level it up. Long story short - it's annoying and difficult to be a tank.

I just started on my Templar to be a tank and while it can be annoying it isn't awful I get right in the action and pull away the nasty hitting mobs away from my DD and healers.

Healing is fun if you enjoy the game play. While I Main as a Templar healer I am starting to really enjoy my sorc healer. Since I have my pets that deal damage to the mobs and bosses while I can focus on healing. Throw down an aoe here and there while using combat prayer to buff and negate magic to buff and protect my allys. In pvp tanking I don't see it worth it so far but could be wrong. Unless they use the tanks simply to stand on siege weapons while being hit by enemy siege weapons. Healing in PVP is very rewarding with AP.

So to say it isn't rewarding to do isn't exactly true minus tanking in pvp.

Guppet · May 2016

BucFanJKE wrote: »

I'm a healer and I can't get groups for dailies in the group finder. I give up on the queue after about 15 mins and just go to the undaunted enclave and try to find people in area chat.

It may sound obvious, but are you queued as just a healer? That's a mighty long queue if your queued correctly as heals. Most I have ever had is 4 mins and that's on PS4.

Are you queuing at funny times?

Lokryn · May 2016

We need "dual spec" like WoW had. That way a player can have two specs where it swaps all skills, champions pts., etc. between a DPS and healer/Tank with a click of a button.

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

No, we need removal of the find party window as is, and removal of the kick player.
It should become randomized, with the option for non-elitist players to tag along.
These are always screwed.
Well, not ALWAYS, but very often.

Guppet · May 2016

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

No, we need removal of the find party window as is, and removal of the kick player.
It should become randomized, with the option for non-elitist players to tag along.
These are always screwed.
Well, not ALWAYS, but very often.

Remove kick player and those very same elitist players will then troll the heck out of the players they would have kicked. Bad idea. You remove consequence, you remove the need to act in any sort or respectful way.

Player joins group of lower level players, sits at the entrance for an hour, what can they do about that. They would soon be screaming for a kick option.

Surak73 · May 2016

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Reading just a few pages of this forum would discourage some of the toughest to even try tanking or healing. Just because they are supposed to "support the group", damage dealers seem to feel entitled to drown them in demands, requirements, and judgements.

The other day I was in Imperial prison as healer with a group from activity finder. You know, with the final boss there are the blue globes which give you a shock if you are too near. Well, a dps was just between two of them. He was taking shock damage from both of them. Did he bother to move away? Oh, no, why he should? He just brought up the emoticon "Heal me!"...

dtm_samuraib16_ESO · May 2016

Guppet wrote: »

dtm_samuraib16_ESO wrote: »

No, we need removal of the find party window as is, and removal of the kick player.
It should become randomized, with the option for non-elitist players to tag along.
These are always screwed.
Well, not ALWAYS, but very often.

Remove kick player and those very same elitist players will then troll the heck out of the players they would have kicked. Bad idea. You remove consequence, you remove the need to act in any sort or respectful way.

Player joins group of lower level players, sits at the entrance for an hour, what can they do about that. They would soon be screaming for a kick option.

True, I forgot to add: and change into vote kick.
My bad, brother.