Official Feedback Thread for Nightblades

VaxtinTheWolf · April 2016

One idea for changing Debilitate.

Binding Thorns(Cripple) 28m Range, 5m Radius

- Sap the agility of up to 3 enemies and bolster your own, reducing their movement speed by 30% and granting you Major Expedition.

- Affected enemies also take (x) Poison Damage over 8 seconds.

- This morph does 15-25% less base damage due to having split targets. Scales of max stamina and weapon damage.

Helluin · April 2016

Leeching Strikes: even after the changements in TG patch, this one is still the not appealing morph.
Checking also the new HA passive Rapid Mending, we can assume that basic attacks are considered by devs a way to regain resources especially for tanks: heavy attacks for Rapid Mending, light and heavy attacks for Leeching Strikes.
Even adding to Leeching Strikes a reduction to block cost (that would compensate for what lost with Bracing), I presume many NB tanks would still use Siphoning Attacks.

Imho Leeching Strikes, to be interesting, should grant the same of Siphoning Attacks + a reduction to block cost (or something else useful to tank) to compensate the malus to weapon/spell power when toggled.
The healing from light/heavy attack, at least for me, is something not really necessary but it can stay.

What do you think about it?

Power Extraction: but for changing the damage from magic into disease, the skill is not comparable to other 360° AoE abilities.
Radius or damage could be increased or a debuff could be added to it.
Otherwise it could simply be the same of Sap Essence (with also healing then) consuming stamina, maybe with less healing and more damage than Sap Essence.

Mark Target: as reported here, the 5 pieces bonus of Vicecanon of Venom considers this skill an attack applying the poison damage and healing.
The skill is fine, the problem is just with that set.

VaxtinTheWolf wrote: »

One idea for changing Debilitate.
Binding Thorns(Cripple) 28m Range, 5m Radius

- Sap the agility of up to 3 enemies and bolster your own, reducing their movement speed by 30% and granting you Major Expedition.

- Affected enemies also take (x) Poison Damage over 8 seconds.

- This morph does 15-25% less base damage due to having split targets. Scales of max stamina and weapon damage.

Awesome idea.

VaxtinTheWolf · April 2016

For leveling leeching -might- be okay to use in a solo playstyle, but It's going to take a lot for me abandon Siphoning Attacks for any reason because I wouldn't be able to do this anymore.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dqAFEBKkp4

But really, my only idea for leeching is to actually make it leech. You reduce your own damage while it's active and it still needs to be on both bars correct? Why not make it drain the power from your enemies, a transfer of damage. Cause your attacks to Sap literal weapon/spell power from your enemies or resources even and give it to yourself. The values stolen can vary, and the effects last just 5-10 seconds. If they really intend to change heavy armor like they have, I don't see why they couldn't do this as well for using Leeching Strikes.

xylena · May 2016

NB Power Extraction morph needs to be buffed on par with its sister morph Sap Essence... at least change the damage type to Physical/Disease like the other NB stamina morphs if not adding some other utility (like lifesteal) to it. As it is, the necessity of Momentum to stamina builds renders the Major Brutality buff redundant on 98% of builds.

Attackopsn · May 2016

*Regarding Leeching Strikes and Siphoning Strikes*

Currently no tank uses leeching due to the superior sustain offered by siphoning. To avoid creating a pre TG SA where you maintain the damage and the sustain, you could make Leeching Strikes reduce your overall dmg by 15% but give you the ability to receive additional resource gains from DoTs similar to the way it was used in previous iterations.

VaxtinTheWolf · May 2016

Didn't they give blood alter a new category of buff for leeching health? If the minor is 2% of damage returned as health, maybe Leeching strikes can have a Major buff that lets 5% of damage be returned as health. You still retain the damage reduction and resource return of leeching, but maybe at a more even amount as the tooltip on the magicka/stamina return of this morph are different values.

Just another idea.

Van_0S · May 2016

Malanor wrote: »

Why does Power Extraction Morph still deal magic damage considering stamina adjustment treatment for the others stamina based abilities. None uses this morph

Yea, PE should also give heals stamina version Sap essence but not scaling to your max stamina.

pema · May 2016

So as a stam nb please make siphoning a bit more interesting.

And please make the morph of the siphoning skill relevant. Force essence it is I beleive. The stam morph stiĺl does magica damage, please correct this as is done with many other skills.in the game

scorpiodog · May 2016

A siphon that uses Magica to give us back stamina instead of Magika (possible a morph)

arkansas_ESO · May 2016

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

YurtTheSilentChief wrote: »

RazielSR wrote: »

Everybody says that stam nb is better for ganking...but is that true? You can gank with you magblade...is just that you need more hits but you can escape easily and drive the other person mad.
Now with the poison thing.You can mark, land a resto thick,lotus,concealed,soul harvest and 70% of times is dead. If not fear,and end like you want.

The difference is the burst damage/ kill an enemy player less than 1 sec.

MagiNB needs to use alot of hard work to get burst up damage i.e. sometimes the target doesn't die.
Note: you have to wait for your soul tether to fill up or ultimate.

StamNB doesn't require that much work in order to get that burst damage.
Note: sometimes you dont require an ultimate to kill your target.

Note: Gank build only

Lol yeah okay, I've been attacked by a vr 16 stam Nightblade as I was lock picking a chest, and I killed him. If someone is getting killed in less than 1 second, it's not just because someone has high burst, it's because the guy getting ganked has garbage defense. And now (in the PTS) I would say stamina has an edge, but you know what magicka doesn't need to try hard to get? Good resource management. In PvP, magicka can use max food, whereas stamina is stuck with regen drinks. We need to sacrifice a lot of damage in order to get what you guys naturally have.

Gotta disagree with you there, I've been able to get 2.5k stam regen, 3.5k weapon damage, and max stam in the low 30k range on my dark elf stam NB. You don't really have to sacrifice much to hit hard as stamina; stamina just naturally hits hard.

cpuScientist · May 2016

arkansas_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

YurtTheSilentChief wrote: »

RazielSR wrote: »

Everybody says that stam nb is better for ganking...but is that true? You can gank with you magblade...is just that you need more hits but you can escape easily and drive the other person mad.
Now with the poison thing.You can mark, land a resto thick,lotus,concealed,soul harvest and 70% of times is dead. If not fear,and end like you want.

The difference is the burst damage/ kill an enemy player less than 1 sec.

MagiNB needs to use alot of hard work to get burst up damage i.e. sometimes the target doesn't die.
Note: you have to wait for your soul tether to fill up or ultimate.

StamNB doesn't require that much work in order to get that burst damage.
Note: sometimes you dont require an ultimate to kill your target.

Note: Gank build only

Lol yeah okay, I've been attacked by a vr 16 stam Nightblade as I was lock picking a chest, and I killed him. If someone is getting killed in less than 1 second, it's not just because someone has high burst, it's because the guy getting ganked has garbage defense. And now (in the PTS) I would say stamina has an edge, but you know what magicka doesn't need to try hard to get? Good resource management. In PvP, magicka can use max food, whereas stamina is stuck with regen drinks. We need to sacrifice a lot of damage in order to get what you guys naturally have.

Gotta disagree with you there, I've been able to get 2.5k stam regen, 3.5k weapon damage, and max stam in the low 30k range on my dark elf stam NB. You don't really have to sacrifice much to hit hard as stamina; stamina just naturally hits hard.

This is true... That guy that did not take you down was trash.

Agency79 · May 2016

The disease damage arrow that I can trigger from relentless focus doesn't correctly scale off of stamina and weapon damage. Edit: it's called "Assassin's Scourge" now.

This means it's often better to simply let the Relentless Focus buff wear off than it is to use an available "Assassin's Scourge"

I offer two potential solutions:

1. Have the disease dmg spectral arrow scale with stamina and weapon damage -or-
2. Remove the spectral arrow part of the skill for this morph and have it do something else that's interesting and useful.

I hope this makes sense - long night at work here

Strider_Roshin · May 2016

cpuScientist wrote: »

arkansas_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

YurtTheSilentChief wrote: »

RazielSR wrote: »

Everybody says that stam nb is better for ganking...but is that true? You can gank with you magblade...is just that you need more hits but you can escape easily and drive the other person mad.
Now with the poison thing.You can mark, land a resto thick,lotus,concealed,soul harvest and 70% of times is dead. If not fear,and end like you want.

The difference is the burst damage/ kill an enemy player less than 1 sec.

MagiNB needs to use alot of hard work to get burst up damage i.e. sometimes the target doesn't die.
Note: you have to wait for your soul tether to fill up or ultimate.

StamNB doesn't require that much work in order to get that burst damage.
Note: sometimes you dont require an ultimate to kill your target.

Note: Gank build only

Lol yeah okay, I've been attacked by a vr 16 stam Nightblade as I was lock picking a chest, and I killed him. If someone is getting killed in less than 1 second, it's not just because someone has high burst, it's because the guy getting ganked has garbage defense. And now (in the PTS) I would say stamina has an edge, but you know what magicka doesn't need to try hard to get? Good resource management. In PvP, magicka can use max food, whereas stamina is stuck with regen drinks. We need to sacrifice a lot of damage in order to get what you guys naturally have.

Gotta disagree with you there, I've been able to get 2.5k stam regen, 3.5k weapon damage, and max stam in the low 30k range on my dark elf stam NB. You don't really have to sacrifice much to hit hard as stamina; stamina just naturally hits hard.

This is true... That guy that did not take you down was trash.

Then I guess all gankers are trash, since I've never been successfully ganked by one person.

ycodryn · May 2016

Magicka nightblade sucks compared to others magicka dps. If you take away our heal then RIP poor thing. Now is already hard to do veteran maelstrom arena, after nerf will be imposible.

susmitds · May 2016

ycodryn wrote: »

Magicka nightblade sucks compared to others magicka dps. If you take away our heal then RIP poor thing. Now is already hard to do veteran maelstrom arena, after nerf will be imposible.

You are kidding right? Magicka NBs are the highest DPS class of the game.

Helluin · May 2016

Agency79 wrote: »

The disease damage arrow that I can trigger from relentless focus doesn't correctly scale off of stamina and weapon damage. Edit: it's called "Assassin's Scourge" now.

This means it's often better to simply let the Relentless Focus buff wear off than it is to use an available "Assassin's Scourge"

I offer two potential solutions:

1. Have the disease dmg spectral arrow scale with stamina and weapon damage -or-
2. Remove the spectral arrow part of the skill for this morph and have it do something else that's interesting and useful.

I hope this makes sense - long night at work here

Honestly if I add stamina, changing an armor glyph from health to stamina, and weapon damage, changing a jewelry glyph from stamina cost reduction to weapon damage, the damage of the Assassin's Scourge increases.
The same when I switch from drinks to food and when I use Major Brutality.

I wrote it already before, from what I tested it scales perfectly with stamina - weapon stats and Champion System.
Already on live server Assassin's Will scales off stamina and weapon damage because it's acting like an ultimate off max stats.
What we asked during TG pts was the damage changed from magic into disease and infact the damage is increased.

@ZOS_GinaBruno , @ZOS_JessicaFolsom could you please have a check on this?

Alendrin · May 2016

Concealed Weapon does not appear to be giving a 25% stealth movement bonus when slotted in 2.4.1

Of note, character is a vampire and I tested in stages 2-4. The stage 4 bonus does not appear to be working either. I don't think I have any other movement speed related items equipped.

ycodryn · May 2016

susmitds wrote: »

ycodryn wrote: »

Magicka nightblade sucks compared to others magicka dps. If you take away our heal then RIP poor thing. Now is already hard to do veteran maelstrom arena, after nerf will be imposible.

You are kidding right? Magicka NBs are the highest DPS class of the game.

Can you post some screenshots with dps of a magicka nb? I say that you are kidding.

Erondil · May 2016

[

ycodryn wrote: »

susmitds wrote: »

ycodryn wrote: »

Magicka nightblade sucks compared to others magicka dps. If you take away our heal then RIP poor thing. Now is already hard to do veteran maelstrom arena, after nerf will be imposible.

You are kidding right? Magicka NBs are the highest DPS class of the game.

Can you post some screenshots with dps of a magicka nb? I say that you are kidding.

(Not mines; tamrielfoundry.com/topic/pve-magicka-dps-by-iwm/)

lathbury · May 2016

why isnt agony being looked at agin also cloak can still be buggy

Lokov · May 2016

WHAT?!
Why you boost stamina builds again and nerf magicka?
Why the фuck you nerf proximity detonation again?
How i should play in magicka melee build with dual wield in pvp now? Especially 1v1 or 1v2.
Can someone finally shoot down your combat designer? Cuz looks like he have no idea about some balance in PvP and what is MMO at all.

Now Im playing only as melee magicka NB and its not so strong in 1v1. I dont want to play as stamina nightblade or any another class in game. With this stupid detonation nerf and with no other boosts I don't see any reason to play this s....t
tons of cyrodiil lags
tons of bugs
stupid gameplay decisions as champion system
boring pvp without any motivation or good reward
The last thing that holding me here was solo/smallscale PvP and duels. Now you're killing it for me.

See ya in GW2.

Jaronking · May 2016

Lokov wrote: »

WHAT?!
Why you boost stamina builds again and nerf magicka?
Why the фuck you nerf proximity detonation again?
How i should play in magicka melee build with dual wield in pvp now? Especially 1v1 or 1v2.
Can someone finally shoot down your combat designer? Cuz looks like he have no idea about some balance in PvP and what is MMO at all.

Now Im playing only as melee magicka NB and its not so strong in 1v1. I dont want to play as stamina nightblade or any another class in game. With this stupid detonation nerf and with no other boosts I don't see any reason to play this s....t
tons of cyrodiil lags
tons of bugs
stupid gameplay decisions as champion system
boring pvp without any motivation or good reward
The last thing that holding me here was solo/smallscale PvP and duels. Now you're killing it for me.

See ya in GW2.

Proxy det was never supposed to be used in a 1v1 its a zerg buster skill.It should do more damage the more people you hit and less damage to a single player.Their finally making the skill function as it always should have.A Zerg busting Skill.

Let's not forgot magica NB still have a lot of abilities that work well in close range.Conceal weapon, Shallow soul,Fear,Soul harvest which is cheap as hell and a good number of Dots.You will be fine in a 1v1 if you know what your doing.Don't use proxy as a crutch.

ThatNeonZebraAgain · May 2016

Posting my experiences playing my Argonian NB magicka tank on the PTS.

Using my copied character, I primarily tested how my NB tank setup on Live responded to changes to Heavy Armor, ability cost increase, and damage shields. Here are the items I was wearing while messing around in vet dungeons solo: 5pc Juggernaut, 3pc Willpower, 3pc Lamae, 1pc Kena (5 Heavy, 1 Medium, 1 Light).

Strangely, stamina was not my biggest issue, running out of magicka was (just under 30k magicka, and 15k stamina). The overall ~6% increase cost to all abilities really takes it's toll, especially for a class/role that has to constantly re-up short-duration buffs.

On top of that, the increased ability cost is an indirect nerf to Siphoning Attacks. Since SA only restores a flat amount, it now has to proc more often within the same amount of time (15 seconds) in order to recoup the same ability costs as we have now on live, with basic attacks (not including bashing, because that no longer procs it) now restoring less of a percent of ability cost. Dropping block to sneak in basic attacks already poses a risk to the group, and now the payoff is even smaller.

Lastly, another observation was the new ineffectiveness of Harness Magic, which I described in this post. The tl;dr is that Harness Magic's shield burns up too quick both because of the 6s timer and when fighting mixed physical and spell dmg enemies, which means that it doesn't return enough resources or provide enough of a shield for it to be an effective ability. I had better resource management and survivability when simply out-healing incoming damage as opposed to attempting to mitigate it with Harness. Aside from a few boss encounters, the Dampen Magic morph is the way to go now.

@Wrobel

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · May 2016

Jaronking wrote: »

Lokov wrote: »

WHAT?!
Why you boost stamina builds again and nerf magicka?
Why the фuck you nerf proximity detonation again?
How i should play in magicka melee build with dual wield in pvp now? Especially 1v1 or 1v2.
Can someone finally shoot down your combat designer? Cuz looks like he have no idea about some balance in PvP and what is MMO at all.

Now Im playing only as melee magicka NB and its not so strong in 1v1. I dont want to play as stamina nightblade or any another class in game. With this stupid detonation nerf and with no other boosts I don't see any reason to play this s....t
tons of cyrodiil lags
tons of bugs
stupid gameplay decisions as champion system
boring pvp without any motivation or good reward
The last thing that holding me here was solo/smallscale PvP and duels. Now you're killing it for me.

See ya in GW2.

Proxy det was never supposed to be used in a 1v1 its a zerg buster skill.It should do more damage the more people you hit and less damage to a single player.Their finally making the skill function as it always should have.A Zerg busting Skill.

Let's not forgot magica NB still have a lot of abilities that work well in close range.Conceal weapon, Shallow soul,Fear,Soul harvest which is cheap as hell and a good number of Dots.You will be fine in a 1v1 if you know what your doing.Don't use proxy as a crutch.

After he said he can't 1v1 on a Nightblade I was 150% done. We have the most single target powers with little AoE/splash damage. Saying you can't 1v1 on a Nightblade is like saying you can't heal on a Templar.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · May 2016

@ZOS_GinaBruno when will we see a real stamina morph in The Siphon Tree one cost stamina and deals a stamina damage type? Great passives that I can't use outside of Soul Tether and Siphoning Attacks.

Jaronking · May 2016

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Jaronking wrote: »

Lokov wrote: »

WHAT?!
Why you boost stamina builds again and nerf magicka?
Why the фuck you nerf proximity detonation again?
How i should play in magicka melee build with dual wield in pvp now? Especially 1v1 or 1v2.
Can someone finally shoot down your combat designer? Cuz looks like he have no idea about some balance in PvP and what is MMO at all.

Now Im playing only as melee magicka NB and its not so strong in 1v1. I dont want to play as stamina nightblade or any another class in game. With this stupid detonation nerf and with no other boosts I don't see any reason to play this s....t
tons of cyrodiil lags
tons of bugs
stupid gameplay decisions as champion system
boring pvp without any motivation or good reward
The last thing that holding me here was solo/smallscale PvP and duels. Now you're killing it for me.

See ya in GW2.

Proxy det was never supposed to be used in a 1v1 its a zerg buster skill.It should do more damage the more people you hit and less damage to a single player.Their finally making the skill function as it always should have.A Zerg busting Skill.

Let's not forgot magica NB still have a lot of abilities that work well in close range.Conceal weapon, Shallow soul,Fear,Soul harvest which is cheap as hell and a good number of Dots.You will be fine in a 1v1 if you know what your doing.Don't use proxy as a crutch.

After he said he can't 1v1 on a Nightblade I was 150% done. We have the most single target powers with little AoE/splash damage. Saying you can't 1v1 on a Nightblade is like saying you can't heal on a Templar.

Hey sometimes you have to humor people.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · May 2016

Attackopsn wrote: »

*Regarding Leeching Strikes and Siphoning Strikes*

Currently no tank uses leeching due to the superior sustain offered by siphoning. To avoid creating a pre TG SA where you maintain the damage and the sustain, you could make Leeching Strikes reduce your overall dmg by 15% but give you the ability to receive additional resource gains from DoTs similar to the way it was used in previous iterations.

Well my Tank used it with the Mage's Guild Curse set that grants a heal on light attack when under 50% health with Leeching Strikes for a double heal and it's just not anywhere near Siphoning Attack.

I have pared this power with so many sets Armor of Rage has the best pairing but it needs to be double barred, 20% self damage reduction, 1/3 less resources then the base power and the heal is weak.

Maybe a incoming damage reduction would help but unless the power the forces you to light attack forever helps you take less damage it's pointless.

umagon · May 2016

I would like them to re-evaluate the healing return on leeching strikes. I have tried a number of setups and even with about 35k health the return is ±1.2k. I just cant understand what setup they are basing the 2% and now 3% return on. And in cyrodiil the value gets cut by 50%. I like the fact it's a toggle and I am fine with the damage cut, but the health return needs improvement. Maybe start with 6% in pve and 10-12% in cyrodiil or make the battle spirit not apply to it.

Strider_Roshin · May 2016

Can we get rid of the stun from incapacitating strike, and switch it with something else? I personally find it to be a burden since I would rather CC my opponent with mass hysteria; making the CC useless to me. Also a lot of magicka users are whining about it because they think it makes it OP (lol). I would honestly prefer no CC at all. Change it to a DoT, snare, debuff, idc. Just get rid of the stun.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · May 2016

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Can we get rid of the stun from incapacitating strike, and switch it with something else? I personally find it to be a burden since I would rather CC my opponent with mass hysteria; making the CC useless to me. Also a lot of magicka users are whining about it because they think it makes it OP (lol). I would honestly prefer no CC at all. Change it to a DoT, snare, debuff, idc. Just get rid of the stun.

The stun was always there I would let players get me down in health to proc the CP that grants 18 ultimate and for the incapacitating Strike stun. Even when not trying to proc it has saved my life more times then I can count.

You don't have to use fear and IS on the same bar plus fear hits the two that your single target attack can't. Dragon Knights have Leap, Sorcerers have Overload and we have Death Stroke. Templars are next for a good ultimate.